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doctrox

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I did not attack you as a person, I simply explained your misunderstanding of “as”.
Your opinion holds no import with the standard rules of English grammar.

A simile is a literary device that directly compares two things to show the similarities between the two - a simile will include the words "like" or "as". - source

"Yet if any man suffer as a Christian, let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf."

First of all, keep in mind this is the one and only place in the entire scripture this word is used by any man of God. Secondly, Peter did not label the followers of Christ a "Christian" in the passage. Read it again, very carefully. He said they were to be "as a Christian." This is very important. The word as means "like or similar to," but it does not mean one is that word. For example:
  1. Genesis 49:9, "...he couched as a lion," does not mean Judah was a lion when he couched!

  2. Exodus 15:5, "...they sank into the bottom as a stone," does not mean they were a stone when they sank.

  3. Matthew 17:20, "...If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed," does not mean faith is a mustard seed.

  4. Matthew 23:37, "...gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens," does not mean God's children were chickens.

  5. Ephesians 5:25, "Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ," does not mean husbands are Christ when they love their wives.
And, therefore:

1 Peter 4:16, "Yet if any man suffer as a Christian," does not mean man is a Christian when they suffer.

When someone is "as" something else, it does not mean one is that something. It means we are similar, in some way, to that name, but we are not literally that name. You see, the heathens are the ones who called the followers of Christ "Christians" (Acts 11:26; 26:28). When Peter was referring to the title "Christian, " it is in the context of suffering, and is in reference to the name as imposed upon them by their enemies, because our enemies want us to suffer. - source

From the OP:
CHRISTIAN: Paul never once refers to himself as a 'christian', while at least five times in the New Testament he refers to himself as a follower of "the way".
The OP has been tried and found worthy.
 
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Anchorite

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Your opinion holds no import with the standard rules of English grammar.

A simile is a literary device that directly compares two things to show the similarities between the two - a simile will include the words "like" or "as". - source


From the OP:

The OP has been tried and found worthy.
Tried and found worthy…in your mind only.

“suffer as a Christian” is not a simile, it means “suffer due to being a Christian”.
 
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doctrox

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You engage in ad hominem...
Tried and found worthy…in your mind only.
...ad hominem indeed.

“suffer as a Christian” is not a simile, it means “suffer due to being a Christian”.
As per English grammar rules, absolutely incorrect and, worse, you foist your opinion contrariwise to the copious posted scriptures.

It’s not a sin to be wrong; it’s not even a sin to be grossly wrong. It is a sin, however, to refuse the reproof, the correction, when the truth of the matter has been made available.

Believers can and do disagree on many things that are not worth fighting over and Scripture is clear that we are not to engage in foolish disputing ~2 Timothy 2:23.
 
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Davy

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Ad hominem is the refuge of fools. And ignorance of the basic rules of standard English grammar is no excuse.


What's "silly to think" is that one's opinion is canon. Rather, as per the scriptural imperatives posted earlier, the Holy Bible remains our final authority in all matters of faith and practice.

When Peter was referring to the title "Christian, " it is in the context of suffering, and is in reference to the name as imposed upon them by their enemies, because our enemies want us to suffer.

Really? Do you really think other Christian brethren here can't see right through you? You are a FAKE, like how President Trump puts it.

So what are you really, a Muslim, a Jew, a Buddhist? Did you have a bad run in with a Christian, or is your hatred of Christians part of your religious belief?
 
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doctrox

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Really? Do you really think other Christian brethren here can't see right through you?
What "other Christian brethren" would that be?

Woe unto you, when all men shall speak well of you! for so did their fathers to the false prophets.

You are a FAKE, like how President Trump puts it.
"President" who?

Because you don't discern that "Christian" is a label used by those of the world to label those not of the world, you, like the majority, remain powerless/ineffective in the religious world of denominations/"-anity's & -ism's." When's the last time you led someone to Christ? Or cast a devil from a brother?

Rather, you lash out here, manifesting, for all to witness. Disgraceful.

If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain. Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.

So what are you really, a Muslim, a Jew, a Buddhist? Did you have a bad run in with a Christian, or is your hatred of Christians part of your religious belief?
Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me. But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you. My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me.

