Isaiah 65:20 - Hundred Year Old Fetuses Dying in New Jerusalem?

[Dcopymope]

Perhaps this person has it figured out?

: Umm, no I don't think he does.

 

[Timtofly]

The restoration of Jerusalem does not take place until after the near total destruction of this current topography. This happens because Satan is allowed 3.5 years to wreak havoc. The restoration is for the 1000 years of the Lord’s Day. This chapter is not for the end of the universe, but for the end of sin. Death will be near non-existent, unless one is cursed because of disobedience.

After this 1000 years, death will be the last enemy to be brought into submission. Then this spacetime will be no more and God will start the next one.

 

[Base12]

Thanks for featuring the thread!

 

[Base12]

BTW...

My general Rule of Thumb is that there are no mistakes or contradictions in my Bible. Therefore I believe I've found a way to resolve this seemingly contradictory verse.

My hope is that another Witness will come to a similar conclusion before I post my interpretation.

;)

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Isaiah 65:20
"There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed"

So it is not talking about the “old man”? No connection between: the old man and but the sinner shall be accursed? “Appointed to die”. How completely God forgets the former man. “I will remember their sins no more.” The former things forgotten. “behold I do a New thing.” Even, “depart from Me you worker of inquiry. I never knew you.” Paul spoke of all having their conversation in the world in the former things of the flesh, and the lust of the flesh. (Ephesians 4:22). To me, the verse speaks of one must be born of the Spirit and not something way out. Paul also said (inspired by the Holy Spirit) that “he not labour in vain”. (Philippians 2:16) yet there is also laboring in vain. (Jeremiah 51:57-58) .

Isaiah 65:17-23 tells of “they will it labour in vain) “For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind. [18] But be ye glad and rejoice for ever in that which I create: for, behold, I create Jerusalem a rejoicing, and her people a joy. [19] And I will rejoice in Jerusalem, and joy in my people: and the voice of weeping shall be no more heard in her, nor the voice of crying. [20] There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed. [21] And they shall build houses, and inhabit them ; and they shall plant vineyards, and eat the fruit of them. [22] They shall not build, and another inhabit; they shall not plant, and another eat: for as the days of a tree are the days of my people, and mine elect shall long enjoy the work of their hands. [23] They shall not labour in vain, nor bring forth for trouble; for they are the seed of the blessed of the Lord, and their offspring with them.”

There will be no old man in the house...instead the old man is crucified with Christ. Similar to Isaiah 52:1 Awake, awake; put on thy strength, O Zion; put on thy beautiful garments, O Jerusalem, the holy city: for henceforth there shall no more come into thee the uncircumcised and the unclean.

 

[Base12]

I guess it's more important to post cat pics and debate whether Mullets go to heaven then to address this very important issue.

 

[Base12]

Here's an interesting answer I found...

I believe the text in Isaiah 65:20 was deliberately altered to make it contradict Revelation 21:4’s “no more death”. I believe the problem with the text lies with the Jews that desired to eradicate support for Jesus being the Christ from their sacred writings.

Reconciling Isaiah 65:20 with “No more death” | All Power to the Lamb

 

[Timtofly]

I guess it's more important to post cat pics and debate whether Mullets go to heaven then to address this very important issue.

Try telling folks that God is judging them, and it is time to repent. The church age is over, along with all of the theology and doctrines humans have heaped upon the body of Christ.

 

[CharismaticLady]

I have my own opinions about what this verse means...

Isaiah 65:20
"There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed"

I'd rather hear what you folks have to say. What do you think the above verse is teaching?

People will still die in New Jerusalem?

Will people that die of old age have to stay in that body forever?

Hundred year old sinners? In the New Heavens and New Earth?

Will Premature Babies have to be kept in incubators until they are a hundred years old and then die?

I thought Death was eliminated in the New Heavens and New Earth?

Isaiah 65:17
"For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind"

What's going on here?

