God's "Two Witnesses" Rule The World During The Future Great Tribulation

[Marty fox]

Stop your fake symbolism Marty that you've presented over years, scripture teaches "Their Dead Bodies" and you know it, be careful with your written words!

Revelation 11:7-9KJV
7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them
8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.
9 And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves.

Luke 16

The Rich Man and Lazarus​

19 “There was a rich man who was dressed in purple and fine linen and lived in luxury every day. 20 At his gate was laid a beggar named Lazarus, covered with sores 21 and longing to eat what fell from the rich man’s table. Even the dogs came and licked his sores.

22 “The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham’s side. The rich man also died and was buried. 23 In Hades, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side. 24 So he called to him, ‘Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.’

25 “But Abraham replied, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony. 26 And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been set in place, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.’

27 “He answered, ‘Then I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my family, 28 for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.’

29 “Abraham replied, ‘They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them.’

30 “‘No, father Abraham,’ he said, ‘but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent.’

31 “He said to him, ‘If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.’”

Even though in the true parable above Jesus was predicting His rejection even after raising from the dead the other lesson is that God is not going to send anymore prophets as Israel has everything they need in the Law and the prophets

 

[ewq1938]

Even though in the true parable above Jesus was predicting His rejection even after raising from the dead the other lesson is that God is not going to send anymore prophets as Israel has everything they need in the Law and the prophets

False.

Act_2:17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:

 

[Truth7t7]

Luke 16

The Rich Man and Lazarus​

19 “There was a rich man who was dressed in purple and fine linen and lived in luxury every day. 20 At his gate was laid a beggar named Lazarus, covered with sores 21 and longing to eat what fell from the rich man’s table. Even the dogs came and licked his sores.

22 “The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham’s side. The rich man also died and was buried. 23 In Hades, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side. 24 So he called to him, ‘Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.’

25 “But Abraham replied, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony. 26 And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been set in place, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.’

27 “He answered, ‘Then I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my family, 28 for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.’

29 “Abraham replied, ‘They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them.’

30 “‘No, father Abraham,’ he said, ‘but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent.’

31 “He said to him, ‘If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.’”

Even though in the true parable above Jesus was predicting His rejection even after raising from the dead the other lesson is that God is not going to send anymore prophets as Israel has everything they need in the Law and the prophets

Stop the reformed propaganda Marty, the (Two Witnesses) have literal bodies that die and lay in a physical street in Jerusalem

 

[Marty fox]

Stop the reformed propaganda Marty, the (Two Witnesses) have literal bodies that die and lay in a physical street in Jerusalem

Listen to what Jesus said He said that prophets being sent won't help so why would He send them?

Prophets were sent to Israel before Jesus came because they pointed to Him then Jesus came that's the purpose of the parable.

 

[Marty fox]

False.

Act_2:17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:

Yes and Peter said that his day was the start of those days

Peter Addresses the Crowd​

14 Then Peter stood up with the Eleven, raised his voice and addressed the crowd: “Fellow Jews and all of you who live in Jerusalem, let me explain this to you; listen carefully to what I say. 15 These people are not drunk, as you suppose. It’s only nine in the morning! 16 No, this is what was spoken by the prophet Joel:

17 “‘In the last days, God says,
I will pour out my Spirit on all people.
Your sons and daughters will prophesy,
your young men will see visions,
your old men will dream dreams.
18 Even on my servants, both men and women,
I will pour out my Spirit in those days,
and they will prophesy.
19 I will show wonders in the heavens above
and signs on the earth below,
blood and fire and billows of smoke.
20 The sun will be turned to darkness
and the moon to blood
before the coming of the great and glorious day of the Lord.
21 And everyone who calls
on the name of the Lord will be saved.’[c]


I'm not saying that people still don't prophesy they do that's different than a biblical prophet

 

[Truth7t7]

Listen to what Jesus said He said that prophets being sent won't help so why would He send them?

Prophets were sent to Israel before Jesus came because they pointed to Him then Jesus came that's the purpose of this parable.

The (Two Witnesses) will return to deliver God's literal plagues upon the earth during the 3.5 year tribulation

Marty as I remember you don't believe in a future human man as being John's (The Beast)?

You don't believe in future physical prophets returning (Two Witnesses)?

You don't believe literal plagues on this earth will take place as seen in Revelation 16:1-11?

Correct me if I'm wrong?

 

[Marty fox]

The (Two Witnesses) will return to deliver God's literal plagues upon the earth during the 3.5 year tribulation

Marty as I remember you don't believe in a future human man as being John's (The Beast)?

