How is the end time different than what we thought.

[Davy]

Well on the side of "darkness" I agree with the idea of sudden destruction coming into view here...the list one could put together is growing. I am not surprised in the way the beast is rolling out its control...but I am surprised at humanity's seeming non-response to it.

I am always trying to get the people I encounter, or the worldly folks I know to try to discuss these things...typically they do not want to...and if a conversation gets going it is quickly side tracked.

I started a substack to keep some things in front of people...they read it... but very little comes of it.

As for the religious folks the common church goer...in my life...most of them are looking for the rapture...a trip to heaven for a time. So any discussion about life in the tribulation is unnecessary to them.

Now on to the side of "light"...the kingdom of heaven is on earth...today...and has been since the Pentecost following the resurrection of our Lord Yahshua. It is continuing to grow but not necessarily in terms of numbers because of the apostasy...and the apostasy occurs because of the purifying fires of tribulation or judgement that bring the sons of God into the divine standard of Christ as they mature.

So the time ahead is setting up to be the glorious battle between the mature sons of God and the mature sons of Satan...and the judgement is set in favor of the saints.

As the time of "great tribulation" gets closer, people will be more and more 'divided' into 2 groups, those deceived, and those not deceived. So those not deceived that spiritually 'see' what is happening will not be able to reveal it to the deceived. This is actually what the "great tribulation" is designed to do, call out God's people who remain in Christ and God's Truth in His Word vs. those who would rather follow the devil and this world.

The "sudden destruction" event Apostle Paul said would happen upon the wicked and deceived per 1 Thessalonians 5, only happens on the LAST DAY of this world when God's consuming fire burns man's works off this earth, and Christ is revealed coming in the clouds to gather His saints, thus ending this present world. Apostle Paul was pulling that "sudden destruction" idea from the Old Testament prophets about the "day of the Lord", which is the last day of this present world.

 

[Davy]

Expect the unexpected.

Lord Jesus told us what to expect leading up to the day of His coming, so time to get busy with that study instead of guessing.

 

[Rockerduck]

Lord Jesus told us what to expect leading up to the day of His coming, so time to get busy with that study instead of guessing.

The Pharisee's knew what to expect when Jesus arrived. But it was not what they expected. That's my point. You misunderstood what said. It wasn't about guessing at all.

 

[Davy]

As I posted earlier…”them” as specified in 1st Thessalonians 5 are those in “darkness”…”But you, brethren, are not in darkness, that the day would overtake you like a thief; for you are all sons of light and sons of day. We are not of night nor of darkness…”

This specifically means…those “in Christ” Keraz…the sons of light. This is not limited to a place called Israel...most of the earth hates Israel...why not they became the harlot...didn't they? Now the modern day "church" is that harlot...and they too will be hated by the nations and the beast.

The religious leaders of Israel all knew that their "king" was prophesied to come through king David's lineage...right? Yet what do they tell Pilate...we have no king but Caesar...a Roman king...you people need to come to grips with the reality that when the Lord Yahshua told Israel in Jerusalem that day...that he was going to leave to them their house desolate...it was back to the wilderness for them.

Then He...as the seed of His Father went on to fulfill His promise to Abraham by bringing forth a spiritual nation comprised of the sons of God...that "son" is reaching maturity and as He does...this creation is going to have to deal with Him...more specifically the beast and Satan are going to have to deal with Him.

The only thing spiritually that will ever come out of Israel or any nation on the earth...are those "in Christ" whom ancient Israel rejected.

Much of that is just 'generally accepted Bible topics' developed from men's traditions, and not a deeper understanding which God's Word is showing.

1. Paul in 1 Thess.5 is pointing to the 'deceived' who listen to the children of darkness. That's why the deceived are in darkness, because they instead are deceived by Satan's host who serve him. Paul even uses the symbolic phrase "drunken in the night" about those deceived.

2. The Western Christian nations do not hate the nation of Israel. Christians instead are the ones hated by the evil false Jews that hide among the Jew's leaders. God's Word gives many examples of false ones, like the Canaanites, which crept in among the children of Israel early in their history, and became Jews. In Jeremiah 24, God showed Jeremiah a basket of evil figs to represent those crept in unawares. Jesus pointed to them in His parable of the tares of the field. And the Book of Jude points to them about those ordained to that condemnation of working against Christ. THOSE... are the ones who crept into the positions of high priest, Pharisees and scribes at Jesus' 1st coming, and those false Jews are the ones that stirred the crowds to have Lord Jesus crucified.

