Fear God or Presume acceptance

[marks]

Another question I can't seem to get anyone with this view to answer . . .

By what Act are we justified?

 

[FollowHim]

It's not impossible, not at all! In faith we do just that.

I was surprised how many people of faith do not believe this.

There is a self fulfilling prophecy by not trying or believing one will fail. All fail to climb Everest if they never go to base camp. So the first question I ask did Jesus say "Welcome good and faithful servant". If Jesus says this to any, literally it is possible.

So yes it is possible so unbelievers are wrong. God bless you

 

[marks]

I was surprised how many people of faith do not believe this.

There is a self fulfilling prophecy by not trying or believing one will fail. All fail to climb Everest if they never go to base camp. So the first question I ask did Jesus say "Welcome good and faithful servant". If Jesus says this to any, literally it is possible.

So yes it is possible so unbelievers are wrong. God bless you

In a way I'm surprised, but then, I too think there is a lot of wrong teaching around.

But that's just my point. If you don't think you can, then you're not going to be doing it.

We can think to ourselves, Jesus is supposed to make me free, and then we try to live in freedom, with very mixed results.

But when we think to ourselves, Jesus DID made me free, and we believe that, then we walk in that freedom - in truth!

Not as some theological position, theory, wish, but in reality.

Because Jesus HAS made us free.

I don't believe God is a liar, or disengenous in any way. So when He says, be holy as God is holy, it's because that's how He wants us to live. Not in some mocking way . . . Be Holy! Sure! As if you could!

In faith, trusting Jesus, He lives His live through ours, righteous, holy.

Much love!

 

[FollowHim]

So . . . you invent your 'opponent', then argue against your invention?

Sadly this was not my invention, it was a quote of a member of a forum who I know and am shocked at their claims said in all seriousness.

It demonstrates why in the public domain we need to speak out to put these sentiments to bed. Such sentiments historically have led to murders, which can be opposed before such notions grow too far.

 

[Helen]

Love the way christians throw this about, have you stopped sinning????

This is one of those threads which comes around and around every now and again.

It is not hard to perceive that 'some christian' believe they are much better than others. So they must also believe that they are better, or holier, or more righteous than other here.
Which means that 'they' have got it right while others have not.

Which , again must mean that they have done something to improve their lot, while the rest of us have done done whatever they have done to be right with God!!
Which bring us back again to works righteousness v faith righteousness.

Well at least I am happy for them that they can live believing that they ave helped Jesus improve on what He did on the cross.

 

[marks]

Sadly this was not my invention, it was a quote of a member of a forum who I know and am shocked at their claims said in all seriousness.

It demonstrates why in the public domain we need to speak out to put these sentiments to bed. Such sentiments historically have led to murders, which can be opposed before such notions grow too far.

That is sad.

I find both extremes very troubling, myself. The one that says, unless you never sin, you're not even a Christian, as well as the other that says you can never stop sinning.

Much love!

 

[Helen]

Consider this carefully.

'Someone' said - " Let him who is without sin cast the first stone."

I get so tired of those who believe they have 'arrived', telling the rest of us that we are not 'in the truth'...like they are..

A person puts up a post and some here rate it..by saying...error, or true.
Thus putting themselves in the place of the judge of what is truth and what is error...yet never seem to examine the plank in their own eye.

A lots of stone throwing...yet I do not see anyone who has the qualifications of sinlessness , to be able look at Jesus in the eye and clean enough to throw their stone... being without sin! Why do they believe they are better than those that Jesus spoke to back then?

 

[Joseph77]

What do you mean?

The question simply is, do you commit sins?

What I mean is, pick or ask a true, honest, question from Scripture, with the attitude and motivation by and of and from Jesus, by the Father's Instruction -

Not a question that apparently often, worldwide, et al, has an ulterior motive.

 

[FollowHim]

That is sad.

I find both extremes very troubling, myself. The one that says, unless you never sin, you're not even a Christian, as well as the other that says you can never stop sinning.

Much love!

The answer to extremes is a bright light, shinning in the darkness. Truth lived out, honesty made real, victory proclaimed and lived.
Peter learnt this after his denial. He knew it all, but held back just to see what would happen, which was like saying Jesus was not trustworthy, and whatever came to pass the Kingdom would reign.

I have learnt when I see the way, it is easy to answer through scripture, because our hearts echo the realities, and we can find the words to show this. God bless you

 

[Episkopos]

It is very difficult to be accepted INTO Christ. It takes a lot of faith and seeking the Lord. And it is the Lord who does the work of translating people into the kingdom. Now we are to encourage each other in this endeavour. The devil does NOT want any of us to penetrate into the kingdom realm so as to threaten his domain.

