How much does an electric school bus cost?
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Chains Broken
Well-Known Member
According to School Transport News a green school bus costs about $120,000 Compared to about $98.000 for a diesel powered school bus. There are about 200 electric school busses in use in the country and they cost an average of $10,000 less to fuel per year. So it would take about 3 years to re coop the initial cost of the us. If the average school buss lasts 15 years school districts end up saving a large amount with electric school busses.
According to the story the electric bus cost some $350,000 compared to around a hundred thousand.
We've already heard the news that electric semi's are not going to work as just them alone would overload the power grid. Are we going to be getting black outs and wasting everyone's fridge food to amuse the Biden admin? Food is already too expensive for everyone.
No....you got the numbers somewhat skewed.
An Electric bus is $400,000 and a propane bus costs $130,000. Propane is not much cheaper per mile to operate. It just has cleaner emissions.
An electric bus also has shorter daily range than either propane or diesel.
However, a hybrid bus has all the range of a fueled vehicle and all the cleaner emissions of a propane bus. The key importance is that the amount of fuel used is dramatically reduced as well as the weight of the vehicle is reduced.
One other element to figure....
A hybrid bus consisting of a "drive-by-wire" system is more stable and safe than any other.
An all electric bus is disposable....a hybrid is not.
Currently hybrid vehicles are in their infancy. The vehicles require lots of maintenance. (More than ICE vehicles)
And by continuing to improve the designs of hybrids we could in fact solve MANY problems associated with all electric vehicles. Which is why I never understood about trying to fund this leap in engineering over hybrids and go straight away to all electric when nobody is ready for such a change in concept or in infrastructure.
A hybrid bus consisting of a "drive-by-wire" system is more stable and safe than any other.
An all electric bus is disposable....a hybrid is not.
Currently hybrid vehicles are in their infancy. The vehicles require lots of maintenance. (More than ICE vehicles)
And by continuing to improve the designs of hybrids we could in fact solve MANY problems associated with all electric vehicles. Which is why I never understood about trying to fund this leap in engineering over hybrids and go straight away to all electric when nobody is ready for such a change in concept or in infrastructure.
Not even close. YOUR source states>>>>
An electric school bus typically costs about $200,000 more than its diesel counterpart.
And they don't work in the winter.
Propane and Natural Gas (CNG) powered buses cost around the $120,000 figure you quoted. Do better.
It is part of the destruction agenda of the WEF, which is actually demonic wisdom from hell.
They are not secret about their plans. Those globalist elitists have been telling everyone who cares to listen what they plan to do to people.
Part of the economic plan is to reduce our need for petroleum products. No secret there.
One of the main reasons is that much of the world's petroleum is produced by people groups that have delusions of grandeur about world domination through the control of this energy and bitumen resource.
Places like Russia, Iran, Iraq, Africa, Venezuela and etc. These people have never really been friends with most of the world.
Europe doesn't produce petroleum. They get theirs from The Middle East, Russia, and Africa.
Which is why they are looking for alternatives....and if the world's oil wells run dry....it's gonna be bad.
So we get organic farming, and ethanol.
And I still believe that we really can't produce an effective EV that can do as well as an ICE vehicle. But a hybrid vehicle can do as well. And likely better than an ICE vehicle but burn only half the fuel.
From car tires to dashboards and insulation on the wires....there is no getting away from using petroleum products. Hydrocarbon fuels are not going away in my lifetime.
Except it has not run out, the oil. Oil production has defied every prediction.
I think the oil is abiotic meaning not produced by decaying vegetation and dead bodies. It is generated continually inside the mantle. The deep earth is like a giant refinery assembling hydrocarbons as various hot gaseous mixtures which rise and cool forming underground lakes.
It can't burn or combust in the deep earth as there is not enough free oxygen to support that. There is tremendous heat, water and pressure and carbon contain rock that it makes hydrocarbons continually with Iron as a catalyst. Naturally they are less dense and rise to the surface. All hydrocarbons as various combinations of the elements Hydrogen and Carbon.
Like this here
Abiotic Oil
A recently revived theory of oil formation suggests that the black stuff may never actually run out!
atlasreport.substack.com
A big negative that oil is from fossil life is that oil is found at layers much deeper than fossils.
1.The depth problem
Many geologists and other scientists have questioned how it can be that oil and gas form in reservoirs so deep within the earth’s crust when the organic material from which they supposedly originate was present at the surface.Many understandably doubt the ability for oil and/ or it’s precursors to seep to depths many kilometers below the surface, sometimes through non-porous layers of rock. The deepest oil well is in Russia at around 12 km deep, but of course untapped or undiscovered reservoirs may well be present much deeper than that.