From the OP:
Be not deceived, for the word "Christianity" is not anywhere in the Bible. And there is zero historical or other evidence that Jesus is the founder of either Christianity or any other religion. Rather, as Jesus says in John 10:10, "the thief does not come except to steal, and to kill, and to destroy. I have come that they may have life, and that they may have it more abundantly."
 
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Davy

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What "other Christian brethren" would that be?

Woe unto you, when all men shall speak well of you! for so did their fathers to the false prophets.


"President" who?

Because you don't discern that "Christian" is a label used by those of the world to label those not of the world, you, like the majority, remain powerless/ineffective in the religious world of denominations/"-anity's & -ism's." When's the last time you led someone to Christ? Or cast a devil from a brother?

Rather, you lash out here, manifesting, for all to witness. Disgraceful.

If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain. Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.


Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me. But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you. My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me.

From the OP:

You still don't fool me. I've been seeing religious hypocrites all my life that pretend some secret personal connection with Christ that no one else has. And showing disdain for the simple word "Christian", which the early Church first called themselves at Antioch, is definitely a way to try and show a hypocritical view of Christianity. That is why I ask what 'other' religion are you actually a follower of.
 
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Anchorite

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Richard Aberdeen said:

Be not deceived, for the word "Christianity" is not anywhere in the Bible. And there is zero historical or other evidence that Jesus is the founder of either Christianity or any other religion.

———-——————————————

Then why did Jesus give so many precise instructions about the new birth, how to be spiritual, how to pray, where to worship, where the kingdom of God resided, who the religious hypocrites were, how to treat others?

And why did Jesus select an inner circle disciples to train and send out as missionaries?

And why did Jesus explain leadership roles?

And why did Jesus say He would build His church, when there was already a temple and synagogues existing?

Certainly sounds like a person founding a new religion, which quickly became known as Christianity.

People all over the world are being imprisoned, tortured, and executed for following the Christian faith, as churches are being burned down — but here’s a guy complaining in a holier-than-thou manner about the words “Christian” and ‘Christianity”!
 
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doctrox

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Certainly sounds like a person founding a new religion, which quickly became known as Christianity.
The idea that Jesus came to start a religion is a popular modern concept, but the Book of James actually endorses "pure religion":

If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain. Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world. (James 1:26-27).

You still don't fool me.
The truth stands on its own.

I've been seeing religious hypocrites all my life that pretend some secret personal connection with Christ that no one else has.
Me, too. Don't be like them.

And showing disdain for the simple word "Christian",
Ahhh, your slip is showing. No one but you has 'disdain-ed' anything.

which the early Church first called themselves at Antioch,
That is incorrect. "Antioch" believers NEVER called themselves "Christian."

is definitely a way to try and show a hypocritical view of Christianity. That is why I ask what 'other' religion are you actually a follower of.
No, the reason you "asked"/accused is because you don't know any other way. Ignorance and fear caused you to lash out, rather than to reason together the truth of the matter.

People all over the world are being imprisoned, tortured, and executed for following the Christian faith, as churches are being burned down — but here’s a guy complaining in a holier-than-thou manner about the words “Christian” and ‘Christianity”!
Rather, the guy is trying to wake you from your denominational slumber and direct you into the role God has ordained for you - not as a pew-warming denominational sycophant but as a child of the Most High walking in authority and affecting the world for Christ.

Paul spoke against denominations because they divide Christ.

Then why did Jesus give so many precise instructions about the new birth, how to be spiritual, how to pray, where to worship, where the kingdom of God resided, who the religious hypocrites were, how to treat others?
"Religious hypocrites" indeed.
 
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Anchorite

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The idea that Jesus came to start a religion is a popular modern concept, but the Book of James actually endorses "pure religion":

If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain. Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world. (James 1:26-27).

Rather, the guy is trying to wake you from your denominational slumber and direct you into the role God has ordained for you - not as a pew-warming denominational sycophant but as a child of the Most High walking in authority and affecting the world for Christ.

Paul spoke against denominations because they divide Christ.
James is explaining some key elements in the new religion that came to be known as Christianity.

Your anti-denomination hostility makes no impact on me. I sit on chairs, I do not sit on pews, nor do I belong to any denomination.

Your attacks on the words “Christian” and “Christianity” divide Christ, and align with Islamic persecution of Christians and churches.
 

doctrox

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James is explaining some key elements in the new religion that came to be known as Christianity.
Jesus didn't come to start a religion.

