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Featured Is holiness actually attainable in this life? Can a man cease from all sin?

Discussion in 'Christian Spirituality Forum' started by Gideons300, Nov 18, 2020.

  1. marks

    marks Well-Known Member

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    Good example!

    And then you grow into the place where you want to make sure that you're spending God's money wisely on groceries and insurance and everything else. And not spending God's money on things that God doesn't want. Because it's all His, and every penny He's put into my hands for a reason.

    Mind you . . . I'm not there yet. But I do know that He has a direction for every moment and every aspect of my life. It's all about maintaining that moment by moment contact with Him so I don't miss the turns.

    Much love!
     
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  2. Pearl

    Pearl Well-Known Member

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    Anybody preacher the full Gospel really needs to make sure people understand that before they they can be born again.
     
  3. amadeus

    amadeus Well-Known Member

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    Working for the Social Security Administration in the United States I saw far too much of that.

    Some people in the church tried to take advantage of me because of my job. Being a soft touch they often used up my personal time to no avail since I could not change the rules for them or anyone else. My wife soon learned to act as a buffer between me and people when I was not on duty. We had to get an unlisted phone number to stop the business calls and I never answered the phone at home. My wife would screen calls for me and cut them off if it was Social Security business. Working for Social Security taught me a lot about church people whose faith was too often in Uncle Sam rather than in God when it came to the money!
     
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  4. Pearl

    Pearl Well-Known Member

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    The lady I mentioned wouldn't even do voluntary work in the church cafe in case she was reported and made to go back to work. Some straight talking was necessary and she fell out with me and anybody else who tried to teach her how to live life in the Spirit. After she left our church I found out she did the round of churches, asking for prayer and getting attention and then just walking away when they too did some straight talking. Sad, and a bad witness for the Saviour she was supposed to love.
     
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  5. amadeus

    amadeus Well-Known Member

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    I hear you loud and clear on this. Unfortunately people who do not understand are watching and put the blame on the whole group for the errors of one or a few.

    I had a friend in the church who fell from a scaffold at work and was seriously disabled. He qualified for Social Security Disability payments, but his condition improved and he started working a job for cash so that it would not be reported directly to Social Security, which would have caused his disability to be reviewed and perhaps terminated. I talked to him nicely about it warning him that he could get in serious trouble if he did not make a formal report of his work to the authorities. He reported me to the Assistant pastor who was in charge at the church for a while. The Assistant took his side telling me that I was wrong and should not report it myself. I was young in the Lord at the time, but not that young. I guess that added to the other things that caused my family to leave that assembly. Help us dear Lord!
     
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  6. ScottA

    ScottA Well-Known Member

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    There is another perspective: God's perspective.

    God's perspective is "I am", the same yesterday, today, and forever. In that perspective, we too "are", and yet here we are in the middle of split hairs, one moment thinking we are, and the next thinking we are not...sinners, that is. Well, it doesn't really work that way. That is not God's reality...and there is no other reality, actually.

    So, do not be troubled with this time of revelation, the reading of this last will and testament, where God unfolds the shades of the rainbow that makes us who we are in Him and how we get there. But rather decide who you "are" and be that person. Walk in the Light and shun the darkness.

    PS, sorry for being away so long. We moved, and times have been crazy, trying. God is good! Blessings all!
     
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  7. Ronald Nolette

    Ronald Nolette Well-Known Member

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    It is possible for one to live in practical holiness all the days of their life. One would need to completely die to self, never yield in thought word or deed for even a nanosecond and have full knowledge and maturity. Many claim to live completely hoply lives and have ceased frrom sin, but in relity, no one has as of yet.

    Yes the shield of faith can quench all the fiery darts, but there are times we let that shield drop.

    Have we only? Yes we HAVR ONLY been completely forgiven and delivered from teh power of darkness. We still have our completely corrupt human nature with all its wiles as well to contend with. God is patient.

    In heaven we will be removed from the ability to sin, but for now , when one believes their free will is restored to them and we must choose to walk in faith day by day! Only believers can choose to obey or disobey god. the unbeliever cannot please god!