You don't believe in future physical prophets returning (Two Witnesses)?

You don't believe literal plagues on this earth will take place as seen in Revelation 16:1-11?

Correct me if I'm wrong?

Yes you are correct I believe they were first century events

I posted 3 threads recently on my view on each chapter of revelation

 

[ewq1938]

Yes and Peter said that his day was the start of those days

Sure a start of those days, but there are more of the last days to come and more prophets ending with the two prophets the beast will kill near the end of the 42 months.

 

[Marty fox]

Sure a start of those days, but there are more of the last days to come and more prophets ending with the two prophets the beast will kill near the end of the 42 months.

Did you notice that Peter said that “in the last days God will pour out His spirit on all flesh“ not just Israel?

The fact of the matter is that God issued Israel a certificate of divorce for adultery and judged her under the Old Covenant law and then married the true church made up of both Jew and Gentile as shown in the parable below

Matthew 22

The Parable of the Wedding Banquet​

22 Jesus spoke to them again in parables, saying: 2 “The kingdom of heaven is like a king who prepared a wedding banquet for his son. 3 He sent his servants to those who had been invited to the banquet to tell them to come, but they refused to come.

4 “Then he sent some more servants and said, ‘Tell those who have been invited that I have prepared my dinner: My oxen and fattened cattle have been butchered, and everything is ready. Come to the wedding banquet.’

5 “But they paid no attention and went off—one to his field, another to his business. 6 The rest seized his servants, mistreated them and killed them. 7 The king was enraged. He sent his army and destroyed those murderers and burned their city.

8 “Then he said to his servants, ‘The wedding banquet is ready, but those I invited did not deserve to come. 9 So go to the street corners and invite to the banquet anyone you find.’ 10 So the servants went out into the streets and gathered all the people they could find, the bad as well as the good, and the wedding hall was filled with guests.

11 “But when the king came in to see the guests, he noticed a man there who was not wearing wedding clothes. 12 He asked, ‘How did you get in here without wedding clothes, friend?’ The man was speechless.

13 “Then the king told the attendants, ‘Tie him hand and foot, and throw him outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’

14 “For many are invited, but few are chosen.”

 

[Marty fox]

The (Two Witnesses) will return to deliver God's literal plagues upon the earth during the 3.5 year tribulation

Marty as I remember you don't believe in a future human man as being John's (The Beast)?

You don't believe in future physical prophets returning (Two Witnesses)?

You don't believe literal plagues on this earth will take place as seen in Revelation 16:1-11?

Correct me if I'm wrong?

See post #29

 

[Davy]

The OP idea is ludicrous.

After the testimony by the "two witnesses", the beast rises out of the bottomless pit and kills them, leaving their dead bodies unburied in the street in Jerusalem. All the nations will rejoice when they see it and send each other gifts.

So doesn't look like they are ruling anything.

The plagues are judgments. And God's Word in Revelation shows the beast still will not give up when those plagues come.

Moreover, some in Christ are to be delivered up at that time of the "two witnesses", and also give a Testimony for Christ, with some of them being BEHEADED per the 5th Seal prophecy of Rev.6.

So do not try to ADD foreign ideas to God's Word and instead accept God's Word AS WRITTEN.

 

[Truth7t7]

The OP idea is ludicrous.

After the testimony by the "two witnesses", the beast rises out of the bottomless pit and kills them, leaving their dead bodies unburied in the street in Jerusalem. All the nations will rejoice when they see it and send each other gifts.

So doesn't look like they are ruling anything.

The plagues are judgments. And God's Word in Revelation shows the beast still will not give up when those plagues come.

Moreover, some in Christ are to be delivered up at that time of the "two witnesses", and also give a Testimony for Christ, with some of them being BEHEADED per the 5th Seal prophecy of Rev.6.

So do not try to ADD foreign ideas to God's Word and instead accept God's Word AS WRITTEN.

The (Two Witnesses) will bring all plagues as often as they will upon this wicked earth, a complete remake of Moses/Aaron against Pharaoh of Egypt

Revelation 11:6KJV
6 These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.

