I have noticed the following Negatives about the 'rapture'...

[amigo de christo]

ead amos .
After this I will RETURN and rebuild the tabernacle of david that is fallen
down .And I will build again the ruins thereof and I will set it UP
That the residue of men might seek after the Lord , and all the gentiles
upon whom MY NAME is called saith the LORD who doeth all these things .
What was amos talking about .
Marks what do you think the prophet meant .
Go read amos .chapter nine verses eleven and twelve .
Marks what do you think this means .
And now a word from JESUS CHRIST many , many years ago .
I HAVE GIVEN THEM YOUR NAME . now read that in amos again . UPON WHOM MY NAME IS CALLED .

 

[amigo de christo]

Torah , the prophets , the law POINTS TO JESUS CHRIST .
To the true Holy Christ of GOD , to a new covenant that was a coming .
To a heavenly jersualem , a third temple wherein its not built by human hands , in the heavens
NOW LET THE KING BE PRAISED . We have come unto MOUNT ZION
the HEAVENLY JERUSALEM
and we too await the CITY TO COME . Let us read those bibles folks .

 

[David in NJ]

No, only your interpretation. But I'm not interested in this sort of conversation, so thank you, and bye for now!

Nontheless, to address your assertion, Scripture tells me otherwise.



Not so:

Jeremiah 31:35-37 KJV
35) Thus saith the LORD, which giveth the sun for a light by day, and the ordinances of the moon and of the stars for a light by night, which divideth the sea when the waves thereof roar; The LORD of hosts is his name:
36) If those ordinances depart from before me, saith the LORD, then the seed of Israel also shall cease from being a nation before me for ever.
37) Thus saith the LORD; If heaven above can be measured, and the foundations of the earth searched out beneath, I will also cast off all the seed of Israel for all that they have done, saith the LORD.

Much love!

marks, i am greatly disappointed that you voided the agreement to submit to God's word.

 

[David in NJ]

Marvel not david . IF one does not adhere to the golden bull of pre trib , THEY GONNA THINK we have no real
idea about any of that stuff . Touch their golden bull , you get the horn every time .
These folks are so hyped up about every lil detail their men passed down from generation to generation .
Only problem is , THEIR BE BIG FAULTS IN IT . BIG ONES .

@rebuilder 454 and @marks and myself agreed to submit to God's word but so far i am the only one fulfilling the contract between us.

See Posts #66, #68, #80 and #218

 

[David in NJ]

Marvel not david . IF one does not adhere to the golden bull of pre trib , THEY GONNA THINK we have no real
idea about any of that stuff . Touch their golden bull , you get the horn every time .
These folks are so hyped up about every lil detail their men passed down from generation to generation .
Only problem is , THEIR BE BIG FAULTS IN IT . BIG ONES .

i am greatly saddened in my heart that my Brethren are more willing to accept a falsehood over the very words of God.

Pre-trib is a lie against the very word of God.

Pre-trib gives birth to many more lies such as falsely claiming Matthew ch24 pertains only to Israel, when in fact JESUS is speaking
directly to His Disciples and forward to all who come to Him for Salvation.

"Then they will deliver you over to be persecuted and killed, and you will be hated by all nations because of My name. 10At that time many will fall away and will betray and hate one another, 11and many false prophets will arise and mislead many.

12Because of the multiplication of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold. 13But the one who perseveres to the end will be saved.

14And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.

 

[David in NJ]

Read amos .
After this I will RETURN and rebuild the tabernacle of david that is fallen
down .And I will build again the ruins thereof and I will set it UP
That the residue of men might seek after the Lord , and all the gentiles
upon whom MY NAME is called saith the LORD who doeth all these things .
What was amos talking about .
Marks what do you think the prophet meant .
Go read amos .chapter nine verses eleven and twelve .
Marks what do you think this means .

Acts ch10
While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who heard the word. 45And those of the circumcision who believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out on the Gentiles also. 46For they heard them speak with tongues and magnify God.

Acts ch15
Then all the multitude kept silent and listened to Barnabas and Paul declaring how many miracles and wonders God had worked through them among the Gentiles. 13And after they had become silent, James answered, saying, “Men and brethren, listen to me:
14Simon has declared how God at the first visited the Gentiles to take out of them a people for His name. 15And with this the words of the prophets agree, just as it is written:

16‘After this I will return
And will rebuild the tabernacle of David, which has fallen down;
I will rebuild its ruins,
And I will set it up;
17So that the rest of mankind may seek the Lord,
Even all the Gentiles who are called by My name,
Says the Lord who does all these things.’