    We are growing daily and being transformed daily in to the image of Christ! And as Paul wrote "He(God) who has begun a good work in you , shall perform it unto the day of Christ!"
     
  8. amadeus

    amadeus Well-Known Member

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    Good to see you here again, Scott!
     
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  9. Gideons300

    Gideons300 Well-Known Member

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    I believe.... dare I say I know? ...... that the answer to this question "How can I walk holy before my God, as a real overcomer, victorious over the world, the flesh and the devil?" will soon be common knowledge to every single saint, no matter their weaknesses, their past failures, their out of control flesh. EVERY child, no one left behind.

    Some, a few here, know me and my testimony. Most do not. But 14 years ago, God appeared to me and spoke to me. I had been a Christian for 38 years but was severely addicted to porn. I was the poster boy for Romans 7, a man who wanted to walk in obedience, but as Paul had found, the things I wanted to do, I could not do, and the things I desperately wanted to be freed from wrapped ever tighter around my heart. Perhaps some of you reading this can relate.

    What He revealed to me changed me in ways I can hardly express in words. The promises immediately began to work, even on a wretch like me. Fruits of the Spirit began to swell and grow, and I could scarcely believe the change. Prayer became rich and as soon as I would call out, He was there, saying "Here am I".Joy replaced boredome, or duty. Guilt was GONE. Victory was my daily bread.

    Do not get me wrong. Even now, years later, I still have a long way to go, but I do so without the hindrance of the never-ending battle between the flesh and the spirit.

    Remember the story of the black dog and white dog fighting in us for control? Which one wins? The one we feed the most, right? But if this is the case, why do we keep feeding the black dog? Good question, huh? LOL.

    This commonly held mindset leads us into a belief called dualism, believing we are both old natured and new natured people. There is no rest here. None. So how do we enter the rest that is clearly promised to us? How do we get the black dog out of us? Starve him out? Chain up? Memorize the Bible? Fast for weeks at a time? Is it even possible? The answer is a resounding YES, but the answer is not what seems logical to us.

    The truth is, it is the most wonderful, illogical thing and as a result, it will be fools and those living in defeat who will accept it before those with their spiritual "cruise control" on. But praise God, in the end, ALL His sheep will hear His voice and not follow another. He is about to plant our feet on the highway of holiness, and just as scriptures tell us, "no evil beast will be found on this highway, and a man, though he be a fool, shall not err therein." Glory!

    What if I told you that God has provided a way where even the weakest among us can walk in such a way that satan flees in defeat? That holiness is not for a select few but a walk promised by the New Covenant for ALL?

    We as His people, the church, have been tossed to and fro ever since the grievous wolves entered the flock after the death of Paul. The final drops of the early rain ceased and the church of the book of Acts entered into a long drought, with but an occasional shower of revival to keep the message of Jesus alive.

    But guys, guess what? There was promised not only an early rain but also a latter rain, and.... are you ready? ..... the latter shall be greater than the former, and we are to be the recipients!

    We have erroneously thought that we are in possession of that blessing. We are wrong, and our mistake will soon be long forgotten as eyes of His hungry children are opened to the truth that actually does set free indeed..... in the way Jesus defined free. Free from committing sin. Not just possible. PROMISED. Whoa.

    I will be sharing my testimony of that amazing night. Yes, it was miraculous, but the real miracle is what He opened my eyes to. The secret of living a holy life, obeying God in all things, not because we are strong enough but because we are weak enough to cry out as Paul did in Romans 7, seeking the Father to deliver us.... from US.

    Bear with me here, for I promise that there really is a place of victory over the world, the flesh and the devil, and it is for you. May God encourage every hungry heart here that there is a land of promise for every single heart that longs for more of Jesus.

    more to come.....

    blessings,

    Gids
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2020
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  10. Nancy

    Nancy Well-Known Member

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    Wow, this woman was willing to have "faith" for healing but, not in Christ for her provisions? I think she just did not want to have to work! Arggh.
     
