How can we be perfect and complete? Is it by Law, or by faith?

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MatthewG

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To be perfect is to be complete - or to have integrity.

Love for Enemies - Matthew 5​

43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor[i] and hate your enemy.’ 44 But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45 that you may be children of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. 46 If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? 47 And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? 48 Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.​

In this instance Jesus is teaching his audience which was his disciples on the mountain here, He said near the end here, closing - Be perfect, therefore as your heavenly Father is perfect. As mentioned earlier, that being perfect is to be complete or to have integrity; There are only two options to choose from.

Is Jesus telling his disciples to be perfect in the flesh? Or to be perfect and complete in faith in Him?


The Rich and the Kingdom of God - Matthew 19​

16 Just then a man came up to Jesus and asked, “Teacher, what good thing must I do to get eternal life?”
17 “Why do you ask me about what is good?” Jesus replied. “There is only One who is good. If you want to enter life, keep the commandments.”
18 “Which ones?” he inquired.
Jesus replied, “‘You shall not murder, you shall not commit adultery, you shall not steal, you shall not give false testimony, 19 honor your father and mother,’[c] and ‘love your neighbor as yourself.’[d]”
20 “All these I have kept,” the young man said. “What do I still lack?”
21 Jesus answered, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”
22 When the young man heard this, he went away sad, because he had great wealth.
23 Then Jesus said to his disciples, “Truly I tell you, it is hard for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of heaven. 24 Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God.”
25 When the disciples heard this, they were greatly astonished and asked, “Who then can be saved?”
26 Jesus looked at them and said, “With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”​

Here, with the disciples Jesus with a person who came up to Him. From verse 16 the man probably of Jewish decent due to what he is enquiring, saying Teacher what good thing must I do to get eternal life? What a direct and straight forward question here in which this person was to the Messiah who was the very Word of God sent to set the captives free. In verse 17 Jesus responds, which I believe He (being the very Word of God) is referring towards his flesh with this man here saying Why do you ask me about is good? Which I believe is pointing about how with-in the flesh there is nothing good about it (though inside which people had yet to know what the Spirit of God, and the very Soul of the Word of God made flesh. You may differ.

Jesus goes on to state that "There is only One who is good. (meaning God - Jesus's Father). IF you want to enter life keep the commandments." Why is Jesus saying this, if he was someone who fulfills the law and the prophets? Because Jesus is pointing the man back to the commandments which by his birthright he had done and knew about having probably gone to the synagogues growing up from childhood.

Which the Man asked Jesus which ones are you talking about that I should keep? Jesus replies with you shall not murder, commit adulty, steal, not give false testimony, honor your mother and father, and love your neighbor as yourself.

The man states back to Jesus, All of these I have kept. What is it do I still lack that I may gain eternal life? So here the man replies, saying he has kept most of the commands that Jesus had just mentioned to him, in verse 18-19, looking at verse 20.

Here Jesus mentions being perfect again, to be complete, have integrity - “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.” Verse 21.

Jesus again here refers again to the material means - which this means is for a spiritual means too - responds saying that if he desires to be perfect, go sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Thinking about this, to let go of our flesh in trying to feed it by possessions it is better to let go, and to give those are in need so that the man will have treasure in heaven.

Just as Jesus said to his Disciples in Matthew 5, how is it we can be perfect? He stated that it was to be perfect as their Father in heaven is perfect. Here to be perfect, the man needed to materially sell everything he had because he was wealthy. Jesus ends it by saying once he has done that, he will have treasure in heaven and should come to follow Him.


The Rich and the Kingdom of God - Matthew 19​

23 Then Jesus said to his disciples, “Truly I tell you, it is hard for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of heaven. 24 Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God.”
25 When the disciples heard this, they were greatly astonished and asked, “Who then can be saved?”
26 Jesus looked at them and said, “With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”​
After the man had left, - in an instance you can see a mark here between old covenant and new covenant Jesus was brining forth. As the man - left onward (not sure what he did) but went back to his material ways that he first performed by the flesh, of perfecting in obeying the law to be made right with God because Jesus doesn't say here right out they he was right with God just yet, until the follow Him part in which He would be made seen right with God by faith. That is where being complete in Him is found and it is finished comes into play that brings forth new life to a believer in which they begin to follow after Jesus.