18“Known to God from eternity are all His works.

 

[amigo de christo]

i am greatly saddened in my heart that my Brethren are more willing to accept a falsehood over the very words of God.

Pre-trib is a lie against the very word of God.

Pre-trib gives birth to many more lies such as falsely claiming Matthew ch24 pertains only to Israel, when in fact JESUS is speaking
directly to His Disciples and forward to all who come to Him for Salvation.

"Then they will deliver you over to be persecuted and killed, and you will be hated by all nations because of My name. 10At that time many will fall away and will betray and hate one another, 11and many false prophets will arise and mislead many.

12Because of the multiplication of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold. 13But the one who perseveres to the end will be saved.

14And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.

Its a very sad thing to watch my friend . very sad indeed .

 

[amigo de christo]

i am greatly saddened in my heart that my Brethren are more willing to accept a falsehood over the very words of God.

Pre-trib is a lie against the very word of God.

Pre-trib gives birth to many more lies such as falsely claiming Matthew ch24 pertains only to Israel, when in fact JESUS is speaking
directly to His Disciples and forward to all who come to Him for Salvation.

"Then they will deliver you over to be persecuted and killed, and you will be hated by all nations because of My name. 10At that time many will fall away and will betray and hate one another, 11and many false prophets will arise and mislead many.

12Because of the multiplication of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold. 13But the one who perseveres to the end will be saved.

14And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.

To pry a man from the doctrines of men one would think would be so easy . IF we just read the
bible for ourselves it would have been . But many do not read it for themselves .
And if they do , they read it through the lens of men and their interpretations .
Men must beware . For a great delusion has arisen . This delusion will take ALL into its net .
All who are not in the lambs book of life .
All whose love is of the world will buy the lie . Many want a god , a christ that offers them
the love of the world . This lie will take all captive to be as one right under it .
I warn against it often . And daily it continues to grow .
Folks had better start reading the bible for themselves . This lie is very , very crafity indeed .
THe lie i speak of and do so often is this other love lie that is coming not From God .
I Know , i know i warn against it often . But its moving in so fast now .
And its taking names and its end will be in flames .
And many more will embrace it , and many more will sell out in the coming days my friend .
Its a literal nightmare to watch folks going under it too . But nigh the end
we were warned of a massive falling away . Well , here it is and here it comes
and soon they will unify under it and soon come against the last lambs who stood against it
and did not conform to it . They call it love . but its no love of GOD my friend . it cometh of the dragon
it cometh unto men whose love is of the world and it leadeth to perditon .

 

[amigo de christo]

Acts ch10
While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who heard the word. 45And those of the circumcision who believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out on the Gentiles also. 46For they heard them speak with tongues and magnify God.

Acts ch15
Then all the multitude kept silent and listened to Barnabas and Paul declaring how many miracles and wonders God had worked through them among the Gentiles. 13And after they had become silent, James answered, saying, “Men and brethren, listen to me:
14Simon has declared how God at the first visited the Gentiles to take out of them a people for His name. 15And with this the words of the prophets agree, just as it is written:

16‘After this I will return
And will rebuild the tabernacle of David, which has fallen down;
I will rebuild its ruins,
And I will set it up;
17So that the rest of mankind may seek the Lord,
Even all the Gentiles who are called by My name,
Says the Lord who does all these things.’

18“Known to God from eternity are all His works.

And what also concerns me , is so many have believed
we wont even be here . Thus they will convince themselves , OH THIS CANNOT BE
as they rush to embrace it and the mark of its name . For many will have told themselves
and say aloud in that day , NO WAY this can be such a thing
for the church would have already been GONE by now if it were . THAT WORRIES THE HECK OUT OF ME
when i watch folks buying into this pre trib too . THEY GONNA TELL THEMSELVES
NO WAY THIS COULD be the mark , CAUSE WE WONT BE HERE . THEY WRONG DAVID .
But as i said if ones love is of the world , HOW can they see .
Not all pre tribbers will take it . BUT MANY WILL . as will many others no matter what trib they think is right .
The lie of the liar will persaude all not in the lambs book of life . And all out war against the lambs will follow suit .