Revelation 3:9KJV
9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

How many Hebrews feared Pharaoh, not many, it was just the opposite, many of the Egyptians abandoned Pharaoh and took refuge in the God of Israel and brought their servants and cattle in from the fields as instructed by the Lord God of Israel

Exodus 9:18-25KJV
18 Behold, to morrow about this time I will cause it to rain a very grievous hail, such as hath not been in Egypt since the foundation thereof even until now.
19 Send therefore now, and gather thy cattle, and all that thou hast in the field; for upon every man and beast which shall be found in the field, and shall not be brought home, the hail shall come down upon them, and they shall die.
20 He that feared the word of the Lord among the servants of Pharaoh made his servants and his cattle flee into the houses:
21 And he that regarded not the word of the Lord left his servants and his cattle in the field.
22 And the Lord said unto Moses, Stretch forth thine hand toward heaven, that there may be hail in all the land of Egypt, upon man, and upon beast, and upon every herb of the field, throughout the land of Egypt.
23 And Moses stretched forth his rod toward heaven: and the Lord sent thunder and hail, and the fire ran along upon the ground; and the Lord rained hail upon the land of Egypt.
24 So there was hail, and fire mingled with the hail, very grievous, such as there was none like it in all the land of Egypt since it became a nation.
25 And the hail smote throughout all the land of Egypt all that was in the field, both man and beast; and the hail smote every herb of the field, and brake every tree of the field.

 

[Davy]

The (Two Witnesses) will bring all plagues as often as they will upon this wicked earth, a complete remake of Moses/Aaron against Pharaoh of Egypt

Revelation 11:6KJV
6 These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.

Revelation 3:9KJV
9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

How many Hebrews feared Pharaoh, not many, it was just the opposite, many of the Egyptians abandoned Pharaoh and took refuge in the God of Israel and brought their servants and cattle in from the fields as instructed by the Lord God of Israel

Read your Bible more, Pharoah and the Egyptians DID NOT GIVE UP and went after the Israelites, even though God protected them.

For the very END of this world, Scripture like Mark 13 and the 5th Seal beheadings are proof that the END will not be EXACTLY like the days of Moses and Aaron. What YOU are trying to do is to OMIT that part of The Bible in the Book of Revelation, and per Christ's Olivet discourse about the events of the END leading up to His future return.

 

[Truth7t7]

Read your Bible more, Pharoah and the Egyptians DID NOT GIVE UP and went after the Israelites, even though God protected them.

For the very END of this world, Scripture like Mark 13 and the 5th Seal beheadings are proof that the END will not be EXACTLY like the days of Moses and Aaron. What YOU are trying to do is to OMIT that part of The Bible in the Book of Revelation, and per Christ's Olivet discourse about the events of the END leading up to His future return.

Revelation 3:9-10KJV
9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.
10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

Isaiah 26:20-21KJV
20 Come, my people, enter thou into thy chambers, and shut thy doors about thee: hide thyself as it were for a little moment, until the indignation be overpast.
21 For, behold, the Lord cometh out of his place to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity: the earth also shall disclose her blood, and shall no more cover her slain.

Revelation 13:9-10KJV
9 If any man have an ear, let him hear.
10 He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.

 

[Davy]

Revelation 3:9-10KJV
9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.
10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

I hope you are not trying to PUSH man's false Pre-trib rapture theory into that.

Jesus' idea of their being kept from the "hour of temptation" simply means when the temptation comes, they will not be tempted.

So what's the 'temptation' He was referring to? The coming pseudo-Christ at the END that He warned the Church about in Matthew 24:23-26, i.e., those who will say, "Christ is here, or there", and Jesus said don't believe it. That false one will work great signs and wonders that IF it were possible, would deceived even Christ's very elect, Jesus said. So what's He doing referring to His "very elect" during the great trib if the Church is supposed to be raptured beforehand?

Furthermore, Jesus was emphatic in Matthew 24:29-31 and Mark 13:24-27 that His coming to gather His Church will be AFTER... the great tribulation.

 

[Douggg]

I hope you are not trying to PUSH man's false Pre-trib rapture theory into that.

Jesus' idea of their being kept from the "hour of temptation" simply means when the temptation comes, they will not be tempted.

No, the hour of temptation the verse says comes upon all the world. Anyone one earth at that time will be affected. So the verse and verse 11 are a referral to the rapture.

10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

11 Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.

So we have those verses that indicate the rapture/resurrection event to be before the great tribulation begins.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

And in 1Thesslalonians 5, we have another timing factor as being before the day of the Lord begins when God's wrath will be poured out. In 1 Thessalonians 5:9-11 is the rapture/resurrection event.

The beginning of the day of Lord is when in 2Thessalonians2:4, the Antichrist commits the transgression of desolation act of sitting the temple claiming to have achieved God-hood.

1Thessalonians5:
9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him.

11 Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do.

