First Virus to cause unnatural separation and muzzling of people

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Justadude

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" Justadude wrote: It's not a binary situation where measures are either 100% effective, or completely useless. If various measures can reduce one's likelihood of being infected, they're worth doing even if they don't completely eliminate the possibility."
If you use the "reply" function, I'll be more likely to see your posts to me (I get a notification). :)

There are many behaviors/choices that can lower the probability of illness. A 2 week quarantine for international travelers could be instituted after air travel returns to normal - that would stop the spread of future viruses. Who should be restricted, people doing normal stuff in their neighborhood or people flying internationally? They brought it here, they should suffer restrictions. Not the normal American. I would contend that a 2 week quarantine will lower the probability much more then mere masks (that some still contend do not stop the virus).
The more effective route is to have widespread testing, contact tracing, and quarantines of those who test positive. That way we don't have to base policies on who we assume has the virus.
 

Waiting on him

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The first virus in history to cause unnatural separation and the muzzling of people

Social Distancing and the use of masks to prevent the spread of the virus are measures based NOT on true science. They are more about what you find in a mandatory course on political science that emphasizes effective tools for authoritarianism and population control.

This then is the so-called science and basis used and the political justification for a 6 foot or 2 meter physical separation or social distancing (SD) and the use of masks between two people for this current active ‘new’ virus.

When a person coughs or sneezes with or without a barrier over their mouth or nose to halt it, virus infected water droplets or even more energetic finer particle mists from the lungs or throat are generated and settles to the ground or at feet of another person 6 feet away or lingers in the air within a few feet to even more than 6 feet away from the other person.

This lingering virus embedded in water/vapor of fine mist though is the major spanner or wrench thrown naturally into the works that is a clear and unavoidable problem with SD and even the use of masks to combat the new virus or any other virus for that matter.

They, the medical ‘experts’ say that if we apply SD into society and into the population for this new and still unknown virus, we can then know if it works or is effective or not, over time. These same ‘experts’ suggest wearing masks with SD as a lesser and secondary mandate- why? The problem with these unscientific thoughts are numerous. Here are some of the highlights – the most obvious ones.

1. Not all people walk precisely at 2m or 6 ft. Many avoid doing SD all together when not in public. It is a very uncontrollable variable.

2. A large percentage of people wear barriers such as masks or plastic shields. Wearing these devises shred the notion of using SD as a control and knowing it effectiveness as a viable measure of slowing down the virus, completely. You cannot observe the SD effect whilst introducing another variable concurrently, viola, the mask!

3. If one is to show the effectiveness of SD, then there has to be a non-SD control group to compare the results. There is none and it there will never one devised.

4. Then there is the nagging lingering fine mist spray of the virus already mentioned, that completely voids the idea of SD being effective measure at all. To linger means to stay in the same airspace for a longer period of time and to stay compact for a longer period of time before even losing altitude. It may flow within the currents of air.

5. Even surgical grade masks when worm ‘correctly’ and smugly, cannot stop the virus from entering the airspace or prevent the virus from entering a body or cavity of the mouth, eyes, nose, especially when a fine mist of the virus in moving in the local airspace. So forget home-make cute masks all together. They do really nothing for preventing the virus spread. Although it can produce a psychologic boosting effect for the user; with a feeling of ‘protection.’

6. The effect of wearing a mask say 4-6 hours a day for a few months can be detrimental to your immune system and breathing in general. We are made to accept bacteria and virus, the good kind to maintain our immune system. Without having full access to these critters our immune system becomes impaired over time. So when a real threatening virus appears, we then are unprepared without a robust immune system to combat it.

7. Wearing a mask for a prolonged period of time can cause lung and breathing problems. Not enough O2 and too much CO2 in our bodies; not to mention inducing a self-inflicted strained lungs condition that stifles tidal normal breathing.

8. There are many important variables that cannot be calculated with any appreciable accuracy in the field, or in public for SD and the use of porous masks.

9. For SD and those with or without masks, - ALL 4 conditions (1. No SD and no masks, 2. SD and no masks, 3. SD and masks, and 4. Only masks and no SD. They ALL must be tested and evaluated. They must be done in a controlled environment as a true scientific experiment. And as of today there has been no true scientific study done on SD or even masking. Not even for the common flu! There have been a few partial tests performed for the use of masks with a virus present; in Hong Kong, Australia and the US, many years ago for the common flu. And these results are still debatable and not convincing. And then we are to believe that SD and even wearing masks are scientific proven measures against ‘slowing down’ a viral spread?!

10. The virus exposure time for potential infection is the main and critical variable for SD and even the use of masks or a combination of both. The time for the virus’ death outside the body is estimated to be between 30 mins to a few hours depending on factors such as being inside or outside, with or without sunshine, with or without rainfall, temperatures being below or above 70 degree F, the humidity, the current air speed and direction, the speed and direction of each of the two people separated, and of course the volume and speed and force of the water droplets or fine mist particles ejected at the muzzle or at the mouth’s exist or at least one person. The calculations really gets complicated even more if both individuals might have the virus and sneeze or cough in the same air space. And finally, how long the two people remain in the same air common airspace.

Before all this ‘new virus’ event began, most people understood that if you hear and or see someone coughing or sneezing you go the other way or evacuate the scene. It was and still is common sense, and it worked. Why not use this same sense for this new virus?

Are servant demeaning muzzles and human separation zones the new norm and the new way of 'dumbing' down the public, triggered by this so-called novel virus?


A critical thinker is something to be….

What say ye?


APAK
I walked into the hardware store yesterday without a mask and everyone looked at me like I had two heads.
 
