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Featured Is there salvation outside the Catholic Church?

Discussion in 'Christian Debate Forum' started by aspen, Aug 5, 2019.

  1. GodsGrace

    GodsGrace Well-Known Member

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    • [​IMG]
     
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  2. brakelite

    brakelite Well-Known Member

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    False equivalence. What you did not do was say to your wife "your cooking was bad tonight", this, thus calling her a bad cook. You told her her meal was not to your liking...I have never seen you say to anyone, your teaching is not to my liking... You have every time said, you are lying... This you are a liar.
    Give us one example of someone who has lied, but is not a liar.
     
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  3. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    And since that was your “last” post on the subject – I will remind you one last time that you are presenting multiple arguments and desperately trying to make it all about withholding the Eucharist.

    You can post all of the articles and videos about marriage and divorce that you want – but it has NOTHING to do with the discipline of withholding the Eucharist. That is a separate issue. Suffice it to say that you failed in your attempt to blur this crystal-clear issue because of your complete inability to understand it.

    Next time - stick to easier subjects like statues and images . . .
     
  4. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    Gee, and I thought you said you were "done" responding to me . . .
     
  5. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    And not ONE Protestant sect obeys these passages.
    Only the Catholic Church does.
     
  6. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    Wrong.

    We are saved BY the grace of God – by the blood of Christ.

    But, we are saved THROUGH His Church, which is His BODY (Col. 1:18, 1 Cor. 12).

    Without His Church YOU wouldn’t know who Christ is or what He taught (Matt. 28:19-20). . .
     
  7. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    I can give you PLENTY of examples of pointing out things to somebody without CALLING them something.

    I told my friend to lose weight because he is obese and is in poor health.
    I didn‘t CALL him a “Fatso”.

    I told my co-worker that she should stop selling her body to men for money.
    I never CALLED her a “whore”.

    I told my brother that he drank too much at a wedding.
    I didn’t CALL him a “drunk”.

    I pointed out to some of you that you LIED about what the Catholic Church teaches.
    I never CALLED any of you “Liars”.

    Face it – the problem here is NOT with ME – it’s with those of you whose LIES I have exposed.
    You guys want to lie with impunity – and the one who points it out is the “bad guy”.

    What a gigantic hypocrisy . . .
     
  8. Giuliano

    Giuliano Well-Known Member

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    And now for something completely different.

     
  9. aspen

    aspen “"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few

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    So there is no salvation outside the Catholic Church. Yet, this is not the teaching of the Catholic Church
     
  10. Giuliano

    Giuliano Well-Known Member

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    Let me look up the official teaching found in the Catechism. I like to go to the Vatican's website when I want to know what they teach.

    CCC - PART 1 SECTION 2 CHAPTER 3 ARTICLE 9 PARAGRAPH 3

    817 In fact, "in this one and only Church of God from its very beginnings there arose certain rifts, which the Apostle strongly censures as damnable. But in subsequent centuries much more serious dissensions appeared and large communities became separated from full communion with the Catholic Church - for which, often enough, men of both sides were to blame." The ruptures that wound the unity of Christ's Body - here we must distinguish heresy, apostasy, and schism - do not occur without human sin:
    Where there are sins, there are also divisions, schisms, heresies, and disputes. Where there is virtue, however, there also are harmony and unity, from which arise the one heart and one soul of all believers.
    818 "However, one cannot charge with the sin of the separation those who at present are born into these communities [that resulted from such separation] and in them are brought up in the faith of Christ, and the Catholic Church accepts them with respect and affection as brothers . . . . All who have been justified by faith in Baptism are incorporated into Christ; they therefore have a right to be called Christians, and with good reason are accepted as brothers in the Lord by the children of the Catholic Church."

    819 "Furthermore, many elements of sanctification and of truth" are found outside the visible confines of the Catholic Church: "the written Word of God; the life of grace; faith, hope, and charity, with the other interior gifts of the Holy Spirit, as well as visible elements." Christ's Spirit uses these Churches and ecclesial communities as means of salvation, whose power derives from the fullness of grace and truth that Christ has entrusted to the Catholic Church. All these blessings come from Christ and lead to him, and are in themselves calls to "Catholic unity."
     
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  11. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    It absolutely IS.
    Extra Ecclesiam Nulla Salus (Outside the Church there is No Salvation) is official Catholic teaching:

    From the Catechism:
    "Outside the Church there is no salvation"
    846 How are we to understand this affirmation, often repeated by the Church Fathers?335 Re-formulated positively, it means that all salvation comes from Christ the Head through the Church which is his Body:

    Basing itself on Scripture and Tradition, the Council teaches that the Church, a pilgrim now on earth, is necessary for salvation: the one Christ is the mediator and the way of salvation; he is present to us in his body which is the Church. He himself explicitly asserted the necessity of faith and Baptism, and thereby affirmed at the same time the necessity of the Church which men enter through Baptism as through a door. Hence they could not be saved who, knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ, would refuse either to enter it or to remain in it.336

    847 This affirmation is not aimed at those who, through no fault of their own, do not know Christ and his Church:

    Those who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience - those too may achieve eternal salvation.337
     
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  12. aspen

    aspen “"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few

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  13. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    Philip James and aspen like this.
  14. aspen

    aspen “"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few

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    I agree with you, but

    Protestants follow the same Christ. The CC accepts their baptism and their marriages simply need a blessing
     
  15. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    I'm not condemning Protestants. Many of them fall into the "invincible ignorance" category.
    I am merely parroting what the Church teaches and has taught for many centuries - namely that ALL who get saved are saved through Christ's Church.
     
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  16. prism

    prism Blood-Soaked

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    It's ONE Church (not Catholic or Protestant) consisting of truly regenerate believers (those who have had a change of nature through the New Birth).
     
  17. epostle

    epostle Active Member

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    Catholicism does not exclude Protestants from being part of the Church, their separation is a matter of varying degrees. It's certain Protestants who refuse to understand what Extra Ecclesiam Nulla Salus really means. The meaning was first taught by the Apostles; the phrase summarizes consistent teaching.
     
  18. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    I couldn't have said it better than @epostle . . .
     
  19. prism

    prism Blood-Soaked

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    LOL, Rather outside of Christ there is no salvation. It was mostly those who clung to their Traditions that booted Jesus Christ out of their synagogues...the community Church of that day.
     
  20. BreadOfLife

    BreadOfLife Well-Known Member

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    Spoken like a person who appears to be ignorant of how Scripture describes the Church.

    - The Church is the Pillar and Foundation of Truth (1 Tim. 3:15).
    - The Church is the FULLNESS of Christ (Eph. 1:22-23).
    - Christ compares His very SELF with His Church (Acts 9:4-5).

    It’s not the Church OR Christ.
    The Church is Christ’s very BODY and He is the Head (Col. 1:18, 1 Cor. 12).
     
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