HOW TO SUFFER

[epostle]

Everybody suffers. There is a spectrum of severity, from a hangnail to a terminal disease and everything in between. Miracles that makes suffering go away is fine but not everyone gets healed. Even St. Paul had his thorn in the flesh. There is social, mental, physical and even spiritual suffering. Worry is a form of suffering. Like when you or one your kids get a D on midterms. Obviously, it's not about something that everybody gets, it's what you do with it that matters.
Putting it on the cross is just a cliche. Try to pray with a tooth ache or a broken arm. Redemptive suffering cannot be experienced by reading scripture. That helps to know about it, but there isn't much in scripture that spells out what our attitudes should be when it comes to redemptive suffering. There is, but it goes unnoticed.

Matt. 10:38 – Jesus said, “he who does not take up his cross and follow me is not worthy of me.” Jesus defines discipleship as one’s willingness to suffer with Him. Being a disciple of Jesus not only means having faith in Him, but offering our sufferings to the Father as He did.

Matt. 16:24; Mark 8:34 – Jesus said, “if any man would come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross and follow me.” Jesus wants us to empty ourselves so that God can fill us. When we suffer, we can choose to seek consolation in God and become closer to Jesus.

Luke 9:23 – Jesus says we must take up this cross daily. He requires us to join our daily temporal sacrifices (pain, inconvenience, worry) with His eternal sacrifice.

https://www.scripturecatholic.com/suffering/

 

[Helen]

Amen...good post.

 

[Hidden In Him]

Everybody suffers. There is a spectrum of severity, from a hangnail to a terminal disease and everything in between. Miracles that makes suffering go away is fine but not everyone gets healed. Even St. Paul had his thorn in the flesh. There is social, mental, physical and even spiritual suffering. Worry is a form of suffering. Like when you or one your kids get a D on midterms. Obviously, it's not about something that everybody gets, it's what you do with it that matters.
Putting it on the cross is just a cliche. Try to pray with a tooth ache or a broken arm. Redemptive suffering cannot be experienced by reading scripture. That helps to know about it, but there isn't much in scripture that spells out what our attitudes should be when it comes to redemptive suffering. There is, but it goes unnoticed.

Matt. 10:38 – Jesus said, “he who does not take up his cross and follow me is not worthy of me.” Jesus defines discipleship as one’s willingness to suffer with Him. Being a disciple of Jesus not only means having faith in Him, but offering our sufferings to the Father as He did.

Matt. 16:24; Mark 8:34 – Jesus said, “if any man would come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross and follow me.” Jesus wants us to empty ourselves so that God can fill us. When we suffer, we can choose to seek consolation in God and become closer to Jesus.

Luke 9:23 – Jesus says we must take up this cross daily. He requires us to join our daily temporal sacrifices (pain, inconvenience, worry) with His eternal sacrifice.

https://www.scripturecatholic.com/suffering/

Haven't had a chance to read your actual post yet, but I'm gathering from your latest signature that you're learning how to deal with suffering just fine, LoL.

Maybe I'll get to the post later. For now, the laugh relieved some of my suffering.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Everybody suffers. There is a spectrum of severity, from a hangnail to a terminal disease and everything in between. Miracles that makes suffering go away is fine but not everyone gets healed. Even St. Paul had his thorn in the flesh. There is social, mental, physical and even spiritual suffering. Worry is a form of suffering. Like when you or one your kids get a D on midterms. Obviously, it's not about something that everybody gets, it's what you do with it that matters.
Putting it on the cross is just a cliche. Try to pray with a tooth ache or a broken arm. Redemptive suffering cannot be experienced by reading scripture. That helps to know about it, but there isn't much in scripture that spells out what our attitudes should be when it comes to redemptive suffering. There is, but it goes unnoticed.

Matt. 10:38 – Jesus said, “he who does not take up his cross and follow me is not worthy of me.” Jesus defines discipleship as one’s willingness to suffer with Him. Being a disciple of Jesus not only means having faith in Him, but offering our sufferings to the Father as He did.

