Does God expect us to obey the hundreds of NT commands on day one of our service to be saved?

[Gospel Believer]

For all Of The Weak Believers out there That just “ Insist” on having a command to keep, perhaps these two commands Jesus left us with in this Wondrous Age Of Grace will allow you to sleep better.....#1 Believe. #2 Love . Sorry to disappoint , but that’s it.......1John3:23

Here’s you some icing on the cake if you also want an Ironclad Law to obey—— Its actually called “ The Law Of Christ “—— “ Take on the burdens of others “........Gal 6:2 Happy now? Lol......
.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

For all Of The Weak Believers out there That just “ Insist” on having a command to keep, perhaps these two commands Jesus left us with in this Wondrous Age Of Grace will allow you to sleep better.....#1 Believe. #2 Love . Sorry to disappoint , but that’s it.......1John3:23

Here’s you some icing on the cake if you also want an Ironclad Law to obey—— Its actually called “ The Law Of Christ “—— “ Take on the burdens of others “........Gal 6:2 Happy now? Lol......
.

I believe we are initially saved by God’s grace without works (Ephesians 2:8-9). But after that… God’s grace teaches us to deny ungodliness, and that we should live righteously and godly in this present world (Titus 2:11-12).

As for God’s commands in the New Testament.

Here are…

New Testament Commands That Are Called A Command:

1. “Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God is one Lord, and you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind, and with all your strength: this is the first commandment.” (Mark 12:29-30 gives us the full complete description of the 1st commandment in the Bible).
2. “And the second is like, namely this, You shall love your neighbor as yourself. There is no other commandment greater than these.” (Mark 12:31).
3. And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment. (1 John 3:23).
4. “Repent” (i.e. Seek forgiveness with the Lord Jesus Christ) (Acts of the Apostles 17:30 says, “God… now commands all men everywhere to repent”).
5. A new commandment I give unto you, That you love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another. By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if you have love one to another (John 13:34-35).
6. “Watch” (“For the Son of man is as a man taking a far journey, who left his house, and gave authority to his servants, and to every man his work, and commanded the doorkeeper to watch. Watch you therefore: for you know not when the Master of the house comes,...” - See: Mark 13:33-37).
7. “Honor your father and mother” (God commanded, saying, Honor your father and mother - Matthew 15:4, Matthew 19:19, Mark 10:19, Luke 18:20) (Ephesians 6:2-3 says “Honour your father and mother (which is the first commandment attached with a promise).
8. Tell the women to keep silent in the churches. For it is not permitted unto them to speak, but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also says the law; And if they will learn anything, let them ask their husbands at home. For it is a shame for women to speak in the church (1 Corinthians 14:34-35).
9. Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you withdraw yourselves from every brother who walks disorderly (2 Thessalonians 3:6).
10. Keep the following commandment without spot, unrebukable, until the appearance of our Lord Jesus Christ: Fight the good fight of faith, and lay hold on eternal life, whereby you are called, and have professed a good profession before many witnesses (1 Timothy 6:12-14).
11. Keep the commandments (Matthew 19:17) (Note: The young rich ruler asked, which ones (i.e. which commands should he keep); Jesus replied, “Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.” (Matthew 19:18-19) (Jesus also said as a part of these commands, “If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor,” - Matthew 19:21).

 

[DJT_47]

If you know nothing else, the plan of salvation is all that's required to be saved. It's simple as intended to be by God. All that's required when all pertinent scriptures are considered is
1. Belief and faith
2. Confession of belief
3. Repentance
4. Water baptism for the remission of sins

Upon doing the above, you, like all those in the bible, will be saved, receive the gift of the Holy Ghost, and be added to the body of Christ by the Lord which is his church, thus becoming a child of God and a Christian.

 

[robert derrick]

If you know nothing else, the plan if salvation is all that's required to be saved. It's simple as intended to be by God. All that's required when all pertinent scriptures are considered is
1. Belief and faith
2. Confession of belief
3. Repentance
4. Water baptism for the remission of sins

Upon doing the above, you, like all those in the bible, will be saved, receive the gift of the Holy Ghost, and be added to the body of Christ by the Lord which is his church, thus becoming a child of God and a Christian.

And continue believing and doing.

Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed.

If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister.

God commands His sons to do His word, to continue as sons of God.

Beginning with day one of being born again, and continuing a thousand years as day one.

 

[Gospel Believer]

I believe we are initially saved by God’s grace without works (Ephesians 2:8-9). But after that… God’s grace teaches us to deny ungodliness, and that we should live righteously and godly in this present world (Titus 2:11-12).

As for God’s commands in the New Testament.

Here are…

New Testament Commands That Are Called A Command:

1. “Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God is one Lord, and you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind, and with all your strength: this is the first commandment.” (Mark 12:29-30 gives us the full complete description of the 1st commandment in the Bible).
2. “And the second is like, namely this, You shall love your neighbor as yourself. There is no other commandment greater than these.” (Mark 12:31).
3. And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment. (1 John 3:23).
4. “Repent” (i.e. Seek forgiveness with the Lord Jesus Christ) (Acts of the Apostles 17:30 says, “God… now commands all men everywhere to repent”).
5. A new commandment I give unto you, That you love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another. By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if you have love one to another (John 13:34-35).
6. “Watch” (“For the Son of man is as a man taking a far journey, who left his house, and gave authority to his servants, and to every man his work, and commanded the doorkeeper to watch. Watch you therefore: for you know not when the Master of the house comes,...” - See: Mark 13:33-37).
7. “Honor your father and mother” (God commanded, saying, Honor your father and mother - Matthew 15:4, Matthew 19:19, Mark 10:19, Luke 18:20) (Ephesians 6:2-3 says “Honour your father and mother (which is the first commandment attached with a promise).
8. Tell the women to keep silent in the churches. For it is not permitted unto them to speak, but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also says the law; And if they will learn anything, let them ask their husbands at home. For it is a shame for women to speak in the church (1 Corinthians 14:34-35).
9. Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you withdraw yourselves from every brother who walks disorderly (2 Thessalonians 3:6).
10. Keep the following commandment without spot, unrebukable, until the appearance of our Lord Jesus Christ: Fight the good fight of faith, and lay hold on eternal life, whereby you are called, and have professed a good profession before many witnesses (1 Timothy 6:12-14).
11. Keep the commandments (Matthew 19:17) (Note: The young rich ruler asked, which ones (i.e. which commands should he keep); Jesus replied, “Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.” (Matthew 19:18-19) (Jesus also said as a part of these commands, “If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor,” - Matthew 19:21).

