How is Jesus Firstborn from the dead?

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

No you are right, Angels are not immortal, God will destroy satan and his angels in the lake of fire( Rev 20)-They arent mortal, they are spirit beings. Oh i see what you are saying by them being mortal, not as in flesh and blood but that God can kill them. Every being created was given free will, Misuse of that free will gets one destroyed.

Yes although the angels are spirit beings they are mortal, because they can be destroyed out of existence by God. Even the Only Begotten Son of God was mortal when in heaven before he became human. If he had been immortal then he would be beyond death, death would not ever had no hold on him. So the Only Begotten Son of God was a mortal spirit being in heaven before he became human. But after Jesus death as a mortal human he was resurrected as a immortal incorruptible life giving spirit. This means he's beyond death. Death has no hold on him forever more. That is also true of those who are mortal humans who God has chosen to be kings, judges, and priests with his Only Begotten Son in that Messianic kingdom. When resurrected they also will be given immortal incorruptible spirit bodies.

 

[Taken]

You fail to see, YHWH(Jehovah) created all other things through the being he sent to earth. That being is his master worker who speaks at proverbs 8.

No clue what you are talking about.

 

[Taken]

No you are right, Angels are not immortal, God will destroy satan and his angels in the lake of fire( Rev 20)-They arent mortal, they are spirit beings. Oh i see what you are saying by them being mortal, not as in flesh and blood but that God can kill them. Every being created was given free will, Misuse of that free will gets one destroyed.

Angels are spirit beings. No they are NOT mortal.

 

[Keiw]

Yes although the angels are spirit beings they are mortal, because they can be destroyed out of existence by God. Even the Only Begotten Son of God was mortal when in heaven before he became human. If he had been immortal then he would be beyond death, death would not ever had no hold on him. So the Only Begotten Son of God was a mortal spirit being in heaven before he became human. But after Jesus death as a mortal human he was resurrected as a immortal incorruptible life giving spirit. This means he's beyond death. Death has no hold on him forever more. That is also true of those who are mortal humans who God has chosen to be kings, judges, and priests with his Only Begotten Son in that Messianic kingdom. When resurrected they also will be given immortal incorruptible spirit bodies.

Yes i agree. The speaker at Proverbs 8 is the one whom God sent to earth. All evidence points to Michael as the one sent by God.

 

[Keiw]

No clue what you are talking about.

I know exactly what i am talking about. All who know the real Jesus, knows it is him speaking at Proverbs 8--No other can be called Gods master worker, but the one whom God created all other things through.

 

[Keiw]

Angels are spirit beings. No they are NOT mortal.

Not mortal flesh, but mortal in that they arent immortal and can be killed by God.

 

[Taken]

I know exactly what i am talking about. All who know the real Jesus, knows it is him speaking at Proverbs 8--No other can be called Gods master worker, but the one whom God created all other things through.

And did someone deny Jesus is the Word of God, that you felt the need to tell me about it?

 

[Taken]

Not mortal flesh, but mortal in that they arent immortal and can be killed by God.

No.
Physical death applies to a mortal.
Body’s of men are mortal. They not only CAN die, But WILL die.
A spiritual death is Separation from God, whether or not the thing is a living spirit or living mortal man.

Angels are not Killed.
Fallen angels shall eternally be Separated from God.
Remember that bottomless pit thingy?

 

[Keiw]

And did someone deny Jesus is the Word of God, that you felt the need to tell me about it?

I shared at prov 8 he tells all he was created. You reject that, because you do not know him. You have been taught a false Christ out of altered translations.

 

[Keiw]

No.
Physical death applies to a mortal.
Body’s of men are mortal. They not only CAN die, But WILL die.
A spiritual death is Separation from God, whether or not the thing is a living spirit or living mortal man.

Angels are not Killed.
Fallen angels shall eternally be Separated from God.
Remember that bottomless pit thingy?

The bible teaches Satan and his fallen angels will be thrown into the lake of fire= destruction.

 

[robert derrick]

Yes 10 years after the chariot event. There are 3 heavens-Our atmosphere, outer space, and Gods dwelling place in the bible. Elijah was retired and went to another spot on earth, thus the letter 10 years later. No mortal flesh lives in Gods dwelling place, its the spirit realm. So Enoch did not go to Gods dwelling place.
John 3:13 says no man entered heaven before Jesus.

So what happened to Enoch?

God simply took him home to bodily die prematurely: His soul was no more on earth, and they just found his dead body without any apparent reason for it?

This was when men lived bodily for hundreds and hundreds of years.

It makes perfect sense, that now you bring it up, No flesh and blood can see nor stand in sight of God, nor inherit His kingdom.

It makes no sense at all that their mortal bodies have been standing in front of God all this time, otherwise, in Rev 4-5, there would certainly ahve been some mention of it!

I have already been concluding the two witnesses are not Elijah and Enoch, nor any other man as Moses back on earth ministering again.

So thanks much.

Aren't you also the one that showed me how we are not born with sin nature? If so, keep it coming.

I love being corrected for the better. It makes all Scripture fall into proper place much more nicely.

 

[robert derrick]

Jesus was the firstborn who knew God.
The rest of the world had spiritually died. He was the candle that brought light to a dark world.
He was the first to bring with him the true knowledge of God.
The rest of the world had become reprobate.

Sounds good to me.