Matt. 16:24; Mark 8:34 – Jesus said, “if any man would come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross and follow me.” Jesus wants us to empty ourselves so that God can fill us. When we suffer, we can choose to seek consolation in God and become closer to Jesus.

Luke 9:23 – Jesus says we must take up this cross daily. He requires us to join our daily temporal sacrifices (pain, inconvenience, worry) with His eternal sacrifice.

https://www.scripturecatholic.com/suffering/

It’s the baptism of the Holy Spirit (fire). The lie is this baptism of fire is to give us what the world calls power. The lie is this baptism is to give us more of the world. But His baptism, is a baptism that purity’s the world out of us until the Son is revealed in us. It is all dung. This fire from heaven, the spirit of God is wrath to the ungodly, but to those that are His...it is a refiners fire that burns off the impurities. With this fire comes much suffering of the flesh until the dross is burnt away, and what is revealed is a likeness of the Son. Do not quench or grieve the Spirit(the fiery trial of God) which is spoken of as evil by others but is for our good. James 1:3-4 Knowing this , that the trying of your faith worketh patience. [4] But let patience have her perfect work, that ye may be perfect and entire, wanting nothing.

Isaiah 42:3
[3] A bruised reed shall he not break, and the smoking flax shall he not quench: he shall bring forth judgment unto truth.

“he shall bring forth judgement unto truth” and judgement begins at the house of God unto truth.

Matthew 12:20
[20] A bruised reed shall he not break, and smoking flax shall he not quench, till he send forth judgment unto victory.

“he shall bring forth judgement unto truth” and judgement begins at the house of God unto victory.

1 Peter 4:12-13
[12] Beloved, think it not strange concerning the fiery trial which is to try you, as though some strange thing happened unto you: [13] But rejoice, inasmuch as ye are partakers of Christ's sufferings; that, when his glory shall be revealed, ye may be glad also with exceeding joy.

Romans 6:4-7
[4] Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. [5] —For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:— [6] Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him , that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. [7] For he that is dead is freed from sin.

We should comfort one another and praise God for the work of bringing to the light those that are His and purifying them, whenever we see the fruit revealed in a life: Ephesians 5:9
[9] (For the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth

The power of God revealed in: Galatians 5:22-23 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, [23] Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.

How to suffer? Philippians 4:4
[4] Rejoice in the Lord alway: and again I say, Rejoice.
...for your name is written in the Lambs book of life.

 

[Helen]

I have heard some preaching about the "Baptism of fire" in my day.
But non that I found convincing, or even provable in the scriptures.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

I have heard some preaching about the "Baptism of fire" in my day.
But non that I found convincing, or even provable in the scriptures.

May I ask what do you mean? I do value your input. There is a sister in Christ who I went to visit one day. I had not seen her in many years and was shocked at the change in her appearance due to her battle with a rare form of cancer. She and her husband once had a thriving mega business, I just rode past their warehouse the other day and it is overgrown, long forgotten, the doors shut due to life struggles. They have lost much. I couldn’t understand how God would take this young woman when she has a ten year old that needs her. While God afforded me the opportunity to raise my children and see my grandchildren born. But, what I saw very clearly in this young woman was the fruit of the Spirit. I’ve never seen such humility and love for Christ in my life in the midst of pain and suffering. SHE has taught me. At the time I considered her cursed but I no longer believe that, but instead...I wish I could go back to that day when I sat with her and praise God with her, and comfort her instead of believing I had to demand for God to heal her and question Him when He didn’t. She was already healed and displayed the image of the Son more than I have ever seen in my life. She radiated light and truth. She didn’t quote scripture or teach, she just loved, fully and completely. All pride, vanity, and superficial had been burned away until all that was left was the fruits we are supposed to look for. Instead, in her pain and suffering, she comforted me. Because THE comforter was there with her, no doubt. Sorry for the long post but: the point is. Should we not praise God for His work when we see those fruits of the Spirit shine in a person...instead rejoice with them and comfort them in the joy that their sleep will be sweet and not bitter because of redemption.

