If Hitler were to have repented for his sins before he died, would he have gone to Heaven?

[Ronald David Bruno]

James 2:


Mr. Hitler needed to show his faith through his deeds. Killing himself was not a sign of repentance.

The good news is that one of the two criminals repented on the cross before he died, Luke 23:


Don't delay the decision. Don't wait until you are about to die. While alive, Matthew 3:

Personally, I believe God made everyone for a purpose. Unfortunately, many were made to represent evil and leading to judgment, wrath and death; and some to show His mercy, forgivenes and life.
People struggle with this concept _ His sovereignty.
Hitler was responsible for some 70+ million deaths: Russians, Europeans, Americans and Germans. It is obvious that since God chose Hitler for that purpose, then Hitler was born a reprobate, with no chance of redemption.
Evil dictators like Lennon, Stalin, Mao Zedong, Pol Pot,etc., were similar examples of Satan's minions.

Supportive scriptures:

Proverbs 16:4 – The LORD has made everything for its purpose, even the wicked for the day of trouble.

But indeed, O man, who are you to reply against God? Will the thing formed say to him who formed it, “Why have you made me like this?” Does not the potter have power over the clay, from the same lump to make one vessel for honor and another for dishonor? What if God, wanting to show His wrath and to make His power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath prepared for destruction, 23 and that He might make known the riches of His glory on the vessels of mercy, which He had prepared beforehand for glory,"
Rom. 9:20-23

I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things. ISAIAH 45:7
* evil > calamities, troubles, disaster, woes

"Let every soul be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and the authorities that exist are appointed by God". Rom. 13:1

 

[Randy Kluth]

Well you make the claim and I am asking for what Scriptures you use to determine this.

You have given a philosophical answer without showing Scripture.

Some of the pharisaical children of the devil later became Christrians.

And you did not answer that until we became the children of God- whose children were we?????

You put me on the spot. To be perfectly blunt, I am most often able to tell whose children they are at any point in their journey, simply because God knows, in advance, what kind of environment Man has caused them to be planted into. I'm not sure anybody is actually called God's child or the Devil's child until they actually display evidence of their final commitment?

If a "pharisaical child of the Devil" later becomes a Christian, I would expect that commitment to be a nominal commitment--a commitment that will not last. Any spiritual benefit would be lost when the soul is tested.

I have not given a philosophical answer to you about this. My rationale, from Scriptures, is that the *meaning of the terms* indicates a belonging, to God or to the Devil. They are self-explanatory. Therefore, it is incumbent upon *you* to prove that they do not mean that.

 

[Adrift]

So... what specifically is the blasphemy against the Holy Spirit?

I have always considered (perhaps wrongly) that blaspheming against the Holy Spirit is refusing to accept Jesus as your Savior after this truth has been revealed to you by the Holy Spirit (God).

All sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme: but he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation: because they said, He hath an unclean spirit.
Mark 3:28 KJV

 

[St. SteVen]

I have always considered (perhaps wrongly) that blaspheming against the Holy Spirit is refusing to accept Jesus as your Savior after this truth has been revealed to you by the Holy Spirit (God).

All sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme: but he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation: because they said, He hath an unclean spirit.
Mark 3:28 KJV

Thanks.
It's amazing the doctrinal gymnastics that we have to do to explain this question.
I've never heard a completely cohesive explanation. Even my own take doesn't really deal with it completely.
It's a mystery. IMHO
No idea what Jesus was trying to tell us.

/

 

[Reggie Belafonte]

Adolph Hitler was the very epitome of human evil: Starting a war that killed 37 million people and devastated a continent, persecuting, torturing, and murdering God's people, setting up a Secret Police to control the populace through fear, murdering your political opponents...

What, do we think the "sin" Jesus died for is just basic naughtiness, like looking at dirty pictures on the internet?

You do not know what you are talking about.
Stalin and Co killed more people than Hitlers Mob and made people suffer for years longer than Hitler pushed.

Not to mention that Stalin and his Mob did nothing but Evil from day one !
But Hitler did very well for the Germans in fact until the War in fact !
All of the political Party's of Germany after WW1 were good for nothing total morons in fact ! But Hitler turned the Nation around you fools ! No one could say that his Party did not do well in fact ! for they were very capable indeed !