Of course we should strive to deny ungodliness and try to live as righteously as we can .....but even with our best attempts, we will fall short and need the Grace of God that actually does the job of Salvation.....we get that Grace through Faith in Jesus Christ and His Finished Work Of The Cross ...
Obeying these commands won’t save you.......Obeying the PROMISES of God is what Saves....That is what Faith is .....taking a Promise Of God and acting upon it.....a Promise as simple as “ Turn to Me and I will Turn to you”..... or a great promise like “ Anybody that asks to be Saved WILL be saved” ......Practice Faith ....Take a Promise Of God and Believe it and that will get you the Holy Spirit .....get that Spirit and the Command-Keeping will follow as that Spirit Transforms you into the Image Of Jesus —- it won’t work the other way around....


When I talk about Commandments, I am talking about Commandment Keeping in regard to Salvation.....The only Commandment that I am aware of that * Must* be kept in order to be Saved is this one—— You MUST be Born Again! How does one accomplish That? Do the Will Of God —-“ BELIEVE On the One that He sent “.....

Just as the Phillipian Jailer asked—— “ What MUST I do to be Saved?” The Answer , as we all should know—- “ BELIEVE on the Lord, Jesus Christ and thou shalt be Saved” ......there’s your Command....

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Of course we should strive to deny ungodliness and try to live as righteously as we can .....but even with our best attempts, we will fall short and need the Grace of God that actually does the job of Salvation.....we get that Grace through Faith in Jesus Christ and His Finished Work Of The Cross ...
Obeying these commands won’t save you.......Obeying the PROMISES of God is what Saves....That is what Faith is .....taking a Promise Of God and acting upon it.....a Promise as simple as “ Turn to Me and I will Turn to you”..... or a great promise like “ Anybody that asks to be Saved WILL be saved” ......Practice Faith ....Take a Promise Of God and Believe it and that will get you the Holy Spirit .....get that Spirit and the Command-Keeping will follow as that Spirit Transforms you into the Image Of Jesus —- it won’t work the other way around....


When I talk about Commandments, I am talking about Commandment Keeping in regard to Salvation.....The only Commandment that I am aware of that * Must* be kept in order to be Saved is this one—— You MUST be Born Again! How does one accomplish That? Do the Will Of God —-“ BELIEVE On the One that He sent “.....

Just as the Phillipian Jailer asked—— “ What MUST I do to be Saved?” The Answer , as we all should know—- “ BELIEVE on the Lord, Jesus Christ and thou shalt be Saved” ......there’s your Command....

First, you implied that Jesus only left us with two commands (to believe, and to love) which is clearly false by the list of commands I have shown in the New Testament (that are each called a command). In addition, these commands would include the commands from the apostles. For to receive the apostles means one is receiving Jesus (Matthew 10:40). The apostle Paul said that what he has written should be regarded as the commandments of the Lord (1 Corinthians 14:37).

Second, some promises of God are unconditional and other promises of God are conditional. For example: God not destroying the earth with a global flood again is an unconditional promise. Conditional promises would be if you honor your father and mother you will long upon the land (Exodus 20:12) (Ephesians 6:2-3). So certain promises of God comes with conditions. In the parable of the sower, we learn that there are those who believe for a while but in time of temptation they fall away (See: Luke 8:13). Jesus implies here it is bad that one does not bring forth fruit unto perfection (Luke 8:14). We learn that a church in Revelation was said to have a name that was alive but in reality they were dead (dead spiritually) and they were told by the LORD Jesus that He did not find their works perfect before God (God the Father).

Three, I will bring up those commands from my previous list that do in fact teach clearly that they are for salvation.

New Testament Commands That Are Called A Command (That are Salvific):

1. “Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God is one Lord, and you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind, and with all your strength: this is the first commandment.” (Mark 12:29-30 gives us the full complete description of the 1st commandment in the Bible).
2. “And the second is like, namely this, You shall love your neighbor as yourself. There is no other commandment greater than these.” (Mark 12:31).
3. And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment. (1 John 3:23).
4. “Repent” (i.e. Seek forgiveness with the Lord Jesus Christ) (Acts of the Apostles 17:30 says, “God… now commands all men everywhere to repent”).
5. A new commandment I give unto you, That you love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another. By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if you have love one to another (John 13:34-35).
6. “Watch” (“For the Son of man is as a man taking a far journey, who left his house, and gave authority to his servants, and to every man his work, and commanded the doorkeeper to watch. Watch you therefore: for you know not when the Master of the house comes,...” - See: Mark 13:33-37).
7. “Honor your father and mother” (God commanded, saying, Honor your father and mother - Matthew 15:4, Matthew 19:19, Mark 10:19, Luke 18:20) (Ephesians 6:2-3 says “Honour your father and mother (which is the first commandment attached with a promise).
8. Keep the following commandment without spot, unrebukable, until the appearance of our Lord Jesus Christ: Fight the good fight of faith, and lay hold on eternal life, whereby you are called, and have professed a good profession before many witnesses (1 Timothy 6:12-14).
9. Keep the commandments (Matthew 19:17) (Note: The young rich ruler asked, which ones (i.e. which commands should he keep); Jesus replied, “Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.” (Matthew 19:18-19) (Jesus also said as a part of these commands, “If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor,” - Matthew 19:21).