Except it has not run out, the oil. Oil production has defied every prediction.
I think the oil is abiotic meaning not produced by decaying vegetation and dead bodies. It is generated continually inside the mantle. The deep earth is like a giant refinery assembling hydrocarbons as various hot gaseous mixtures which rise and cool forming underground lakes.
It can't burn or combust in the deep earth as there is not enough free oxygen to support that. There is tremendous heat, water and pressure and carbon contain rock that it makes hydrocarbons continually with Iron as a catalyst. Naturally they are less dense and rise to the surface. All hydrocarbons as various combinations of the elements Hydrogen and Carbon.
Like this here
Abiotic Oil
A recently revived theory of oil formation suggests that the black stuff may never actually run out!
A big negative that oil is from fossil life is that oil is found at layers much deeper than fossils.
1.The depth problem
Many geologists and other scientists have questioned how it can be that oil and gas form in reservoirs so deep within the earth’s crust when the organic material from which they supposedly originate was present at the surface.
Many understandably doubt the ability for oil and/ or it’s precursors to seep to depths many kilometers below the surface, sometimes through non-porous layers of rock. The deepest oil well is in Russia at around 12 km deep, but of course untapped or undiscovered reservoirs may well be present much deeper than that.
If you can accept the idea-- oil is a by-product of earth.
It's like urine. Nobody drinks urine, but everybody produces it. You take in water and put out urine. It's waste.
From an earthly perspective-- the earth "produces" oil constantly as a natural process.
People always freak out when there is an oil spill and oil goes into the ground--- forgetting entirely that it came out of the ground. It's awesome that there's a use for it.
Hobie
Well-Known Member
Well, its not the cost that one should worry about, but whether it can get the kids back home...
I was talking to a administrator from Michigan who was overseeing the purchase of the new electric school buses, and I was shocked at what he said. In order to get them to the schools, they had to put them on a flatbed and ship them there as they couldnt reliably make it, and this was in the summer. And with the freezing temperatures hitting now, they are lucky if they can get back to school with the kids to say nothing of getting them back home...
Another awesome little known fact is there is life in the deep earth.
Inner Earth Is Teeming With Exotic Forms of Life
More than a mile below the surface, our planet supports diverse creatures that could give us clues about life across the solar system
Scientists discover staggering amount of life deep below Earth's surface
The dark, high-pressure depths of Earth’s interior is an unexpected place to find life. Now, an international group of scientists report there’s 16.5 to 25 billion tons of micro-organisms beneath the planet’s surface. The team’s work is redefining what a habitable environment is.
www.astronomy.com
Deep Discovery
Lloyd is a member of the Deep Carbon Observatory (DCO), a collaborative network of more than 1,000 geologists, chemists, physicists and biologists around the globe that is uncovering the life buried within the Earth. The group is on a decade-long mission to discover how the carbon stored deep in the Earth affects life on the surface.The collaboration has revealed that life teems beneath the planet’s surface in a vast ecosystem scientists call “the deep biosphere.” A diverse mix of environments make up this other world beneath Earth’s crust, which encompasses a volume nearly twice as large as all the oceans combined. And surprisingly, life flourishes there, the researchers announced today.
“Every time we look in one of these disparate environments, we find living things,” Lloyd said.
The scientists probed hundreds of locations around the globe. They drilled a mile and a half into the seafloor and excavated gold and diamond mines in South Africa. So far, the deepest specimens of life come from more than 3 miles beneath the surface.
The mass of life in this deep biosphere adds up to hundreds of times more than all of the humans on Earth, the researchers calculated, and most of it is microbes. About 70 percent of the world’s bacteria and their single-celled cousins, the archaea, inhabit the deep biosphere, the researchers found.
Except it has not run out, the oil. Oil production has defied every prediction.
I think the oil is abiotic meaning not produced by decaying vegetation and dead bodies. It is generated continually inside the mantle. The deep earth is like a giant refinery assembling hydrocarbons as various hot gaseous mixtures which rise and cool forming underground lakes.
It can't burn or combust in the deep earth as there is not enough free oxygen to support that. There is tremendous heat, water and pressure and carbon contain rock that it makes hydrocarbons continually with Iron as a catalyst. Naturally they are less dense and rise to the surface. All hydrocarbons as various combinations of the elements Hydrogen and Carbon.
Like this here
Abiotic Oil
A recently revived theory of oil formation suggests that the black stuff may never actually run out!
A big negative that oil is from fossil life is that oil is found at layers much deeper than fossils.
1.The depth problem
Many geologists and other scientists have questioned how it can be that oil and gas form in reservoirs so deep within the earth’s crust when the organic material from which they supposedly originate was present at the surface.
