Israel is Babylon the Great!

[Ronald Nolette]

According to God's Word. Not according to the replacement theology taught by those who replace Israel, who exist in Christ alone, with unbelievers. Indeed, your replacement theology is heresy.

Well time will tell the tale! We will see if god fulfills HIs promises to the nation of Israel or He used replacement theology and gave the [promises He made to Israel to the church.

Maybe from now on you should simply call the church Israel, for you believe it is the true Israel against the Scriptures.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Yes. I DID SAY that in my post #87:
"Whosoever hath NOT the Spirit of Christ, he is none of His", and therefore remains to be a dwelling place for Satan."

And, your selection of 2Thes. 2:4 is the correct scripture choice, of which I am meaning, because "THAT spirit of antichrist" infects many, and not just one.

So you believe the spirit of Antichrist can be in many places at one time and that he infects believers! Okay then! He doesn't infect thte lost according to 2 thess. 2 but to believers if the only temple is the believer!

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Joining Israel is not replacing Israel.

Well are you a proselyte to Judaism then?

 

[TribulationSigns]

In the book of Revelation 18, she is the New Testament UNFAITHFUL congregation that God judges is depicted as Babylon. This concept may be a mystery to many Christians, particularly those who lack spiritual insight. However, some are misled by looking for physical cities like Jerusalem, Rome, or New York, leading to their flawed interpretations.

 

[covenantee]

Not according to gods Word. but according to those who have bought into the heresy of replacement theology, they do think that.

The Church has not replaced ethnic (genetic) Israel. An ethnic (genetic) Jew before receiving Christ continues to be the same ethnic (genetic) Jew after receiving Christ.

So what does your replacement "theology" say is replaced?

C'mon, all you dispensationalists. No one has yet answered this question.

 

[quietthinker]

Israel is Babylon the Great!​

'Babylon' is the metaphor used in scripture for all that opposes God. When 'the Great' is added as in 'Babylon the Great' it tells us Babylon has become an all encompassing system globally with a religious ideology. Why religious? Because it is the driver of people. Just look at football stadiums in swing, there is a fervour which has a life of its own. Look at politics, it is also driven by a similar fervour.....strong enough for people to kill.
The fervour against God including his people is yet to be manifested in its ferocity.
Satan's objective is to wipe the knowledge of God from the Planet.

The story in the book of Esther is a foreshadowing of what In my view will become Global.

Israel the nation is just a part of the global system opposed to God's principles evidenced by it's overt oppression of the Palestinian people.

 

[TribulationSigns]

Israel New Testament Unfaithful Congregation is Babylon the Great! She is that great city who is supposed to represent God but has become a whole and the holds of false prophets and christs (those with the spirit of the devils). Nothing to do with the physical city at all!​

 

[ewq1938]

Well are you a proselyte to Judaism then?

No, the Israel I speak of started with the disciples and continued through them to other ISraelites in the faith and service of Christ. The Christian church, the body of Christ and the Bride of Christ started with Christian Jews. Gentiles must join them, not replace them. Replacing isn't even possible and the thought of it is ridiculous.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

No, the Israel I speak of started with the disciples and continued through them to other ISraelites in the faith and service of Christ. The Christian church, the body of Christ and the Bride of Christ started with Christian Jews. Gentiles must join them, not replace them. Replacing isn't even possible and the thought of it is ridiculous.

Yes we join the original Jews who birthed teh church and we become one body in christ.

but the promises god made to OT IUsrael will be fulfilled completely to the nation of Israel during th emillenial kingdom.

Even Paul reminds us that the plan of God for the nation of Israel is still in effect.

15 For if the casting away of them be the reconciling of the world, what shall the receiving of them be, but life from the dead?

16 For if the firstfruit be holy, the lump is also holy: and if the root be holy, so are the branches.

17 And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert grafted in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree;

18 Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee.

19 Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be grafted in.

20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:

21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.

22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be grafted in: for God is able to graft them in again.

24 For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert grafted contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree?

25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the father's sakes.

29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.

You do well to read very carefully the Words God inspired Paul to use concerning Israel.

verse 15
verses 24-29

Remember God in Jeremiah 31 is going to make a New Covenant with the nation of Israel.

 

[TribulationSigns]

Remember God in Jeremiah 31 is going to make a New Covenant with the nation of Israel.