I believe that Hitler was Owned and controlled By the Rothschild's and Co ! and only did their bidding ! The So called Zionist and that's what they truly are in fact ! for they are not worthy of God in fact ! and most of the German Jews knew this for a fact ! and despised them totally and that's why the Zionist had to make a Burnt offering to them all ! They offered them up to their gods in fact ! The Nazi symbol has been around for around 4000 years and such is just a way that they used on the Germans so as to create such nonsense in fact and the Bolsheviks were another creation set to trap the Slavic Race into a Hellfire ! but that Bolshevik Game play was to dangerous to be pushed on the Germans because they were not that stupid, so they used the Nazi Game with them !

Look at the Jewish Wars all through history, they played it smart, for they in leadership were not fools ? Not always on Gods side as well in fact if you know the history well. So when Jesus turned up ? they at the top had other gods that they served in fact ? Paul woke up to the fact ! and Nathaniel knew who Jesus was directly, because Jesus said what Nathaniel truly was, a True Israelite in fact ! He is the epitome of Gods servants !

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

I have always considered (perhaps wrongly) that blaspheming against the Holy Spirit is refusing to accept Jesus as your Savior after this truth has been revealed to you by the Holy Spirit (God).

All sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme: but he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation: because they said, He hath an unclean spirit.
Mark 3:28 KJV

Jesus said sins against Him could be forgiven, if one asks before they die. But the sin against the Holy Spirit is different. He distinguishes between this particular type of sin with all others: "Therefore I say to you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven men. 32 Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come." Matt. 12:31-32

So what is that sin?
> When the Pharisees accused Him of healing by the power of Satan, they blasphemed the Holy Spirit, saying God was Satan.
Jesus' miracles were supposed to be the proof test of Who He was and they not only reject Him (Who, as He already existed in the form of God, did not consider equality with God something to be grasped) but blasphemed the Holy Spirit/ God - an unforgivable sin.
So the mistake of not recognizing Jesus as God was already considered something that man would wrestle with.
"Now Jesus cried out and said, “The one who believes in Me, does not believe only in Me, but also in Him who sent Me. 45 And the one who sees Me sees Him who sent Me." John 12:44-45
:If I do not do the works of My Father, do not believe Me; but if I do, though you do not believe Me, believe the works, that you may know and believe that the Father is in Me, and I in Him.” John 20:37-38

 

[Ronald Nolette]

You put me on the spot. To be perfectly blunt, I am most often able to tell whose children they are at any point in their journey, simply because God knows, in advance, what kind of environment Man has caused them to be planted into. I'm not sure anybody is actually called God's child or the Devil's child until they actually display evidence of their final commitment?

If a "pharisaical child of the Devil" later becomes a Christian, I would expect that commitment to be a nominal commitment--a commitment that will not last. Any spiritual benefit would be lost when the soul is tested.

I have not given a philosophical answer to you about this. My rationale, from Scriptures, is that the *meaning of the terms* indicates a belonging, to God or to the Devil. They are self-explanatory. Therefore, it is incumbent upon *you* to prove that they do not mean that.

And yet I was clearly a child of the devil for I worshipped him and read the satanic bible. then when God decided it was time, He saved me.

all you did in your criteria were to judge on the outer appearance in a moment of time (even if that moment was a long period) but God judges the heart.

we have no ability to call someone a child of the devil or a child of God. One may look like either but later revealed to be the other. That is a judgment left to God.

 

[Randy Kluth]

And yet I was clearly a child of the devil for I worshipped him and read the satanic bible. then when God decided it was time, He saved me.

You're claiming what you have yet to prove, that the Bible establishes that you were a "child of the Devil." Asserting things doesn't prove anything except that you believe something.

all you did in your criteria were to judge on the outer appearance in a moment of time (even if that moment was a long period) but God judges the heart.

Yes, it is the heart that responds to God, or not. By responding positively to God's word, a person can get saved and become a "child of God." By responding negatively to God's word, a person can become a "child of Satan." The difference is the degree to which a person responds to God's word.