But it makes it harder when believers bring unbelief into the mix. These are unwittingly doing the devil's work for him...bringing in incredulity and criticism...where edification and faith are required.

So if people can see the church as a team sport...which few do....then any success for one member is received with joy from the rest.

But that's not what happens. A house divided against itself cannot stand. And this is the state of the modern church.

Whereas we should be encouraging and exhorting people to seek the Lord and enter into the kingdom realm...there is very little faith and much doubt that we can do anything beyond normal life in Christ.

But we can do all things in Christ. For most this is but an empty theory. But it shouldn't be that way among professing believers.

So then the chief enemy of our faith is fellow believers.

 

[marks]

What I mean is, pick or ask a true, honest, question from Scripture, with the attitude and motivation by and of and from Jesus, by the Father's Instruction -

Not a question that apparently often, worldwide, et al, has an ulterior motive.

You don't think this is in the context of this discussion? Why not? And you don't think that this is a question God would want me to be asking? Again, Why not?

Much love!

 

[marks]

The answer to extremes is a bright light, shinning in the darkness. Truth lived out, honesty made real, victory proclaimed and lived.

Beautiful!

This is why I'm here, to keep these truths ever before my eyes.

Peter learnt this after his denial. He knew it all, but held back just to see what would happen, which was like saying Jesus was not trustworthy, and whatever came to pass the Kingdom would reign.

When Jesus signified how Peter would die, He only said that they will take you where you don't want to go.

History tells us Peter was crucified. If Jesus could tell Peter he would be crucified just by saying, where you don't want to go, this tells me that this was the death Peter especially hated, dreaded.

Peter was ready to died fighting for Jesus, and he would have if Jesus hadn't stopped it. But when Peter saw that Jesus was just meekly going along with their plan to put Jesus on a cross, Peter just couldn't go down that road. I think it simply horrified him. Peter was willing to die, but not that death.

Later he would be. The death by which he would glorify God. Even that death.

I think this describes the depth of the change in us that is needed to renew our minds from the mind of the flesh to the mind of Christ.

I think many don't really understand the death we die in Him, how total it actually is. We just can't think of death only as what we experience with our senses, a person now gone, inanimate, over.

We only see the remains, what is left behind when the person has left.

We are no more subject to the desires and deceptions of our flesh then the physically dead are. And yet we are alive!

Still in this realm, able to bear fruit.

I have learnt when I see the way, it is easy to answer through scripture, because our hearts echo the realities, and we can find the words to show this. God bless you

I like this too! One of the wonderful blessings in Christ is to read the Word, and to see your life.

2 Corinthians 3:18, beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord transforms us into that same image.

Much love!

 

[marks]

So then the chief enemy of our faith is fellow believers.

That's quite the perspective! It sounds like you very much "divide the house"! But of course the apostle wrote that there must be some division, so it can be seen who is approved.

Of course, you make that announcement with your screenname, isn't that right? Who the approved one is? And who gives approval?

 

[Nancy]

This is one of those threads which comes around and around every now and again.

It is not hard to perceive that 'some christian' believe they are much better than others. So they must also believe that they are better, or holier, or more righteous than other here.
Which means that 'they' have got it right while others have not.

Which , again must mean that they have done something to improve their lot, while the rest of us have done done whatever they have done to be right with God!!
Which bring us back again to works righteousness v faith righteousness.

Well at least I am happy for them that they can live believing that they ave helped Jesus improve on what He did on the cross.

"Well at least I am happy for them that they can live believing that they have helped Jesus improve on what He did on the cross."<--- As if! lol.

"Which , again must mean that they have done something to improve their lot, while the rest of us have done whatever they have..." <---- So glad Christ did the doing! Also that He is no respecter of persons ❤
xo

 

[Enoch111]

James declares we need to come near to God, through obedience and repentance, without which we are not acceptable.

As you will note in this passage, he was addressing those who by their words and actions were not really converted. Hence he calls them "sinners". And sinners are required to repent and obey the Gospel, which means believe on the Lord Jesus Christ.

Jesus says simply we must be written in the Lambs book of Life.

You have a misunderstanding about the Lamb's Book of Life. Everyone's name is written therein, but it is only removed when people refuse to repent and be converted. God says that He will "blot out" (remove) the names of those who sin against Him.

