Is Hell Eternal?

[Chuckt]

Not what Logabe was addressing Chuck. You're taking verses from a different part of scripture that is not dealing with the issue Logabe is dealing with.
Jesus said nothing drawing all men to Him in Matthew 25.

As a general principle, you have to interpret scripture with scripture and it is not what you say or I say. It is what God says.

 

[StanJ]

As a general principle, you have to interpret scripture with scripture and it is not what you say or I say. It is what God says.

I agree, so what is your point?

 

[logabe]

He will draw all men to Himself. They will be drawn to the left hand or the right hand:

Matthew 25:32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:
Matthew 25:33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.
Matthew 25:41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

I don't see where Jesus said that in John, but that's why we shouldn't assume Jesus
is saying something when He's not.

My point is, man's ability to comprehend the scriptures by the Spirit is very limited and
we tend to put our own twist into it which causes us to miss what God is really saying.

Jesus said, if I be lifted up on the cross, I will draw (very positive statement) ALL MEN
unto me.

Yes, I do agree most will need some correction, (left hand) but even the left hand is used
to bring people back to a position of obedience. In fact, God uses judgment to bring all
people unto Himself. He sure used judgment on me and still does today if I get out of line.

Ultimately, the sacrifice of Jesus Christ alone will perform this awesome task, but it will take
Ages of time to accomplish this feat of putting all enemies under His feet. In other words,
after the judgment has completed it's purpose, then it will be easy to see what God's Plan
was all along. Here's a scripture to show you what I am saying.

Matthew 12:20,

20 A bruised reed shall he not break , and smoking flax shall
he not quench , till he send forth judgment unto victory.

What a God! What a Plan!

Logabe

 

[Chuckt]

Did you read the second half of that verse? He won't break or quence "Till"? That implies He will break or quench.

 

[logabe]

Did you read the second half of that verse? He won't break or quence "Till"? That implies He will break or quench.

Yes... when the time appointed by God comes, all will be broken and submissive to the purpose
and plan of God. We can enjoy that right now if we choose to submit to the teachings of Jesus,
but if not, the day is coming when we will not have that choice because God will turn that judge-
ment into victory!

What a God! What a Plan!

Logabe

 

[Classic Rider]

In Jesus' day salvation was thought to be for Jews and not for Gentiles. If a Gentile wanted to leave his country and move to Israel and worship in the court of the Gentiles he could be saved but for the rest of the multitudes of Gentiles in other nations it was believed that salvation was not for them. It was in that context that Jesus said "If I am lifted up I will draw all men unto me".. He was telling the people that the time had come when all men (Gentiles as well as Jews) could be saved. All men means rich, poor, Jew, Gentile, black, brown, white, etc. etc. It doesn't have to mean every man. All men means all types of people without distinction... not every person without exception.

 

[logabe]

In Jesus' day salvation was thought to be for Jews and not for Gentiles. If a Gentile wanted to leave his country and move to Israel and worship in the court of the Gentiles he could be saved but for the rest of the multitudes of Gentiles in other nations it was believed that salvation was not for them. It was in that context that Jesus said "If I am lifted up I will draw all men unto me".. He was telling the people that the time had come when all men (Gentiles as well as Jews) could be saved. All men means rich, poor, Jew, Gentile, black, brown, white, etc. etc. It doesn't have to mean every man. All men means all types of people without distinction... not every person without exception.

That's what I'm talking about. In my view, you have a very limited interpretation of that scripture, but
that's okay. We tend to put limitations on the spoken Word of God because of the ways we have been
taught. I was constantly being taught as a child how weak God was and how strong our free will is. It
was totally left up to us whether we were going to make it to heaven or not. God's hands were tied
most of the time until things went completely out of wack, then we could somehow call on the Lord and
He could muster up enough power to fight the devil for us. I never could understand that one, but I found
myself doing it every time I got in trouble, because that was how I was taught.

I believe Jesus gave us that scripture to see if we could believe it, or would we try to water it down with
our own understanding that someone taught us in the past.

My point is, I believe Jesus means ALL, because I can look @ other scriptures that can confirm without a
doubt that God means ALL. For instance, 1st Cor. 15:22 says,

22 For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ all will be made alive.

Do you believe ALL died in Adam? That doesn't take much faith to believe that ALL died in Adam. Let's talk
about that for a minute. Did you have anything to do with your death in Adam? Not @ ALL. When we came
out of our mother's womb we were speaking lies, and it wasn't because we had did anything to deserve it.
Adam did it and we had to suffer the consequences of his disobedient choice by being born in mortality.

So here's my point. If we didn't have anything to do with the death inside of us, what makes us think we will
have something to do with the life that Jesus puts into us. We will be reconciled when we believe, but the ones
that don't accept Jesus will be reconciled when they are raised from the dead, because Jesus died for them and
He will only leave them in their stubbornness until they have paid their last pence. Ultimately, All will be reconciled
back to God. Col. 1:20 says,

20 and through Him to reconcile all things to Himself, having made peace
through the blood of His cross; through Him, I say, whether things on
earth or things in heaven.

All things in the Greek (ta panta) means all things. I don't know about you, but this is good news if you and I can
believe it. If we limit it to me and a few more folks will be saved... that's good for you and them few folks with you,
but God told Abraham in his seed, all the families of the earth shall be blessed. Does that mean a few of that all will
be blessed? I don't think so!

What a God! What a Plan!

Logabe