 

[David in NJ]

And what also concerns me , is so many have believed
we wont even be here . Thus they will convince themselves , OH THIS CANNOT BE
as they rush to embrace it and the mark of its name . For many will have told themselves
and say aloud in that day , NO WAY this can be such a thing
for the church would have already been GONE by now if it were . THAT WORRIES THE HECK OUT OF ME
when i watch folks buying into this pre trib too . THEY GONNA TELL THEMSELVES
NO WAY THIS COULD be the mark , CAUSE WE WONT BE HERE . THEY WRONG DAVID .
But as i said if ones love is of the world , HOW can they see .
Not all pre tribbers will take it . BUT MANY WILL . as will many others no matter what trib they think is right .
The lie of the liar will persaude all not in the lambs book of life . And all out war against the lambs will follow suit .

John McArthur has publicly preached that you can receive the Mark of the Beast and still be forgiven.

That is how great the deception is.

 

[amigo de christo]

John McArthur has publicly preached that you can receive the Mark of the Beast and still be forgiven.

That is how great the deception is.

THAT MY FRIEND is what i am talking about . RIGHT THERE .
HE also preaches CESSATIONISM .
many now are also , under the influence of a false love , are convincing themselves
of this . saying things like well the mark aint the unpardonable sin .
Others are saying well its okay to take a chip or whatever , CAUSE IT CANT BE THE MARK
cause we would not be here . THEY add things like the Six six six gets added in later .
THEY ARE CONVINCING THEMSELVES OF A LIE . many more
are and have strayed so far into this other love spell , they too believe it aint even necessary to beleive on JESUS CHRIST
to be saved . THE DUNG HAS HIT THE FAN DAVID . And they buying a LOT OF BULL .
THE BULL that cometh of their golden bull .
NOw to a lamb when we see the all inclusive love bull , we see it for what it is , JUST PLAIN OL BULL.
but many see it as a GOLDEN BULL . NOPE its just bull . Kept it as clean as i could to make my point .

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

All the places I'd have guessed, it's not there.

For all I know this is a modern tale, I just cannot find any ancient sources, not even anything more than 100 years old. Not even that.

Much love!

It"s a nice tale, I like it ... it's fits. You don't really need this tale to know that the Groom will soon come to get His Bride when the Father tells Him to. The trumpets will blow and we will be taken up and then we will certainly celebrate that!

 

[keithr]

The dead of vs 19 above are the dead found here:

Ephesians 2:1 (KJV) And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;

Ephesians 2:5-6 (KJV) Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;) And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

I don't think that can be correct. Isaiah 26:19 says (WEB):

(19) Your dead shall live. My dead bodies shall arise. Awake and sing, you who dwell in the dust; for your dew is like the dew of herbs, and the earth will cast out the departed spirits.​

That is definitely talking about really dead people, not live people who are reckoned dead because they are unforgiven sinners.

 

[rebuilder 454]

Directed at the lie of pre-trib = always = "no lie is of the truth"

Rev 14 is a lie?
It blows apart completely, your foundation stone and banner pillar of everything you use as end times prism.
That being "he only comes one time"
Not to mention, you have the dead in Christ raised AFTER the living are raptured in rev 14. 100% false.
Game
Set
Match

 

[keithr]

He was not resurrected as a human being (that would be taking back his sacrifice).

How so? I don't see that. Resurrection doesn't make His death not having happened. It still happened. That was the sacrifice.

John 6:51 (WEB):

(51) I am the living bread which came down out of heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever. Yes, the bread which I will give for the life of the world is my flesh.”​

His flesh was the sacrifice which Jesus gave "for the life of the world". You cannot take back what you give as a sacrifice, otherwise it is not a sacrifice, and you have not given it. In the type the sacrifice is completely consumed, or destroyed:

Leviticus 16 (WEB):

(11) “Aaron shall present the bull of the sin offering, which is for himself, and shall make atonement for himself and for his house, and shall kill the bull of the sin offering which is for himself.​

(14) He shall take some of the blood of the bull, and sprinkle it with his finger on the mercy seat on the east; and before the mercy seat he shall sprinkle some of the blood with his finger seven times.​

(25) The fat of the sin offering he shall burn on the altar.​

(27) The bull for the sin offering, and the goat for the sin offering, whose blood was brought in to make atonement in the Holy Place, shall be carried outside the camp; and they shall burn their skins, their flesh, and their dung with fire.​

2 Corinthians 5:15-16 (WEB):

(15) He died for all, that those who live should no longer live to themselves, but to him who for their sakes died and rose again.​

(16) Therefore we know no one after the flesh from now on. Even though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now we know him so no more.​

1 John 3:2 (WEB):

(2) Beloved, now we are children of God, and it is not yet revealed what we will be. But we know that when he is revealed, we will be like him; for we will see him just as he is.​