That is because of the misinterpretation of grace that has been taught in the Church during the Reformation. They believe it means getting away with murder...

No one teaches this nonsense. If you think they do, you must quote precisely what was said, and by whom and to whom.

 

[Enoch111]

Not to say he hasn't, only that I haven't seen it.

He (Episkopos) implies it. But he does not understand the meaning of salvation by grace through faith. Therefore he has concocted his own theology. That is also what the Catholic Church as done.

 

[CharismaticLady]

No one teaches this nonsense. If you think they do, you must quote precisely what was said, and by whom and to whom.

If this isn't "sin so grace may abound" I don't know what is! Paul preached the opposite of Martin Luther of the Reformation. And many in the church still teach this anti-holiness dung.

Martin Luther, “Sin Boldly”

Martin Luther "Sin boldly":
"If you are a preacher of mercy, do not preach an imaginary but the true mercy. If the mercy is true, you must therefore bear the true, not an imaginary sin. God does not save those who are only imaginary sinners. Be a sinner, and let your sins be strong, but let your trust in Christ be stronger, and rejoice in Christ who is the victor over sin, death, and the world. We will commit sins while we are here, for this life is not a place where justice resides. We, however, says Peter (2. Peter 3:13) are looking forward to a new heaven and a new earth where justice will reign. It suffices that through God’s glory we have recognized the Lamb who takes away the sin of the world. No sin can separate us from Him, even if we were to kill or commit adultery thousands of times each day. Do you think such an exalted Lamb paid merely a small price with a meager sacrifice for our sins? Pray hard, for you are quite a sinner."

 

[mjrhealth]

You may be in the minority that thinks that in Christ is sin. So some of us have found the perfect saviour.

You need an introduction?

I think the modern church doesn't have any depth of understanding or experience of Christ when compared to the living church of the 1st century. They certainly had their problems. But the leaders had a real spiritual connection to God.

What we have now is a pale shadow of that. No depth or power and a doctrine that emphasizes sinful humanity and the weakness of the flesh...as if Jesus had never established His kingdom at all.

The religion of death says that we must physically die to abide in Christ...to be saved from our sins...and to bear an eternal spiritual fruit.

The true gospel is in the power of the Holy Spirit and cleanses people of all sin...so that we can have fellowship with a Holy God and His Son Jesus. The new man is HOLY...without any spot or wrinkle of sin. We are exhorted to put him on.

Have you ever encountered Jesus?

Introduction to Christ, No I met Him... Its this sin business, Christians come to Christ than they get told you cant sin no more, so they get frustrated because they still do, because christians keep demanding perfection of the imperfect, than they either run away or turn to the law hoping that "it" will perfect them, either way there faith get shattered. And all I can say is, if you believe that He is and God is Faithful, than you can see God, even in your imperfection, because He Jesus Christ is perfect, and when we are in Him, God no longer see us the imperfect, but in His son, who is perfect.

Why it is that christians are so afraid to say they do, i dont know, God isnt blind. Something to do with " being seeing to be". We know what Jesus said of them

Mat_23:26 Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.

 

[Enoch111]

Martin Luther, “Sin Boldly”

We should leave Luther out of this, since he wrote a lot of truth as well as a lot of nonsense. Especially his Anti-Semitic nonsense. You should be quoting some contemporary well-known evangelist or preacher.

 

[Episkopos]

Introduction to Christ, No I met Him... Its this sin business, Christians come to Christ than they get told you cant sin no more, so they get frustrated because they still do, because christians keep demanding perfection of the imperfect, than they either run away or turn to the law hoping that "it" will perfect them, either way there faith get shattered. And all I can say is, if you believe that He is and God is Faithful, than you can see God, even in your imperfection, because He Jesus Christ is perfect, and when we are in Him, God no longer see us the imperfect, but in His son, who is perfect.

Why it is that christians are so afraid to say they do, i dont know, God isnt blind. Something to do with " being seeing to be". We know what Jesus said of them

Mat_23:26 Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.

See you are stuck in Romans 7. The difference between you and Paul is that he was not satisfied to remain in the bondage of sin...and you have been taught that it's normal and ok. But the call of Christ is to move on into the freedom of Christ....where you are set free from that bondage. Through the Spirit...the higher law...you overcome the lower law of sinning and death. You enter into the life from above. THAT is the gospel.

But people deny this life and power and have made the gospel about ignoring sin or being indifferent to sinning. And this Paul would condemn...let alone God.

But few in this time can see how far we have fallen from grace in our time.