So once again, the 'deceived' are acted upon by the actual deceivers of the devil, the devil's own servants. Thus we cannot blame ALL Jews for the event of Christ's crucifixion! Even the scribes of Israel at Christ's 1st coming were not born of Israel, but were Kenites of the lands of Canaan. And they were joined with the Pharisee crept in unawares against Christ. So not all of the Pharisees were of those false Jews that crept in. Nicodemus, who believed Jesus, was a Pharisee, and provided spices for Lord Jesus' burial.

3. Apostle Paul told you, in Romans 11, that God Himself spiritually blinded the majority of Paul's brethren the Jews. And Paul also told you that blindness away from The Gospel would remain upon them until the fullness of the Gentiles comes in, which points to the day of Christ's future return.

So ANY consternation by any Christian against the 'blinded' Jews today is NOT justified in Christ, which is why Apostle Paul called those who do such being wise in their own conceits (Romans 11:25-32).

When Lord Jesus returns, that... is when God's blindness (a spiritual stupor per the manuscripts), will be removed, and they will then understand Who Jesus of Nazareth, The Christ, is. Zechariah 12 even shows they will 'mourn' for Him.

Thus anyone who believes the orthodox unbelieving Jews that are descendants of the 12 tribes have been discarded by God, do not know enough of God's written Word to even think that way.

 

[Davy]

The Pharisee's knew what to expect when Jesus arrived. But it was not what they expected. That's my point. You misunderstood what said. It wasn't about guessing at all.

Well, you didn't explain that in your post. So one who read your sole statement, "Expect the unexpected", has to think you are speaking of the latter times, not the Pharisees. Afterall, this Thread is about the latter times.

 

[marks]

The prophecies of the end of the world point to or are always connected with the second coming of Christ. We see the disciples asking Christ...
“ . . . Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?” Matthew 24:3.
Christ goes down a list in verses 4-14..
"4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.
5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.
6 And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.
7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.
8 All these are the beginning of sorrows.
9 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake.
10 And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.
11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.
12 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.
13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come."

and in Luke 21 we see
“9 But when ye shall hear of wars and commotions, be not terrified: for these things must first come to pass; but the end is not by and by.
10 Then said he unto them, Nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom:
11 And great earthquakes shall be in divers places, and famines, and pestilences; and fearful sights and great signs shall there be from heaven.
12 But before all these, they shall lay their hands on you, and persecute you, delivering you up to the synagogues, and into prisons, being brought before kings and rulers for my name's sake.
13 And it shall turn to you for a testimony.
14 Settle it therefore in your hearts, not to meditate before what ye shall answer:
15 For I will give you a mouth and wisdom, which all your adversaries shall not be able to gainsay nor resist.
16 And ye shall be betrayed both by parents, and brethren, and kinsfolks, and friends; and some of you shall they cause to be put to death.
17 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake.
18 But there shall not an hair of your head perish.” Luke 21:9-18.

And things within the church itself..
“For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; and they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.” 2 Timothy 4:3, 4.

A compromise of Gods truth will come into the church..
“Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.” 2 Thessalonians 2:3, 4.

Scoffers would come... “
Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts, and saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.” 2 Peter 3:3, 4.

And we would see even worse among the people..
“This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good, traitors, heady, highminded lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God; having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.”
2 Timothy 3:1-5.

People during the last days will be looking for fun and having parties and drinking with no restraints..
“And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man. They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all. Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded; but the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.” Luke 17:26-30.

Prophecy tells us this and foretells that there would be false christs trying to deceive, and we would see wars and rumor of wars, and they would try to proclaim peace but...

“For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them.” 1 Thessalonians 5:3.

So we are seeing all these things and it looks like getting to the part of "sudden destruction cometh upon them.” So are we surprised, or is this what we expected with the intensity and force, and implementation of control that is happening?

No, I'm not surprised. This is pretty much what I've been expecting.

Much love!

 

[Davy]

People during the last days will be looking for fun and having parties and drinking with no restraints..
“And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man. They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all. Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded; but the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.” Luke 17:26-30.