So why is it hard for a rich to enter into the Kingdom of Heaven? Because they do not see their flaws before a truly perfect and holy God. It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who is rich to enter into the kingdom of God. The question here becomes what does it mean to be rich? That could be rich in pride, status, placing oneself above others, not just wealth itself. Because it is okay for Christians to make money, and save it and use it as they will but not to be come prideful above others because of it. That is why it is so hard for a rich person to enter into the kingdom of Heaven.

After explaining this to them, the disciples Who then can be saved?

Jesus responded and looked at them, with this is impossible (through material means), but with God (through spiritual means) with Him all things are possible.

So what does it mean to be perfect is it by the flesh or by and through faith in Christ and resting in his works, and having relationship with the Father, to walk in integrity to be open and honest with God with our failures and to believe on the one whom God had sent.
 

dev553344

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Being perfect is as Heavenly Father is perfect. That means living a Christ like life. No sin, and doing the will of the Father.

Having faith isn't perfection by itself.
 
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dev553344

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In order to be perfect you must not do evil and only do good. That is who God is, our Father in Heaven.
 
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dev553344

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The two verses that come to mind imply some sort of action to be perfect. First to sell all you have and then follow Christ:

Matthew 5:48 Therefore you shall be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect.​

Matthew 19:21 Jesus said to him, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell what you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me.”​

 
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MatthewG

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Being perfect is as Heavenly Father is perfect. That means living a Christ like life. No sin, and doing the will of the Father.

Having faith isn't perfection by itself.

Oh wow, that sounds like one has to never sin in order to be right with God. That equates which something may be binding or restricting in order to please God because they must be completely perfect in their flesh.

Do you believe that all people fail in their flesh or is there some way to perfect it in the sense of it never ever sinning ever again?

From my understanding devin, and it maybe wrong but I do not believe God desires for anyone to be set in any type of bondage whatsoever be it to man-made traditions or even the Law mandated that they have to follow it to be made right with God. That strips Jesus Christ of everything he had ever done when people go back and revert back to bondage of being a slave to these things and not be free in Christ Jesus.


In order to be perfect you must not do evil and only do good. That is who God is, our Father in Heaven.

Sometimes Evil thoughts come into my mind though I do not act on them, my flesh in it nothing is good, so how can anyone perfect their flesh? Can you become completed in Christ into a new spiritual life? New spiritual life in Christ, and not focusing on the flesh of sin and putting and eye toward heavenly things?

The two verses that come to mind imply some sort of action to be perfect. First to sell all you have and then follow Christ:

Matthew 5:48 Therefore you shall be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect.​

Matthew 19:21 Jesus said to him, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell what you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me.”​


These two are quoted in the teaching here, thank you for taking time to share some of your insights and hope the questions are clear and understandable if you decide to answer any if you would like to share.

Thank you, Devin.
 
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amigo de christo

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Having Christ let us grow unto perfection .
AND lets also read what pual wrote about SCRIPTURE and the reading of it .
That the man of GOD may be PERFECT and furnished unto all good works . YEAH OPEN BIBLES and start learning .
Learn the doctrine whereby one will grow wise unto salvation through faith in Christ .
For all doctrine is good for reproof , correction , instruction in righteousness . READ THEM BIBLES and learn .
 

dev553344

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Oh wow, that sounds like one has to never sin in order to be right with God. That equates which something may be binding or restricting in order to please God because they must be completely perfect in their flesh.

Do you believe that all people fail in their flesh or is there some way to perfect it in the sense of it never ever sinning ever again?

From my understanding devin, and it maybe wrong but I do not believe God desires for anyone to be set in any type of bondage whatsoever be it to man-made traditions or even the Law mandated that they have to follow it to be made right with God. That strips Jesus Christ of everything he had ever done when people go back and revert back to bondage of being a slave to these things and not be free in Christ Jesus.




Sometimes Evil thoughts come into my mind though I do not act on them, my flesh in it nothing is good, so how can anyone perfect their flesh? Can you become completed in Christ into a new spiritual life? New spiritual life in Christ, and not focusing on the flesh of sin and putting and eye toward heavenly things?



These two are quoted in the teaching here, thank you for taking time to share some of your insights and hope the questions are clear and understandable if you decide to answer any if you would like to share.