Luke 22:31-32 And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat: [32] But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and when thou art converted, strengthen thy brethren.

The first step in the process of sifting wheat is to loosen the chaff from the edible grain, which is called threshing. The old-fashioned way to do this is to spread the wheat onto a floor made from stone, concrete or tamped earth and to beat it with a flail.

1 Corinthians 3:15-16
[15] If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. [16] Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

 

[Helen]

May I ask what do you mean? I do value your input. There is a sister in Christ who I went to visit one day. I had not seen her in many years and was shocked at the change in her appearance due to her battle with a rare form of cancer. She and her husband once had a thriving mega business, I just rode past their warehouse the other day and it is overgrown, long forgotten, the doors shut due to life struggles. They have lost much. I couldn’t understand how God would take this young woman when she has a ten year old that needs her. While God afforded me the opportunity to raise my children and see my grandchildren born. But, what I saw very clearly in this young woman was the fruit of the Spirit. I’ve never seen such humility and love for Christ in my life in the midst of pain and suffering. SHE has taught me. At the time I considered her cursed but I no longer believe that, but instead...I wish I could go back to that day when I sat with her and praise God with her, and comfort her instead of believing I had to demand for God heal her and question Him when He didn’t. She was already healed and displayed the image of the Son more than I have ever seen in my life. She radiated light and truth. She didn’t quote scripture or teach, she just loved, fully and completely. All pride, vanity, and superficial had been burned away until all that was left was the fruits we are supposed to look for. Instead, in her pain and suffering, she comforted me. Because THE comforter was there with her, no doubt. Sorry for the long post but: the point is. Should we not praise God for His work when we see those fruits of the Spirit shine in a person...instead rejoice with them and comfort them in the joy that their sleep with be sweet and not bitter because of redemption.

Luke 22:31-32 And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat: [32] But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and when thou art converted, strengthen thy brethren.

The first step in the process of sifting wheat is to loosen the chaff from the edible grain, which is called threshing. The old-fashioned way to do this is to spread the wheat onto a floor made from stone, concrete or tamped earth and to beat it with a flail.

1 Corinthians 3:15-16
[15] If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. [16] Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

What a lovely testimony.
The healing thing is one of the things I still don't understand.
We know that "healing is the children's bread" and our by inheritance.
But seeing it work 100% I have never seen.
For myself I have been healed many times...but also not been healed of certain things , and have no idea why, no different belief ..no different type of 'magic' prayer!! I have to come to the place of accepting that with some God has a different plan that He is working. Therein is peace.

Oh, I mentioned the words 'baptism of fire' because some believe that there is the baptism in water, a baptism in the Holy Ghost and a baptism in fire.
I see Matt 3-11 as one baptism , not two.

Not that it really matters

Thanks for sharing that post. It is powerful.

Bless you...H

 

[VictoryinJesus]

What a lovely testimony.
The healing thing is one of the things I still don't understand.
We know that "healing is the children's bread" and our by inheritance.
But seeing it work 100% I have never seen.
For myself I have been healed many times...but also not been healed of certain things , and have no idea why, no different belief ..no different type of 'magic' prayer!! I have to come to the place of accepting that with some God has a different plan that He is working. Therein is peace.

Oh, I mentioned the words 'baptism of fire' because some believe that there is the baptism in water, a baptism in the Holy Ghost and a baptism in fire.
I see Matt 3-11 as one baptism , not two.

Not that it really matters

Thanks for sharing that post. It is powerful.

Bless you...H

I also see one baptism, not two. But I also see this fiery trial that comes upon a person that we are told to not think is strange.

 

[Helen]

I also see one baptism, not two. But I also see this fiery trial that comes upon a person that we are told to not think is strange.

Yes, we are in agreement here

I see it as the loving Hand of Father.
If our life was always sunshine and blue skies , with no storms, wind, or hail , our root would never go down deep , neither would we learn how to hang on through it all.

