Here is why, as an Adventist, I believe America is in Trouble.

[Brakelite]

One could have the MOB and use cash.

Of course. But cash won't be available to those who refuse the mark, or they would be able to buy and sell.

 

[ewq1938]

Of course. But cash won't be available to those who refuse the mark, or they would be able to buy and sell.

Cash won't be accepted if one doesn't have the mark.

 

[No Pre-TB]

The city that Ellen White saw was still in heaven, Christ was still ministering in the temple

Not so. That temple was not in the Holy City. She specified “Holy City” and matched it with “resurrection” and anyone not in the Holy City would be “locked out of its gates”. Matching Rev 22 New Jerusalem.

 

[Brakelite]

However, I don’t agree that you must observe a physical literal sabbath.

And there's the rub. There are only two parties in the world at the second coming. Those who keep the commandments of God and have the faith of Jesus, and those who don't. Those that don't, who worship the beast and it's image, obviously are keeping the commandments of man in accordance to the dictates and worship criteria of the beast. That beast is the RCC. Now ask the RCC what her criteria is for worship. All yourself the question... From what authority do I derive my belief that the 4th Commandment is no longer valid?

Cash won't be accepted if one doesn't have the mark.

So it's a visible mark that shopkeepers can see? Or a physical chip implant that can be read? Today there are Christians with tattoos dedicated to their former gods, former girl friends, former fetishes, former and current vanities, yet without judgement. What makes this mark such an abomination that it inches such enduring wrath from the Almighty?

 

[ewq1938]

So it's a visible mark that shopkeepers can see? Or a physical chip implant that can be read?

Or something like those things. The text says it is a mark on the head or right hand. That eliminates anything like worshiping on a certain day. SDA adds so much to the text that isn't there and you guys are surprised when others reject such false teachings?

What makes this mark such an abomination that it inches such enduring wrath from the Almighty?

lol, why ask such a question when the text makes it clear. It's a mark from the AC, related to his name. It literally marks people as his and naturally God is going to be angry about it.

 

[amigo de christo]

This nation and this world is in dire trouble cause it has Shown God the spine and rejected the true gospel
for this all inclusive lie . Now we see where its all headed as pope francis gathers with all his false religions
this sunday to honor the agenda of the one world govt and give the world its ten commandments . Its all a farce .

 

[amigo de christo]

And there's the rub. There are only two parties in the world at the second coming. Those who keep the commandments of God and have the faith of Jesus, and those who don't. Those that don't, who worship the beast and it's image, obviously are keeping the commandments of man in accordance to the dictates and worship criteria of the beast. That beast is the RCC. Now ask the RCC what her criteria is for worship. All yourself the question... From what authority do I derive my belief that the 4th Commandment is no longer valid?

So it's a visible mark that shopkeepers can see? Or a physical chip implant that can be read? Today there are Christians with tattoos dedicated to their former gods, former girl friends, former fetishes, former and current vanities, yet without judgement. What makes this mark such an abomination that it inches such enduring wrath from the Almighty?

Dont bow before the global religion led by francis and the worlds religoins to unify the world to serve the new wordly ten commandments .
Did i not try and warn us where it was all headed . Heed not francis , HEED JESUS and learn those bibles .

 

[Brakelite]

something like those things. The text says it is a mark on the head or right hand.

The text actually says "in the forehead". Not on. What is in the forehead? The conscience. If you conscientiously receive the mark, you are doing so from religious conviction. You are convinced it's the righteous thing to do.
The hand in scripture is used metaphorically for work. If you receive the mark in your hand, you are doing so from convenience. You don't conscientiously believe it's the right thing to surrender to, but you are doing so in order to eat and live your life. In Revelation those who receive the mark are set in contradistinction to those who keep the commandments of God. Most Christians uphold the ten Commandments, except for one. That one was changed by the Antichrist and almost everyone followed Rome example and direction on discarding it. And with no good biblical reason for doing so. And even the Catholic Church herself claims Sunday sacredness as a mark of her authority. And so it is, because it's by her authority alone that Sunday exists as a holy day. SDAs are not making this up. It is biblical... It is logical... And it's prophetic.
KJV Daniel 7:25
25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

 

[Brakelite]

Those that receive the mark cannot receive the seal of God, and vice versa. The seal is the Father's name... Which is Good character. God's commandments are His character... His righteousness... You are sealed in the mind, conscience, by character which is reflected in obedience to God's commandments. See the harmony?