There are a lot of reasons that people make bad choices, which we will call "mitigating factors." This means that though a person responds badly to the word of God it does not mean that God's word is being rejected for all time. Obviously, in your case, you rejected God's word (unconsciously) but did not reject it for all time.

we have no ability to call someone a child of the devil or a child of God. One may look like either but later revealed to be the other. That is a judgment left to God.

If you will simply read the Bible you will see how wrong you are.

John 8.44 You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father’s desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks his native language, for he is a liar and the father of lies.

Acts 13.10 “You are a child of the devil and an enemy of everything that is right! You are full of all kinds of deceit and trickery. Will you never stop perverting the right ways of the Lord?"

1 John 3.10 This is how we know who the children of God are and who the children of the devil are: Anyone who does not do what is right is not God’s child, nor is anyone who does not love their brother and sister.

John 1.12 Yet to all who did receive him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God.

1 John 2.14 I write to you, dear children, because you know the Father. I write to you, fathers, because you know him who is from the beginning. I write to you, young men, because you are strong, and the word of God lives in you, and you have overcome the evil one.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

You're claiming what you have yet to prove, that the Bible establishes that you were a "child of the Devil." Asserting things doesn't prove anything except that you believe something.

Well that is what you have done. At least I have working experience of actively being on Satans side of the spiritual warfare.

Yes, it is the heart that responds to God, or not. By responding positively to God's word, a person can get saved and become a "child of God." By responding negatively to God's word, a person can become a "child of Satan." The difference is the degree to which a person responds to God's word.

There are a lot of reasons that people make bad choices, which we will call "mitigating factors." This means that though a person responds badly to the word of God it does not mean that God's word is being rejected for all time. Obviously, in your case, you rejected God's word (unconsciously) but did not reject it for all time.

People make "bad" choices because we are inherently bad. As Isaiah wrote- even our rightouseness is filthy rage before God.​

If you will simply read the Bible you will see how wrong you are.

John 8.44 You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father’s desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks his native language, for he is a liar and the father of lies.

Acts 13.10 “You are a child of the devil and an enemy of everything that is right! You are full of all kinds of deceit and trickery. Will you never stop perverting the right ways of the Lord?"

1 John 3.10 This is how we know who the children of God are and who the children of the devil are: Anyone who does not do what is right is not God’s child, nor is anyone who does not love their brother and sister.

John 1.12 Yet to all who did receive him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God.

1 John 2.14 I write to you, dear children, because you know the Father. I write to you, fathers, because you know him who is from the beginning. I write to you, young men, because you are strong, and the word of God lives in you, and you have overcome the evil one.

Well this corresponds exactly to what I said in the beginning. If one is not a child of god, then by default they are a child of the devil no matter how outwardly "good" or "bad" they behave.

Even we cannot say with 100% certitu8de who the children of God are. REason?

1 John 2:19
They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.

Matthew 7:21-23​

​

King James Version​

​

​

21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Matthew 13:24-30

King James Version

​

24 Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field:
25 But while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way.
26 But when the blade was sprung up, and brought forth fruit, then appeared the tares also.
27 So the servants of the householder came and said unto him, Sir, didst not thou sow good seed in thy field? from whence then hath it tares?
28 He said unto them, An enemy hath done this. The servants said unto him, Wilt thou then that we go and gather them up?
29 But he said, Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them.
30 Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

Once again we judge on the external, but we can not know a persons heart fully.

One is either a child of God or they are a child of the devil.

 

[Randy Kluth]

One is either a child of God or they are a child of the devil.

You are determined to believe you were once a "child of the Devil." That's okay--your opinion. To me it's not an either/or, a binary choice. My language is different.

I say that the inclination is there from the seed of the person because that seed is the product of someone who has lived previously, and what they choose, whether good or bad, will either align with God's original choices or not.

The bad seed will receive God's seed in their own bad soil. They may seem to receive that seed, and actually do receive it to some extent. But in the end, the bad soil will "cough up" the good seed of God's word.

You may be good seed, brother, and simply found yourself in a bad environment. You made bad choices. You even chose to worship the Devil.