We all know that we have an Enemy..and one who id showing himself more and more in the world. Only those who have been through deep waters, and have come through many storms with scars and battle wounds....will have what it takes to help the helpless and blind in those last days.

I believe God is getting His people ready. Ready to share His truth with others, and lead the blind into the light.

We are never 'in the fire' for the fire...we are there to be refined and hardened into a vessel of use in His hand.

.....H

 

[epostle]

May I ask what do you mean? I do value your input. There is a sister in Christ who I went to visit one day. I had not seen her in many years and was shocked at the change in her appearance due to her battle with a rare form of cancer. She and her husband once had a thriving mega business, I just rode past their warehouse the other day and it is overgrown, long forgotten, the doors shut due to life struggles. They have lost much. I couldn’t understand how God would take this young woman when she has a ten year old that needs her. While God afforded me the opportunity to raise my children and see my grandchildren born. But, what I saw very clearly in this young woman was the fruit of the Spirit. I’ve never seen such humility and love for Christ in my life in the midst of pain and suffering. SHE has taught me. At the time I considered her cursed but I no longer believe that, but instead...I wish I could go back to that day when I sat with her and praise God with her, and comfort her instead of believing I had to demand for God to heal her and question Him when He didn’t. She was already healed and displayed the image of the Son more than I have ever seen in my life. She radiated light and truth. She didn’t quote scripture or teach, she just loved, fully and completely. All pride, vanity, and superficial had been burned away until all that was left was the fruits we are supposed to look for. Instead, in her pain and suffering, she comforted me. Because THE comforter was there with her, no doubt. Sorry for the long post but: the point is. Should we not praise God for His work when we see those fruits of the Spirit shine in a person...instead rejoice with them and comfort them in the joy that their sleep will be sweet and not bitter because of redemption.

Luke 22:31-32 And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat: [32] But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and when thou art converted, strengthen thy brethren.

The first step in the process of sifting wheat is to loosen the chaff from the edible grain, which is called threshing. The old-fashioned way to do this is to spread the wheat onto a floor made from stone, concrete or tamped earth and to beat it with a flail.

1 Corinthians 3:15-16
[15] If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. [16] Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

Great post! It touches on the theme of my OP. Redemptive suffering is a difficult concept to wrap ones head around. It sounds like your sister attained acceptance in her final days, what we are all supposed to strive for when suffering befalls us. Prayers, bible reading, how many times we go to church, teaching, all the churchie things takes a back seat. Accepting and carrying our own crosses as we walk with Jesus to Calvary is the real deal. That's love. Then suffering is transformed into something meaningful, instead of being wasted. You don't have to be dying, and you don't have to be Catholic.

 

[Helen]

 

[epostle]

Haven't had a chance to read your actual post yet, but I'm gathering from your latest signature that you're learning how to deal with suffering just fine, LoL.

Maybe I'll get to the post later. For now, the laugh relieved some of my suffering.

Righteous indignation has nothing to with suffering. Please post a testimony of how your suffering has brought you closer to Jesus. While I may or may not have your attention, I would like to know about your avatar. Why is an angel holding a head by the hair? Is that an ISIS angel? Fallen angels are eternal, they can't be decapitated. Pope Francis doesn't have enough hair to grab.

 

[Hidden In Him]

Righteous indignation has nothing to with suffering. Please post a testimony of how your suffering has brought you closer to Jesus. While I may or may not have your attention, I would like to know about your avatar. Why is an angel holding a head by the hair? Is that an ISIS angel? Fallen angels are eternal, they can't be decapitated. Pope Francis doesn't have enough hair to grab.