 

[quietthinker]

Translation: My denomination can add things to scripture and that's ok with us.

Jesus said, 'unless you eat my flesh and drink my blood you have no life in you'. Now that's pretty overt wouldn't you say? Do we now need to do some fancy footwork to apply that literally to believers as the RCC has done or do we hear/see his words as metaphor?

The 'religious mind' can and will conjure anything it imagines as reality; just look at the various 'dreamtime' stories from the cultures around the world.

When Jesus says he is the vine and we are the branches, isn't he talking in metaphor? or does one really understand this literally?
In my view, only foolishness would pull that card.

Hearing the intent is being wise. Hearing anything else is akin to the description God gave to Jonah of the Ninevites; he said they didn't know their left hand from their right hand. I would say he is describing a foolish people.

 

[ewq1938]

The text actually says "in the forehead". Not on.

The Greek text has the word EPI and it has a wide range of meanings, including in or on or about etc. The English translation NEVER has a greater authority than the Greek manuscripts.



G1909

epi
ep-ee'
A primary preposition properly meaning superimposition (of time, place, order, etc.), as a relation of distribution [with the genitive case], that is, over, upon, etc.; of rest (with the dative case) at, on, etc.; of direction (with the accusative case) towards, upon, etc.: - about (the times), above, after, against, among, as long as (touching), at, beside, X have charge of, (be-, [where-]) fore, in (a place, as much as, the time of, -to), (because) of, (up-) on (behalf of) over, (by, for) the space of, through (-out), (un-) to (-ward), with. In compounds it retains essentially the same import, at, upon, etc. (literally or figuratively).

 

[ewq1938]

Jesus said, 'unless you eat my flesh and drink my blood you have no life in you'. Now that's pretty overt wouldn't you say?

Jesus also said, "Follow me". That's the most overt thing in the bible, wouldn't you agree?

 

[quietthinker]

Jesus also said, "Follow me". That's the most overt thing in the bible, wouldn't you agree?

I sense ewq that you are debating for its own sake and not in order to get any clarity. I will leave you to your path.

 

[Reggie Belafonte]

Dont bow before the global religion led by francis and the worlds religoins to unify the world to serve the new wordly ten commandments .
Did i not try and warn us where it was all headed . Heed not francis , HEED JESUS and learn those bibles .

I wonder what the new Worldly commandments are ?
The First top priority would be tho shall not be racist !

But why did any of the Commandments have nothing to say about such ? Well it's because the fact of the matter is that everyone is racist in fact ! and there is nothing wrong with that at all in fact really, but for one who does not understand or truly comprehend that there is a huge difference between being racial prejudice and racist in fact. as one understands the issue and the other does not or is ignorant to the real issue.

So why not is racist a Commandment ? because it's a non issue in fact !

Why not make a Law against Sin ? well the Commandments are an issue regarding Sin !
If you go against any of the Commandments you are a fool.
The two that Jesus gave us are Grace related. and if one has not Grace you are not worthy of God in fact and the other Commandments are not truly alive, until they are under Christ Jesus Grace.

Satan works to created deceptions and delusions, so Satan makes claims that are not True. Racist is not a delusion, Racial Prejudice is a delusion and stupid ! but racial issues are regarding only facts, that they are concerning only cultural issues.

But what of the Cultural Marxist agenda They are in fact racial Prejudice ! for they undermine all Race and culture in fact and make all equal ? So as to dominate over all ? and bring everyone down to the lowest common denominator in fact. Idolising the lowest of the low, like Satan does. Satan robs people of everything that God gave us all.