But in your case, if you are a child of God--a good seed, there were mitigating factors leading you, a generally "good person," to make bad choices.

The Scriptures that consign us all to rebellion and treachery were not designed to prove that all have to act out that sinful inclination. It is just designed to prove that the inclination is in us--something we must learn to fight against.

Paul quoted in Romans how the OT Scriptures saw all Israel, at one point in their history, as despicably corrupt. Bad influences spread, and even the good people within the nation can succumb, at times--if only for awhile.

But proving we're all sinners is not saying we must be bad all the time. And Israel was not always, in their history, despicably wicked.

W do not have to always capitulate to sin. We can fight against sin, and our carnal tendencies. Those who are of God's seed will prevail, if only in a very weak sense. Many of us were raised in hostile circumstances, and will come forth victorious with some pretty serious scars. ...My view.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

You are determined to believe you were once a "child of the Devil." That's okay--your opinion. To me it's not an either/or, a binary choice. My language is different.

So then for the 3rd or 4th time answer this statement : If one is not a child of God, they are a child of..........

The Scriptures that consign us all to rebellion and treachery were not designed to prove that all have to act out that sinful inclination. It is just designed to prove that the inclination is in us--something we must learn to fight against.

But all do in some measure because all are born lost with a sin nature and sin by default. Before one is saved, one sins because that is who they are, a sinner by birth.

Paul quoted in Romans how the OT Scriptures saw all Israel, at one point in their history, as despicably corrupt. Bad influences spread, and even the good people within the nation can succumb, at times--if only for awhile.

Wrong. Paul said there has always been a remnant , just like to day- they are th eones who become followers of Jeshua ha- Mashiach

But proving we're all sinners is not saying we must be bad all the time. And Israel was not always, in their history, despicably wicked.

W do not have to always capitulate to sin. We can fight against sin, and our carnal tendencies. Those who are of God's seed will prevail, if only in a very weak sense. Many of us were raised in hostile circumstances, and will come forth victorious with some pretty serious scars. ...My view.

By Gods standard- even our good deeds are counted as filthy rags in His sight! As for the rest, we are making relative judgments based on relative rules established by each society.

Duirng WW2 Our society said the holocaust was wrong, German society said differently .

 

[Davy]

The abode of the pit, or hell, is in... the heavenly dimension.

So the real question should be, per Luke 16, is WHICH SIDE... would Hitler have been taken to? The answer to that is easy... to the side where the "rich man" was taken, called the abode of "hell" (haides), across a great gulf in Paradise per Luke 16.

 

[Randy Kluth]

So then for the 3rd or 4th time answer this statement : If one is not a child of God, they are a child of..........

For the 3rd or 4th time I'll give you the same answer, though you won't like it. It is *not* a binary choice. A person is not normally called, in the Bible, a "child of Satan" until his choices reveal him to be such. On the other hand, "children of God" were stated to be such from the beginning, likely because that was God's original and exclusive choice.

For myself, personally, apart from the Bible, I would say that "if one is not a child of God they are a child of Satan." I say this not on a biblical basis, nor on the basis of human choice, but rather, on the basis of God's foreknowledge and predestination. Although He predestined nobody from the beginning to be damned, He ultimately knows who are produced apart from the original seed of His word, and they are "children of Satan."

Let me put it like this, although it's pure hypothesis. God spread His good seed over the original garden, and only good children would emerge. But with human rebellion, and God entrusting gardening to Man, seed got cast outside of the garden in places where temptations would overwhelm the seed.

God foreknew that this seed would fail, because he knew in advance it was "bad seed." It was "bad seed" because it would be cast beyond where He originally designed it to be cast. It was destined to fail, but not *predestined* to fail.

So although you at one time did not appear to be a "child of God," you actually were, in the predestined sense, because you were created by the original plan of God and by the original good seed of God's word. Even though you didn't immediately respond to who you were, you ultimately did respond, when the light and heat of God's word finally penetrated the darkness in your life and the darkness of this world around you.

You may not like my answers, but they are what they are....

But all do in some measure because all are born lost with a sin nature and sin by default. Before one is saved, one sins because that is who they are, a sinner by birth.