Many understandably doubt the ability for oil and/ or it’s precursors to seep to depths many kilometers below the surface, sometimes through non-porous layers of rock. The deepest oil well is in Russia at around 12 km deep, but of course untapped or undiscovered reservoirs may well be present much deeper than that.
If it as you suggest with this article....
That still doesn't mean that the earth can Naturally produce enough to keep up with our ever exponentially increasing demand for the petroleum.
To put it this way.
If today a moratorium was placed on all ICE vehicles, boats, barges, etc and only EVs would be produced....peak petroleum usage would not happen until 2050 and then level off to remain constant.
See the issue?
We are rapidly approaching a point where these OPEC+ nations will control the world through their sale of petroleum. None of these nations are our friends or friendly with the US or Europe. (Including Europe or the US at times). And as we continue to purchase their petroleum we are funding our own demise. They absolutely use a portion of the profits to fund their aggression towards other nations including Westernized Civilizations.
The petroleum from the Permean Basin and Brent Sea has been mostly exhausted. There still exists some petroleum in these locations but it's in smaller amounts than ever before. Estimates of in ground reserves are shrinking. (Not by fear mongers but by industry geologists)
And since the replenishment is slow...it will be centuries before enough oil is produced by the earth to make drilling and pumping in these locations feasible again.
We can make diesel out of coal or biomass...but again it's not cost productive. (Unless crude gets too expensive...currently biomass is used to supplement current diesel)
It's not the oil itself we need but cheap oil that is necessary and from sources not seeking Westernized Society.
Assumptions only. Oil has yet to show a slow down in production
Earth is a big place volume wise below our feet.
Oil wells have gone dry. So obviously there's a limit to how much is produced.
As things currently stand peak oil is not predictable. We continue to use exponentially more each year. Granted the USA tends to be extremely efficient in its use of petroleum products....moreso than other nations.
I'm not suggesting that we all go out and get an EV. Passenger vehicles only account for 25% of the fuel consumed. Commercial vehicles (planes, trains, trucks, and cargo ships burn a LOT more than average person does by a long shot.
What I'm saying is that there are technologies that work....it's just that Biden didn't bother.
Oil companies go back and draw oil from supposedly dry wells. New technologies expand the use of "dry" wells.
New problem has emerged out of test engineers at University of Nebraska. The batteries are so heavy in these vehicles ......guard rails are not capable of keeping the vehicle on the road or reducing the impact of a crash .....This means that bus load of kids and the driver may take a dive through current crash guard rails ....
The fracking technology might be doing more harm than good....yes it floats the oil up so it can be pumped but it might be destroying the area or plugging up the mechanism that makes the oil. Not to mention that water wells in the area are now toxic....not exactly a good thing either.
And you're correct about all EV vehicles being way too heavy. Currently they are given an allotment for being overweight....but basically the weight is still destroying the roads as physics and engineering have not changed.
A bridge or road is engineered to hold only so much weight...go past that and the bridge begins to crumble and break down. Just because you aren't burning diesel doesn't mean that the road isn't being destroyed by the weight at a faster rate.
This is yet another perk of hybrids. They weigh less than even a standard diesel truck. So they can actually haul MORE than a standard diesel truck. Add in the inherent safety of all wheel drive and they can outperform a diesel with lower fuel cost every day of the week.
Which is why I'm really scratching my head as to why they mandated all Electric vehicles instead of hybrids.
Most tractor/trailer rigs have to go off road to get loads of grain, food, or logs for lumber. These trucks get stuck quite often because they lack all wheel drive. This sort of drive would eliminate that and with the increased fuel efficiency I don't know of a trucking company that wouldn't buy one.
Increased load weight,
increased fuel efficiency,
and no distance limitations.
Currently the main issue is a real lack of government incentives and that it's "risky" for manufacturers to build.
Commercial vehicles are purchased AFTER the numbers are in on maintenance costs and fuel costs are averaged. Not before.
And it's a total numbers game involving parts and labor in a specific driving area. Can you get parts? Can you get maintenance at reasonable prices? Tires? Lights? Fuel is usually contracted prices. Some companies will buy DEF and store it on site instead of buying it at truck stops. And the trucking industry is ALWAYS the leader in consumer vehicle technology. Your GPS map on your phone was in trucks decades ago. Same with Allison transmissions because they are more fuel efficient and powerful than standard.
I'm not anti-petroleum or anti business. I'm a realist. Hybrid vehicles make sense. They are simply largely untested for commercial purposes. They don't have to be. If our government had thrown its weight behind those instead of strict EVs....you wouldn't mind driving one today.
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