#1. Loving God (according to the 1st greatest commandment) is a part of inheriting eternal life (See: Luke 10:25-28).
#2. Loving your neighbor (according to the 2nd greatest commandment) is a part of inheriting eternal life (See: Luke 10:25-28).
#3. Believing in Jesus is a part of having everlasting life (John 3:16). Loving one another (the brethren) is a part of everlasting life (See: 1 John 3:15, and 1 John 3:10).
#4. Repentance is a part of salvation. For Jesus said, “I tell you, no; but unless you repent you will all likewise perish.” (Luke 13:3) (NKJV).
#5. Loving one another (Repeat command - But it’s focus is on loving Jesus as He loved the disciples) (See #3).
#6. Watching for the return of our Lord is for salvation. The church that was said that they have a name that says they are alive but they are actually dead. They are told to watch. Also, in the Parable of the 10 Virgins (Matthew 25:1-13), the 5 foolish virgins who did not watch and who did not have enough oil in their lamps (i.e. they did not really have the Holy Spirit), the Lord said He did not know them when they knocked and He did not open the door to let them in.
#7. Honor your Father and Mother is attached to the words of our Lord telling us if you will enter into life, keep the commandments (Matthew 19:17).
#8. Fighting the good fight of faith tells us right in the verse that it is a part of laying hold in eternal life (Please read very slowly several times in prayer: 1 Timothy 6:12).
#9. Jesus tells us about various commandments as a part of entering into life to the young rich ruler (Please read: Matthew 19:16-23).

 

[Gospel Believer]

Before proceeding with your Unbiblical list of works for Salvation, please allow me to stop you in your tracks.....NOBODY .....repeat ..... NOBODY has ever obeyed the Command to love God with ALL of your heart, ALL of your Soul etc.....in addition , NOBODY has EVER loved their neighbor as much as they loved themselves....( the last time you selfishly bought a shirt, did you also buy one for that neighbor that you supposedly love just as much as you love yourself? Yeah.....I thought not.)

This is a simple and obvious example how we can NEVER measure up to God’s Standard if you choose to take the “ Performance” route in order to get Justified.....As for myself, I cling to the Grace of God Plus Nothing to get me Home .....of course you do not see the absolute need for Grace because more than likely you have never experienced it.....that is scary......you do not see the need for Grace and therefore you reject the only thing that can Save you....” It is by GRACE that you are Saved”......” It is GRACE that teaches us to say No to Sin” .......Good Luck with you Rule -Keeping and your Performance .....two good things in and of themselves perhaps , but they do not save and only lead to pride and self- Righteousness and Religious finger- pointing...

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Before proceeding with your Unbiblical list of works for Salvation, please allow me to stop you in your tracks.....NOBODY .....repeat ..... NOBODY has ever obeyed the Command to love God with ALL of your heart, ALL of your Soul etc.....in addition , NOBODY has EVER loved their neighbor as much as they loved themselves....( the last time you selfishly bought a shirt, did you also buy one for that neighbor that you supposedly love just as much as you love yourself? Yeah.....I thought not.)

This is a simple and obvious example how we can NEVER measure up to God’s Standard if you choose to take the “ Performance” route in order to get Justified.....As for myself, I cling to the Grace of God Plus Nothing to get me Home .....of course you do not see the absolute need for Grace because more than likely you have never experienced it.....that is scary......you do not see the need for Grace and therefore you reject the only thing that can Save you....” It is by GRACE that you are Saved”......” It is GRACE that teaches us to say No to Sin” .......Good Luck with you Rule -Keeping and your Performance .....two good things in and of themselves perhaps , but they do not save and only lead to pride and self- Righteousness and Religious finger- pointing...

The Word of God is true in what it says. You cannot accept it because you believe it is impossible. But with God, all things are possible. See… this is a faith thing. Your not believing this part of the Bible because YOU say it is impossible or because YOU don’t see anbody doing it. But faith is not by sight but it is unseen. We believe the Bible even when it seems impossible. For have you seen anybody rise from the grave?

It’s true that believers are saved by God’s grace through faith without works (Ephesians 2:8-9), but this is in reference to our Initial Salvation (See Ephesians 2:1). In fact, God’s grace teaches us to deny ungodliness and that we should live righteously and godly in this present world (Titus 2:11-12). Yes, we are first saved by believing the gospel message in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4. But do you even realize that the gospel calls us? According to Scripture the gospel calls us to:…. God has chosen you to salvation through the Sanctification of the Spirit and a belief of the truth (2 Thessalonians 2:13-14). 2 Thessalonians 2:13, Romans 8:13, 2 Corinthians 7:1 is a different aspect of salvation then Ephesians 2:8-9. Grace gives us the ability to do the work (1 Corinthians 15:10).

I mean, what is your opinion of Galatians 6:8-9? It says the person who sows to the Spirit shall reap life everlasting In verse 8. Then in verse 9 it says let us not be wearing in well doing (good works) for we will reap if we faint not. Meaning, sowing to the Spirit is “welling doing.” We must be involved in well doing (by the Spirit) other wise we will not reap everlasting life. It’s just that simple if you simply believe your Bible plainly.

 

[MatthewG]

Believe and love.

 

[Gospel Believer]

The Word of God is true in what it says. You cannot accept it because you believe it is impossible. But with God, all things are possible. See… this is a faith thing. Your not believing this part of the Bible because YOU say it is impossible or because YOU don’t see anbody doing it. But faith is not by sight but it is unseen. We believe the Bible even when it seems impossible. For have you seen anybody rise from the grave?

