Is Reality an Illusion?

[Episkopos]

Being someone who is intrigued by these concepts, I think it's a fun excercise to comtemplate it as long as I don't constipate it. It's easy to overthink it and end up in sci fi land.

If it wasn't reaL in some sense, then in all fairness we shouldn't be judged by what we do in it. God creates, therfore he makes things from other things or from nothing, or what we may think of as nothing. He made this and sits outside of it looking in and introduces things as He sees fit into it. It's plenty real to every creature who inhabits it. We might call it our "reality" because in every sense we are aware it is real.

You sound like an atheist here. The atheist sees that he already has life...why does he need to go to Jesus for life? Jesus is the Way the Truth and the Life. So many modern believers are really just unbelievers since they see the material world as the only platform that is available to us. For these...seeking the kingdom first...has to mean we are looking to die as quickly as possible...in order to partake of the afterlife as per our religious assumptions.

Of course this world is real to us. And that is all there is until one is born into the kingdom realm of the Spirit. We are not to love this world or the things of this world. So then where is our love to take place?

One of my questions would be, does he segway this into the rest or are we compartmentalized? It's hard to tell. I'm nothing like God other than a representation in a crude way of His 'image'. His thoughts are so far above mine it's embarrassing and not worth a mention.

The givens are that He knows the beginning from the end, much like a watch maker who tediously makes a precision watch he knows everything about it and he has predicted every outcome. God is sovereign. If someone is playing with His stuff he is aware of it. There is possibility that the other side has enough info to play with it, but only as He allows. Anything they would do will be like trying to scratch a diamond, yet I think they can influence it. Jesus has dominion over heaven and earth, as in all the forms of heaven and anything inbetween.

The gospel is an invitation into His eternal realm. And this is meant for now while we are still in these mortal bodies. Waiting for a physical death for intimacy with God....to know Him...is the error of the agnostic and the atheist.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Not really.
It's the wind blowing every wind of doctrine around.
The others have all been used and abused.

It will be the buttering first.

every once in a while we get a gospel that is so far out there, you wonder where it comes from.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Some still don’t understand what Spirit gives birth to spirit means...I’m afraid....they don’t understand that Gods Spirit is a Living Spirit.

Some think Mary had to read her Bible..for God to sow his seed into her womb...I mean “ seriously “...

Being birthed by Gods Spirit is an Honour and a Privilege...

Notice.

He said being born again into an eternal KIND of life.

He does not believe you recieve eternal life period when you are saved.

you can see just by adding one words. it changes the meaning..

 

[Ritajanice]

Notice.

He said being born again into an eternal KIND of life.

He does not believe you recieve eternal life period when you are saved.

you can see just by adding one words. it changes the meaning..

We are Born into God’s Kingdom..

​

◄ John 3:3 ►

​

Audio Crossref Comment Greek Verse (Click for Chapter) New International Version Jesus replied, “Very truly I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless they are born again.

.I thought he meant that?...I never read kind....best I pay more attention to what is being written then.

Plus we are saved from eternal damnation are we not, as Born Again?

We have been Born Again of imperishable seed....which means exactly what God’s word says,LOL.

Anyway...I’m outta here....

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

Playing with definitions of reality. Is heaven more real than earth? God made them both, and will remake both. We are alive on earth, and we are alive in heaven. Is one less true than the other? Each in their own order.

Much love!

Right. When Jesus said, I am the truth, that is defined as reality. Then in Col. 1:16-17, reality is not only created by Him, it is in Him.
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
"Consist" means held together. So we can surmise that every atom in the inverse is held together by His power. This of course requires omniscience, omnipresence and omnipotence.
Therefore, this physical reality is just as real as the spiritual realm, only it is temporal. We are put here in this training environment if you will for the purpose to prepare us. We are to learn good and evil and reconcile with God. All things that are good are from God. We experience all good things, and they are truth/ reality on earth and in heaven. But we also experience evil which is true/ real as well ( not a part of His being, but He holds it together - is In control of it).
An illusion is something that is imagined and not real, it is not true.
The word illusion is not found in the KJV.
In the NASB it appears twice:

1. Isaiah 30:10
   Who say to the seers, “You must not see visions”; And to the prophets, “You must not prophesy the truth to us. Speak to us pleasant words, Prophesy illusions.
   In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
2. Zechariah 10:2
   For the household idols speak deception, And the diviners see an illusion And tell deceitful dreams; They comfort in vain. Therefore the people wander like sheep, They are wretched because there is no.

So we can see that an illusion is something that is not real. Simulations are also not the real thing, they are imitations, the action of pretending, models of something that is real. Creation isn't a simulation. The Garden was physically perfect then sin distorted and corrupted every cell in it. It doesn't mean it isn't real, it just means it's really corrupt.

