How many kingdoms in Daniel?

[Earburner]

Satan has had influence, but Satan has not been a king over every nation. Satan has given his power to the sea beast, and will heal the 6th head. But this beast is not symbolic of a single individual, but human government for the last 2500 years, since Babylon and Nebuchadnezzar was the initial head.

Satan is the beast that speaks as a dragon.

The beast that speaks as a dragon, is where we are right now in prophetic time, ever since 1776 AD.

 

[Timtofly]

The beast that speaks as a dragon, is where we are right now in prophetic time, ever since 1776 AD.

Actually that won't be until the pit of the grave is actually opened and those on earth are physically tormented.

 

[ewq1938]

Yes, I do hear what the scholars imply. However, we who are sinful cannot look upon God's face and live, unless we see Him through the face of God the Son, who is One with and in the Father.
Exo. 33:17-23
[20] And he said, Thou canst not see [H7200 set gaze; look on; take sight] my face: for there shall no man see me, and live.

And for this reason, the sacrifice of Christ's innocent blood was required for both man and God as well, otherwise the Father would never have been able to dwell within us. And in that, He can only do so, by us having faith in Jesus. John 14:23.
2 Cor. 4
[6] For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

Many people have seen God. There was a time when no one could look at his face and live but wasn't always true because it is written that someone was face to face with God and did not die.

Gen 32:24 And Jacob was left alone; and there wrestled a man with him until the breaking of the day.
Gen 32:25 And when he saw that he prevailed not against him, he touched the hollow of his thigh; and the hollow of Jacob's thigh was out of joint, as he wrestled with him.
Gen 32:26 And he said, Let me go, for the day breaketh. And he said, I will not let thee go, except thou bless me.
Gen 32:27 And he said unto him, What is thy name? And he said, Jacob.
Gen 32:28 And he said, Thy name shall be called no more Jacob, but Israel: for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed.
Gen 32:29 And Jacob asked him, and said, Tell me, I pray thee, thy name. And he said, Wherefore is it that thou dost ask after my name? And he blessed him there.
Gen 32:30 And Jacob called the name of the place Peniel: for I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved.

Here Jacob not only wrestles with God physically, he also was allowed to see His face and live.

 

[ewq1938]

The beast that speaks as a dragon, is where we are right now in prophetic time, ever since 1776 AD.

That's from church-ianity not the bible. The bible states the beast has only 42 months but you have changed it to hundreds of years. The Rev 13 beast is not America either.

 

[Earburner]

Actually that won't be until the pit of the grave is actually opened and those on earth are physically tormented.

No, ever since 1776, its the beast in Rev. 13:11-17. All need to catch up to current prophetic time. Many have fallen way behind!! And no, it's not about a pope and/or the Protestant churches
[11] And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.

 

[Stumpmaster]

Satan has had influence, but Satan has not been a king over every nation. Satan has given his power to the sea beast, and will heal the 6th head. But this beast is not symbolic of a single individual, but human government for the last 2500 years, since Babylon and Nebuchadnezzar was the initial head.

Satan is the beast that speaks as a dragon.

According to you. Got it. Bad theology though.

 

[Earburner]

Many people have seen God. There was a time when no one could look at his face and live but wasn't always true because it is written that someone was face to face with God and did not die.

Gen 32:24 And Jacob was left alone; and there wrestled a man with him until the breaking of the day.
Gen 32:25 And when he saw that he prevailed not against him, he touched the hollow of his thigh; and the hollow of Jacob's thigh was out of joint, as he wrestled with him.
Gen 32:26 And he said, Let me go, for the day breaketh. And he said, I will not let thee go, except thou bless me.
Gen 32:27 And he said unto him, What is thy name? And he said, Jacob.
Gen 32:28 And he said, Thy name shall be called no more Jacob, but Israel: for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed.
Gen 32:29 And Jacob asked him, and said, Tell me, I pray thee, thy name. And he said, Wherefore is it that thou dost ask after my name? And he blessed him there.
Gen 32:30 And Jacob called the name of the place Peniel: for I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved.

Here Jacob not only wrestles with God physically, he also was allowed to see His face and live.

Let's be real, many thought it was God, but they were ministering Angels sent by God, coming in the LORD'S Name.

