Can science challenge the church? Check out the new podcast.
Is Reality an Illusion?
- Thread starter Episkopos
- Start date
-
Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.
You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
How can a dreamer prove to another dreamer, that his dream is reality?Is this thread an illusion? Can people actually see it?
If ones starting place is that there is no reality then one is in an endless cycle of imaginary worlds/dreams.
As decarte could only conclude, I think, therefore I am.
Reality is grounded in God.
I think you have misunderstood the idea of there being a simulation of reality in the temporal world. The only reality that goes on is the eternal reality.
Which reality? Which god?
Eternally Grateful
Well-Known Member
Playing with definitions of reality. Is heaven more real than earth? God made them both, and will remake both. We are alive on earth, and we are alive in heaven. Is one less true than the other? Each in their own order.
Much love!
Eternally Grateful
Well-Known Member
Perhaps thinking of this world experience as a simulation or some such makes it easier to believe God's complete and total mastery of it?
Much love!
ScottA
Well-Known Member
- Feb 24, 2011
- 11,744
- 5,599
- 113
- Faith
- Christian
- Country
- United States
Kudos to you for your endeavors on this topic!
It is written that before the end of this would be world and reality, "in the days of the sounding of the seventh angel, when he is about to sound, the mystery of God would be finished, as He declared to His servants the prophets." Revelation 10:7
These are those days.
And by and in this same spirit I have and can tell you the answers to all the questions raised by Hoffman. To our shame science has indeed come to remind us of what is true, and yet does so, as you have said in a manner of speaking, but not from a godly or spiritual perspective. Instead, science has and does attempt to explain all things from and by the basis and terms of this would be reality. That is all secular science has to work with.
However, from God and in His terms, this world of the same elements is a mere "image", as is mankind. Thus, illusion, avatar, or simulation is somewhat true in concept. Which, of course, falls short of what is true in total according to God. Simply put, the world is as a book written "before the world was" created, now read and made available as revelation to those involved by a media of God in what should be understood to be well beyond 3D. All of which is stated if not only eluded to in the scriptures. The beginning of which is mankind being created out of nothing--scientifically of the elements of light and energy...the source of all matter--as an "image." Then clarified by Paul in the wrap up of scriptural revelations as finishing "but each one in his own order", or time. "Then comes the end" of this would be world.
As such, your flight simulator comparison is good, but slightly off, in that the training is not unto success, but unto failure, as it is written, all die in the experience.
Your words of encouragement are also good, however. Because, since Christ has ascended from this world Himself, He has arranged for an exception to what had previously been the hard and fast rules--that is, that one need not first die before ascending, but can be born again to be alive in the spirit while remaining in the world and in the form of flesh or matter. Paul referred to this as "we who are alive and remain." Scripture then tells us that this is the first resurrection, with which comes blessing, but also the experience of internal war between the flesh and the spirit, or as Paul also elaborated, as "another law in my members." In other words, this resurrected life new since Christ has sent and made possible and available the Holy Spirit--includes "another law" that did not before exist in the history of the world. Which is a kind of half step toward full spiritual ascension, or of standing with "one foot on the land, and the other on the sea."
However, as the writings of a book already written, all that is really important for us to be concerned with, is that we make good decisions--to be ourselves--as that is the point. Again, this is a mere revelation by "image" of what was. However, there is also a clause and a possible exception, not unlike that made by God at Nineveh. Which is to say, yes, these things were "before the world was"--but, in God in whom all things are possible--there is no actual chronology of events, meaning that there remains a prerogative in God that these things be in His real time, or the lack thereof. Therefore, if we are who we are and do what we would do, the result is sure to be "I am" what I am, just as it is with God; and yet God has made it possible to appeal to His own nature...and change--even midstride. Therefore it is written, "repent" (change). For what is not possible with mankind, is possible with God, and so when we pray, we should pray without regard to times, but with regard to Him on whom no such limit is imposed...and He will hear.
Last edited:
Starise
Member
A simulation would be the pretend precursor to the real thing. Why would God simulate?
The thing we are all in composed of time and matter surely looks different on the back end. Who is privy to that? God for sure and maybe some others Elohim. Notice I said maybe.
The thing we are all in composed of time and matter surely looks different on the back end. Who is privy to that? God for sure and maybe some others Elohim. Notice I said maybe.
It's only a simulation in comparison to eternal reality. This is a training ground where sins are forgivable as we learn to walk uprightly and move into God by faith.
Being born again is being born into eternal reality...the kingdom of God. Before that we have no idea that we live in a simulation in the flesh.
PossibleThrowawayAccount
Active Member
Absolutely not. If reality as we know it was just an illusion then Christianity would be like Hinduism. For reference, Hinduism teaches that reality is an illusion ("maya") and that we are all one divided supersoul who act out parts in Vishnu's dream.
If this were a simulation or a dream then there would be no point in Jesus dying for us and God wouldn't actually care rather or not we do sinful things.
If this were a simulation or a dream then there would be no point in Jesus dying for us and God wouldn't actually care rather or not we do sinful things.
Eternally Grateful
Well-Known Member
This is a false gospel. This is what I would call an illusion. that through you being obedient, you can have other sins forgiven.
That is called justification by works.
Well, modern Christianity can look like paganism...with a powerless religion of an afterlife....that has no power other than to promise life (not now of course) for having certain beliefs...like the Nordic Valhalla. The ancients had no power over sin. But the gospel gives us power that no one could conceive of before Christ became the light of the world. Entering into Christ gives us His life...and access to the living God. You can look for comparisons....without honesty...all day long. People have an inner pull towards God, knowing that there must be more to life than this temporal world. That should not surprise anyone..and certainly not let the devil take away what is obvious to the serious seeker. What the church lacks is an actual testimony of the life of Christ displayed for all to see...hence people seek God elsewhere. Instead of trying to look down on others for seeking God the wrong way...try instead to seek God the right way yourself.
The opposite is true. God wants His human creation to join Him in eternity. He sent His Son into the simulation in order to lift us out from it into His presence and His life...eternal life. The power of the flesh is within the confines of this simulation...this temporal reality. We are set free from it by entering Christ and the eternal truth....the truth (the eternal reality that Jesus brings) sets us free from this world of limitation.
If you think the life you live according to the flesh is an eternal one...just wait a few more years.
We can enter into eternal life by first receiving a sample of grace (being born out of time...out of the simulation...into an eternal life). With that sample of grace we then can go to God to get the full measure of grace in order to walk in His resurrection life....a life beyond sin....beyond the limitations inherent by the power of the flesh.
Those who are given an eternal consciousness, know what the race of faith entails...at least they will learn if they continue in faith. God will show them the way,
Last edited:
Disobedience is a false gospel. That is called self-justification.
Eternally Grateful
Well-Known Member
Justification by works is a false gospel. The wage of sin is death, The gift of God is eternal life.
You can;t earn a gift my friend. And you will never be sinless in this lifetime.. no matter how hard you try..
Your disobedience speaks of the source of your convictions....yourself. A witness of Christ knows the power that gives obedience. Someone who relies on religious formulas does not know that power...hence your twisting things and making up down and down up.
Having to disconnect one's brain in order to accept religious formulas makes it difficult if not impossible to love God with all one's mind (as well as ones heart). God's ways stand up to intelligent inquiry. Human religions do not.
Eternally Grateful
Well-Known Member
Your self righteousness and your refusal to came to the cross is your own religion.
I know the power of obedience. and I know where it comes from.
But if you have not been justified freely by the cross. You can be obedient all you want. Your still dead in your sin.
Similar threads
- Locked