It’s true that believers are saved by God’s grace through faith without works (Ephesians 2:8-9), but this is in reference to our Initial Salvation (See Ephesians 2:1). In fact, God’s grace teaches us to deny ungodliness and that we should live righteously and godly in this present world (Titus 2:11-12). Yes, we are first saved by believing the gospel message in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4. But do you even realize that the gospel calls us? According to Scripture the gospel calls us to:…. God has chosen you to salvation through the Sanctification of the Spirit and a belief of the truth (2 Thessalonians 2:13-14). 2 Thessalonians 2:13, Romans 8:13, 2 Corinthians 7:1 is a different aspect of salvation then Ephesians 2:8-9. Grace gives us the ability to do the work (1 Corinthians 15:10).

I mean, what is your opinion of Galatians 6:8-9? It says the person who sows to the Spirit shall reap life everlasting In verse 8. Then in verse 9 it says let us not be wearing in well doing (good works) for we will reap if we faint not. Meaning, sowing to the Spirit is “welling doing.” We must be involved in well doing (by the Spirit) other wise we will not reap everlasting life. It’s just that simple if you simply believe your Bible plainly.

It’s the same old story......Jesus Saves—- * BUT!”...........Jesus might be “Essential” for Salvation—- He Just isn’t “ Adequate” for Salvation......What’s with this “ Initial” Salvation clap- trap? Lol.....how about a little Chapter and Verse for “that” Brand New Unbiblical excuse to add Works to the Finished Work Of The Cross....

As for Galatians 6:8-9 ? I don’t care if we have to “ sow to the Spirit “......I don’t care if we have to “ persevere “ .....I don’t care if we have to juggle twenty buzzing chain saws in the air at the same time! God Promises that it is * HE* that will keep you strong.....*God* is the One that Promises to Save you if you simply ask Him to....God Promises that it is * He* that will declare you “ Blameless” on Judgement Day.....The “ Monkey” is on God’s back to see that I get Saved once I “ Turn to Him” ...Do we Trust God to keep His Promises Or don’t we?

No matter what Roadblock any Legalist tries to put in my way when it comes to Salvation , God will see that it is taken care of.....” Salvation is Of the Lord” ......If it we’re up to us to keep ourselves Saved, we wouldn’t last three minutes....it’s like Paul said—- I started my Christian Walk by Trusting God and I’m gonna finish it the same way....If I have to “ Sow to the Spirit” to get Saved, you can bet your bottom dollar that I will be sowing to the Spirit....and I WILL be Saved......I actually Trust God to keep His Promises—— THAT is the Faith that God is looking for—— THAT is the kind of Faith That Saves......

 

[Bible Highlighter]

It’s the same old story......Jesus Saves—- * BUT!”...........Jesus might be “Essential” for Salvation—- He Just isn’t “ Adequate” for Salvation......What’s with this “ Initial” Salvation clap- trap? Lol.....how about a little Chapter and Verse for “that” Brand New Unbiblical excuse to add Works to the Finished Work Of The Cross....

As for Galatians 6:8-9 ? I don’t care if we have to “ sow to the Spirit “......I don’t care if we have to “ persevere “ .....I don’t care if we have to juggle twenty buzzing chain saws in the air at the same time! God Promises that it is * HE* that will keep you strong.....*God* is the One that Promises to Save you if you simply ask Him to....God Promises that it is * He* that will declare you “ Blameless” on Judgement Day.....The “ Monkey” is on God’s back to see that I get Saved once I “ Turn to Him” ...Do we Trust God to keep His Promises Or don’t we?

No matter what Roadblock any Legalist tries to put in my way when it comes to Salvation , God will see that it is taken care of.....” Salvation is Of the Lord” ......If it we’re up to us to keep ourselves Saved, we wouldn’t last three minutes....it’s like Paul said—- I started my Christian Walk by Trusting God and I’m gonna finish it the same way....If I have to “ Sow to the Spirit” to get Saved, you can bet your bottom dollar that I will be sowing to the Spirit....and I WILL be Saved......I actually Trust God to keep His Promises—— THAT is the Faith that God is looking for—— THAT is the kind of Faith That Saves......

Your going to have to deal with Galatians 6:8-9 someday. It will either be in this life or at the Judgment. If we don't receive God's Words they will simply judge us on the last day. This includes me, you, and every other person on the planet.

Granted, I believe some verses or passages are difficult to understand (Especially in light of certain passages), and their meaning takes deep study, but we cannot speak against what the Bible says. Your belief simply does not align with what Galatians 6:8-9 plainly says.

How about if you keep reading Galatians 6:8-9 over and over and over and over again. Put that passage on the inside of you and believe it and don't speak against what it says.

For right now you are speaking against this passage. You cannot have a holey bible full of holes (Whereby you only believe in certain parts of it). You have to believe the whole counsel of God's Word.

 

[MatthewG]

Galatians 6

Young's Literal Translation

​

6 Brethren, if a man also may be overtaken in any trespass, ye who [are] spiritual restore such a one in a spirit of meekness, considering thyself -- lest thou also may be tempted;
2 of one another the burdens bear ye, and so fill up the law of the Christ,
3 for if any one doth think [himself] to be something -- being nothing -- himself he doth deceive;
4 and his own work let each one prove, and then in regard to himself alone the glorying he shall have, and not in regard to the other,
5 for each one his own burden shall bear.
6 And let him who is instructed in the word share with him who is instructing -- in all good things.
7 Be not led astray; God is not mocked; for what a man may sow -- that also he shall reap,
8 because he who is sowing to his own flesh, of the flesh shall reap corruption; and he who is sowing to the Spirit, of the Spirit shall reap life age-during;
9 and in the doing good we may not be faint-hearted, for at the proper time we shall reap -- not desponding;
10 therefore, then, as we have opportunity, may we work the good to all, and especially unto those of the household of the faith.
11 Ye see in how large letters I have written to you with my own hand;
12 as many as are willing to make a good appearance in the flesh, these constrain you to be circumcised -- only that for the cross of the Christ they may not be persecuted,
13 for neither do those circumcised themselves keep the law, but they wish you to be circumcised, that in your flesh they may glory.
14 And for me, let it not be -- to glory, except in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, through which to me the world hath been crucified, and I to the world;
15 for in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth anything, nor uncircumcision, but a new creation;
16 and as many as by this rule do walk -- peace upon them, and kindness, and on the Israel of God!
17 Henceforth, let no one give me trouble, for I the scars of the Lord Jesus in my body do bear.
18 The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ [is] with your spirit, brethren! Amen.