A "sinner" is not exact.y equated with a "child of Satan." A sinner is under the power of Satan, but does not necessarily *belong* to Satan.

Wrong. Paul said there has always been a remnant , just like to day- they are th eones who become followers of Jeshua ha- Mashiach

Yes, there are always exceptions. But Paul quotes a passage that generalizes about the *entire country* going corrupt, notwithstanding a prophet or two who remain faithful. The surviving faithful remnant can be so small that we can generalize that the entire nation went south.

By Gods standard- even our good deeds are counted as filthy rags in His sight! As for the rest, we are making relative judgments based on relative rules established by each society.

This is such a misunderstood passage. What the Bible is saying is that mankind, no matter how much good he does, is viewed as unworthy as long as sin remains undealt with by God's atonement and forgiveness. No matter how much good Israel did, they still had to have atonement made for them. No matter how much good we do as Christians we must rely upon God's mercy and grace for His blessings.

Duirng WW2 Our society said the holocaust was wrong, German society said differently .

It was a bad time in Germany, just as it was in ancient Israel when they were all viewed as despicable rebels and sinners. There were a few Germans, like Bonhoeffer, who knew the German Church had closed its eyes and compromised with Hitler.

 

[St. SteVen]

A person is not normally called, in the Bible, a "child of Satan" until his choices reveal him to be such. On the other hand, "children of God" were stated to be such from the beginning, likely because that was God's original and exclusive choice.

Well said.

/

 

[Reggie Belafonte]

So then for the 3rd or 4th time answer this statement : If one is not a child of God, they are a child of..........

But all do in some measure because all are born lost with a sin nature and sin by default. Before one is saved, one sins because that is who they are, a sinner by birth.

Wrong. Paul said there has always been a remnant , just like to day- they are th eones who become followers of Jeshua ha- Mashiach

By Gods standard- even our good deeds are counted as filthy rags in His sight! As for the rest, we are making relative judgments based on relative rules established by each society.

Duirng WW2 Our society said the holocaust was wrong, German society said differently .

German society said differently BS ! Most did not know about the Genocide at all in fact, because it was hidden in fact from the majority !
It was the Nazi Party that was a Socialist Government and with any Socialist Government when they get clear power they own the people ! and what you may say and think, you must tow the Socialist line or else you become a enemy of the State in fact !

Sure in the West the Socialist became a Fabian Socialist game play, so that means that they do you in slowly in fact, but Hitlers Socialism was abrupt tailored for the times by the powers that be that run the world, for their own ends. just like Communism was and is still a good tool to play on shallow simple people who know or knew no better !

The Holocaust was only a creation of the Jews in fact, it was they who called it a Burnt offering to their gods ? and this was promoted in the West as the Holocaust !
Only Anti-Christ call such a burnt offering ( Holocaust ) ? because such was given up to their gods in fact ! For they are in fact promoting such and boasting of it ! but the thing is most people can not join the dots because they have not been educated on the subject but only a coming from a indoctrinated stance and the Anti-Christ are pissing themselves laughing at the shallowness of most people !

Not only that but the Star the so called Zionist have on their flag is so wrong ! if you are a worthy Christian in fact, for the Bible informs us what this symbol is ! only a work of Man ! Not in regards God at all in fact !
St Stephen points this out in Acts ! and when Stephen was pointing out to the Jews about the History of the Jews in Acts ! he is totally correct in regards God in fact, for the leadership was off track regarding God but was on a Mans works trip and that's why the Jews failed in fact ! and that's why they killed Stephen in fact, for as Jesus pointed out in fact, Who was of, their Father ? The one who was a murderer from the beginning and of lies ! for they had been lead astray in fact ! Because if a people were worthy of God = Israel ! such as They who are worthy Israel will never fail in fact !
The Jews always failed every time when they turned their backs on God in fact ! and now we see Christianity has turned their backs on Christ Jesus in fact ! and that's why we are as Nations finished and the Hellfire awaits ! for you are idolising stupid gods in fact !
The gods of the Sodomites for one in fact and all the rest of the childish retarded depravity in fact that is puffed up and painted as Pride ! a boast of pure ignorance ! the same with abortion of healthy baby's up to 9 months. now that's pure Evil that's right up their, it's Genocide ! if not, on par with offering up a Burnt offering to your Satanic gods ?