Thank you, Devin.
I think you're confusing forgiveness of sin and being perfect as Heavenly Father is perfect.

Let me ask you this Matthew, if you are perfect as heavenly Father, then do you think heavenly Father sins? No he does not.

And Jesus directs us to obey the commandments through out the bible.

 
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MatthewG

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I think you're confusing forgiveness of sin and being perfect as Heavenly Father is perfect.

How do you think that?

Let me ask you this Matthew, if you are perfect as heavenly Father, then do you think heavenly Father sins? No he does not.

Our flesh falls short, but if the Kingdom of God is with in you, and the Father is with you by the holy spirit, and the Lord Jesus Christ is with you all by faith, are you made complete and right with God by faith in the resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ, by the Spirit? That is what Paul speaks about in Romans 5:1-5.

Not sure why you pointed out sins exactly. All of our flesh fails being a part of the nature of Adam, we are born in sin. Sin was paid for on the Cross... once and for all people. It is now a choice for them to go to Christ and have a newness of life where they leave their old fleshly ways behind (meaning to start turning their focus on heavenly things rather than the ways of the flesh and how they are dying to it), from my perspective because it needs to be explained to be seen and understood if possible.

Romans 6:11 In the same way, count yourselves dead to sin but alive to God in Christ Jesus.

And Jesus directs us to obey the commandments through out the bible.

But do you see it is Him that it is even possible for you to do so if you do it perfectly by and through allowing the spirit of Christ to move in and through you? You know you are the temple of God, in which allows you to have the spirit to use in this life even ask God for wisdom if one needs it, asking in faith never doubting?

Galatians 2:20 I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I now live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me.
 
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dev553344

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How do you think that?



Our flesh falls short, but if the Kingdom of God is with in you, and the Father is with you by the holy spirit, and the Lord Jesus Christ is with you all by faith, are you made complete and right with God by faith in the resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ.

Not sure why you pointed out sins exactly. All of our flesh fails being a part of the nature of Adam, we are born in sin. Sin was paid for on the Cross... once and for all people. It is now a choice for them to go to Christ and have a newness of life where they leave their old fleshly ways behind (meaning to start turning their focus on heavenly things rather than the ways of the flesh and how they are dying to it), from my perspective because it needs to be explained to be seen and understood if possible.

Romans 6:11 In the same way, count yourselves dead to sin but alive to God in Christ Jesus.



But do you see it is Him that it is even possible for you to do so if you do it perfectly by and through allowing the spirit of Christ to move in and through you? You know you are the temple of God, in which allows you to have the spirit to use in this life even ask God for wisdom if one needs it, asking in faith never doubting?

Galatians 2:20 I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I now live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me.
We know from scripture that sinners don't want to call themselves perfect or saints. A sinner should be confessing their sinning to God and probably to their church bishops.

There are only two examples of sinners being justified in scripture that I know of. The Parable of the Tax Collector and Pharisee in Luke 18:9-14. And the woman that washed Jesus' feet with her tears which precludes the parable of the two debtors in Luke 7:36-50.

And that shows the attitudes of sinners that get justified. They admit their faults before God.
 
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MatthewG

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We know from scripture that sinners don't want to call themselves perfect or saints. A sinner should be confessing their sinning to God and probably to their church bishops.

God is there, and he is enough. Devin , wasn't Moses a sinner, for killing an egyptian? David an adulterer for having had Bethsheba?

You are a sinner, and so am I, but thankfully because of the blood of Christ you move into a new spiritual home in the Spirit, and looking forward to the heavenly Jerusalem in which comes when we pass away.

Please understand that I am no advocating sin, but the truth is all of us do, and God is there to have just as you had spoken about who hears our prayers and the Lord suffered on our behalf that we can made right with God because of faith on him.

There are only two examples of sinners being justified in scripture. The Parable of the Tax Collector and Pharisee in Luke 18:9-14. And the woman that washed Jesus' feet with her tears which precludes the parable of the two debtors in Luke 7:36-50.

Yes, there was a person who was proud saying thank you God im not like this sinner, and the other said God have mercy on me Im a sinner.


And that shows the attitudes of sinners that get justified. They admit their faults before God.

Amen, I'm right there with you its good to confess your sins to God and God will deal kindly and gently with you by the Spirit in your own heart.
 