 

[Gospel Believer]

Your going to have to deal with Galatians 6:8-9 someday. It will either be in this life or at the Judgment. If we don't receive God's Words they will simply judge us on the last day. This includes me, you, and every other person on the planet.

Granted, I believe some verses or passages are difficult to understand (Especially in light of certain passages), and their meaning takes deep study, but we cannot speak against what the Bible says. Your belief simply does not align with what Galatians 6:8-9 plainly says.

How about if you keep reading Galatians 6:8-9 over and over and over and over again. Put that passage on the inside of you and believe it and don't speak against what it says.

For right now you are speaking against this passage. You cannot have a holey bible full of holes (Whereby you only believe in certain parts of it). You have to believe the whole counsel of God's Word.

You admit that some verses are “ difficult to understand” , so let me put forth a verse of Scripture that is NOT hard to understand.....Ephesians 2:8 “ It is by Grace that you are Saved , thru Faith lest any man should boast” Do we take verses that require “ deep study” and let them supersede verses that are so simple that they can’t be argued with?

I would suggest that you read that verse over and over and over and over again and put it on the inside of you and believe it and don’t speak against what it says......right now you are speaking against this passage and your holey Bible is full of holes....( you are only believing the certain parts that you like) ....Don’t you realize that you have to believe the whole council of God's Word)

If one interprets this “ hard to understand” verse in the same manner that you do, ( Saved by Works) it would invalidate dozens of verses and essentially turn Paul’s Gospel Of Grace into a joke.....

The Unsaved man can not “ Sow to the Spirit” because he does not have that Spirit indwelling him....One obtains the “ Life Everlasting” talked about in this verse by having the Holy Spirit within him—- Not by doing the Good Deeds That this same Spirit inspires......The Ultimate “ Sowing to the Spirit” and the only “ Sowing” That Saves a Soul is Believing the Gospel Of 1 Cor :1-4....Anybody can perform “ well doing” acts and that is why this verse distinguishes between the Lost man and the Saved Man .....Everything The Lost man does is from the Flesh.....that’s all he has......His “Best” works are “ Filthy Rags”......Our Verse in question says that good deeds that are “ FROM THE SPIRIT” is what gives you Eternal Life.....It’s not what you do.....it’s what The Spirit does THROUGH you......It is that Indwelling Spirit that “prompts” the good Works That Saves.....NOT those good works in and of themselves.....

You say that I have to “ deal” with Galatians verse 8 ? I just did.....you can’t deal” with it until you understand it....as I say, to be understood “ your” way, turns the entire Bible on its head.....Doctrine is vital....one can never replace a clear and simple Bible verse like Ephesians2:8 with verses that are, as you admit, Difficult to understand..... any Newbies to the Faith out there? You can take that last statement to the Bank.....

 

[MatthewG]

You admit that some verses are “ difficult to understand” , so let me put forth a verse of Scripture that is NOT hard to understand.....Ephesians 2:8 “ It is by Grace that you are Saved , thru Faith lest any man should boast” Do we take verses that require “ deep study” and let them supersede verses that are so simple that they can’t be argued with?

I would suggest that you read that verse over and over and over and over again and put it on the inside of you and believe it and don’t speak against what it says......right now you are speaking against this passage and your holey Bible is full of holes....( you are only believing the certain parts that you like) ....Don’t you realize that you have to believe the whole council of God's Word)

If one interprets this “ hard to understand” verse in the same manner that you do, ( Saved by Works) it would invalidate dozens of verses and essentially turn Paul’s Gospel Of Grace into a joke.....

The Unsaved man can not “ Sow to the Spirit” because he does not have that Spirit indwelling him....One obtains the “ Life Everlasting” talked about in this verse by having the Holy Spirit within him—- Not by doing the Good Deeds That this same Spirit inspires......The Ultimate “ Sowing to the Spirit” and the only “ Sowing” That Saves a Soul is Believing the Gospel Of 1 Cor :1-4....Anybody can perform “ well doing” acts and that is why this verse distinguishes between the Lost man and the Saved Man .....Everything The Lost man does is from the Flesh.....that’s all he has......His “Best” works are “ Filthy Rags”......Our Verse in question says that good deeds that are “ FROM THE SPIRIT” is what gives you Eternal Life.....It’s not what you do.....it’s what The Spirit does THROUGH you......It is that Indwelling Spirit that “prompts” the good Works That Saves.....NOT those good works in and of themselves.....

You say that I have to “ deal” with Galatians verse 8 ? I just did.....you can’t deal” with it until you understand it....as I say, to be understood “ your” way, turns the entire Bible on its head.....Doctrine is vital....one can never replace a clear and simple Bible verse like Ephesians2:8 with verses that are, as you admit, Difficult to understand..... any Newbies to the Faith out there? You can take that last statement to the Bank.....

I will say Gospel friend there are some things that hard to interpret but most can be reconciled by the use of comparing. Scripture with scripture and of course asking God to help by the spirit to help with whatever a person may be studying.