 

[Episkopos]

Right. When Jesus said, I am the truth, that is defined as reality. Then in Col. 1:16-17, reality is not only created by Him, it is in Him.
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
"Consist" means held together. So we can surmise that every atom in the inverse is held together by His power. This of course requires omniscience, omnipresence and omnipotence.
Therefore, this physical reality is just as real as the spiritual realm, only it is temporal. We are put here in this training environment if you will for the purpose to prepare us. We are to learn good and evil and reconcile with God. All things that are good are from God. We experience all good things, and they are truth/ reality on earth and in heaven. But we also experience evil which is true/ real as well ( not a part of His being, but He holds it together - is In control of it).
An illusion is something that is imagined and not real, it is not true.
The word illusion is not found in the KJV.
In the NASB it appears twice:

1. Isaiah 30:10
   Who say to the seers, “You must not see visions”; And to the prophets, “You must not prophesy the truth to us. Speak to us pleasant words, Prophesy illusions.
   In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
2. Zechariah 10:2
   For the household idols speak deception, And the diviners see an illusion And tell deceitful dreams; They comfort in vain. Therefore the people wander like sheep, They are wretched because there is no.

So we can see that an illusion is something that is not real. Simulations are also not the real thing, they are imitations, the action of pretending, models of something that is real. Creation isn't a simulation. The Garden was physically perfect then sin distorted and corrupted every cell in it. It doesn't mean it isn't real, it just means it's really corrupt.

The video I commented on describes the temporal reality as an illusion. It also affirms this world as a simulation. I think it depends on the importance we place on it as our ultimate reality.

Is our sense of peace real peace? Or is it an illusion? Is our sense of salvation a temporal idea? Or are we partaking of the power of the life to come.

How can Jesus categorize us as being dead in sins if we are still alive enough to do them?

Do you understand what a simulation is? Do you understanding the power of an illusion? Just look at the state of the church today.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

We are Born into God’s Kingdom..

​

◄ John 3:3 ►

​

Audio Crossref Comment Greek Verse (Click for Chapter) New International Version Jesus replied, “Very truly I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless they are born again.

.I thought he meant that?...I never read kind....best I pay more attention to what is being written then.

Plus we are saved from eternal damnation are we not, as Born Again?

We have been Born Again of imperishable seed....which means exactly what God’s word says,LOL.

Anyway...I’m outta here....

Yes, and those born again have eternal life and will never perish.

Got to watch the fine print..

 

[Episkopos]

Yes, and those born again have eternal life and will never perish.

Got to watch the fine print..

Indoctrination aside...how do you know you have eternal life? What does it look like? What does being seated in heavenly places look like? Are these just religious illusions...afterlife predictions... religious assumptions to name and claim for oneself? How does God keep the religious hypocrites out? (Now I know you can't see your own hypocritical stance...based on gnostic religious beliefs)

Why is a God of truth and righteousness seem to be satisfied by mere lip-service and place such a high value on religious opinions that are self-serving?

Old Testament Pharisee: Confident of justification for religious beliefs and works

New Testament Pharisee: Confident of justification for religious beliefs plus nothing (lawlessness)

 

[Ritajanice]

Yes, and those born again have eternal life and will never perish.

Got to watch the fine print..

Amen!!....

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Indoctrination aside...how do you know you have eternal life?

New Testament Pharisee: Confident of justification for religious beliefs plus nothing (lawlessness)

How do I know?

Because God promised it. And he keeps his promises.

faith is the substance of things hoped for the evidence of things not seen. My hope is eternal life. Which God who can not lie promised before time began..

You should try to trust God sometime. He is real and you will see a major change in your thinking and your life.

 

[Lambano]

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

The video I commented on describes the temporal reality as an illusion. It also affirms this world as a simulation. I think it depends on the importance we place on it as our ultimate reality.

Is our sense of peace real peace? Or is it an illusion? Is our sense of salvation a temporal idea? Or are we partaking of the power of the life to come.

How can Jesus categorize us as being dead in sins if we are still alive enough to do them?

Do you understand what a simulation is? Do you understanding the power of an illusion? Just look at the state of the church today.

The guy in the video started talking about evolution, how we evolved. That was a red flag for me. He doesn't know what he is talking about, neither did Einstein or Hawking figure it out.
Jesus gave me peace. It is real, true.
Dead to the penalty and slavery of sin we are, means He has transformed us into a New Creature, spiritually. Now, still in the flesh _ but not following after its lusts _ We can still sin, slip up on occasion, fall and get up, confess our sin, correct oir errors and move forward _ so it is not sin unto death. We are not under the Law of sin, we are under Grace. The Law was a pedagogue for us and we don't need that pedagogue, we have the Holy Spirit, who teaches us and guides into all truth.