Prophecy tells us this and foretells that there would be false christs trying to deceive, and we would see wars and rumor of wars, and they would try to proclaim peace but...

“For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them.” 1 Thessalonians 5:3.

So we are seeing all these things and it looks like getting to the part of "sudden destruction cometh upon them.” So are we surprised, or is this what we expected with the intensity and force, and implementation of control that is happening?

Well, you quoted a lot of Scripture which does reveal a lot of what's happening today. But when you got to the the above paragraphs you started drifting from what Bible Scripture actually teaches.

The main event in the days of Noah ("Noe") that caused God to bring the world flood then was the mating of fallen angels with the flesh daughters of Adam to produce a giant-hybrid offspring which God did not create. So when Lord Jesus said that about the day of His coming would be like the days of Noe, that especially was what He was pointing to, because Rev.12:7-17 reveals Satan and his host of angels will be booted out of the Heavenly down to this earth among us for the end of this world.

And those who will be saying that, "Peace and safety" will be saying that because of the great signs, wonders, and miracles the coming false-Messiah is to work on earth, curing the world's problems, and deceiving the whole world into believing he is Christ. This is why you forgot... to finish what Jesus said about hearing of "wars and rumors of wars", because He ended that with, "but the end is not yet". What that means is NO WARS and NO RUMORS of WAR for the very end during that false "Peace and safety" time for the deceived.

That period when the world will be saying that, "Peace and safety" will be the time of "great tribulation", which will NOT be a time of WWIII like all the false Hal Lindsay books and Left-Behind books and movies try to claim in attempting to support the FALSE Pre-trib Rapture Theory. The coming "great tribulation" will be a time of world peace established by the coming false-Messiah to fool the world into thinking he is The Christ having returned. All religions will believe on him as their expected one.

That "sudden destruction" event of 1 Thess.5 will come upon the deceived and wicked on the LAST DAY of this world when Jesus comes to gather His elect. God's Word calls that the "day of the Lord" on that final day of this world. Apostle Peter even revealed that "day of the Lord" is the day when God's consuming fire will burn man's works off the surface of this earth, just as God destroyed that old world with a flood of waters (2 Peter 3).

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

So I guess you are one of the 'few', did you decided that?

I guess you'll have to study to find out.

 

[Keraz]

Thus anyone who believes the orthodox unbelieving Jews that are descendants of the 12 tribes have been discarded by God, do not know enough of God's written Word to even think that way.

Lack of knowledge of the Prophetic Word applies to you.

You fail to see firstly; that the Jews are not all of Israel. They constitute only 2/12ths. The House of Israel is still scattered among the nations and are as many as the sands of the sea.
Secondly; over 20 Bible prophesies tell of how the current Jewish State of Israel will be uprooted from the Land and only a remnant will survive. Jeremiah 12:14, Romans 9:27, +

 

[Davy]

Lack of knowledge of the Prophetic Word applies to you.

You fail to see firstly; that the Jews are not all of Israel. They constitute only 2/12ths. The House of Israel is still scattered among the nations and are as many as the sands of the sea.
Secondly; over 20 Bible prophesies tell of how the current Jewish State of Israel will be uprooted from the Land and only a remnant will survive. Jeremiah 12:14, Romans 9:27, +

Your post above is really IGNORANT.

If you had actually read... my posts, you would have understood that I cover about the "tares" that crept in among Israel all the time, and NO ONE, including YOU, ever comments about those Scriptures I quote!!! Thus your post above is just STUPID!

And NO, the Jews do NOT constitute 2/12ths of Israel. They constitute 3/12's, because the "house of Judah" per God's Word eventually made up THREE TRIBES, not just TWO.

Your above post of VANITY throws away the deceived Jews that Apostle Paul said in Romans 11 have been BLINDED by God's Own Hand! Paul said ALL ISRAEL WILL BE SAVED WHEN GOD TAKES AWAY THEIR SIN (and that means WHEN they believe on Jesus Christ at His coming!).

 

[Reddsta]

As the time of "great tribulation" gets closer, people will be more and more 'divided' into 2 groups, those deceived, and those not deceived. So those not deceived that spiritually 'see' what is happening will not be able to reveal it to the deceived. This is actually what the "great tribulation" is designed to do, call out God's people who remain in Christ and God's Truth in His Word vs. those who would rather follow the devil and this world.