From what I’ve heard there are many sections that go through and try to make doctrines form the use of numbers and putting things together, so many different perceptions out there.

The Bible is the main source they are some things it’s hard to say for certain what the verse may infer to beening depending on if anyone ommentprs agree one the same interpretations.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

You admit that some verses are “ difficult to understand” , so let me put forth a verse of Scripture that is NOT hard to understand.....Ephesians 2:8 “ It is by Grace that you are Saved , thru Faith lest any man should boast” Do we take verses that require “ deep study” and let them supersede verses that are so simple that they can’t be argued with?

I was not referring to how Ephesians 2:8-9 is difficult to understand. I know what Paul is saying here and he is referring to how we are initially saved. How many times were you quickened or made alive? See Ephesians 2:1. Read the context, it says: “Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:”; How many times do you receive a gift? Just one time, right? Ephesians 2:8 basically says our being saved by God’s grace is a gift of God. So this is referring to our Initial Salvation. For you don’t receive gifts over and over and over again. It’s talking about how when you first got saved.

I would suggest that you read that verse over and over and over and over again and put it on the inside of you and believe it and don’t speak against what it says......

I told these words to you and now you are being sarcastic by repeating what I said.

right now you are speaking against this passage and your holey Bible is full of holes....( you are only believing the certain parts that you like) ....Don’t you realize that you have to believe the whole council of God's Word)

I believe Ephesians 2:8-9 just fine. But you misinterpret the context to make it something more than what it says at the expense of other verses in Scripture.

If one interprets this “ hard to understand” verse in the same manner that you do, ( Saved by Works) it would invalidate dozens of verses and essentially turn Paul’s Gospel Of Grace into a joke.....

Sorry. Your gospel does not exist in the Scriptures because it turns God’s grace into a license for immorality (See: Jude 1:4). No amount of sin can be justified under God’s grace. For Paul asks, shall we continue in sin so that grace may abound? His answer is, God forbid (Romans 6:1-2). Meaning, you cannot do so.

I say this because if you agreed with what Galatians 6:8-9 says plainly, you would not be trying to speak against it. For a believer who does not think they can sin and still be saved will not read Galatians 6:8-9 in such a way to undo what it plainly says (like you have done).

The Unsaved man can not “ Sow to the Spirit” because he does not have that Spirit indwelling him....One obtains the “ Life Everlasting” talked about in this verse by having the Holy Spirit within him—- Not by doing the Good Deeds That this same Spirit inspires......The Ultimate “ Sowing to the Spirit” and the only “ Sowing” That Saves a Soul is Believing the Gospel Of 1 Cor :1-4....Anybody can perform “ well doing” acts and that is why this verse distinguishes between the Lost man and the Saved Man .....Everything The Lost man does is from the Flesh.....that’s all he has......His “Best” works are “ Filthy Rags”......Our Verse in question says that good deeds that are “ FROM THE SPIRIT” is what gives you Eternal Life.....It’s not what you do.....it’s what The Spirit does THROUGH you......It is that Indwelling Spirit that “prompts” the good Works That Saves.....NOT those good works in and of themselves.....

Okay. First, I never said that I do something separate from the Holy Spirit in Galatians 6:8-9.
Galatians 6:8-9 is talking to the believer, as well. I never made a case that this was referring to an unbeliever so you are barking up the wrong tree.

Anyways, I have known for a very long time that God ultimately does the good works through a believer. Believers have the fruits of the Spirit. Jesus said you can do nothing without me. But God is not going to force you to do good works through you, either. The Parable of the Talents is just one example of a warning to us believers of how we cannot be unfruitful or unfaithful or we will not enter the joy of our Lord (See: Matthew 25:14-30). In addition: We are told in Scripture to continue in the faith. Continue in God’s grace. Keep yourselves in the love of God. Continue in His goodness. So it’s synergistic.

Second, when you read verses like Isaiah 64:6 about the Israelite's righteousness as being filthy rags, you also have to read the context before it, friend.

“Thou meetest him that rejoiceth and worketh righteousness, those that remember thee in thy ways: behold, thou art wroth; for we have sinned: in those is continuance, and we shall be saved.” (Isaiah 64:5).

The “Thou” is in reference to God. It is saying God meets that person who rejoices and works righteousness and those who remember God in His ways. Verse 5 also says that they (i.e. the Israelites) have sinned. So this shows that their righteousness is not the righteous acts or deeds of God because they were sinning, and God meets those who rejoice and work righteousness. So obviously verse 5 is talking about the righteous acts of God that He requires of us, and verse 6 is refering to man directed righteous deeds that God did not tell them to do. Remember when Jesus condemned the Pharisees for their man made traditions? This is what it is talking about. The Israelites were not unbelievers. They simply were in sin and they were justifying man made traditions. The Lord requires us to do works of righteousness (Ephesians 2:10).

Three, if you were to more carefully read Galatians 6:8-9 it says we will reap if we FAINT NOT. This is in well doing (Good works) and the burden of sowing in well doing falls on you the reader (i.e. the believer). If things were as you say, then there would be no admonishment to us in saying that we could potentially faint in well doing. It would say that we are guaranteed in never fainting and we will reap because we had some past salvation experience. But it simply does not say that.

You say that I have to “ deal” with Galatians verse 8 ? I just did.....you can’t deal” with it until you understand it....as I say, to be understood “ your” way, turns the entire Bible on its head.....Doctrine is vital....one can never replace a clear and simple Bible verse like Ephesians2:8 with verses that are, as you admit, Difficult to understand..... any Newbies to the Faith out there? You can take that last statement to the Bank.....

You speak of things that you really don’t understand. Again, you are not believing verse 9 in that it says we will reap if we faint not. You don’t believe you will faint not even though that is what the verse says. It says let us not be weary in well doing. So the burden of us doing well doing rests on us (along with God working in our life). But you ignore that you can faint In sowing to the Spirit in Galatians 6:8-9.