 

[ewq1938]

Let's be real, many thought it was God, but they were ministering Angels sent by God, coming in the LORD'S Name.

I'm going to believe what Jacob said about seeing God face to face in the bible and disregard what you say about it.

 

[Earburner]

That's from church-ianity not the bible. The bible states the beast has only 42 months but you have changed it to hundreds of years. The Rev 13 beast is not America either.

1. The ever evolving Composite Sea beast, with 10 horns, is about to visibly enter onto the world scene, in it's last and final stage. It's manifestation will be a Global Economic Empire for 42 months, utilizing the economic mark of the beast, in order for one to BUY or SELL.

2. The Earth beast, having 2 horns like a lamb, but speaks as a dragon, has been the false prophet, forcing and saying: "peace and safety", by making fire (weapons of war) come down from heaven in the sight of men, and in the sight of the [Composite Sea beast].

3. The image of the 10H Composite Beast is the UN. It has been the 2H beast that has said to all the people of the world, that THEY of the world should make an image to the Composite beast,....and that THEY HAVE!
It is the UN that "causes" all people, to take "the mark of" the Composite Sea beast.
Rev. 13:11-17.

 

[Earburner]

I'm going to believe what Jacob said about seeing God face to face in the bible and disregard what you say about it.

Ok. Either way, it has no effect on anyone's salvaltion, through faith in Christ.

 

[Earburner]

So just ignore the issue with the previous passage and red herring your way out with a new one? You always do that. 2 Peter 3 doesn't support your views anymore than 2Th1:9 does.

2Th 1:9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

“shall be punished” is in the FUTURE TENSE which means that the being punished with everlasting destruction ie: GWTJ/LOF is NOT happening at the second coming but is a FUTURE event after the second coming just as Premill teaches and exactly opposite of what Amill teaches.

I would say that the "future tense" is to be understood to be immediate, WHEN Jesus is revealed from heaven in flaming fire, which ignites the entirety of this earth into melted lava, thus taking vengence-
on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
[9] Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction [eternal death, as having never lived] from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;
Q. WHEN???
A. WHEN he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.
THAT DAY is a simultaneous event of destruction upon all the wicked unsaved, and redemption for all the saved.
KJV 2 Thes. 1:7-10

Have you never read and understood Luke 17:28-29?
[28] Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded;
[29] But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
[30] Even thus shall it be in the DAY
WHEN the Son of man is revealed.

 

[ewq1938]

1. The ever evolving Composite Sea beast, with 10 horns, is

Not something originating from the bible. Rev 13 introduces the sea beast but says it has 42 months to rule and does not describe any of this church-ianity fictional "ever evolving" nonsense.

The bible doesn't have any of that made up things about the beast. Read it for yourself:

Rev 13:1 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.
Rev 13:2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.
Rev 13:3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.
Rev 13:4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
Rev 13:5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.
Rev 13:6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.
Rev 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
Rev 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

 

[ewq1938]

I would say that the "future tense" is to be understood to be immediate, WHEN Jesus is revealed from heaven in flaming fire, which ignites the entirety of this earth into melted lava, thus taking vengence-

A clear case of when the bible disproves your theology, just deny what the bible says and rewrite it to match your beliefs. You can't take future tense verbs and declare them to be understood in the present tense... You make a mockery of the text and it's divine use of verb tenses.

You and your church-ianity is wrong, and goes directly against the writings of the Holy bible and when the bible confronts you on this, you alter it.

 

[Earburner]

Not something originating from the bible. Rev 13 introduces the sea beast but says it has 42 months to rule and does not describe any of this church-ianity fictional "ever evolving" nonsense.

The bible doesn't have any of that made up things about the beast. Read it for yourself:

Rev 13:1 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.
Rev 13:2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.
Rev 13:3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.
Rev 13:4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
Rev 13:5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.
Rev 13:6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.
Rev 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
Rev 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

We all have run the gamut of counting heads, beasts, horns, kingdoms and kings, who is missing, who is not, and who is to come.

The bottom line is we are 2024 years into the future since Christ's first appearance in the flesh. One would think by looking at the present scheme of things, concerning this world, one should be able to agree that we are SEEING the Day of His Glorious return approaching.
Heb. 10
[23] Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised;)
[24] And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works:
[25] Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.

