Yahweh is the one true elohim.
Theos is applied to many in scripture besides Yahweh. The same is true with elohim.
The Greek word for “gods” is theoi, not theos.
The Hebrew word for “gods” is elohim.
How is it that you cannot see?
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Yahweh is the one true elohim.
Theos is applied to many in scripture besides Yahweh. The same is true with elohim.
The Greek word for “gods” is theoi, not theos.
The Hebrew word for “gods” is elohim.
The translators of the Geneva Bible, as is the case with all English translations published from translation of the Greek manuscripts prior to 1611, understood that John is speaking about God’s own logos, alluding to Genesis 1.
You dislike the translation of the Protestant Reformers who produced the Geneva Bible, believing it to be less accurate. (See the praise heaped on the Geneva Bible by others.) Even so, you can see that there is a major difference in meaning in the translation. That’s the thing which I want others to see and think about.
God’s logos is not his voice. God’s logos is his mind. His voice expresses what is in his mind.
What (in the case of the heavens and the earth) existed in God’s logos, in a manner of speaking, became flesh.
Who (in the case of Jesus) existed in God’s logos later became flesh.
It has been suggested for our consideration that the Protestant Reformers produced a less accurate translation of John’s Gospel. Why would they do that?
”[The Geneva Bible is] a superb translation.”
www.biblegateway.com
A less accurate translation doesn’t equate well with a superb translation.
”[The Geneva Bible is] a superb translation.”
1599 Geneva Bible (GNV) - Version Information - BibleGateway.com
A less accurate translation doesn’t equate well with a superb translation.
Thinking about the Greek word logos being masculine in gender. Let is consider a passage like Matthew 13:20.
”The one on whom seed was sown on the rocky places, this is the man who hears the word (Gk. logos) and immediately receives it with joy;”
Why does the translator use “it” (neuter) rather than “him” (masculine) when referring to the word (Gk. logos)? Is the translator mistaken?
”The one on whom seed was sown on the rocky places, this is the man who hears the word (Gk. logos) and immediately receives it with joy;”
Why does the translator use “it” (neuter) rather than “him” (masculine) when referring to the word (Gk. logos)? Is the translator mistaken?
That's why I posted the interlinear, you can see for yourself.
I'm imagining you shopped that translation to show the wording you were looking for, so I'm expecting you already know this,
American Standard Version for John 1:3
3 All things were made through him; and without him was not anything made that hath been made.
The Bible in Basic English for John 1:3
3 All things came into existence through him, and without him nothing was.
Common English Bible for John 1:3
3 Everything came into being through the Word, and without the Word nothing came into being. What came into being
Common English Bible w/ Apocrypha for John 1:3
3 Everything came into being through the Word, and without the Word nothing came into being. What came into being
The Complete Jewish Bible for John 1:3
3 All things came to be through him, and without him nothing made had being.
Holman Christian Standard Bible for John 1:3
3 All things were created through Him, and apart from Him not one thing was created that has been created.
The Darby Translation for John 1:3
3 All things received being through him, and without him not one [thing] received being which has received being.
English Standard Version for John 1:3
3 All things were made through him, and without him was not any thing made that was made.
Good News Translation for John 1:3
3 Through him God made all things; not one thing in all creation was made without him.
Good News Translation w/ Apocrypha for John 1:3
3 Through him God made all things; not one thing in all creation was made without him.
GOD'S WORD Translation for John 1:3
3 Everything came into existence through him. Not one thing that exists was made without him.
Hebrew Names Version for John 1:3
3 All things were made through him. Without him was not anything made that has been made.
Jubilee Bible 2000 for John 1:3
3 All things were made by him, and without him was not any thing made that was made.
King James Version for John 1:3
3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
Lexham English Bible for John 1:3
3 All [things] came into being through him, and apart from him not one [thing] came into being that has come into being.
The Message Bible for John 1:3
3 Everything was created through him; nothing - not one thing! - came into being without him.
New American Standard Bible for John 1:3
3 All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being.
New Century Version for John 1:3
3 All things were made by him, and nothing was made without him.
New International Reader's Version for John 1:3
3 All things were made through him. Nothing that has been made was made without him.
New International Version for John 1:3
3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.
New King James Version for John 1:3
3 All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.
New Living Translation for John 1:3
3 God created everything through him, and nothing was created except through him.
New Revised Standard for John 1:3
3 All things came into being through him, and without him not one thing came into being. What has come into being
New Revised Standard w/ Apocrypha for John 1:3
3 All things came into being through him, and without him not one thing came into being. What has come into being
Douay-Rheims Catholic Bible for John 1:3
3 All things were made by him: and without him was made nothing that was made.
Revised Standard Version for John 1:3
3 all things were made through him, and without him was not anything made that was made.
Revised Standard Version w/ Apocrypha for John 1:3
3 all things were made through him, and without him was not anything made that was made.
Third Millennium Bible for John 1:3
3 All things were made by Him, and without Him was not anything made that was made.
John 1:3 - Compare Bible Verse Translations
Compare Bible translations of John 1:3 using all available Bible versions and commentary. "Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made"
Much love!
Thank you. What it shows us is that the gender is masculine. What it doesn’t explain to us is why the grammatical gender is translated neuter by the translators of the Geneva Bible.