The New Earth will not have been made yet. I have always believed that verse is talking about during the 1000 year Millennium.

 

[Base12]

Jesus said there will be no marriage in Heaven...

Matthew 22:30
"For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven"

So Children are being born out of wedlock?

 

[CharismaticLady]

Jesus said there will be no marriage in Heaven...

Matthew 22:30
"For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven"

So Children are being born out of wedlock?

The Millennium is not heaven, silly. The second resurrection is after the Millennium.

 

[Heart2Soul]

I don't understand your response. How much more context does One need?

Here is the OP again...

Isaiah 65:17
"For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind"

The verse is self explanatory. The 'New Heavens and New Earth' referenced in it is the same as this...

2 Peter 3:13
"Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness"

...and this...

Revelation 21:1
"And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea"

Everyone agrees that Death will no longer exist at that point, correct?

1 Corinthians 15:54
"So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory"

So why do we see Death mentioned right after New Heavens and New Earth are created?

Isaiah 65:20
"There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed"

1 Corinthians 15:54 I take it to mean prophesy being fulfilled....then shall be brought to pass the saying....

 

[Base12]

The second resurrection is after the Millennium.

Hmmm. I understood the Second Resurrection to be for the Unsaved, just before they are thrown into the Lake of Fire.

 

[Base12]

1 Corinthians 15:54 I take it to mean prophesy being fulfilled....then shall be brought to pass the saying....

Thanks Heart2Soul. I think I'll post my interpretation of Isaiah 65:20 tomorrow. I'm interested in what the folks here have to say about it.

 

[Heart2Soul]

Isaiah 65:20
"There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed"

I take this to speak of the born again sinner vs the unrepentant sinner.

 

[CharismaticLady]

Hmmm. I understood the Second Resurrection to be for the Unsaved, just before they are thrown into the Lake of Fire.

I always assumed that too, but when you scrutinize the first resurrection, you see it is only martyrs. The second resurrection seems to be all others and the outcome is determined by if their name is written in the Book of Life or not. Look at it and tell me what you see.

 

[Base12]

Thanks Heart2Soul. I think I'll post my interpretation of Isaiah 65:20 tomorrow. I'm interested in what the folks here have to say about it.

OK, as promised, here is my take on Isaiah 65:20...

It all boils down to one word being misinterpreted. It's not a translation error per se, but it would seem that this word was chosen to sort of keep the verse 'open to interpretation' until such time it could be understood better.

The word I'm referring to is 'for'...

Isaiah 65:20
"There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed"

Strong's Number: 3588 ki
Definition: that, for, when

Strong's Hebrew: 3588. כִּי (ki) -- that, for, when

There are all kinds of ways that 'for' can be understood and I believe most folks are looking at it the wrong way. One translation of that word is 'because'.

So if we changed the word 'for' into 'because' it's still a bit vague as to what is being said but it helps.

I believe a more appropriate understanding is something like 'otherwise'.

Thus, the verse would go something like...

Isaiah 65:20
"There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: [otherwise] the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed"

So ultimately I believe the verse is stating that in the New Heavens and New Earth, there won't be any children and there won't be any old people. *OTHERWISE * folks would be resurrected in the bodies they died in and it would be a terrible situation.

For example: Someone who dies of old age, with all kinds of health problems, would be resurrected in a similar body and would have to stay that way for many years. It would be like a curse.

Likewise a premature baby would have to be in that body for a hundred years. What kind of quality life would they have?

I will admit it's still strange to mention Death in that verse. Not sure what to make of that other than it's perhaps referring to the age before the Flood in which folks lived hundreds of years.

Now when we compare this analogy to the rest of the Bible, we find it matches perfectly. The Saved will be resurrected in Glorified Bodies OF THE SAME AGE. What age is anyone's guess, but it's not impossible to imagine it would be in the Prime of Life.

So there you have it. Thanks goes out to the Gentleman in the video below for helping me with this.