LoL!! Brother, you are saving the day!! Ok, a serious answer:

Everybody suffers. There is a spectrum of severity, from a hangnail to a terminal disease and everything in between. Miracles that makes suffering go away is fine but not everyone gets healed. Even St. Paul had his thorn in the flesh. There is social, mental, physical and even spiritual suffering. Worry is a form of suffering. Like when you or one your kids get a D on midterms. Obviously, it's not about something that everybody gets, it's what you do with it that matters.
Putting it on the cross is just a cliche. Try to pray with a tooth ache or a broken arm. Redemptive suffering cannot be experienced by reading scripture. That helps to know about it, but there isn't much in scripture that spells out what our attitudes should be when it comes to redemptive suffering. There is, but it goes unnoticed.

Matt. 10:38 – Jesus said, “he who does not take up his cross and follow me is not worthy of me.” Jesus defines discipleship as one’s willingness to suffer with Him. Being a disciple of Jesus not only means having faith in Him, but offering our sufferings to the Father as He did.

Matt. 16:24; Mark 8:34 – Jesus said, “if any man would come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross and follow me.” Jesus wants us to empty ourselves so that God can fill us. When we suffer, we can choose to seek consolation in God and become closer to Jesus.

Luke 9:23 – Jesus says we must take up this cross daily. He requires us to join our daily temporal sacrifices (pain, inconvenience, worry) with His eternal sacrifice.

https://www.scripturecatholic.com/suffering/

Oh, God.... I heard it said by a powerful man of God not long ago that before God can use you He has to kill you. He said it sort of humorously. I seem to have been through it. Not the run-of-the-mill online opposition stuff. I'm talking about a crushing of spirit and total breaking of the heart in my own personal life, where you question if you have any value to anyone...

But I want to be the best servant of God I possibly can be, and if it means I have to go through extreme emotional pain, then so be it. I do take up my cross, every day as a matter a fact. I wake up with the same pain I had the day before, and the day before, and the day before... but I have to be taken out of the way. I want to reflect more of Him and less of me.

Btw, I do take the severed head as angelic. For me it communicates spiritual warfare, because that's who my real enemy is. I suppose my avatar has been exposed for possibly teaching a falsehood. But go easy on him. He's had a hard two months.

 

[epostle]

2 Corinthias 4:10 – Paul writes that we always carry in the body the death of Jesus so that the life of Jesus may also be manifested in our bodies. Christ has allowed room in His Body for our sufferings, and our sufferings allow room for Christ to bring us to life.

Philippians 1:29 – for the sake of Christ we are not only to believe in Him but also to suffer for His sake. Growing in holiness requires more than having faith in God and accepting Jesus as personal Lord and Savior. We must also willfully embrace the suffering that befalls us as part of God’s plan. Thus, Christ does not want our faith alone, but our faith in action which includes faith in suffering.

Colossians 1:24 – Paul rejoices in his sufferings and completes what is lacking in Christ’s afflictions for the sake of His body. This proves the Catholic position regarding the efficacy of suffering. Is there something lacking in Christ’s sufferings? Of course not. But because Jesus loves us so much, He allows us to participate in His redemptive suffering by leaving room in His mystical body for our own suffering. Our suffering, united with our Lord’s suffering, furthers the work of His redemption.
https://www.scripturecatholic.com/suffering/

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Great post! It touches on the theme of my OP. Redemptive suffering is a difficult concept to wrap ones head around. It sounds like your sister attained acceptance in her final days, what we are all supposed to strive for when suffering befalls us. Prayers, bible reading, how many times we go to church, teaching, all the churchie things takes a back seat. Accepting and carrying our own crosses as we walk with Jesus to Calvary is the real deal. That's love. Then suffering is transformed into something meaningful, instead of being wasted. You don't have to be dying, and you don't have to be Catholic.