MatthewG

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Because Jesus Christ suffered for our behalf - the same in turn also comes for being a Christian following after Christ, we deny ourselves and pick up the cross and follow him by the Spirit
 

dev553344

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God is there, and he is enough. Devin , wasn't Moses a sinner, for killing an egyptian? David an adulterer for having had Bethsheba?

You are a sinner, and so am I, but thankfully because of the blood of Christ you move into a new spiritual home in the Spirit, and looking forward to the heavenly Jerusalem in which comes when we pass away.

Please understand that I am no advocating sin, but the truth is all of us do, and God is there to have just as you had spoken about who hears our prayers and the Lord suffered on our behalf that we can made right with God because of faith on him.



Yes, there was a person who was proud saying thank you God im not like this sinner, and the other said God have mercy on me Im a sinner.




Amen, I'm right there with you its good to confess your sins to God and God will deal kindly and gently with you by the Spirit in your own heart.
It was faith and love that justified the woman that washed Jesus' feet with her tears. And she performed care for Jesus, which is an act of faith and a good work.
Faith without works is dead. James 2:14-26

And another example of a sinner going to paradise is the thief on the cross, but he was being punished to death for his crimes.
 
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MatthewG

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It was faith and love that justified the woman that washed Jesus' feet with her tears. And she performed care for Jesus, which is an act of faith and a good work.
Faith without works is dead. James 2:14-26

And another example of a sinner going to paradise is the thief on the cross, but he was being punished to death for his crimes. And God may have considered that enough punishment.

Desire to thank you so much for sharing your insights brother. :) May be others will also come to share as well.
 
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MatthewG

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Having Christ let us grow unto perfection .
AND lets also read what pual wrote about SCRIPTURE and the reading of it .
That the man of GOD may be PERFECT and furnished unto all good works . YEAH OPEN BIBLES and start learning .
Learn the doctrine whereby one will grow wise unto salvation through faith in Christ .
For all doctrine is good for reproof , correction , instruction in righteousness . READ THEM BIBLES and learn .
Thank you for always encouraging for people to go and read the bible, Amigo.
 

Enoch111

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How can we be perfect and complete? Is it by Law, or by faith?

Neither. It is only by the grace of God and the transforming power of Christ and the Holy Spirit. Ultimately it is God who perfects the saints. In the meantime we are commanded to live as follows: 11For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men, 12Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world (Titus 2:11,12)​

 

MatthewG

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Neither. It is only by the grace of God and the transforming power of Christ and the Holy Spirit. Ultimately it is God who perfects the saints. In the meantime we are commanded to live as follows: 11For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men, 12Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world (Titus 2:11,12)​

May God get the glory, thank you for sharing what was written to Titus which can help us now today to looking toward the heavenly and make the choice to believe in Him who brings eternal life in which helps us to be come more equipped to live by faith in the knowledge of our Father and the Son, Enoch111! Praise God for His Son who makes us right with God by faith in him and it’s does bring forth a new life to that believer.
 

Grailhunter

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To be perfect is to be complete - or to have integrity.



In this instance Jesus is teaching his audience which was his disciples on the mountain here, He said near the end here, closing - Be perfect, therefore as your heavenly Father is perfect. As mentioned earlier, that being perfect is to be complete or to have integrity; There are only two options to choose from.

Is Jesus telling his disciples to be perfect in the flesh? Or to be perfect and complete in faith in Him?




Here, with the disciples Jesus with a person who came up to Him. From verse 16 the man probably of Jewish decent due to what he is enquiring, saying Teacher what good thing must I do to get eternal life? What a direct and straight forward question here in which this person was to the Messiah who was the very Word of God sent to set the captives free. In verse 17 Jesus responds, which I believe He (being the very Word of God) is referring towards his flesh with this man here saying Why do you ask me about is good? Which I believe is pointing about how with-in the flesh there is nothing good about it (though inside which people had yet to know what the Spirit of God, and the very Soul of the Word of God made flesh. You may differ.

Jesus goes on to state that "There is only One who is good. (meaning God - Jesus's Father). IF you want to enter life keep the commandments." Why is Jesus saying this, if he was someone who fulfills the law and the prophets? Because Jesus is pointing the man back to the commandments which by his birthright he had done and knew about having probably gone to the synagogues growing up from childhood.