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  11. michaelvpardo

    michaelvpardo Well-Known Member

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    When Moses approached this strange sight of a Bush in flames yet not being consumed, he heard a voice telling him to take off his sandals because he was standing upon Holy ground. I realize that some people may think that there are places on Earth where there are patches of dirt and rock that are innately Holy, but given what the Lord spoke about the temple, the altar, and the gifts upon it, I think it's safe to say that when Moses first spoke with God, the ground was Holy because of the presence of God there at that time and place. If we receive His Spirit we are Holy to Him. Holy does not mean pure or without sin, but separate and dedicated to God's purposes. In the book of Acts, Annanias and Saphira dropped dead after lying to the Holy Spirit. They were believing Christians from the new community of saints that had been sealed by His Spirit and God took their lives as an example to the church because of their attempted deception. If they hadn't been believers God wouldn't have struck them down, people lie and deceive all the time and generally don't immediately drop dead. Israel was Holy to the Lord, chosen for both blessings and curses based upon faithfulness and obedience, or lack of it. They were separated from all the people of the Earth as an example to all who would believe in the name of the Lord which since the resurrection is pretty much just the church.
    Aaron's sons, Nadab and Abihu, were struck down by the Lord's fire for offering profane incense before the altar and specifically as an example that those who approach God must hallow Him.
    3 And Moses said to Aaron, “This is what the Lord spoke, saying:
    ‘By those who come near Me
    I must be regarded as holy;
    And before all the people
    I must be glorified.’ ”
    Leviticus 10:3
    These young men weren't killed for being sinners, but for regarding the commandments given by God through His servant Moses as irrelevant to them, because of their priesthood and in effect, blaspheming the Holy Spirit.
    The Apostle Paul taught that in Christ (having received Him) we have two natures, the new man born of the Spirit of God, and the old man, the descendant of Adam and inheritors of the curse, the fallen nature of unredeemed man. There is nothing in scripture that suggests we can be perfect in this life except in the sense of being complete, whole, united and one with God by receiving Him. If we believe, our soul has been redeemed, but scripture plainly states that we await the redemption of our bodies at Christ's return and shall be transformed, effectively bodies without sin. I'm not implying that we can't keep ourselves from sinning if we make a conscious effort to do so recognizing that something we're tempted with is sin. Paul was clear in the passage you quoted that if we are lead by the Spirit (follow His direction) we will not satisfy the desires of the flesh, but this applies to each and every decision we have to make. Since life frequently puts us in situations where we behave reactively and without a lot of time for thought, our sin nature is going to manifest itself on a daily basis and I guarantee that most people don't recognize their sin in the moment unless the Holy Spirit immediately convicts us of what we're doing. My reading of scripture informs me that the Christian life is one of ongoing sanctification, not perfection. We sin, God convicts us by His Spirit, we repent, His blood cleanses us, on and on, over and over, but hopefully not the same sin.
    At the last supper Jesus prayed for us and prayed that we be sanctified by the word of God. The Holy Spirit is the One who convicts us of sin, but it's the word of God that defines sin for us. When we're born again our spirit is made alive to God in an instant of time, but we still have our old unredeemed body, our fleshly nature, and our mind is at least in part a function of that body and is not renewed instantly so we are encouraged by scripture to be transformed by the word and to renew our minds through the word. We learn to think biblically by reading the bible. We learn to discern right from wrong by reading the bible. We learn how to respond in situations without sinning by reading the bible. We gain faith in the face of opposition by reading the bible, and in all these things believing what we read to be true. If Christians are weak or even powerless in our times it is because of unbelief in the bible, picking and choosing what we will believe and what we won't. I don't mean to lay that at anyone's feet, because everything that is of this world, all our vain philosophies, all our science and understanding is aimed like an arrow at the veracity of God's word.
     
