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Female Pastors

Discussion in 'Christian Theology Forum' started by 101G, Apr 20, 2013.

  1. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly New Member

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    Maybe, but maybe not. If you have any scripture that state the body is the bride please post them, I would like to read them.
     
  2. Selene

    Selene New Member

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    Revelations 21:9 And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.

    The Lamb of God seated at the throne is Christ. In Matthew 9:15, Christ refers to Himself as the Bridegroom. New Jerusalem and New Israel is another name for the Church. And the bride (the Church as a whole) is certainly not going to be viewed as "male" because Christ is not a homosexual.

    And as I pointed out to you in an earlier post, I said that Moses also said the same thing to the Israelites. Moses told the Israelites that they were also a nation of priests, but NONE of the women were chosen to serve as priests. To be a nation of priest does not mean that women are to lead in the priesthood. It means that all of us were called by God to be a holy people set apart and different from others.

    There is neither Greek nor Jew nor male nor female.....means that all are equal in Jesus Christ, but equality here does not mean that everyone performs the same function or role. Each individual has a different role to play in the body of Christ. All are one in Christ, but all serve different functions and all have different status just as the Apostle Paul says. If you had read everything that Paul stated instead of taking one verse out of context, you can actually see what he was really saying when you quote that one verse:

    1 Corinthians 12:12 Just as a body, though one, has many parts, but all its many parts form one body, so it is with Christ. For we were all baptized by [fn] one Spirit so as to form one body—whether Jews or Gentiles, slave or free—and we were all given the one Spirit to drink. Even so the body is not made up of one part but of many. Now if the foot should say, "Because I am not a hand, I do not belong to the body," it would not for that reason stop being part of the body. If the whole body were an eye, where would the sense of hearing be? If the whole body were an ear, where would the sense of smell be? But in fact God has placed the parts in the body, every one of them, just as he wanted them to be. If they were all one part, where would the body be? As it is, there are many parts, but one body. The eye cannot say to the hand, "I don't need you!" And the head cannot say to the feet, "I don't need you!" On the contrary, those parts of the body that seem to be weaker are indispensable, and the parts that we think are less honorable we treat with special honor. And the parts that are unpresentable are treated with special modesty, while our presentable parts need no special treatment. But God has put the body together, giving greater honor to the parts that lacked it, so that there should be no division in the body, but that its parts should have equal concern for each other.

    Look at the scripture. It says that some in the Body of Christ have greater honor than others. God gave the title "Head of the house" to men. That is their role in the Body of Christ and in the nation of priest. Women were given different roles.
     
  3. 101G

    101G Well-Known Member

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    2 Selene,
    you keep bring up Moses, listen carefully, 2 Corinthians 3:14 "But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ". 15 But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart. 16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away. 17 Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty".

    and two not every woman was a prophet in Israel, but Deborah was. so that want fly. so was it not every man was prophet, but God calling.

    now under the new covenant, God choose who he wishes, and we have proven that in the service of women in office.

    Alright Selene, I have a question for you. what are the duties of a priest of the Lord Jesus Christ today under the new covenant. and at what temple do your priest perform their duties in today.
     
  4. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly New Member

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    Very poor scripture example Selene try again show me where scripture states that the body of Christ (ekklesia) is the bride of Christ. The scripture you posted just states that there is a bride but does not state the bride's entity so try again.
     
  5. Selene

    Selene New Member

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    All you had to do was read the next verse to find the Bride's identity. I already told you that New Israel and New Jerusalem is another name for the Church.

    Revelations 21:9-10 And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.
    And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,

    So according to scripture, who is the Bride of the Lamb. Her name is New Jerusalem. She is the Bride....the Church.

    Revelations 21:2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.


    What?? You have nothing to say about the Scripture I pointed out to you?? Did you not see that all people in the Body of Christ do not have the same status and role despite that the Body of Christ is a nation of priests??
     
  6. JB_Reformed Baptist

    JB_Reformed Baptist Many are called but few are chosen.

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    Good point. :D
     
  7. 101G

    101G Well-Known Member

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    What?? You have nothing to say about the Scripture I pointed out to you?? Did you not see that all people in the Body of Christ do not have the same status and role despite that the Body of Christ is a nation of priests

    sorry, it did not. Status have nothing to do with an office or function. so that scripture do not address the topic as for status. if you rely on it for that, then our point is made. for we proved that women have STATUS, and authority in in Christ Jesus in the church. so you fail again.

    do you deny this scriptures Galatians 3:27 "For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus". Y/N?

    that just killed your STATUS view, another crutch killed,

    and please answer my question. "what are the duties of a priest of the Lord Jesus Christ today under the new covenant. and at what temple do your priest perform their duties in".


    so you can try again, (smile).
     
  8. JB_Reformed Baptist

    JB_Reformed Baptist Many are called but few are chosen.

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    So tell me, when you use the word Pastor, are you using it in the generic sense or are you using it in the strict sense as an overseer/Elder/Shepherd of the flock?
     