Fast forward to 15:00...

Am I breaking a rule here? Did I go too far and change the Word of God to mean something it doesn't? You folks will have to be the judge.

Thanks everyone for visiting and commenting.

:)

 

[Windmill Charge]

I don't understand your response. How much more context does One need?

Here is the OP again...


Isaiah 65:17
"For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind"

The verse is self explanatory. The 'New Heavens and New Earth' referenced in it is the same as this...

2 Peter 3:13
"Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness"

...and this...

Revelation 21:1
"And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea"

Everyone agrees that Death will no longer exist at that point, correct?

1 Corinthians 15:54
"So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory"

So why do we see Death mentioned right after New Heavens and New Earth are created?

Isaiah 65:20
"There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed"

A classic case of a little bit of knowledge is dangerous.

One does not cheery pick verses and paste them into a carefully selected passage to prove ones pet heresy or any other idea.

Isiaih was talking about the new kingdom kin how people living there would be blessed. He illustrated that by saying they would live long lives..

 

[Base12]

Isiaih was talking about the new kingdom kin how people living there would be blessed. He illustrated that by saying they would live long lives..

So what you are saying is that the Saved who are dead now, will be resurrected to live in the 1,000 Year Reign, but when the 1,000 years are up, Jesus will say "OK, it's time for everyone to die again".

Jesus will then proceed to murder everyone, only to resurrect them again in the Second Resurrection?

 

[Timtofly]

I always assumed that too, but when you scrutinize the first resurrection, you see it is only martyrs. The second resurrection seems to be all others and the outcome is determined by if their name is written in the Book of Life or not. Look at it and tell me what you see.

Different resurrections.
John mentions 3 in Revelation, and only the last two are numbered. Figure that puzzle out.
The resurrection Jesus is talking about that has no marriage is this one: Revelation 6:9, "When the Lamb broke the fifth seal, I saw underneath the altar the souls of those who had been put to death for proclaiming the Word of God, that is, for bearing witness."
These souls are in heaven since the resurrection that happened at the moment Jesus died on the Cross. The veil in the temple was rent, bringing an end to the OT covenant. All those saints were resurrected and there souls and bodies (ghosts) are under the alter. Ghost do not marry and have offspring. Next verse 11: "Each of them was given a white robe (new glorified body); and they were told to wait a little longer, until the full number of their fellow-servants should be reached, of their brothers who would be killed, just as they had been." The wait is instantaneous. Verse 12-14:
12 Then I watched as he broke the sixth seal, and there was a great earthquake, the sun turned black as sackcloth worn in mourning, and the full moon became blood-red.
13 The stars fell from heaven to earth just as a fig tree drops its figs when shaken by a strong wind.
14 The sky receded like a scroll being rolled up, and every mountain and island was moved from its place.
This is the moment of Paul's resurrection. The dead in Christ are already under the alter. All receive a robe, and then, those alive in Christ meet them in the air while putting on their white robes in the air.

The first and last resurrection at the end of Revelation consist of this:
1. Those beheaded in Satan's 3.5 year rule.
2. All the dead of all time. Those whose names will be removed from the Lamb's book of life, at the final judgment.

John says that those in the first two resurrections will not be subject to the judgments of the very last resurrection of all dead.
This means any one not under the alter will be subject to the last judgment.

Any one alive on earth, who are not in Christ's retinue in the Second Coming have one last chance to be saved from death. All other humans have already died, and still dead, or they are with Christ when Christ returns.
So those alive on earth will only be saved from death, if they get their heads cut off by Satan. These are the dead of this first resurrection in Revelation 20: "And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for testifying about Yeshua and proclaiming the Word of God, also those who had not worshipped the beast or its image and had not received the mark on their foreheads and on their hands. They came to life and ruled with the Messiah for a thousand years.
5 (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were over.) This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is anyone who has a part in the first resurrection; over him the second death has no power.