Hey I have a right to question anyone or anything to do with my town or Country openly ! so I can point who ever I want, out as for who or what they represent being bad or good openly !
But under Socialism and their Cultural Marxist agenda one has no right to express anything for fear of ones life. Same in Jesus time the Satanist did not want Jesus speaking for they feared such in fact.

Under Socialism the Truth is shunned in fact and feared !

So you know what I could say that my Nation has a better culture than another or my people are better than yours ? So what ! I hope they believe they have the right to say what ever they please as well. but that's not to say that I would give them high regards for anything that I seen as fitting and low regards to what I seen as lowly ? as I see fit !
Now one may be some what wrong as one does not understand the culture and the land of theirs ? but one should be open to understanding there issues. That's not being prejudice !

But on the other hand I can run my own Country down as I see fit, be they friends or family even, why because it's true. and that's what matters that you be true to yourself first and foremost and willing to understand others predicament. but we offer to help others up, not drag them down ! or let people be victims of scallywag self abuse.
Jesus came to lift others up so they would have Life in abundance ! who he created you to become. Not a Rat or subjected to being under delusions or deceptions.

One should recognise in your own race that it is that is dragging such down ! Own it ! and call it out ones self openly ! or such will never resolve such a issue, or such will only drive the degenerates further, helping no one.

All I seen nowadays is trash regardless of race making out they are the victim and playing the blame game but will not take responsibility for their own actions. Every degenerate Brat does the same, it's always someone others fault. Or it's the old, us VS them nonsense, Communist play that one over and over like a broken record, but they are to lazy to turn it over. That's there motto ! always barking up the wrong tree, or chasing shadows.

 

[Brakelite]

The Greek text has the word EPI and it has a wide range of meanings, including in or on or about etc. The English translation NEVER has a greater authority than the Greek manuscripts.



G1909

epi
ep-ee'
A primary preposition properly meaning superimposition (of time, place, order, etc.), as a relation of distribution [with the genitive case], that is, over, upon, etc.; of rest (with the dative case) at, on, etc.; of direction (with the accusative case) towards, upon, etc.: - about (the times), above, after, against, among, as long as (touching), at, beside, X have charge of, (be-, [where-]) fore, in (a place, as much as, the time of, -to), (because) of, (up-) on (behalf of) over, (by, for) the space of, through (-out), (un-) to (-ward), with. In compounds it retains essentially the same import, at, upon, etc. (literally or figuratively).

I think the translators were led by the holy Spirit, context, wisdom, and logic when they used 'in'. Tattoos had been used for millennia by entire cultures in loyalty to their false idols. This hasn't changed to this day, in fact entire body ink is more popular than ever and as one watches sport, walks at the beach, or attends the local gym, tattoos are everywhere and on make and female. Yet there is not a glimmer of condemnation from God, nor criticism it suggestion from Christians that those tattoos and their deeper meanings bring with them any thing more than personal distaste from a minority of conservative naysayers. That includes tattoos dedicated to Satan, Lucifer, and a host of symbols reminiscent of the worst characters in history and present society... Yet no-one is suggesting these bring eternal damnation upon anyone. No my friend. The mark isn't about tattoos regardless of who they were dedicated to, Antichrist or Santa Claus or your latest mistress. The mark is not literal but a spiritual attitude and acceptance or rejection of spiritual truth and your response to that truth...it is about worship and your loyalty or otherwise to God.

 

[ewq1938]

I think the translators were led by the holy Spirit, context, wisdom, and logic when they used 'in'.

Nonsense. There are many translator errors in the KJV and all translations. Besides, in or on is the same thing in this context as a tattoo is in and on the body. Not saying it will be a tattoo but it could be.

 

[Brakelite]

Nonsense. There are many translator errors in the KJV and all translations. Besides, in or on is the same thing in this context as a tattoo is in and on the body. Not saying it will be a tattoo but it could be.

So you are adamantly positive and unyielding in your position against me, yet unsure of your own. You are adamant regarding what the mark isn't, yet have no idea as to what it is, nor any idea as to the identity of the beast itself... The Antichrist. Your attitude speaks volumes for prejudice, but none for scholarship.