Which the Man asked Jesus which ones are you talking about that I should keep? Jesus replies with you shall not murder, commit adulty, steal, not give false testimony, honor your mother and father, and love your neighbor as yourself.

The man states back to Jesus, All of these I have kept. What is it do I still lack that I may gain eternal life? So here the man replies, saying he has kept most of the commands that Jesus had just mentioned to him, in verse 18-19, looking at verse 20.

Here Jesus mentions being perfect again, to be complete, have integrity - “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.” Verse 21.

Jesus again here refers again to the material means - which this means is for a spiritual means too - responds saying that if he desires to be perfect, go sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Thinking about this, to let go of our flesh in trying to feed it by possessions it is better to let go, and to give those are in need so that the man will have treasure in heaven.

Just as Jesus said to his Disciples in Matthew 5, how is it we can be perfect? He stated that it was to be perfect as their Father in heaven is perfect. Here to be perfect, the man needed to materially sell everything he had because he was wealthy. Jesus ends it by saying once he has done that, he will have treasure in heaven and should come to follow Him.



After the man had left, - in an instance you can see a mark here between old covenant and new covenant Jesus was brining forth. As the man - left onward (not sure what he did) but went back to his material ways that he first performed by the flesh, of perfecting in obeying the law to be made right with God because Jesus doesn't say here right out they he was right with God just yet, until the follow Him part in which He would be made seen right with God by faith. That is where being complete in Him is found and it is finished comes into play that brings forth new life to a believer in which they begin to follow after Jesus.

So why is it hard for a rich to enter into the Kingdom of Heaven? Because they do not see their flaws before a truly perfect and holy God. It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who is rich to enter into the kingdom of God. The question here becomes what does it mean to be rich? That could be rich in pride, status, placing oneself above others, not just wealth itself. Because it is okay for Christians to make money, and save it and use it as they will but not to be come prideful above others because of it. That is why it is so hard for a rich person to enter into the kingdom of Heaven.

After explaining this to them, the disciples Who then can be saved?

Jesus responded and looked at them, with this is impossible (through material means), but with God (through spiritual means) with Him all things are possible.

So what does it mean to be perfect is it by the flesh or by and through faith in Christ and resting in his works, and having relationship with the Father, to walk in integrity to be open and honest with God with our failures and to believe on the one whom God had sent.

How can we be perfect and complete? Is it by Law, or by faith?​

Neither is the answer.

But you have opened up a few topics here that have caused some big misunderstandings in Christianity.

Matthew 5:48 Therefore you are to be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.
Can we be perfect as our heavenly Father is perfect? In anything?

Matthew 19:24 Again I say to you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.”

Luke 18:18-22 A ruler questioned Him, saying, “Good Teacher, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?” And Jesus said to him, “Why do you call Me good? No one is good except God alone. You know the commandments, ‘DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, DO NOT MURDER, DO NOT STEAL, DO NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS, HONOR YOUR FATHER AND MOTHER.’” And he said, “All these things I have kept from my youth.” Now when Jesus heard this, He said to him, “One thing you still lack; sell all that you possess and distribute the money to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me.”

Are Christians suppose to own nothing and roam the streets with nothing but the shirts on their backs?

Luke 14:26 If anyone comes to Me, and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be My disciple.

Is this a true statement?

[[[Matthew 5:39 But I say to you, do not resist an evil person; but whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also.

Matthew 5:44 But I say to you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,

Matthew 10:34 Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I did not come to bring peace, but a sword.

Luke 22:36 And He said to them, “But now, whoever has a money belt is to take it along, likewise also a bag, and whoever has no sword is to sell his coat and buy one.]]]

Would Christianity have survived as pacifists? Can these scriptures be reconciled?

Matthew 7:14 For the gate is small and the way is narrow that leads to life, and there are few who find it.

Few?

Even the scholars call these verses the hard sayings of Christ.

Can we figure them out?
 
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MatthewG

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How can we be perfect and complete? Is it by Law, or by faith?​

Neither is the answer.

Hello Grail,

That doesn't make sense one of them have to lead to completion or maturity or lead to integrity.

Integrity to follow Christ is an individual response, and it allows for the Spirit of Christ to follow through the person in which they react to the world and the people in the world by the Spirit rather than the flesh.