I understand what a simulation is, it is simular to the original, an imitation, a model for testing.

Illusion is something not real, not truth, it has no power, only a deception.
I look at the state of the Church ( Body of Christ) and it is perfect! Christ is perfect. We have spiritually been perfected and are in Christ. Now if you are talking about sin in the Churches on Earth, filled with sinners, is it any different than in then the 1st Century? Look at the seven Churches of Revelation. Only Philadelphia and Smyrna did not receive a rebuke. The rest had problems, needed to repent. One was nearly dead and another the Lord wanted to vomit out of His mouth.
As I have said before, God is Sovereign and so all of history leading up to today and into eternity is under His control. He factors in all our blunders and so the Body of Christ is exactly where He Intended it to be - His plan is moving along on schedule. We are in fact doing His work, though the workers are few ... that is a statement of fact so evidently He only needs a few.

That is the kind of God I believe in.

 

[Episkopos]

The guy in the video started talking about evolution, how we evolved. That was a red flag for me. He doesn't know what he is talking about, neither did Einstein or Hawking figure it out.
Jesus gave me peace. It is real, true.
Dead to the penalty and slavery of sin we are, means He has transformed us into a New Creature, spiritually. Now, still in the flesh _ but not following after its lusts _ We can still sin, slip up on occasion, fall and get up, confess our sin, correct oir errors and move forward _ so it is not sin unto death. We are not under the Law of sin, we are under Grace. The Law was a pedagogue for us and we don't need that pedagogue, we have the Holy Spirit, who teaches us and guides into all truth.

I understand what a simulation is, it is simular to the original, an imitation, a model for testing.

Illusion is something not real, not truth, it has no power, only a deception.

Sure.

I look at the state of the Church ( Body of Christ) and it is perfect! Christ is perfect. We have spiritually been perfected and are in Christ.

Those who are walking the narrow path are being perfected in character. Only those who have personally entered into Christ have put on His perfection in holiness. These are the saints who walk without sin.

Now if you are talking about sin in the Churches on Earth, filled with sinners, is it any different than in then the 1st Century? Look at the seven Churches of Revelation. Only Philadelphia and Smyrna did not receive a rebuke. The rest had problems, needed to repent. One was nearly dead and another the Lord wanted to vomit out of His mouth.
As I have said before, God is Sovereign and so all of history leading up to today and into eternity is under His control. He factors in all our blunders and so the Body of Christ is exactly where He Intended it to be - His plan is moving along on schedule. We are in fact doing His work, though the workers are few ... that is a statement of fact so evidently He only needs a few.

That is the kind of God I believe in.

Amen. Many must be sifted through to get to the few. Many are called but few are chosen.

 

[ScottA]

Being someone who is intrigued by these concepts, I think it's a fun excercise to comtemplate it as long as I don't constipate it. It's easy to overthink it and end up in sci fi land.

If it wasn't reaL in some sense, then in all fairness we shouldn't be judged by what we do in it. God creates, therfore he makes things from other things or from nothing, or what we may think of as nothing. He made this and sits outside of it looking in and introduces things as He sees fit into it. It's plenty real to every creature who inhabits it. We might call it our "reality" because in every sense we are aware it is real.

One of my questions would be, does he segway this into the rest or are we compartmentalized? It's hard to tell. I'm nothing like God other than a representation in a crude way of His 'image'. His thoughts are so far above mine it's embarrassing and not worth a mention.

The givens are that He knows the beginning from the end, much like a watch maker who tediously makes a precision watch he knows everything about it and he has predicted every outcome. God is sovereign. If someone is playing with His stuff he is aware of it. There is possibility that the other side has enough info to play with it, but only as He allows. Anything they would do will be like trying to scratch a diamond, yet I think they can influence it. Jesus has dominion over heaven and earth, as in all the forms of heaven and anything inbetween.

When we ask the big questions of life, like what is life all about, etc., and realize that this is not all there is...then it helps to understand that this would be reality is not the best measure of what is actually real or important.

For example, if we can imagine downward from our own world to consider the make believe world of Disney or Looney Tunes, surely it is not a stretch to also consider upwards from our own world view to that of God's kingdom view. In which case, by example, in a world of animated characters whose surroundings are only more of the same animations of light projections where they too feel pain or even bleed seemingly real blood, and can turn to the right or to the left and travel that world over much as we can--except it isn't actually real--but "created." Now if that is not enough of a hint to just how we should imagine our own "created" existence...then, yes, the option is certainly there to look no further, pinch ourselves and say "Yep, this is real!" and limit our gaze to what we know best, rather than what we can perhaps imagine without some help--you know...like Pinocchio...who became a "real" boy.

But how sad then for those who will not allow themselves.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

Those who are walking the narrow path are being perfected in character. Only those who have personally entered into Christ have put on His perfection in holiness. These are the saints who walk without sin.