----------------------------------------------------

So before the day of the Lord begins. And before the great tribulation begins.

The next timing factor is to be ready. In Matthew 24:42-44, we don't exactly when the rapture/resurrection event will take place. But we are to be ready, living a Christian life.

In Luke 21:34-36, to escape going through the great tribulation...

36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.
------------------------------------------------------

So the rapture/resurrection event...

1. is before the beginning of the day of the Lord (before the transgression of desolation act).
2. is before the beginning of the great tribulation (before the abomination of desolation is placed on the temple mount).
3. the exact day is not known.

.....but some time before Stage 4 of the little horn. Maybe even today. 1Thessalonians5:11 Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do.

 

[Douggg]

Furthermore, Jesus was emphatic in Matthew 24:29-31 and Mark 13:24-27 that His coming to gather His Church will be AFTER... the great tribulation.

No, Matthew 24:31 and Mark 13:27 are referring to the gathering of the Jews to the land of Israel.

Matthew 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Mark 13:27 And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In Deuteronomy 30:1-6 is that gathering....

1 And it shall come to pass, when all these things are come upon thee, the blessing and the curse, which I have set before thee, and thou shalt call them to mind among all the nations, whither the LORD thy God hath driven thee,

2 And shalt return unto the LORD thy God, and shalt obey his voice according to all that I command thee this day, thou and thy children, with all thine heart, and with all thy soul;

3 That then the LORD thy God will turn thy captivity, and have compassion upon thee, and will return and gather thee from all the nations, whither the LORD thy God hath scattered thee.

4 If any of thine be driven out unto the outmost parts of heaven, from thence will the LORD thy God gather thee, and from thence will he fetch thee:

5 And the LORD thy God will bring thee into the land which thy fathers possessed, and thou shalt possess it; and he will do thee good, and multiply thee above thy fathers.

6 And the LORD thy God will circumcise thine heart, and the heart of thy seed, to love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, that thou mayest live.

 

[Truth7t7]

No, the hour of temptation the verse says comes upon all the world. Anyone one earth at that time will be affected. So the verse and verse 11 are a referral to the rapture.

10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

11 Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.

So we have those verses that indicate the rapture/resurrection event to be before the great tribulation begins.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

And in 1Thesslalonians 5, we have another timing factor as being before the day of the Lord begins when God's wrath will be poured out. In 1 Thessalonians 5:9-11 is the rapture/resurrection event.

The beginning of the day of Lord is when in 2Thessalonians2:4, the Antichrist commits the transgression of desolation act of sitting the temple claiming to have achieved God-hood.

1Thessalonians5:
9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him.

11 Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do.

----------------------------------------------------

So before the day of the Lord begins. And before the great tribulation begins.

The next timing factor is to be ready. In Matthew 24:42-44, we don't exactly when the rapture/resurrection event will take place. But we are to be ready, living a Christian life.

In Luke 21:34-36, to escape going through the great tribulation...

36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.
------------------------------------------------------

So the rapture/resurrection event...

1. is before the beginning of the day of the Lord (before the transgression of desolation act).
2. is before the beginning of the great tribulation (before the abomination of desolation is placed on the temple mount).
3. the exact day is not known.

.....but some time before Stage 4 of the little horn. Maybe even today. 1Thessalonians5:11 Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do.

View attachment 54588

No such thing as a pre-trib rapture found in scripture, it was created by John N. Darby in the 1830's and promoted by C.I. Scofield in his 1909 reference bible, better known as dispensationalism

 

[Douggg]

No such thing as a pre-trib rapture found in scripture, it was created by John N. Darby in the 1830's and promoted by C.I. Scofield in his 1909 reference bible

The term pre-trib as implied by the proponents of the pre-trib view means "pre-70th week". i.e. the timing of the rapture/resurrection event must take place before the 70th week begins, according to them.

However, we don't know exactly when the rapture/resurrection event will take place. It may take place before the 70th week begins. We don't know for certain.

What we do know is that the rapture/resurrection event must take place before the Antichrist goes into the temple, sits, claims to have achieved God-hood. That act triggers the beginning of the day of Lord when God's wrath is poured out. And we are not appointed to God's wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ. 1Thessalonians5:9-11.

 

[Truth7t7]

However, we don't know exactly when the rapture/resurrection event will take place. It may take place before the 70th week begins. We don't know for certain.

The Bible teaches the resurrection of all takes place on "The Last Day" at the second coming of Jesus Christ

John 5:28-29KJV
28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

John 6:39-40KJV
39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.