The "sudden destruction" event Apostle Paul said would happen upon the wicked and deceived per 1 Thessalonians 5, only happens on the LAST DAY of this world when God's consuming fire burns man's works off this earth, and Christ is revealed coming in the clouds to gather His saints, thus ending this present world. Apostle Paul was pulling that "sudden destruction" idea from the Old Testament prophets about the "day of the Lord", which is the last day of this present world.

Nicely said Davy...these forums exist to prove that what is happening in the kingdom of God will not be revealed to the deceived.

 

[Reddsta]

2. The Western Christian nations do not hate the nation of Israel.

The context of my post to Keraz was in the light of Paul’s writing in 1 Thessalonians 5…and Keraz pro-Israel perspective…and was aimed at the time of Paul’s writing. Perhaps you did not catch that.

Western “Christians”…maybe…and their constituency is dwindling, however not necessarily the nations they are in. That’s not a subject I wish to go into at this time…

 

[Davy]

Nicely said Davy...these forums exist to prove that what is happening in the kingdom of God will not be revealed to the deceived.

And I say that out of experience, because I personally have show some brethren in a Bible study the actual Scripture where Lord Jesus revealed He comes to gather His saints after... the tribulation, and I then asked them questions to find out if they truly understood what they read. They showed they understood, at that time.

But later, like even two weeks later, I'd ask them about that Scripture again, and it would be like they never ever read it, as if God had just taken it right out of their minds. I then figured that was a sign for me, that only GOD can give understanding, and for those who have not, He has a time and reason for when they are to understand.

 

[Davy]

The context of my post to Keraz was in the light of Paul’s writing in 1 Thessalonians 5…and Keraz pro-Israel perspective…and was aimed at the time of Paul’s writing. Perhaps you did not catch that.

Western “Christians”…maybe…and their constituency is dwindling, however not necessarily the nations they are in. That’s not a subject I wish to go into at this time…

I realize that some Churches today do not heed Apostle Paul in Romans 11:25-33 of how Paul's brethren the Jews are simply 'blinded' by God's Hand away from The Gospel for this present world time, and that blindness is to eventually be removed (not just individually either, but as a nation).

Most of those Churches don't preach Old Testament history about God's Plan for the "house of Judah" (Jews), and how He separated them from the larger portion of the children of Israel (ten tribe "house of Israel"). There's even some Biblically illiterate in those deceived Churches that claim the teaching about the two separate 'houses' in God's Word is propaganda, made up.

 

[Hobie]

Well, you quoted a lot of Scripture which does reveal a lot of what's happening today. But when you got to the the above paragraphs you started drifting from what Bible Scripture actually teaches.

The main event in the days of Noah ("Noe") that caused God to bring the world flood then was the mating of fallen angels with the flesh daughters of Adam to produce a giant-hybrid offspring which God did not create. So when Lord Jesus said that about the day of His coming would be like the days of Noe, that especially was what He was pointing to, because Rev.12:7-17 reveals Satan and his host of angels will be booted out of the Heavenly down to this earth among us for the end of this world.

And those who will be saying that, "Peace and safety" will be saying that because of the great signs, wonders, and miracles the coming false-Messiah is to work on earth, curing the world's problems, and deceiving the whole world into believing he is Christ. This is why you forgot... to finish what Jesus said about hearing of "wars and rumors of wars", because He ended that with, "but the end is not yet". What that means is NO WARS and NO RUMORS of WAR for the very end during that false "Peace and safety" time for the deceived.

That period when the world will be saying that, "Peace and safety" will be the time of "great tribulation", which will NOT be a time of WWIII like all the false Hal Lindsay books and Left-Behind books and movies try to claim in attempting to support the FALSE Pre-trib Rapture Theory. The coming "great tribulation" will be a time of world peace established by the coming false-Messiah to fool the world into thinking he is The Christ having returned. All religions will believe on him as their expected one.

That "sudden destruction" event of 1 Thess.5 will come upon the deceived and wicked on the LAST DAY of this world when Jesus comes to gather His elect. God's Word calls that the "day of the Lord" on that final day of this world. Apostle Peter even revealed that "day of the Lord" is the day when God's consuming fire will burn man's works off the surface of this earth, just as God destroyed that old world with a flood of waters (2 Peter 3).