  12. Gideons300

    Gideons300 Well-Known Member

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    As I mentioned, I received a visitation from God fourteen years ago. I was saved by a true miracle on Christmas Eve, 1970. Having been a porn addict since I was an early teen, and then finally saved 21, I had high hopes that my addiction would be a thing of the past. I was wrong. For the next 3 and a half decades, I was the poster boy for Romans 7. I hated my sin. I loved my sin.


    Oh, I did not go down swinging. I tried everything I knew to finally walk as I knew deep inside a God wanted me to. I prayed, I fasted, I memorized large portions of the Word. I became a home pastor in my large Charismatic church. But in the end, my undefeated addiction just left me angry, judgmental, legalistic, disillusioned and tired of life. And dog tired of failing the God who loved me.

    One night, I reached my end. I literally had nothing else that I knew of to try, to hope for, that would perhaps lead me to the ‘free indeed’ I saw so clearly promised in His Word. In tears and desperation, I cried out to God, not knowing what else to do. I had no more answers, no more new things to try, no more resolutions to make, no more leaves to turn over. And then it happened. God appeared to me. Yes, visibly.

    LOL, I can see the eye-rolls now. And before any asks what He looked like, let me say this. I haven’t a clue. His golden light, brighter than the sun, put me on my face. I dared not look up. And then He spoke. Yes, audibly.

    He said:

    “My son, for this I am well pleased with you.”

    Confused? LOL. Yeah, me too. For 38 years, I had tried desperately to feel like God not only loved me but was pleased with me as well. But no matter what Paul told us in Romans 8 that there is no condemnation in Christ Jesus, it was almost all I ever felt. Guilt, failure and condemnation. If I gave, even out of my lack, I should have given more. If I read ten chapters in the Word, it should have been twenty. Even mowing my own lawn made me feel like I was taking care of my kingdom, not His. Can you say ‘miserable’? That was me.

    And now, at my lowest point of failure, admitting my powerlessness and hating my life, now He comes and tells me He was pleased with me? Now?? It made no sense, none, until the next words He spoke....

    “I knew all along that you could not walk the walk I had for you, but you did not yetknow it.”

    Did you catch that key word…. yet?☺️ You see, I finally knew it. I had finally, after almost four decades of trying to die to my sin-loving self, been brought to the point I had NO confidence in the flesh that was my prison. It was inescapable.

    But the Lord did not stop there. He continued, asking me a question....

    “In all your efforts to walk pleasing to me, did you ever do as I instructed you to do through my servant Paul?”

    My mind reeled, wondering what He was referring to. But then, in an instant, He simply took my blinders off and let me see what He was talking about. The key to my cell door swinging open was found in Romans 6. And as I opened my Bible, I sat dumbfounded at the secret, the key to my being able to walk as an overcomer that had been hiding from me all those years, all while it was in plain sight.

    Here in Romans 6, Paul tells us that there are two truths we must know.

    1) When Christ died, so DID we.

    2) When Christ rose from the dead, so DID we.

    I can hear them now. “That’s it?? That’s the secret?” LOL. Not yet. What did Paul tell us next? What was the instruction he asked of us concerning these two truths that were etched in the jeweled stone foundations of Heaven?

    Likewise (in the same way) reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

    Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof. Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin:

    but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.

    Romans 6:10-13

    I pray your ears are open. Do you see it?? He gave us instructions…. Something to DO. Our God tells us…. Hear this truth, embrace it as YOUR truth, do not let go of it, and I promise you, your walk will never be the same, for this is the path to FREE INDEED.

    You see, I had memorized these verses. I knew Romans 6-8 were profound chapters and had to hold the secret to victory that I had long sought. But..... never, not once..... had I actually done what those words from the Lord had been telling me to DO. I had never reckoned that those two truths were MY truths.... this very moment. I had never appropriated the victory He had bought for us as MY victory. I always hoped for those results, but hope is not faith. Faith calls those things that are not as though they are. Faith, real genuine faith, must always be NOW faith.

    So what did I do? Through my tears, my awe, my joy, my shaking knees, I spoke. Out loud. LOUDLY out loud. I reckoned that the old me was dead. Not needing to die. Not dying daily. DEAD. I reckoned that I was a brand new creature with a brand new heart, a heart that sin had no authority over. I died to sin once...ONCE.... just as God had instructed us.