I'm imagining you shopped that translation to show the wording you were looking for, so I'm expecting you already know this,
American Standard Version for John 1:3
3 All things were made through him; and without him was not anything made that hath been made.
The Bible in Basic English for John 1:3
3 All things came into existence through him, and without him nothing was.
Common English Bible for John 1:3
3 Everything came into being through the Word, and without the Word nothing came into being. What came into being
Common English Bible w/ Apocrypha for John 1:3
3 Everything came into being through the Word, and without the Word nothing came into being. What came into being
The Complete Jewish Bible for John 1:3
3 All things came to be through him, and without him nothing made had being.
Holman Christian Standard Bible for John 1:3
3 All things were created through Him, and apart from Him not one thing was created that has been created.
The Darby Translation for John 1:3
3 All things received being through him, and without him not one [thing] received being which has received being.
English Standard Version for John 1:3
3 All things were made through him, and without him was not any thing made that was made.
Good News Translation for John 1:3
3 Through him God made all things; not one thing in all creation was made without him.
Good News Translation w/ Apocrypha for John 1:3
3 Through him God made all things; not one thing in all creation was made without him.
GOD'S WORD Translation for John 1:3
3 Everything came into existence through him. Not one thing that exists was made without him.
Hebrew Names Version for John 1:3
3 All things were made through him. Without him was not anything made that has been made.
Jubilee Bible 2000 for John 1:3
3 All things were made by him, and without him was not any thing made that was made.
King James Version for John 1:3
3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
Lexham English Bible for John 1:3
3 All [things] came into being through him, and apart from him not one [thing] came into being that has come into being.
The Message Bible for John 1:3
3 Everything was created through him; nothing - not one thing! - came into being without him.
New American Standard Bible for John 1:3
3 All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being.
New Century Version for John 1:3
3 All things were made by him, and nothing was made without him.
New International Reader's Version for John 1:3
3 All things were made through him. Nothing that has been made was made without him.
New International Version for John 1:3
3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.
New King James Version for John 1:3
3 All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.
New Living Translation for John 1:3
3 God created everything through him, and nothing was created except through him.
New Revised Standard for John 1:3
3 All things came into being through him, and without him not one thing came into being. What has come into being
New Revised Standard w/ Apocrypha for John 1:3
3 All things came into being through him, and without him not one thing came into being. What has come into being
Douay-Rheims Catholic Bible for John 1:3
3 All things were made by him: and without him was made nothing that was made.
Revised Standard Version for John 1:3
3 all things were made through him, and without him was not anything made that was made.
Revised Standard Version w/ Apocrypha for John 1:3
3 all things were made through him, and without him was not anything made that was made.
Third Millennium Bible for John 1:3
3 All things were made by Him, and without Him was not anything made that was made.
John 1:3 - Compare Bible Verse Translations
Compare Bible translations of John 1:3 using all available Bible versions and commentary. "Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made"www.biblestudytools.com
Much love!
Thanks again. Are you also planning to do the same for all of the English translations which refer to the word / logos as “it” in John’s prologue? If not, why not?
Perhaps you misunderstood. I googled translation comparisons til I found the one that had the longest list. I only shopped for quantity, not content. As you see, the great majority of translators stayed with the gender of the Greek text.
In "translating" masculine into neuter, that becomes an interpretation. This is one of the reasons I never use the NIV, as it has many many passages that are "interpreted", and not translated.
That is of course a question you'd have to ask them, why is it that unlike most other translators, why did they not show the actual gender of the word used there?
Much love!
There is a difference between grammatical gender and natural gender. That comes into play here in our discussion of decisions translators make when producing their translations from Greek to English.
It’s content that I’m interested. The majority didn’t prior to 1611, and many since don’t.
What we’re reading in all of these translations are translator interpretations.
They saw exactly what we saw. The grammatical gender for logos is masculine. The question really isn’t what they saw written in the Greek. The question really is what they understood John to be saying.
It does?
Of course it does, it's what we've been talking about. The contexts show us how to see these.
In John 1:1-3, the attribution is to a creator, but in changing pronouns you remove that creator, and fill the gap by calling the creator actually to be an idea in the mind of another. I'm not buying that. The text does not support that. The context does not support that. The "idea in the mind of another" did not take on a body and live among us. A person does that. A "He". Just like it says. And just like it says in other passages.
Philippians 2:7 KJV
But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
Much love!
Once again, I’m asking our readers to think about why the translators of the Geneva Bible (and all English translations prior to KJV from the Greek manuscripts) - all trinitarians - made the decision to refer to the word as “it” in John’s prologue.
Your list, having omitted the translations you believe are less accurate, is incomplete.
No, still you are not understanding. I did not omit anything. I found the longest list I could and posted it. Plain and simple. If you have some complaint against this comparison of translations, it's not with me.
Much love!
You haven’t yet been able to account for why trinitarian translators decided to refer to the logos as “it”.
Paul is writing here not about the Father, but rather the Son.
My contention is that which is made by the Apostles’ creed.
Your list does not include all translations. It includes only the translations which you believe are more accurate.
Agreed.
The word / logos in John 1:1-5 is not the Son in English translations prepared and published (by trinitarians) prior to 1611.
It's not incumbent on me to account for someone's decision to translate something. It seems to me that the vast majority of translations don't agree, and how do you account for that? I guess you have a lot more accounting for to do, yes?
Much love!
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