The true Worthy Jews became Christians in fact 2000 years ago ! and Christians do not have burnt offerings in fact !

 

[Ronald Nolette]

For the 3rd or 4th time I'll give you the same answer, though you won't like it. It is *not* a binary choice. A person is not normally called, in the Bible, a "child of Satan" until his choices reveal him to be such. On the other hand, "children of God" were stated to be such from the beginning, likely because that was God's original and exclusive choice.

So until we a child of God whose child are we? If it is not a binary choice, what kind of choice? Tertiary?

For myself, personally, apart from the Bible, I would say that "if one is not a child of God they are a child of Satan." I say this not on a biblical basis, nor on the basis of human choice, but rather, on the basis of God's foreknowledge and predestination. Although He predestined nobody from the beginning to be damned, He ultimately knows who are produced apart from the original seed of His word, and they are "children of Satan."

Well as Paul said we are translated out of the kingdom of darkness that is poweful evidence. I agree, I was a child of God before He created the world! All the rest lie in the lap of the wicked one. If that doesn't make them children of the devil by default, I don't know of any other choices. And you seem loathe to offer another option.

Let me put it like this, although it's pure hypothesis. God spread His good seed over the original garden, and only good children would emerge. But with human rebellion, and God entrusting gardening to Man, seed got cast outside of the garden in places where temptations would overwhelm the seed.

God foreknew that this seed would fail, because he knew in advance it was "bad seed." It was "bad seed" because it would be cast beyond where He originally designed it to be cast. It was destined to fail, but not *predestined* to fail.

Well keeping it biblical, it was not bad seed, but bad soil.

This is such a misunderstood passage. What the Bible is saying is that mankind, no matter how much good he does, is viewed as unworthy as long as sin remains undealt with by God's atonement and forgiveness. No matter how much good Israel did, they still had to have atonement made for them. No matter how much good we do as Christians we must rely upon God's mercy and grace for His blessings.

Then why didn't teh bible say what you said? why do you need to clear up gods INspired Word? It simply says our goodness (righteousness) is filthy rqags before God. Just like Paul reiterated in Corinthjians and Romans that those in the flesh cannot please god.

It was a bad time in Germany, just as it was in ancient Israel when they were all viewed as despicable rebels and sinners. There were a few Germans, like Bonhoeffer, who knew the German Church had closed its eyes and compromised with Hitler.

But society as a whole accepted killing Jews. Just like the surrounding nations around Israel as society accepted worshipping pagan gods. God decides what is right and wrong and not society or culture or current trends.

 

[Randy Kluth]

So until we a child of God whose child are we? If it is not a binary choice, what kind of choice? Tertiary?

I'm saying that the Bible does not say we're either a child of God or a child of Satan--not a binary choice. It is being revealed as we make final choices, and recognized as such by the word of God.

So what are we until it is determined that we're one or the other? It's not revealed until it is revealed.

What the Bible does say about all people is that they're either saved or unsaved--this is a binary choice. But it is not clear who among Christians are actually saved, or who among the unsaved will get saved. So we don't have a binary choice when judging where "all men" are with respect to being "children of God" or "children of Satan."

Well as Paul said we are translated out of the kingdom of darkness that is poweful evidence. I agree, I was a child of God before He created the world!

Don't agree with me on that--I never said that! I said God's original intention was to bring into existence only those who were His children. You were not His child before you were born, or before the world was even created!

All the rest lie in the lap of the wicked one. If that doesn't make them children of the devil by default, I don't know of any other choices. And you seem loathe to offer another option.

Nothing to do with "loathing." It's just my opinion that those trapped in the Devil's snares, or prison, are not by default "children of Satan." If they are trapped, they are captives and victims, and not necessarily "his children!"

Well keeping it biblical, it was not bad seed, but bad soil.