Your anti-denomination hostility makes no impact on me. I sit on chairs, I do not sit on pews, nor do I belong to any denomination.

Your attacks on the words “Christian” and “Christianity” divide Christ, and align with Islamic persecution of Christians and churches.
Your ignorance is no excuse. Men in bondage make poor witnesses.

It was unbelievers who derogatorily called the followers of Christ, "Christians."

How and when was the word "Christian" first used? The term 'Christian' was used to describe a follower of Christ in terms of the world, from the world’s point of view. The pagans at Antioch called the apostles "Christians" first (Acts 11:26; 26:28) and used it derogatorily because the apostles didn’t follow the commercial world of the pagans. "Christian" is an adjective, not a noun. The substance is not in the word "Christian", the substance is in the heart of the man it is attempting to describe, and which the pagan user cannot see.

Christ never called himself a Christian, Christ never called his followers Christians. The apostles never called each other Christians. Christ never used an adjective to describe himself. So how are we to identify ourselves then? The disciples called each other, "brethren", "disciples", "apostles", "servants", "believers", "followers", "the faithful", "the elect", "the called", and "saints." We can also identify ourselves as "bondservants" of Christ.

If you go to Zodhiates Word Studies, he tells you that when they were called Christians at Antioch, using the word ‘crematezo,’ it was a "divine warning." In other words, be forewarned, avoid this word and the use of it. And that’s what the apostles did. You will never read any of these New Testament writers using the term ‘christian’ to describe themselves.

Moving from the milk to the meat, for those of you who wish to lift your witness game, the following is how this plays out in the real world.

The servants of Christ belong to the kingdom of God. If you do not belong to a certain kingdom, you are labeled or named by that kingdom to be of another kingdom. For example, people in the continent (kingdom) of North America call those from the continent (kingdom) of South America, South Americans; from Asia, Asians; from Africa, Africans; from Europe, Europeans. But South Americans don’t call themselves South Americans, Asians don’t call themselves Asians. Africans don’t call themselves Africans, and Europeans don’t call themselves Europeans. Do North Americans call themselves North Americans? When you introduce yourself to somebody, do you say, "Hi! I’m a North American!" No, you don’t, because those from the same kingdom do not place labels on themselves or others. If you are a constituent of a Kingdom, you do not name one in the same Kingdom any thing; but you call them according to the relation between the two of you (brother, sister, mother, father, workman, labourer, minister, bishop, deacon, etc.). And who establishes the relation? The Lawgiver (Isaiah 33:22, James 4:12).

The term "Christian" was imposed upon the servants of Christ by Christ’s enemies living outside the Kingdom of God, to label those living in the Kingdom of God. Servants of Christ should not call themselves Christians, since this would imply that we are not from the Kingdom of God. Just like someone in Asia would not call themselves ‘Asians’, those living in Christ should not call themselves ‘Christians,’ because it would give the impression to others that you are from a different kingdom.

1 John 4:5, "They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world...

As scripture says, those who are of the world speak of the world, and use the words of the world. By using the words of the world, or by using the words of another kingdom, you identify yourself as being of that kingdom. And, since the word "Christian" is a term of the world, it might be best to use the words of God to describe us.
 
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Davy

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The idea that Jesus came to start a religion is a popular modern concept, but the Book of James actually endorses "pure religion":

If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain. Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world. (James 1:26-27).


The truth stands on its own.


Me, too. Don't be like them.


Ahhh, your slip is showing. No one but you has 'disdain-ed' anything.


That is incorrect. "Antioch" believers NEVER called themselves "Christian."


No, the reason you "asked"/accused is because you don't know any other way. Ignorance and fear caused you to lash out, rather than to reason together the truth of the matter.


Rather, the guy is trying to wake you from your denominational slumber and direct you into the role God has ordained for you - not as a pew-warming denominational sycophant but as a child of the Most High walking in authority and affecting the world for Christ.

Paul spoke against denominations because they divide Christ.


"Religious hypocrites" indeed.

Acts 11:26
26 And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people.
And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch.
KJV

I rest my case. God's Word as proof that the title of Christian was first used at Antioch by the disciples of Christ.
 