 

[Brakelite]

One thing to always bear in mind. Whatever the nature of the coming crisis...
(KJV Daniel 12:1
1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.)... And however grievous the intensity and pressure that will be mounted against God's people, we may remember the following...
KJV Hebrews 5:9
9 And being made perfect, He (Jesus) became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him.
The above harmonizes with Revelation 14:12.

 

[amigo de christo]

I wonder what the new Worldly commandments are ?
The First top priority would be tho shall not be racist !

But why did any of the Commandments have nothing to say about such ? Well it's because the fact of the matter is that everyone is racist in fact ! and there is nothing wrong with that at all in fact really, but for one who does not understand or truly comprehend that there is a huge difference between being racial prejudice and racist in fact. as one understands the issue and the other does not or is ignorant to the real issue.

So why not is racist a Commandment ? because it's a non issue in fact !

Why not make a Law against Sin ? well the Commandments are an issue regarding Sin !
If you go against any of the Commandments you are a fool.
The two that Jesus gave us are Grace related. and if one has not Grace you are not worthy of God in fact and the other Commandments are not truly alive, until they are under Christ Jesus Grace.

Satan works to created deceptions and delusions, so Satan makes claims that are not True. Racist is not a delusion, Racial Prejudice is a delusion and stupid ! but racial issues are regarding only facts, that they are concerning only cultural issues.

But what of the Cultural Marxist agenda They are in fact racial Prejudice ! for they undermine all Race and culture in fact and make all equal ? So as to dominate over all ? and bring everyone down to the lowest common denominator in fact. Idolising the lowest of the low, like Satan does. Satan robs people of everything that God gave us all.

Hey I have a right to question anyone or anything to do with my town or Country openly ! so I can point who ever I want, out as for who or what they represent being bad or good openly !
But under Socialism and their Cultural Marxist agenda one has no right to express anything for fear of ones life. Same in Jesus time the Satanist did not want Jesus speaking for they feared such in fact.

Under Socialism the Truth is shunned in fact and feared !

So you know what I could say that my Nation has a better culture than another or my people are better than yours ? So what ! I hope they believe they have the right to say what ever they please as well. but that's not to say that I would give them high regards for anything that I seen as fitting and low regards to what I seen as lowly ? as I see fit !
Now one may be some what wrong as one does not understand the culture and the land of theirs ? but one should be open to understanding there issues. That's not being prejudice !

But on the other hand I can run my own Country down as I see fit, be they friends or family even, why because it's true. and that's what matters that you be true to yourself first and foremost and willing to understand others predicament. but we offer to help others up, not drag them down ! or let people be victims of scallywag self abuse.
Jesus came to lift others up so they would have Life in abundance ! who he created you to become. Not a Rat or subjected to being under delusions or deceptions.

One should recognise in your own race that it is that is dragging such down ! Own it ! and call it out ones self openly ! or such will never resolve such a issue, or such will only drive the degenerates further, helping no one.

All I seen nowadays is trash regardless of race making out they are the victim and playing the blame game but will not take responsibility for their own actions. Every degenerate Brat does the same, it's always someone others fault. Or it's the old, us VS them nonsense, Communist play that one over and over like a broken record, but they are to lazy to turn it over. That's there motto ! always barking up the wrong tree, or chasing shadows.

Here they are . ITS total abomination . they worship the creature . take a peek at
some of these commandments . CREATION MANIFESTS DIVINITY . What an abomination .
They have put earth over GOD , humanity above God . Only in CHRIST JESUS have we been given a divine nature .NOT
Creation . Creation was CREATED BY GOD . THIS is where its all headed .
A religoin that serves the agenda of the world and beast , the dragon . This is abomination and let no lamb partake of it peroid .

 

[ewq1938]

So you are adamantly positive and unyielding in your position against me, yet unsure of your own. You are adamant regarding what the mark isn't, yet have no idea as to what it is, nor any idea as to the identity of the beast itself... The Antichrist. Your attitude speaks volumes for prejudice, but none for scholarship.

So says the one who subscribes to a definition of the mark that doesn't come from the bible. Your words are meaningless here.