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Rita

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We are getting tested in the care home next week - had to give in my nhs number today, so they are finally getting that done.......three residents have not been well, but their tests came back negative - waiting on a few more..........
Not sure whether shop workers are getting tested yet, they should as I think all key workers should be first.
Rita
 
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Waiting on him

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I pray that you don't experience much suffering and that you will be with Christ when you are called

That being said it is a mild virus in terms of deaths. It kills the old and the sick. A dangerous virus would kill everyone who gets it
The flu is comparable perhaps even more dangerous given the fact that it also kills children
80,000 people died from flu in 2018 but there has never been calls for a shut down

Consider my mate who has a wife and three children. All of them are healthy. He has lost his job and had to forfeit his mortgage.
Now he and his family are homeless. Struggling to survive... I see very little empathy for these people.

I don't see why this has to happen, why healthy people and families have to suffer.
It's only those at risk that need to be careful and isolate. Only a tyranny quarantines the healthy
Half the good Christian men I work with have been terminated from their jobs some have been employed there more than a decade.
 
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Justadude

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Widespread testing is a sham! NBA teams get tested but nurses do not; actors & actresses get tested but grocery workers do not. The tests are administered in a biased manner - this is human nature.
Yes, the decisions on who did and didn't get tested has been an obvious travesty with some "regular folks" even dying as a result. That doesn't mean the concept is flawed. We can do better.

Contact tracing requires privacy invasions and quarantines happen after the 'cat is out of the bag'.
It works. I know if I had been around someone who later tested positive, I'd want to know so I could get tested.

If you travel internationally and are not tested upon return, then you can infect one person - that is too much.
Unfortunately we don't have that level of testing available. That's a major problem.

Left-wingers started this 'responsibility' issue. Now, I will point out that they are killers if they allow disease to spread. Not quarantining international travelers will cause deaths - remember, one death is too many. Or, are some deaths acceptable?
I'm not sure what you're talking about here.
 

Waiting on him

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My mother inlaw is 90 and has tested positive. She's doing well, what everyone is neglecting to disclose is the co relationship with the comorbidity in those perishing. Doctors are signing off as the cause of death is c19, but are they neglecting to recognize the 50 years of chain smoking?
 
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Justadude

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My mother inlaw is 90 and has tested positive. She's doing well
That's good! :)

what everyone is neglecting to disclose is the co relationship with the comorbidity in those perishing.
I've been hearing about the increased risk in those who have comorbidities since the early days of the outbreak.

Doctors are signing off as the cause of death is c19, but are they neglecting to recognize the 50 years of chain smoking?
If a person has a complicating factor but they're still alive, and then they get COVID and die, the doctors will list the cause of death as from COVID, since that's what actually killed them.
 

Justadude

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I'm talking about the Left-wingers blaming Trump for the spread of this disease; claiming he is responsible for so many deaths due to Coronavirus. If Trump is responsible, then all international travelers are responsible to a greater degree.
The criticisms of the President were about his initial downplaying of the virus, his decisions to eliminate key federal programs and teams, the delays in ramping up production of vital equipment, and his promotion of treatments that hadn't been properly tested. Those are all real things.

If I am responsible because I do not wear a mask, then you are responsible for not wearing a mask when you have the flu. Every death matters! Or, some deaths are acceptable. People wont say 'some deaths are acceptable' because they get reamed for saying it; like they are cold-hearted that they accept some deaths. Hypocrisy! (unless they wear masks for the flu, too).
I don't know how else to help you understand the situation. It's about flattening the curve so people don't die because of overrun hospitals. With high-risk individuals, it's up to them and those around them to try and prevent them from getting it until treatments and a vaccine are available.
 

Waiting on him

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now I understand why God says the last enemy He will put under His feet is death.

Everyone is fighting for their lives like the third monkey getting on the ark, and it's starting to rain
 
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farouk

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We are getting tested in the care home next week - had to give in my nhs number today, so they are finally getting that done.......three residents have not been well, but their tests came back negative - waiting on a few more..........
Not sure whether shop workers are getting tested yet, they should as I think all key workers should be first.
Rita
@Rita: Thinking of you guys...
 
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APAK

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I walked into the hardware store yesterday without a mask and everyone looked at me like I had two heads.
Have not been 'forced' to wear one yet. Went to a hamburger joint with my wife yesterday and the owners and their kids, and staff were normal people...no masks, no sanitizers, no gloves, just like there was no so-called virus... as before....loved it..
 

Cristo Rei

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If a person has a complicating factor but they're still alive, and then they get COVID and die, the doctors will list the cause of death as from COVID, since that's what actually killed them

But from what I heard that isn't the standard practice.
Eg. If a person has a pulmonary disease, gets the flu and dies then they put the pulmonary disease first as the primary cause of death.
The flu gets listed as a contributing factor. That's what iv heard doctors say anyway. If u think about it, it makes sense i think
 
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Waiting on him

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But from what I heard that isn't the standard practice.
Eg. If a person has a pulmonary disease, gets the flu and dies then they put the pulmonary disease first as the primary cause of death.
The flu gets listed as a contributing factor. That's what iv heard doctors say anyway. If u think about it, it makes sense i think
Primary cause of death,,,, (SIN).
 
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MattMooradian

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I don't know how else to help you understand the situation.
Ok. You are obfuscating. Are some deaths acceptable? Are deaths from the flu acceptable enough that we shouldn't have to wear masks? Are non-mask wearers responsible if someone dies after spreading a virus to them?
I understand your argument about hospital beds & respirators. You know, hospitals have not been overwhelmed by covid cases and there are more than enough respirators to go around. You have set up straw men to combat an argument that I have not raised.