    And having done so, praise God, I yielded myself to God, but this time I did it differently. Previously, I would try to give myself to God, but as the mess, the failure, the worm that I knew I was.

    But that is not what God asked for, was it? He said that we are to, now, because of what Christ had accomplished for us, yield ourselves to God in faith, faith that what He said was true was true for US, right now, this very day. We are to yield ourselves as those who are alive from the dead. Whoa. No more worm. Butterfly!

    And when I did, something deep inside began bubbling up inside me. Joy. Freedom. God caused my faith that had laid there as an small but all-sufficient seed of God’s nature in me, to begin sprouting. Why? I had finally held up my shield of faith and, praise God, what I found was that satan’s arrows truly were extinguished. I tasted freedom that night for the first time, and it was.... and is.... glorious.

    This is not sinless perfectionism of which I constantly share. It is truly the beginning of the sanctification process, not the end. I have far, far to go in my walk with the Lord. I pray the lack and weaknesses others still see in me do not hinder their belief that God can set them free as well. But I would be remiss if I did not also tell you that the changes that He has brought about in me stagger even my imagination as to what God has done by dwelling IN me by faith.

    I have much more to share concerning the last fourteen years. I pray God allows me an opportunity to share with you what He continues to show me and to teach me. Thank you all for bearing with this long testimony.

    Just know this. Your weakness, your inability to overcome sin.... they are actually a gift from God. I can hear you laughing, lol. But I am quite serious. Who is it that can believe such amazing things as I am sharing? The desperate man. The man who has no strength, and KNOWS IT. The man who has come to the point that he has NO confidence in the flesh. The one who has come to the blessed point that he HATES his life... his old nature that refuses to allow God full control.

    What God has shown me He is now showing you through the words He asks me to speak. This walk of victory over the world and its endless pull, the flesh and its lusts and unbounded self-love, and the devil and his endless temptations and accusations, it is your birthright, already purchased, already given.

    Your weakness is not the hinderance you have thought it was. It is your key to crossing over from the wilderness to the land of promise. You see, your awareness of your fallen nature and your absolute inability to ever overcome it are what make you perfectly fit to receive what God has for you. Glory!

    Can our God be THAT good? Oh, yes dear brothers and sisters! Can He truly set us free indeed, despite our weakness, our past sins, our addictions? There is no doubt about it. Our God’s goodness is stronger than our badness and it is high time we get our eyes off of our insufficiency and onto His ability to turn those with no strength into overcomers, victorious over the world, the flesh and the devil himself.

    God is about to do a work in our day that if our eyes did not see it, we would never believe it. He is going to separate the wheat from the tares, and prepare His own for our soon-coming wedding. Are you tired of going through the motions, feeling deep down you are missing something? Then buckle up, for God is about to blow your mind and fill your heart to overflowing with the joy of your FULL salvation.

    Blessings to all.

    Gideon
     
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  13. Mayflower

    Mayflower Well-Known Member

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    I usually can't get through a paragraph of these long threads people post. I really love this thread though. Im too tired to respond or process though. Ill have to come back tomorrow! Go God!
     
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  14. Pearl

    Pearl Well-Known Member

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    You are dead right Nancy. She was just going through the motions; being seen to be doing the right thing - that which was expected of her in Christian circles.
     
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  15. Nancy

    Nancy Well-Known Member

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    How many Christians walk in the dark, why bother?? I suppose there are still people who think if you attend a building on Sundays that you magically become a Christian. Makes you wonder what she is hearing and learning. Who is discipling her? Yeah, my guess is nobody :(
     
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  16. Pearl

    Pearl Well-Known Member

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    I've known people like that before Nancy, they do the rounds of churches and individuals within those church fellowships. They tell the same old story and get the same answers over and over again until they move on the the next church/person who will spend time with them and give them the attention they seem to crave. It's sad isn't it. When I was in my thirties there was a young man called Martin from our church who latched on to me, probably because I was a new face at church. He was early twenties, his father had been a vicar and his sister was a member of the same church.