Titus 2:11-12 says God’s grace teaches us to deny ungodliness and that we should live righteously and godly in this present world.

Grace gives us the ability to do the work (See: 1 Corinthians 15:10).

But many today want to justify sin under God’s grace.

Isaiah 26:10 (NKJV) says:
Let grace be shown to the wicked, Yet he will not learn righteousness; In the land of uprightness he will deal unjustly, And will not behold the majesty of the LORD.

 

[Gospel Believer]

I was not referring to how Ephesians 2:8-9 is difficult to understand. I know what Paul is saying here and he is referring to how we are initially saved. How many times were you quickened or made alive? See Ephesians 2:1. Read the context, it says: “Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:”; How many times do you receive a gift? Just one time, right? Ephesians 2:8 basically says our being saved by God’s grace is a gift of God. So this is referring to our Initial Salvation. For you don’t receive gifts over and over and over again. It’s talking about how when you first got saved.


I told these words to you and now you are being sarcastic by repeating what I said.



I believe Ephesians 2:8-9 just fine. But you misinterpret the context to make it something more than what it says at the expense of other verses in Scripture.



Sorry. Your gospel does not exist in the Scriptures because it turns God’s grace into a license for immorality (See: Jude 1:4). No amount of sin can be justified under God’s grace. For Paul asks, shall we continue in sin so that grace may abound? His answer is, God forbid (Romans 6:1-2). Meaning, you cannot do so.



Okay. First, I never said that I do something separate from the Holy Spirit in Galatians 6:8-9.
Galatians 6:8-9 is talking to the believer, as well. I never made a case that this was referring to an unbeliever so you are barking up the wrong tree.

Anyways, I have known for a very long time that God ultimately does the good works through a believer. Believers have the fruits of the Spirit. Jesus said you can do nothing without me. But God is not going to force you to do good works through you, either. The Parable of the Talents is just one example of a warning to us believers of how we cannot be unfruitful or unfaithful or we will not enter the joy of our Lord (See: Matthew 25:14-30). In addition: We are told in Scripture to continue in the faith. Continue in God’s grace. Keep yourselves in the love of God. Continue in His goodness. So it’s synergistic.

Second, when you read verses like Isaiah 64:6 about the Israelite's righteousness as being filthy rags, you also have to read the context before it, friend.

“Thou meetest him that rejoiceth and worketh righteousness, those that remember thee in thy ways: behold, thou art wroth; for we have sinned: in those is continuance, and we shall be saved.” (Isaiah 64:5).

The “Thou” is in reference to God. It is saying God meets that person who rejoices and works righteousness and those who remember God in His ways. Verse 5 also says that they (i.e. the Israelites) have sinned. So this shows that their righteousness is not the righteous acts or deeds of God because they were sinning, and God meets those who rejoice and work righteousness. So obviously verse 5 is talking about the righteous acts of God that He requires of us, and verse 6 is refering to man directed righteous deeds that God did not tell them to do. Remember when Jesus condemned the Pharisees for their man made traditions? This is what it is talking about. The Israelites were not unbelievers. They simply were in sin and they were justifying man made traditions. The Lord requires us to do works of righteousness (Ephesians 2:10).

Three, if you were to more carefully read Galatians 6:8-9 it says we will reap if we FAINT NOT. This is in well doing (Good works) and the burden of sowing in well doing falls on you the reader (i.e. the believer). If things were as you say, then there would be no admonishment to us in saying that we could potentially faint in well doing. It would say that we are guaranteed in never fainting and we will reap because we had some past salvation experience. But it simply does not say that.


You speak of things that you really don’t understand. Again, you are not believing verse 9 in that it says we will reap if we faint not. You don’t believe you will faint not even though that is what the verse says.

Titus 2:11-12 says God’s grace teaches us to deny ungodliness and that we should live righteously and godly in this present world.

Isaiah 26:10 (NKJV) says:
Let grace be shown to the wicked, Yet he will not learn righteousness; In the land of uprightness he will deal unjustly, And will not behold the majesty of the LORD.

You have made your case and I have made mine.....let the reader decide......May God grant us all Wisdom in this and other matters...

 

[Bible Highlighter]

You have made your case and I have made mine.....let the reader decide......May God grant us all Wisdom in this and other matters...

Talking to us believers: It says LET US NOT BE WEARY IN WELL DOING. It does not lay the burden solely on the Spirit doing the well doing here. So you the believer have to not be WEARY IN WELL DOING. Any believer with no agenda to change the passage is just going to read and believe this passage at face value. Your belief does not allow for a normal reading of Galatians 6:8-9.

 

[Gospel Believer]

Talking to us believers: It says LET US NOT BE WEARY IN WELL DOING. It does not lay the burden solely on the Spirit doing the well doing here. So you the believer have to not be WEARY IN WELL DOING. Any believer with no agenda to change the passage is just going to read and believe this passage at face value. Your belief does not allow for a normal reading of Galatians 6:8-

It appears that we disagree.......

 

[Angel Faith]

Does God expect us to obey the hundreds of New Testament commands on day one of our service to be saved (after we are saved by God’s grace)?

The charge has been claimed by Belief Alone Salvationists that you must obey all of the New Testament commands (or that you must reach a state of Sinless Perfection whereby you can never sin again) in order for salvation by obedience to be valid after you are saved by God’s grace. This is why many believe that all you have to do is just believe in Jesus for salvation or the finished work of the cross and you are good to enter the Kingdom.