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doctrox

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I rest my case. God's Word as proof that the title of Christian was first used at Antioch by the disciples of Christ.
Of course followers of Jesus Christ were first called "Christians" at Antioch. That's never been the issue.

Rather, the issue is: who called them that? Who did the calling?

"...And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch." (Acts 11:26). When one "calls" another, the one doing the calling is not the receiver of the call! To further understand what "called" means, here are the 9 appearances of the word "called."

You've not only failed to prove that any believer ever called himself "Christian," but you've also refused to respond to the copiously documented facts posted here that clearly prove it was unbelievers who first "called" the followers of Christ "Christian."

As the final nail in this denominational coffin, here is further documentation:

"Christian: A follower of the religion of Christ [Note carefully that Christ never started a religion - John 7:16]. It is probable that the name Christian, like that of Nazarenes and Galileans, was given to the disciples of our Lord in reproach or contempt. What confirms this opinion is, that the people of Antioch in Syria, Acts 11:26, where they were first called Christians observed by Zosimus, Procopius, and Zonaras, to have been remarkable for their scurrilous jesting. Some have indeed thought that this name was given by the disciples to themselves; others, that it was imposed on them by divine authority; in either of which cases we should have met with it in the subsequent history of the Acts, and in the Apostolic Epistles, all of which were written some years after; whereas it is found but in two more places in the New Testament, Acts 26:28, where a Jew is the speaker, and in 1 Peter 4:16, where reference appears to be made to the name as imposed on them by their enemies. The word used, Acts 11:26, signifies simply to be called or named, and when Doddridge and a few others take to imply a divine appointment, they disregard the usus loquendi [established acceptation of the term] which gives no support to that opinion. The words Tacitus, when speaking of the Christians persecuted by Nero, are remarkable, ‘vulgus Christianos appellabat,’ ‘the vulgar call them Christians.’ Epiphanius says, that they were called Jesseans, either from Jesse, the father of David, or, which is much more probable, from the name of Jesus, whose disciples they were. They were denominated Christians, A. D. 42 or 43; and though the name was first given reproachfully, they gloried in it, as expressing their adherence to Christ, and they soon generally accepted it." Richard Watson, Watson’s Bible Dictionary (1832), p. 233.

"Cristianos, Christian: a word formally not after the Greek but after the Roman manner, denoting attachment to or adherents to Christ. Only occurs as used by others of them, not by Christians of themselves. Tacitus (A.D. 96) says (Annals 15, 44), ‘The vulgar call them Christians. The author or origin of this denomination, Christus, had, in the reign of Tiberius been executed by the procurator, Pontius Pilate.’" Ethelbert William Bullinger, A Critical Lexicon and Concordance of the English and Greek New Testament (1908), p. 152.

"This name (Christian) occurs but three times in the New Testament, and is never used by Christians of themselves, only as spoken by or coming from those without the church. The general names by which the early Christians called themselves were ‘brethren,’ ‘disciples,’ ‘believers,’ and ‘saints.’ The presumption is that the name ‘Christian’ was originated by the heathen." Thomas W. Doane, Bible Myths (1882), page 567, note 3.

"The name (Christian) given by the Greeks or Romans, probably in reproach, to the followers of Jesus. It was first used at Antioch." Easton’s Bible Dictionary.

"Egypt, which you commanded to me, my dearest Servianus, I have found to be wholly fickle and inconsistent, and continually wafted about every breath of fame. The worshippers of Serapis (here) are called Christians, and those who are devoted to the god Serapis (I find), call themselves Bishops of Christ." The Emperor Adrian to Servianus, written A.D. 134.

If you go to Zodhiates Word Studies, he tells you that when they were called Christians at Antioch, using the word ‘crematezo,’ it was a "divine warning." In other words, be forewarned, avoid this word and the use of it. And that’s what the apostles did. You will never read any of these New Testament writers using the term ‘christian’ to describe themselves.

And so, as per the OP:
Be not deceived, for the word "Christianity" is not anywhere in the Bible. And there is zero historical or other evidence that Jesus is the founder of either Christianity or any other religion.
The documented historical facts and scriptural proofs clearly validate that statement.

As the takeaway to the cracking of this programmed denominational nut, I strongly suggest that when we witness, we do so in the boldness of the name of Jesus Christ and not in the cowardice of the world's politically correct denominational label of "Christian."
 
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