    He got into the habit of visiting in the afternoons - i was a stay home mum back then - and telling me his troubles and woes. After a while it got so he would still be there when Ray came home for his tea and I felt obliged to feed Martin too. As time went by he would call at all hours even after we changed churches and eventually we had to go to the phone box and ask a friend who knew him to come and get rid of him. He just went round and round in circles and eventually became a drunk with a liver disorder and burned to death one night in front of his own fire. So sad. He knew there was 'lifeboat' - Jesus - but he just wouldn't get into the boat, just hung on to the ropes and hoped somebody would pull him in. We all tried but he wouldn't help himself.
     
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2020
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  17. Nancy

    Nancy Well-Known Member

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    Very tragic Pat,
    This is so sad...seems he was looking for anyone other than God to save him. You did your part, and then some but...we have to know when to put an end to the enabling. It is hard in the beginning as, we need to be gentle as doves yet wise as serpents. You showed him Gods love and light yet, he could not pull himself away from all the things in this world dangling before him. I do know of those who go from church to church to see what they can get as well...lot's of churchs have food and clothes pantry's. I once had a sister that did that...especially around the holidays...always bothered me when she would do that. She did eventually stop and grow closer to The Lord. She passed in 1993 so, I've no doubt God has her in His loving hands.
    Please God, open the eyes of the blind!
    Amen,
    xo
    nancy
     
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  18. 101G

    101G Well-Known Member

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    100% correct, and combined with what our brother said,
    for it is written,
    Leviticus 11:44 "For I am the LORD your God: ye shall therefore sanctify yourselves, and ye shall be holy; for I am holy: neither shall ye defile yourselves with any manner of creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth."

    so A. Pearl is correct and on point, he have given us his Spirit, it is God doing to keep us holy, "and ye shall be holy; for I am holy" YE "SHALL?" yes, when I get in you.

    and B, amadeus is correct, we have an obligation, remember we're in a covenant. we're, "Quench not the Spirit."

    and C. many other who contribute well, as in, "Eventually... Your identity in your mind changes...", and there are many more,

    it's good to see our brothers and sisters work in concert with the scriptures. thank God.

    good discussion, and good answers from all.

    PICJAG
    101G The "Spiritual Saboteur"

    PS, may I leave this with the discussion. in some men eyes, we will never be seen as Holy. but in God eyes we can be holy as he, and his EYES only... count. for our covenant states on his, God obligation, he put this into the contract, Jeremiah 31:34 "And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more."

    if one is in Christ we have rest from the work of sin, and 1 John 2:1 states, "My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:" BINGO, I have this faith, listen,

    Romans 8:38 "For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,"
    Romans 8:39 "Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord."

    For I am persuaded too.

    be blessed.


    PICJAG
    101G The "Spiritual Saboteur"
     
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  19. HisLife

    HisLife Active Member

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    You cant put your failures as Gods responsibility, You're shifting the blame... a pretty low tactic 1 John 1:8
     
  20. Gideons300

    Gideons300 Well-Known Member

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    You are kidding, right? Shifting the blame? The blame is not on God, my dear brother. Have you ever heard of God being limited in His ability to bless us because of unbelief?

    The promises of God are clear. He has promised to cause us (His exact words, btw) to walk in total obedience. If we are not experiencing that amazing deliverance from the power of darkness, if we are simply content to be forgiven and reserve our spot in Heaven, if we want to use Romans 7 as our excuse for our failings when we are not even close to possessing the broken heart and desire for full deliverance from the power of the enemy as Paul possessed, then the blame falls squarely on OUR shoulders.

    We are about to be awakened to the sureness of His promises, and the mess we have presented to the world as Christianity is about to rival, no, surpass the church in the book of Acts. The result? The world, long viewing us as hypocrites, will KNOW that Jesus is Lord, for He shall be sanctified IN us. Glory!

    blessings,

    Gideon
     
    Nancy likes this.
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