  9. 101G

    101G Well-Known Member

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    JB_Reformed Baptist,
    So tell me, when you use the word Pastor, are you using it in the generic sense or are you using it in the strict sense as an overseer/Elder/Shepherd of the flock?
    no, I'm using it as a gift.

    so JB, is it a gift or an office?.
     
  10. Guestman

    Guestman Active Member

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    The question, "Can a Pastor to the body of Christ, (the church), be female/woman? " is answered by the apostle Paul in a letter to Timothy: "Let a woman learn in silence with full submissiveness. I do not permit a woman to teach, or to exercise authority over a man, but to be in silence."(1 Tim 2:11, 12) He then says that "Adam was formed first, then Eve."(1 Tim 2:13) Paul recognized that the woman was created for man, not man for the woman and that the man was the one to teach within the Christian congregation.


    Over 5 years before Paul gave this counsel to Timothy in about 61 C.E. concerning dealing with the congregation, he had wrote to the Corinthians: "But I want you to know that the head of every man is the Christ; in turn the head of the woman is the man; in turn the head of the Christ is God."(1 Cor 11:3)


    He then says that a woman would shame her head by "prophesying" in the congregation with her uncovered.(1 Cor 11:4) When in the presence of a qualified male, and has to conduct perhaps a Bible study with another person at their home, she covers her head to show her submission to the headship principle. At Genesis 2:24, God establishes the headship of a man over the woman, with the woman being submissive to the man in recognition of him as head.


    At 1 Corinthians 11, the apostle Paul was emphasizing the Scriptural guideline of a man having headship over the woman, be it in the home as a wife or in the Christian congregation as a "sister", just as the Christ is head over the man and God is head over the Christ. Thus, the headship principle is firmly established, in which everyone has a head except our Creator, Jehovah God.


    And furthermore, only qualified males were selected to serve as "overseers" or "elders", "qualified to teach" in the Christian congregation.(1 Tim 3:2) Later, Paul says that "women should likewise be serious, not slanderous, moderate in habits, faithful in all things."(1 Tim 3:11) Hence, men took the lead in both the home and the congregation, with women under their direction.


    But what can women do in the congregation ? In the book of Psalms, concerning making known "the good news of the kingdom" that Jesus said would be published worldwide at Matthew 24:14, it says: "Jehovah himself gives the saying: The women telling the good news are a large army."(Ps 68:11) Yes, the women are indeed a "large army" in speaking about God's kingdom to all "from house to house" (Acts 20:20), with more women doing this preaching and teaching work in the "field" or "harvest" than men.(Matt 9:38)
     
  11. 101G

    101G Well-Known Member

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    2 Guestman

    The question, "Can a Pastor to the body of Christ, (the church), be female/woman? " is answered by the apostle Paul in a letter to Timothy: "Let a woman learn in silence with full submissiveness. I do not permit a woman to teach, or to exercise authority over a man, but to be in silence."(1 Tim 2:11, 12) He then says that "Adam was formed first, then Eve."(1 Tim 2:13) Paul recognized that the woman was created for man, not man for the woman and that the man was the one to teach within the Christian congregation.

    LOL, I have already answered that, re-read the post.

    Over 5 years before Paul gave this counsel to Timothy in about 61 C.E. concerning dealing with the congregation, he had wrote to the Corinthians: "But I want you to know that the head of every man is the Christ; in turn the head of the woman is the man; in turn the head of the Christ is God."(1 Cor 11:3)

    is that authority or SOURCE?. if this is authority why not say God is the head of Jesus, why not?. Christ is from the Spirit, and Jesus is the Spirit, and the Spirit was in that flesh called Christ. so that Lie is expose. its SOURCE?.

    He then says that a woman would shame her head by "prophesying" in the congregation with her uncovered.(1 Cor 11:4) When in the presence of a qualified male, and has to conduct perhaps a Bible study with another person at their home, she covers her head to show her submission to the headship principle. At Genesis 2:24, God establishes the headship of a man over the woman, with the woman being submissive to the man in recognition of him as head.

    a. a woman cover, 1 Corinthians 11:15 "But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her: for her hair is given her for a covering".

    b. God establishes the headship of a man over the woman, with the woman being submissive to the man in recognition of him as head.
    NO, only the married, to lead first. HEADSHIP don't mean ruleship, to HAVE the rule OVER her is a permission. meaning he is the first to serve. find out what "Having the rule over" means vs "Rule". this is to correct you

    c. He then says that a woman would shame her head by "prophesying" in the congregation. wait a minute, I thought the apostle say women don't suppose to speak in church at all, so why is she prophesying, IN THE CHURCH. WE CAN SEE THE LIE.
    At 1 Corinthians 11, the apostle Paul was emphasizing the Scriptural guideline of a man having headship over the woman, be it in the home as a wife or in the Christian congregation as a "sister", just as the Christ is head over the man and God is head over the Christ. Thus, the headship principle is firmly established, in which everyone has a head except our Creator, Jehovah God.

    keep it at home, but in the church, LIE, 1 Corinthians 11:1 "Be ye followers of me, even as I also am of Christ". and if a custom is not applying, scripture, 1 Corinthians 11:16 "But if any man seem to be contentious, we have no such custom, neither the churches of God". that just killed that lie.