I believe the Bible teaches that Sanctification is a process of living holy by the Spirit. It’s why Romans 8:13 says but if you put to death the misdeeds of the body by the Spirit you will live (i.e. live eternally). 2 Corinthians 7:1 says let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit perfecting holiness in the fear of God. These verses would not make any sense if we were automatically perfectly obeying all of the Lord’s commands in the New Testament on day one and we could never slip up on rare occasion and break God’s commands ever again. Granted, I am not against a new believer being able to do that. I would be for the brethren doing that since day one if we had strong Christian leaders training new converts to obey in all things right away. But that’s not always the reality for everyone. The thief on the cross was saved without works. But for those who live out their faith: I believe God gives us grace and time to learn His Word and to study it so as to know His will and to learn how to obey God.

Abraham did not even fulfill the command by God to take his son’s life. Abraham did not sacrifice Isaac and yet God was telling him to do that. God was testing Abraham’s loyalty. So it’s a willingness of our heart to obey God. For example: We are told to make disciples and baptize them in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost teaching them all things that Christ commanded. Can you do that on day one after you are saved? What if you are in the mountains and there is nobody but you and the other person who led you to Jesus? Again, can you know of all of what Christ commands on day one? I imagine in some circumstances you could (if you had the right teachers). But is one not saved while they are still learning of those commands and they are not obeying them yet? This is why I believe there is grace. This grace is not a license for immorality of us thinking we can willfully sin. No, no. Most certainly not. We must seek to obey God in everything. Why? Because it is a part of our faith. It is our willingness to obey that I believe God is looking at before we can learn of that command and put into action. I say this because how many of you here are obeying the great commission in baptizing others in the name of Jesus (i.e. the name (singular) that represents the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit)? That’s a command by Jesus. Are you doing it? Are you not saved because you have not done so yet? I don’t believe so. I believe God gives us grace and time to do those things He desires of us. We should pray and ask God for help to obey Him in all things.

This also does not mean that we do not have to obey God as a part of God’s plan of salvation, either. 2 Thessalonians 2:13-14 says God has chosen us to salvation through the Sanctification of the Spirit and a belief of the truth (Which is a call of the gospel). The gospel is 1 Corinthians 15:1-4. But the CALL of the gospel is our Sanctification (living holy by the Spirit and putting away sin and learning to know how to obey God), and continuing to believe the doctrines and or truths in the Bible.

Note: I believe that if a Christian sins (like say looking upon a woman in lust, or not forgiving someone), they must confess and forsake that sin. Believers need to strive to seek to obey all of God’s commands. This is a part of living by faith. If we are not seeking to obey God as a part of the Kingdom, we are simply seeking to be our own lords and masters. God calls us to obedience and to pick up our cross and to deny ourselves. We have to count the cost and we have to be willing to give up all for the Lord Jesus. Again, this takes time for many of us to learn. There are many tests of our faith along the way. Our faith is not always a walk in the park. Jesus said, strive to enter the straight gate (Luke 13:24). So yes. We should be striving to obey the commands that come from the Lord Jesus and His followers in the New Testament. But I believe God gives us grace to get there. For grace gives us the ability to do the work (1 Corinthians 15:10).

I see it as like a baby learning to walk. Baby steps. Slow graduation from our old muscle memory of crawling, being close to the ground.
And then slowly trust and grow stronger and leave that place of familiarity to grow in the faith one can achieve more.

 

[mailmandan]

You admit that some verses are “ difficult to understand” , so let me put forth a verse of Scripture that is NOT hard to understand.....Ephesians 2:8 “ It is by Grace that you are Saved , thru Faith lest any man should boast” Do we take verses that require “ deep study” and let them supersede verses that are so simple that they can’t be argued with?

I would suggest that you read that verse over and over and over and over again and put it on the inside of you and believe it and don’t speak against what it says......right now you are speaking against this passage and your holey Bible is full of holes....( you are only believing the certain parts that you like) ....Don’t you realize that you have to believe the whole council of God's Word)

If one interprets this “ hard to understand” verse in the same manner that you do, ( Saved by Works) it would invalidate dozens of verses and essentially turn Paul’s Gospel Of Grace into a joke.....

The Unsaved man can not “ Sow to the Spirit” because he does not have that Spirit indwelling him....One obtains the “ Life Everlasting” talked about in this verse by having the Holy Spirit within him—- Not by doing the Good Deeds That this same Spirit inspires......The Ultimate “ Sowing to the Spirit” and the only “ Sowing” That Saves a Soul is Believing the Gospel Of 1 Cor :1-4....Anybody can perform “ well doing” acts and that is why this verse distinguishes between the Lost man and the Saved Man .....Everything The Lost man does is from the Flesh.....that’s all he has......His “Best” works are “ Filthy Rags”......Our Verse in question says that good deeds that are “ FROM THE SPIRIT” is what gives you Eternal Life.....It’s not what you do.....it’s what The Spirit does THROUGH you......It is that Indwelling Spirit that “prompts” the good Works That Saves.....NOT those good works in and of themselves.....

You say that I have to “ deal” with Galatians verse 8 ? I just did.....you can’t deal” with it until you understand it....as I say, to be understood “ your” way, turns the entire Bible on its head.....Doctrine is vital....one can never replace a clear and simple Bible verse like Ephesians2:8 with verses that are, as you admit, Difficult to understand..... any Newbies to the Faith out there? You can take that last statement to the Bank.....

That salvation is by grace through faith and is not by works (Ephesians 2:8,9) is not hard to understand. It's just hard for works-salvationists to ACCEPT. It's a shame that HUMAN PRIDE will not allow works-salvationists to trust in Jesus Christ as the ALL-SUFFICIENT means of their salvation. Their hands are FULL OF THEIR WORKS/SELF PERFORMANCE and they will not let go in order to receive Christ through faith. At best, such people only trust in Christ as their "initial" Savior, but not their ultimate Savior. Truly sad. Self righteousness is a cancer to the gospel.