We are all first made and born perfectly by Christ, whether angel or man, but when we first sinned, as all men do, though not Jesus nor all angels, we were found with iniquity and died spiritual to God.

Jesus is the one and only man to know God after being firstborn pure into the world with mortal flesh.

And so, He was the firstborn who knew and chose God and sinned not from His youth.

 

[robert derrick]

This is total nonsense. Every human being is born with a sin nature and with a dead spirit. It is only after the New Birth that we are born again and made into new creatures in Christ.

You and your sinful doctrine are still dead.

Those sinning today are not born of God today.

And no. You are not total nonsense. Just totally dead. Useless too.

 

[robert derrick]

.


I'm aware of at least three different kinds of resurrections. There's a
resurrection of the core of one's being (John 5:24-25, Eph 2:1) a basic
resurrection (Matt 11:5) and a resurrection to immortality (1Cor 15:51-54)
_

He was of course speaking of the last mortal to immortality.

However, no man was every resurrected spiritually before Jesus' own resurrection from the dead, which makes Him firstborn from the dead.

But, to say no one was born again before He ascended to heaven is not so true.

I do not believe the members were not being added to the body of Christ, until the day of Pentecost; otherwise, none of the disciples and apostles were born again and being saved until the fire of the upper room.

I say Mary Magdalen was the first one born and again and spiritually resurrected on earth, because she was the first to see Jesus bodily resurrected and believed in Him as Lord and Saviour, which is how every man is saved, though not necessarily by sight as Mary and Thomas.

When we believe in Jesus death, burial, and resurrection as our Lord and our God, then we are being saved by faith.

 

[robert derrick]

He could have gotten that letter before.The Bible jumps around in time in a lot of places. I just can't see God moving him to a different area of the earth. What would be the purpose..

To make way for Elisha comes to mind.

But without killing his body, as He may have done with Enoch.

I'm thinking it makes no sense at all to believe any mortal flesh and blood is standing before the God of the whole earth in heaven.

Otherwise, there would be mention of that in the throne room in Rev4-5.

The only time and place and way for any flesh and blood to stand before God is on earth, as the flesh and bone body of Jesus Christ.

 

[robert derrick]

rubbish!!!! Its amazing to me how bad your theology is, its almost like it gets worse everytime you post.

I hope you have plenty of drool on your face along with your exclamations. I've begun just posting more and more threads, and spend less time with spluttering children on each one.

Which is why you see less responses from me.

As I said before, when you do show signs of maturity, then I'd be glad to hear from you. Although most your stuff is mantra, you do still add pearls of folly, that I add to my ever growing list of OSAS delusion.

If I were more of a scholar, I could write a book about the beasts of Ephesus then and of OSAS today.

 

[Taken]

I shared at prov 8 he tells all he was created. You reject that, because you do not know him. You have been taught a false Christ out of altered translations.

Well that’s nice you shared prov 8 as you say.
Then you tell me what I reject.

How about if you can not QUOTE a Scripture you at least learn how to properly reference a Scripture.....and WHY are you speaking FOR me?

 

[robert derrick]

The Only Begotten Son of God wasn't immortal in heaven with God before he became human. A person who is immortal can't die, death has no hold on any person who is immortal. When Jesus became human he was still mortal. The Only Begotten Son of God was mortal in heaven before he became a human being but Jesus sacrificed that mortal human being and at his resurrection he was changed from a mortal corruptible human to a immortal incorruptible life giving spirit.

More pagan cult worship around the greatest of all idolized mortal heroes called 'Jesus', even greater than the defied Herakles.

The angels in heaven are mortal beings. The scriptures show that the angel that became Satan the Devil and those angels who sided with him, his demons, are mortal and will be destroyed out of existence when they're thrown into the lake of fire just as when death, and Hades(the Grave) are thrown into the lake of fire are destroyed out of existence.

And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

People don't want to acknowledge the truth of their own immortal souls, if we are making ourselves spiritually corrupt by sinning, because we want an 'out' in case we are wrong and are not going to be resurrected with the just, while sinning unto the end of this life.

I used to like to think that too, until I started taking God at His word and the Scriptures seriously.

The following teaching is not for you. I just love teaching the truth when I get the chance.

The Word was God, and the body prepared for the word was mortal, as is all of man's flesh, beginning with Adam.

Every soul of man, as with every angel, is created spiritually immortal. It is the mortal body of the saint, that becomes resurrected unto immortality. The rest stand dead before God at the judgment.

 

[robert derrick]

That doesnt negate truth found at John 3:13 does it? God could have easily shown Moses his death prior to it. Isaiah wrote about Cyrus defeating babylon 200 years before it occurred.

This is a good counter, which means Elijah wrote the letter prior to his death, or was still alive somewhere in seclusion from prophesying to Israel.

Either way, when we must say flesh and blood is still standing before God in His throne room, we realize that can't be the case, since it contradicts basic Scripture.

No mortal man sees God in His throne room, not in his flesh and blood. John was not in his flesh and blood in heaven, nor was the one int he third heaven.

If Elijah and Enoch are indeed standing before the God of the earth, to return as the two witnesses, then their dead bodies would need be resurrected for them to do so, and that would mean two deaths and two bodily resurrections.

Interesting stuff.

 

[Taken]

The bible teaches Satan and his fallen angels will be thrown into the lake of fire= destruction.

Destruction does not mean death.