    And furthermore, only qualified males were selected to serve as "overseers" or "elders", "qualified to teach" in the Christian congregation.(1 Tim 3:2) Later, Paul says that "women should likewise be serious, not slanderous, moderate in habits, faithful in all things."(1 Tim 3:11) Hence, men took the lead in both the home and the congregation, with women under their direction.

    LIE, re-read post #172 page 6. and futhermore, see if the definition for "woman" is a wife or not.

    But what can women do in the congregation ? In the book of Psalms, concerning making known "the good news of the kingdom" that Jesus said would be published worldwide at Matthew 24:14, it says: "Jehovah himself gives the saying: The women telling the good news are a large army."(Ps 68:11) Yes, the women are indeed a "large army" in speaking about God's kingdom to all "from house to house" (Acts 20:20), with more women doing this preaching and teaching work in the "field" or "harvest" than men.(Matt 9:38)

    A women can do just what you can do in church, in the thing pertaining to the LORD.

    alright Guestman, I have answered all of your question, and all of your premises have failed. those crutches are destroyed.


    Now Guestman, since you have brought up HEADSHIP. the scripture states, 1 Corinthians 11:3 "But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God".
    I say this is Source, and not authority. I ask, why do the scriptures say that "God is the head of Christ", and not "God is the head of Jesus". I say because Jesus is God. if you disagree, answer me this.
    Revelation 1:8 "I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty".
    Revelation 1:17 "And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last: 18 I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death".

    Guestman, which of the scripture is your so called Jehovah, and which one is our Lord Jesus the Christ. this will put an end to this HEADSHIP, or AUTHORITY thing in 1 Corinthians 11

    I'll be waiting for your answer.
     
  12. JB_Reformed Baptist

    JB_Reformed Baptist Many are called but few are chosen.

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    Where do you get the idea it's a gift alone?
     
  13. 101G

    101G Well-Known Member

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    Where do you get the idea it's a gift?

    READ the Entire body of the topic post.
     
  14. JB_Reformed Baptist

    JB_Reformed Baptist Many are called but few are chosen.

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    Ok. So, can woman hold office as an Elder within a body of believers?
     
  15. 101G

    101G Well-Known Member

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    Ok. So, can woman hold office as an Elder within a body of believers?=

    see post #172 page 6.

    see all untill next time
     
  16. JB_Reformed Baptist

    JB_Reformed Baptist Many are called but few are chosen.

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    OK.

    Your "word study" is flawed. You extrapolate from one thing to another. You haven't even taken the context(s) into consideration. Just because we can get a common denominator out of two supposed things, it doesn't necessarily follow we end up with the same conclusion.

    Your rational - if I can call it that - is like the 'Dog and Cat' scenario in Psychology. "A cat one day comes across a dog and looks it up and down and observed that this dog had four legs as itself and two ears and fir etc and concluded that because of all these similarities it must be a dog as well."
     
  17. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly New Member

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    "Prepared as a bride adorned for her husband" this is simply your speculation. New Jerusalem is a city that has the beauty of a bride but it by no means states that New Jerusalem is a bride but it does declare it is a city.

    Care to try again with some scripture that actually states what you believe?
     
  18. mjrhealth

    mjrhealth Well-Known Member

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    You can all bicker and argue over whos "word of God " is correct, in teh end God doesnt care one iota about what you think, He will use as He sees fit, and if that person happens to be a women well so be it, and God forbid anyone who rejects any word she may speak, if it is from God, because if you do, than you would have rejected God Himself. I hope you understand.

    In all His Love
     
  19. Selene

    Selene New Member

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    Jiggyfly, the fact stands that the Bible does refer to Christ as a bridegroom, and I already showed you who that bridegroom is according to scripture. If you believe that Christ is married to a stone city, that is your belief. We believe that Christ is a bridegroom, and the bride is the Church. Do you not know that the husbands is viewed as representing Christ (the Bridegroom) and the wife is viewed as representing the Church??

    Ephesians 5:23 For the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, his body, of which he is the Savior. Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit to their husbands in everything.Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her.........In this same way, husbands ought to love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. After all, no one ever hated their own body, but they feed and care for their body, just as Christ does the church—.........This is a profound mystery—but I am talking about Christ and the church.

    Why do you think that the Apostle Paul made this comparison between a husband and wife and Christ and His Church?? It is because Christ is the Bridegroom and the Church is His Bride. And you think that the Bride is a stone city?? Did I not tell you that New Jerusalem is another name for the Church??
     
  20. JB_Reformed Baptist

    JB_Reformed Baptist Many are called but few are chosen.

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    Keep up the GOOD WORK, sister. :)
     
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