We do not yet know, or understand, what our resurrection nature will be like. It will not be human - we are changed. That is the nature of Jesus since his resurrection too - he is no longer human, just as he was not human before God changed his nature and made him human. Having sacrificed that perfect human life, God then resurrected Jesus as a spirit being:

Philippians 2:6-9 (WEB):

(6) who, existing in the form of God, didn’t consider equality with God a thing to be grasped,​

(7) but emptied himself, taking the form of a servant, being made in the likeness of men.​

(8) And being found in human form, he humbled himself, becoming obedient to the point of death, yes, the death of the cross.​

(9) Therefore God also highly exalted him, and gave to him the name which is above every name;​

1 Corinthians 15:45-49 (WEB):

(45) So also it is written, “The first man, Adam, became a living soul.” The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.​

(46) However that which is spiritual isn’t first, but that which is natural, then that which is spiritual.​

(47) The first man is of the earth, made of dust. The second man is the Lord from heaven.​

(48) As is the one made of dust, such are those who are also made of dust; and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.​

(49) As we have borne the image of those made of dust, let’s also bear the image of the heavenly.​

 

[keithr]

They will have the power to strike the earth with "every plague", exceeding the power of Moses or Elijah.

When Jesus was transfigured, who was he seen talking with. Was it Elijah and Enoch, or Elijah and Moses?

 

[David in NJ]

Rev 14 is a lie?
It blows apart completely, your foundation stone and banner pillar of everything you use as end times prism.
That being "he only comes one time"
Not to mention, you have the dead in Christ raised AFTER the living are raptured in rev 14. 100% false.
Game
Set
Match

Good Morning rebuilder 454

i like your ending = "Game, Set, Match"

pre-trib rapture is "hay, wood and stuble" that will burn up without a 'match' before the LORD Jesus Christ

John ch17 - "Sanctify them(you and me) in Your Truth, Your word is Truth"

ALL of Revelation is Truth

Did you know that there are 7 dialogues in Revelation that address His Second Coming = 7 times

Before we even get to chapter 14, Rev ch6 shows us His Second Coming = 6:12-17

Revelation is a 'revealing' of His Glory, His Saints on earth, His Saints in Heaven, Worship, satan's plan, Judgment, His Return and More

 

[David in NJ]

I don't think that can be correct. Isaiah 26:19 says (WEB):

(19) Your dead shall live. My dead bodies shall arise. Awake and sing, you who dwell in the dust; for your dew is like the dew of herbs, and the earth will cast out the departed spirits.​

That is definitely talking about really dead people, not live people who are reckoned dead because they are unforgiven sinners.

Good Morning keithr,

You are 100% Correct on Isaiah 26:19 = dead bodies in the earth that will be Resurrected at His Second Coming

@rwb is 100% Correct in Ephesians chapter 2 = BEFORE the physical body is resurrected our spirits must be Resurrected from death.

If a person is not 'BORN-AGAIN' by the SPIRIT of GOD first, they will never receive a Resurrected GLORIFIED ETERNAL BODY

 

[rwb]

I don't think that can be correct. Isaiah 26:19 says (WEB):

(19) Your dead shall live. My dead bodies shall arise. Awake and sing, you who dwell in the dust; for your dew is like the dew of herbs, and the earth will cast out the departed spirits.​

That is definitely talking about really dead people, not live people who are reckoned dead because they are unforgiven sinners.

What Isaiah says shall come to pass because Christ has raised from the dead. All who physically die IN CHRIST shall awake from physical death also, but that will not be until the last trumpet sounds and the bodies of the physically dead are resurrected either to immortal & incorruptible life or damnation.

If we are not made spiritually alive in Christ during our lifetime, we will be among those who are resurrected to damnation, the lake of fire that is the second death. The time is NOW when the spiritually dead must hear His voice, and whosoever hears shall have eternal life through Him. The time that is COMING is when the physically dead are resurrected from the graves to either stand before God at the Great White Throne Judgment to be judged according to what is written in the books and the book of life. Or they will be counted among those who have done good and made immortal & incorruptible to receive their eternal reward which shall be everlasting life with Christ on the new earth.

John 5:25 (KJV) Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.

John 5:28-29 (KJV) Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

Romans 14:10 (KJV) But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.

Revelation 20:11-15 (KJV) And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

 

[David in NJ]

Rev 14 is a lie?
It blows apart completely, your foundation stone and banner pillar of everything you use as end times prism.
That being "he only comes one time"
Not to mention, you have the dead in Christ raised AFTER the living are raptured in rev 14. 100% false.
Game
Set
Match

Have you examined the evidence in Post #284