Yea, I'm sort of taking the symbolism of seeds in 2 directions, one referring to "children" and the other referring to "God's word." To me, the result is the same--God's word produces God's children.

But God's seed is also freely given to those who reject it, or who just temporarily accept it, or perhaps use it in a diminished way. People use God's word to do the good they were created to do, but do not always accept being completely owned by God.

God's word is sown everywhere, but good children are those who respond to God's word. Thus, the seed is the same for God's word as it is for becoming God's children--it is the success of God's word in producing children.

When God puts his word in good soil, it is the same thing as producing children. But taken in another direction I would say that even producing good children that word can find itself in a difficult environment, initially, producing disappointing results initially. But in the end, God's word can produce good children even out of a difficult environment.

Then why didn't teh bible say what you said? why do you need to clear up gods INspired Word? It simply says our goodness (righteousness) is filthy rqags before God. Just like Paul reiterated in Corinthjians and Romans that those in the flesh cannot please god.

I'm not cleaning up God's word, but explaining it. It's most often a problem over context.

If we understood, in the era of Law, that it was designed to produce obedience, and we saw Israelis doing good works without truly repenting along with their sacrifices, then we could understand what Paul meant by "our righteousness being filthy rags."

But society as a whole accepted killing Jews. Just like the surrounding nations around Israel as society accepted worshipping pagan gods. God decides what is right and wrong and not society or culture or current trends.

I couldn't agree more. I didn't know we disagreed on any of this?

 

[amigo de christo]

James 2:


Mr. Hitler needed to show his faith through his deeds. Killing himself was not a sign of repentance.

The good news is that one of the two criminals repented on the cross before he died, Luke 23:


Don't delay the decision. Don't wait until you are about to die. While alive, Matthew 3:

We see the true repentance of one of them said thieves . exactly .
A he was sorrowful for what HE had done
and the number one thing was , HE BELEIVED IN JESUS THE CHRIST . the true repentance
that cometh of GOD leadeth salvation . there is no salvation outside of JESUS THE CHRIST
and if one truly is drawn to him their hearts will be sorrowful and contrite for the evil they had done .
NO LONGER JUSTIFYING THEIR SIN but hating even the wicked sinful desires of their own flesh .
SO , how come i see so many in churches , claiming to BELIEVE ON JESUS CHRIST and yet HOLDING UP THEIR RAINBOWS and or other sins .
that is a red flag
And even more so why do i see so many
that might holler about doing good works , but seem to believe that it dont matter what religoin one beleives in
or whom they believed in . cause that lie wont be saving squat either .

 

[amigo de christo]

I do not drink coffee, if much at all.

the absolute most deadly drink of all is the drink that cometh of THE HARLOTS CUP . now that be A FACT TOO .
anway we may all return to the original thread . Sip not , taste not , dont even put that cup unto our lips .
A harlots cup is full of fornication and the mother of all Harlots
has appeared from , from WITHIN THE MIGHTY REALM OF CHRISTENDOM to offer up her cup
to all religoins and denominations . that WHORE gonna burn and my advice to all is
they partake not of her cup or recieve of her plauges they will . FOR STRONG IS THE LORD GOD who shall judge
her and her united we are one children . WHEREFORE COME YE OUT from amongst them
and be YE HOLY ye who bear the vessels of the LORD .

 

[amigo de christo]

And yet I was clearly a child of the devil for I worshipped him and read the satanic bible. then when God decided it was time, He saved me.

all you did in your criteria were to judge on the outer appearance in a moment of time (even if that moment was a long period) but God judges the heart.

we have no ability to call someone a child of the devil or a child of God. One may look like either but later revealed to be the other. That is a judgment left to God.

well it was good up to the part where you said we have no ability to callsomeone a child of the devil .
cause LOOK at what some of the apostels called some of them resisters .
While one is under the power and influence of satan they are indeed a child of the devil .
Infleunced by the power of satan and of darkness . BUT
JESUS can set any one free of the power of satan and of darkness . ITS WHY WE GOTTA PREACH THE ORIGINAL GOSPEL
to all that has breath . YE child of the devil , said paul to the man trying to turn the deputy from the faith .
OH yeah , HE DID CALL Him that .