But you have opened up a few topics here that have caused some big misunderstandings in Christianity.


What exactly are those subject topics?

Matthew 5:48 Therefore you are to be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.
Can we be perfect as our heavenly Father is perfect? In anything?

By the working power of the spirit through a person - yes they will walk with being complete in Christ, walking in faith by the spirit, known they are made right with God by faith in the death, burial, and resurrection, or is that incorrect?

No one can truly be perfect like God himself in their flesh, but by Christ working in them, the credit then goes always back to God.

Matthew 19:24 Again I say to you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.”

This was addressed in the post.

Luke 18:18-22 A ruler questioned Him, saying, “Good Teacher, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?” And Jesus said to him, “Why do you call Me good? No one is good except God alone. You know the commandments, ‘DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, DO NOT MURDER, DO NOT STEAL, DO NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS, HONOR YOUR FATHER AND MOTHER.’” And he said, “All these things I have kept from my youth.” Now when Jesus heard this, He said to him, “One thing you still lack; sell all that you possess and distribute the money to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me.”

This was addressed in the post but not Luke's account. As a teenager growing up I didn't even honor my own mother - now Christ with-in me helps me to do so.

Are Christians suppose to own nothing and roam the streets with nothing but the shirts on their backs?

Where did this question come from? I addressed several things in the post for people to consider.


Luke 14:26 If anyone comes to Me, and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be My disciple.

This is talking about how one values one or the other. The commandments Jesus stated in some of his accounts is to love God first, then to love your neighbor as yourself. It comes to the choices do I put the opinions and observation of others and the worldly advice from them above God himself, and putting him secondary.

Is this a true statement?
Yes.

[[[Matthew 5:39 But I say to you, do not resist an evil person; but whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also.

This is a true statement as well.

Matthew 5:44 But I say to you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,

Yes, what about it? In their day in age they were literally killed, most today just argue and debate, and kill by stealing time away from others.
Matthew 10:34 Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I did not come to bring peace, but a sword.
Division between the Material and the Spirit - dealing with the nation of Israel in which, the sword would come down on them for having killed the Son of God.

Luke 22:36 And He said to them, “But now, whoever has a money belt is to take it along, likewise also a bag, and whoever has no sword is to sell his coat and buy one.]]]

This topic here is specifically for the disciples themselves, and not applicable to us today in my best estimation, the main thing about the rich ruler, was that he made the choice to return back to his materials even though he was sorrowful.

Would Christianity have survived as pacifists? Can these scriptures be reconciled?

Jesus Christ was only hard on the religious pharisees, never greeks or those outside the Jewish bloodline.

Matthew 7:14 For the gate is small and the way is narrow that leads to life, and there are few who find it.

Few?

Yes there are few that truly find that strait narrow binding way, that leads to freedom in Christ, but also suffering on his behalf.

Even the scholars call these verses the hard sayings of Christ.

Can we figure them out?
By the spirit guiding I do not see why not.
 

Grailhunter

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That doesn't make sense one of them have to lead to completion or maturity or lead to integrity.

Integrity to follow Christ is an individual response, and it allows for the Spirit of Christ to follow through the person in which they react to the world and the people in the world by the Spirit rather than the flesh.
We are not talking about integrity or maturity or just good people....the topic is perfection.

What exactly are those subject topics?
I listed them...

By the working power of the spirit through a person - yes they will walk with being complete in Christ, walking in faith by the spirit, known they are made right with God by faith in the death, burial, and resurrection, or is that incorrect?

No one can truly be perfect like God himself in their flesh, but by Christ working in them, the credit then goes always back to God.

This is all double talk. Not an answer.

Where did this question come from? I addressed several things in the post for people to consider.

Christ's answer to the rich man.....

You are not providing any answers to the scriptures.....the question is can you?
 
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MatthewG

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We are not talking about integrity or maturity or just good people....the topic is perfection.


I listed them...



This is all double talk. Not an answer.



Christ's answer to the rich man.....

You are not providing any answers to the scriptures.....the question is can you?

Grail,

Not so sure what to say here. Will just let it stand, I don’t understand where you are directing the conversation or what it is you are saying.

Thank you though for sharing your subjective view on what your thoughts are on perfection?