But Jesus is the narrow gate. Many do believe in Him. 2.65 billion claim to be believers in Christ, that's 1/3 of the planet, making it much narrower than the other 5.45 billion are entering into: Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, , irreligious, mystics, occultists.
Btw, Our spirits are purified, not our flesh.

 

[Episkopos]

But Jesus is the narrow gate. Many do believe in Him. 2.65 billion claim to be believers in Christ, that's 1/3 of the planet, making it much narrower than the other 5.45 billion are entering into: Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, , irreligious, mystics, occultists.

You are missing the depth of what it means to walk the narrow way.

Btw, Our spirits are purified, not our flesh.

That is a Gnostic idea. Jesus had the same flesh as we do.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

That is a Gnostic idea. Jesus had the same flesh as we do.

He was certaining human, but spiritually without sin. We are born into sin, passed down from Adam ( Rom. 5:12). It is passed down from the father, a human descendant of Adam. Jesus was not born into sin, with the nature of sin, with the penalty of sin passed down from Adam.
Why? Mary was impregnated by God. Jesus is God, who came down from Heaven, a pure spirit, into her womb, and was born and dwelt among us. He did not commit sin while He lived either. He could not break His own Law that He gave the Israelites.

You are missing the depth of what it means to walk the narrow way.

God draws us to Himself, calls us inwardly and outwardly through His Word, through an elaborate plan, set of events and people sent into our lives, we are led down this path until our blindness is removed, God reveals Himself to us, our sin is revealed and we experience godly sorrow at which time we humble ourselves, ask for forgiveness, die to oursleves, become born again, follow Jesus, focus on Him, led by the Spirit until we die and our spirit separates from our body and goes to be with Jesus. The path towards begins when God draws you and continues until you see Him face to face.
Am I missing something?

 

[Episkopos]

He was certaining human, but spiritually without sin. We are born into sin, passed down from Adam ( Rom. 5:12). It is passed down from the father, a human descendant of Adam. Jesus was not born into sin, with the nature of sin, with the penalty of sin passed down from Adam.
Why? Mary was impregnated by God. Jesus is God, who came down from Heaven, a pure spirit, into her womb, and was born and dwelt among us. He did not commit sin while He lived either. He could not break His own Law that He gave the Israelites.

God draws us to Himself, calls us inwardly and outwardly through His Word, through an elaborate plan, set of events and people sent into our lives, we are led down this path until our blindness is removed, God reveals Himself to us, our sin is revealed and we experience godly sorrow at which time we humble ourselves, ask for forgiveness, die to oursleves, become born again, follow Jesus, focus on Him, led by the Spirit until we die and our spirit separates from our body and goes to be with Jesus. The path towards begins when God draws you and continues until you see Him face to face.
Am I missing something?

That all depends what you believe you are being called into.

 

[amigo de christo]

lol.

You keep proving me right my friend

I guess you will always have Laurina and faithfulness to follow you.

I am just here to try to help others discern the false gospel you are proposing.

You have what they call partial truths.. Thats what religion is

it first points to self. and it adds just enough truth to make it sound good.



Sadly it looks like @Ritajanice is starting to buy into it. All I can do is pray for her.

expose it to the last breath . the reason more and more are also buying into this
is how they try and present it with a partial truth . They can describe the effects of being born again .
They can say truths like ONLY GOD can make you born again .
BUT its not based on HAVING TO BELIEVE ON JESUS AS CHRIST . rather its a new age concept of born again .
This might by why Rita seems to be connecting to epi and his talk . Cause of how they can describe the effects of being born again .
THIS is actuallly found in INCLUSIVISMS teachings .
IT , for example , teaches that mulsims , buddists , athiests etc are under the WORKING of THE SPIRIT
are in effect born again if they have these good works and so called love .
ITS A LIE OF COURSE . cause NO man or woman who has been born again , WHO IS OF THE SPIRIT
would call JESUS accursed , aka seperate , aka no need to have to BELIEVE ON HIM . Anti christ spirit
is wise indeed . IT knows how to decieve . THIS is why epi always has certain truths about being born again
and yet IS NOT and does not teach the gospel as DID CHRIST . THIS is truly nothing more than a works gospel under guise
of love path to GOD and THE DIRE NEED TO BELIEVE ON JESUS CHRIST is TROD UNDER FOOT . ITS SLICK my friend .
JUST STAY PLANTED ON THE ORIGINAL YE MUST BELIEVE IN JESUS CHRIST GOSPEL . cause their LIE wont save a one of them .
BUT JESUS CAN . YE MUST BELIEVE . SHOUT THAT TO THE END OF DAYS MY FRIEND .

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

That all depends what you believe you are being called into.

I thought I made that clear: reconciliation with God through Christ.