There is still so much I do not understand. As I read you post to Hidden in Him about righteous indignation...I am not sure what that is. It wasn’t until about three years ago when something changed in my life. My relationship with God changed from distant, to close. Aside from illness and other trials, my biggest test of faith has come through a child. I really messed up as a mother. It is something I’ve really had to go to God and agree with Him on. I asked him years ago to be the better parent I never was. He has answered that prayer. At one point my husband and I enjoyed our children and grandchildren but then it changed. Our oldest became addicted to drugs and not able to face us, she vanished. She left her five year old with his father who was very abusive. I don’t know how to explain it without getting lengthy. It come to a point where I drew as close to God as I could get: I forgave my daughter who I struggled to understand how she could abandon a child and just leave him. Three years of on my knees praying my daughter would live but also struggling with the things I saw my grandson going through. In a way I became his mother figure but it wasn’t right. It came to a point where I gave my grandson and my daughter over to God and asked Him to do what He does so well. Redeem. The challenge for me has been letting go of control of what I want and trusting God with what He knows is better. Fast forward to today and another test of faith. Our daughter is home and has been for over a year. She is different. She owns what she has done and embraces truth. My grandsons father passed away from an overdose. I’ve watched God change my daughter into someone willing to bear the consequences of telling the truth. She had to go to court to fight to keep legal custody of her son. Even though she has been clean and in counseling for over a year, transparent in taking hair follicle test when asked to by the court...she still lost legal custody of her son. That hardly ever happens. Most states want to rehabilitate a parent-child relationship. She has been given no plan to work toward unification. The evidence in court wasn’t about her being unfit but that the ones that were fighting for custody of him are more fit. Our daughter set on the stand and when asked what drugs she has ever tried, she told them. When asked if she abandoned her son...she answered yes. No excuses. Just the truth and transparency, no matter what it cost. I saw the court going in the other direction and a mother trying would get her child but it didn’t go that way. My heartbreaks because I can’t imagine losing rights to my child, and I also love my grandson greatly, but I would rather support my daughter in taking the path of truth rather than, encouraging her to lie for the sake of gain. God is good and I trust Him with my children and my grandchildren. If He gives them a right path to walk, I will encourage them to walk in it...no matter the cost. You can’t go wrong with telling the truth. I know God will use this for good, for everyone involved. Trusting Him when it doesn’t make sense-

 

[Helen]

@VictoryinJesus
Wow..another heart rending post.
God has certainly allowed you to go through "deep waters"...
I am not sure which is worse...physical pain or emotional pain.
Maybe they are equal.

God bless you, and may He answer the cries of your heart.
. . . .

 

[amadeus]

@VictoryinJesus
I have no words of encouragement for the pain of your situation beyond trusting God as I believe you already are. I am praying that God will handle the situation in His Way. He is always able and always knows what is best.

 

[epostle]

Some 38 years ago I was admitted to a large psychiatric hospital on a court order. I had bipolar psychosis and survived shock treatments. It seemed I was there for months. Later, I was going back and forth on an outpatient basis. I complained to my doctor about feeling like a loser because all my siblings were successful and I was just a nut case. I will never forget what he said:
I have patients with your illness that are in jail or the cemetery. Many repeatedly get re-admitted because they don't take their meds. Your brothers and sisters may not do as well you if they had this illness. You got through because of your faith.

Six years later I finished nursing school.

 

[FHII]

Prayers, bible reading, how many times we go to church, teaching, all the churchie things takes a back seat. Accepting and carrying our own crosses as we walk with Jesus to Calvary is the real deal.

I like what you wrote, but I don't know that I would say those things "take a back seat". Maybe thats just an idiom!

I look at it as part of carrying our own crosses and following Jesus. Of course, what you do in Church, what you lear in the teaching and what you say in your prayers should continue beyond those activities. If that's what you are getting at, I agree.

 

[Helen]

Some 38 years ago I was admitted to a large psychiatric hospital on a court order. I had bipolar psychosis and survived shock treatments. It seemed I was there for months. Later, I was going back and forth on an outpatient basis. I complained to my doctor about feeling like a loser because all my siblings were successful and I was just a nut case. I will never forget what he said:
I have patients with your illness that are in jail or the cemetery. Many repeatedly get re-admitted because they don't take their meds. Your brothers and sisters may not do as well you if they had this illness. You got through because of your faith.

Six years later I finished nursing school.

Praise God...Another great testimony for coming through the storms of life "by Faith".

Amen!!