 

[Stumpmaster]

Rev 13 introduces the sea beast but says it has 42 months to rule

Yes, having risen to the sum of the ages.

 

[Earburner]

A clear case of when the bible disproves your theology, just deny what the bible says and rewrite it to match your beliefs. You can't take future tense verbs and declare them to be understood in the present tense... You make a mockery of the text and it's divine use of verb tenses.

You and your church-ianity is wrong, and goes directly against the writings of the Holy bible and when the bible confronts you on this, you alter it.

To be blunt, upon Christ's Glorious and fiery return (2 Thes. 1:7-10; Luke 17:28-30) there is no such thing of a future 1000 year reign of Christ on earth!!

My faith and understanding is not of church-ianity, aka "the leaven" of today's Pharisees, by "the wisdom of men".
What I say is foreign to you because it is by the power [anointing] of God, of which is freely given to all who do "have the mind [Spirit] of Christ".
Now, if you do have the mind of Christ within you, then that is where your faith should stand, and "NOT IN the wisdom of men". 1 Cor. 2:5.
1 John 2
[27] But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

John 14
[26] But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

 

[Earburner]

Yes, having risen to the sum of the ages.

All would understand that, if they would learn the following:
1. In Daniel, the fulfilled 2300 day prophecy is literal days, and not a contrived theory of 2300 years.

2. In Daniel, the 70th week of the 70 week prophecy was fulfilled during Jesus' first appearance in His mortal flesh (with John the baptist-Zech. 4:14) for 3.5 years, and then by His Spirit for the remaining 3.5 years, which equals to one prophetic week of 7 years (the 70th week).

3. The 8th head, in Rev. 17:11, "IS OF THE SEVEN" , and is that Composite Sea beast, with 10 horns, as shown in Rev. 13:1-3.

Rev. 17
[11] And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition [destruction, upon the Day of Jesus' Glorious return- 2 Thes.1:7-10; Luke 17:28-30; 2 Peter ch. 3].

4. There is no 1000 literal year reign of Christ on earth, AFTER THAT DAY of Christ's Glorious and fiery return from heaven.

 

[TrevorHL]

Greetings Earburner,

My faith and understanding is not of church-ianity, aka "the leaven" of today's Pharisees, by "the wisdom of men".
What I say is foreign to you because it is by the power [anointing] of God, of which is freely given to all who do "have the mind [Spirit] of Christ".

Despite your claim to be Spirit guided your understanding misses the mark.

To be blunt, upon Christ's Glorious and fiery return (2 Thes. 1:7-10; Luke 17:28-30) there is no such thing of a future 1000 year reign of Christ on earth!!

To be blunt, you are wrong here. Jesus will return soon to establish the Kingdom of God centred in Jerusalem for the 1000 years Isaiah 2:1-4.

All would understand that, if they would learn the following:
1. In Daniel, the fulfilled 2300 day prophecy is literal days, and not a contrived theory of 2300 years.

You have missed here again and relied upon your own wisdom. The 2300 are symbolic and represent the 2300 years from BC 334-333 to AD 1967 Luke 21:24. "Try the Spirits, whether they be of God".

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[Earburner]

Greetings Earburner,

Despite your claim to be Spirit guided your understanding misses the mark.

I would hope that all professing Christians might study and digest ALL of 1 Cor. ch. 2, because when they do, they might find out who they really are in Rom. 8:8-9, instead of being suddenly surprised on "that day":
Mat. 7[21] Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
[22] Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
[23] And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

1 Cor. 2
[12] Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
[13] Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
[14] But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
[15] But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.
[16] For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.

To be blunt, you are wrong here. Jesus will return soon to establish the Kingdom of God centred in Jerusalem for the 1000 years Isaiah 2:1-4.

I hope that you are aware that under any NEW contractual (covenant) agreement, all agreements and promises by both parties, under the OLD contractual (covenant), become null and void.
Please notice that the NEW Covenant, through Jesus' shed blood, reveals nothing of the KoG being centered in "Jerusalem which now is", for an additional 1000 years on earth.