Well, I guess this is what you consider the peaceful time, I think you have missed what is happening...

 

[Davy]

Well, I guess this is what you consider the peaceful time, I think you have missed what is happening...

And you are still making errors in your thinking, because of your not staying in God's Word as written.

Per Apostle Paul in 1 Thessalonians 5, he linked that time the deceived will be saying, "Peace and safety" with the very end of this world when the "sudden destruction" on the "day of the Lord" comes to end this present world.

I realize your false Pre-trib Rapture theory teachers say the "day of the Lord" happens PRIOR to the time of "great tribulation", but they are tell a big fat LIE directly against God's written Word.

Per 2 Peter 3:10, God's consuming fire is going to BURN MAN'S WORKS OFF THIS EARTH on the "day of the Lord". So HOW is Satan's world beast kingdom and the Antichrist going to still exist when that happens? It won't, because the "day of the Lord" is the LAST DAY of this present world and is when Jesus comes to gather His Church and end this present world.

You simply are not using your brain, but are allowing those liars to think for you.

 

[Hobie]

And you are still making errors in your thinking, because of your not staying in God's Word as written.

Per Apostle Paul in 1 Thessalonians 5, he linked that time the deceived will be saying, "Peace and safety" with the very end of this world when the "sudden destruction" on the "day of the Lord" comes to end this present world.

I realize your false Pre-trib Rapture theory teachers say the "day of the Lord" happens PRIOR to the time of "great tribulation", but they are tell a big fat LIE directly against God's written Word.

Per 2 Peter 3:10, God's consuming fire is going to BURN MAN'S WORKS OFF THIS EARTH on the "day of the Lord". So HOW is Satan's world beast kingdom and the Antichrist going to still exist when that happens? It won't, because the "day of the Lord" is the LAST DAY of this present world and is when Jesus comes to gather His Church and end this present world.

You simply are not using your brain, but are allowing those liars to think for you.

Need to see what they say their purpose is for the world order they have set up...
"Prescriptively, world order refers to a preferred arrangement of power and authority that is associated with the realization of such values as peace, economic growth and equity, human rights, and environmental quality and sustainability."

"The UN has created and developed peacekeeping operations as one of the measures to ensure international peace and security. "

"According to the Charter, the General Assembly can make recommendations on the general principles of cooperation for maintaining international peace and security, including disarmament, and for the peaceful settlement of any situation that might impair friendly relations among nations. "

Peace and Security | United Nations

Saving succeeding generations from the scourge of war was the main motivation for creating the United Nations, whose founders lived through the devastation of two world wars.

www.un.org

 

[Rockerduck]

The gov't's are saying "peace and safety" right now. All the major cities say crime rate is low and no need for police. And riots were just peaceful assembly's where cities were destroyed. They don't tell us how the Ukraine war is going much anymore. Still trying to scare every one with plagues and tell us how great the economy is.

 

[ChristisGod]

The gov't's are saying "peace and safety" right now. All the major cities say crime rate is low and no need for police. And riots were just peaceful assembly's where cities were destroyed. They don't tell us how the Ukraine war is going much anymore. Still trying to scare every one with plagues and tell us how great the economy is.

ditto

 

[Cassandra]

And you are still making errors in your thinking, because of your not staying in God's Word as written.

Per Apostle Paul in 1 Thessalonians 5, he linked that time the deceived will be saying, "Peace and safety" with the very end of this world when the "sudden destruction" on the "day of the Lord" comes to end this present world.

I realize your false Pre-trib Rapture theory teachers say the "day of the Lord" happens PRIOR to the time of "great tribulation", but they are tell a big fat LIE directly against God's written Word.

Per 2 Peter 3:10, God's consuming fire is going to BURN MAN'S WORKS OFF THIS EARTH on the "day of the Lord". So HOW is Satan's world beast kingdom and the Antichrist going to still exist when that happens? It won't, because the "day of the Lord" is the LAST DAY of this present world and is when Jesus comes to gather His Church and end this present world.

You simply are not using your brain, but are allowing those liars to think for you.

Unless I'm mistaken, i don't think Hobie believes in a pre trib rapture