You have missed here again and relied upon your own wisdom. The 2300 are symbolic and represent the 2300 years from BC 334-333 to AD 1967 Luke 21:24. "Try the Spirits, whether they be of God".

Kind regards
Trevor

It could be that you never investigated Dan. 8:14 thoroughly. Since that might be the case, I urge you to read the words in the Hebrew, so that you also don't become led astray by "the wisdom of men".
[14] And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days [Strongs-"days"]**
then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.
You might want to do the same in Dan. 12:11, and checkout "days"- H3117.

**Note:
Strong's Number - H1242
Hebrew: בּקר
Transliteration: bôqer
Pronunciation: bo'-ker
Definition: From H1239; properly dawn (as the break of day); generally morning: - (+) {day} {early} {morning} morrow.
KJV Usage: morning (191x), morrow (7x), day (3x), days (with H6153) (1x), early (3x).
Occurs: 205
In verses: 189

Edit: I might also suggest that you read and study the historical account about the 2300 days in 1 Maccabees chs. 1-6, in conjunction with Daniel chs. 7 and 8.
It is by those events described, both prophetically and historically, that Israel celebrates Hanukkah to this day.

 

[covenantee]

To be blunt, you are wrong here. Jesus will return soon to establish the Kingdom of God centred in Jerusalem for the 1000 years Isaiah 2:1-4.

The Kingdom of God was established by and in Christ at His first coming.

Mark 1
14 Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God,
15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.

Luke 8:1
And it came to pass afterward, that he went throughout every city and village, preaching and shewing the glad tidings of the kingdom of God: and the twelve were with him,

Luke 11:20
But if I with the finger of God cast out devils, no doubt the kingdom of God is come upon you.

Luke 17:21
Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

Romans 14:17
For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.

I hope that you are aware that under any NEW contractual (covenant) agreement, all agreements and promises by both parties, under the OLD contractual (covenant), become null and void.
Please notice that the NEW Covenant, through Jesus' shed blood, reveals nothing of the KoG being centered in "Jerusalem which now is", for an additional 1000 years on earth.

Amen.

In God's New Will and Testament, all covenants and promises are fulfilled only in Christ, and in those who are in Christ.

The OT covenants and promises are the promissory clauses of God's Old Will and Testament, and they are both revoked and fulfilled in the promissory clauses of His New Will and Testament, written in the Blood of His Son Jesus Christ, the Divine Testator, coming into full force and effect upon His death.

If you have made your own Will and Testament, you will see that the very first clause states the following or its equivalent:

"I HEREBY REVOKE all former Wills and other testamentary dispositions by me at any time therefore made and declare this to be my Last Will and Testament."

This means that all former wills and testaments, and all of their promissory clauses in their entirety, are completely null and void. In their place, the promissory clauses of the current last new will and testament are the only ones in force and effect. Any promissory clause which appeared in the old will and testament, but does not appear in the new will and testament, is irrevocably null and void unless yet another new will and testament is made which re-includes it.

Thus we see:

Hebrews 9
15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.
16 For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.
17 For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.

Hebrews 10
9 Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second.

Hebrews 8
13 In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.

God`s New Will and Testament is everlasting:

Hebrews 13
20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant.

There is none greater.

We see other new promissory clauses of the New Will and Testament in:

Matthew 21:33-45
In this parable, the son, who is identified as the heir, typifies Christ.

Galatians 3:16
Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

2 Corinthians 1:20
For all the promises of God in him are yea, and in him Amen, unto the glory of God by us.

Hebrews 1:1,2
1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

In them, we see that the Heir and Beneficiary is Christ alone, that all of the promises are affirmed and confirmed in Him, and that He is Heir of all things. All includes the OT land promises, the restoration promises, the blessings promises, and all else. There are no exceptions.

God has appointed His Son alone as heir of all things. Unbelieving Israel is not an heir. Galatians 4:30-31.

His New Will and Testament contains even better promises:

Hebrews 8
6 But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.

Such as:

Hebrews 11
16 But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.

Additional promissory clauses in...:

Romans 8:16-17
16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

Galatians 3:29
And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

...declare that we who are in Christ are joint heirs with Him.

But it is clear and plain:

There are no promissory clauses for anyone, Jew or Gentile...

Who is not in Christ.