No. Not the nation Israel.

God made a New Covenant with COVENENT ISRAEL which includes the Old Testament Congregation and the New Testament Congregation which represents her. Christ is Israel. Not a pile of dirt on Earth.

 

[ewq1938]

Yes we join the original Jews who birthed teh church and we become one body in christ.

but the promises god made to OT IUsrael will be fulfilled completely to the nation of Israel during th emillenial kingdom.

Israel isn't what it used to be. Now it is a nation of Christians that live all over the planet. No promises belong to anyone else in the NT in this sense. Christian Israel is the church, is the bride of Christ, and is the body of Christ and will be the subject of fulfilled promises.

 

[Zao is life]

Well time will tell the tale! We will see if god fulfills HIs promises to the nation of Israel or He used replacement theology and gave the [promises He made to Israel to the church.

Maybe from now on you should simply call the church Israel, for you believe it is the true Israel against the Scriptures.

True Israel are the citizens of Israel and together they are the living stones who make up the Temple of God, a.k.a the church.

Christian teaching.

God's promises to Israel are all in and through Christ.

Who is your King of Israel, then?

The saints who will worship the man of sin, the image of the beast being worshiped in the New Testament Temple of God, will be guilty of the same apostasy and lawlessness that the Jews who worshiped the idol in the holy place which was set up by Antiochus IV Epiphanes in the Old Testament temple were guilty of.

 

[Nancy]

That quote is real.

You're kidding, right? How long do you think the "internet" has been around??!! Since 1865? That is the year good ole Abe died.

 

[John839]

You're kidding, right? How long do you think the "internet" has been around??!! Since 1865? That is the year good ole Abe died.

Theodor Herzl has written these words on his article at the Deutsche Zeitung. This quote is real.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

No. Not the nation Israel.

God made a New Covenant with COVENENT ISRAEL which includes the Old Testament Congregation and the New Testament Congregation which represents her. Christ is Israel. Not a pile of dirt on Earth.

No. No where does it say "covenant" Israel. It says the house of Israel and Judah and that is the ethnic nation of Israel! Not some mystical "covenant" Israel.

Ezekiel 20:33-38

King James Version

​

33 As I live, saith the Lord God, surely with a mighty hand, and with a stretched out arm, and with fury poured out, will I rule over you:
34 And I will bring you out from the people, and will gather you out of the countries wherein ye are scattered, with a mighty hand, and with a stretched out arm, and with fury poured out.
35 And I will bring you into the wilderness of the people, and there will I plead with you face to face.
36 Like as I pleaded with your fathers in the wilderness of the land of Egypt, so will I plead with you, saith the Lord God.
37 And I will cause you to pass under the rod, and I will bring you into the bond of the covenant:
38 And I will purge out from among you the rebels, and them that transgress against me: I will bring them forth out of the country where they sojourn, and they shall not enter into the land of Israel: and ye shall know that I am the Lord.

Zechariah 13:8-9

King James Version

​

8 And it shall come to pass, that in all the land, saith the Lord, two parts therein shall be cut off and die; but the third shall be left therein.
9 And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The Lord is my God.

Jeremiah 31:31-38

King James Version

​

31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:
33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.
35 Thus saith the Lord, which giveth the sun for a light by day, and the ordinances of the moon and of the stars for a light by night, which divideth the sea when the waves thereof roar; The Lord of hosts is his name:
36 If those ordinances depart from before me, saith the Lord, then the seed of Israel also shall cease from being a nation before me for ever.
37 Thus saith the Lord; If heaven above can be measured, and the foundations of the earth searched out beneath, I will also cast off all the seed of Israel for all that they have done, saith the Lord.

Sorry, but Gods word speaks of ethnic natural Israel, not some mystical "covenant" Israel. Especially the New Covenant- for it was not some mystical Israel that broke the old covenant.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Israel isn't what it used to be. Now it is a nation of Christians that live all over the planet. No promises belong to anyone else in the NT in this sense. Christian Israel is the church, is the bride of Christ, and is the body of Christ and will be the subject of fulfilled promises.

Nope. If you knew the promises of God in the OT to the nation of Israel (the descendants of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob) you would know it is not to the church but to natural Israel that God will fulfill all His promises made to the nation.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

True Israel are the citizens of Israel and together they are the living stones who make up the Temple of God, a.k.a the church.

Christian teaching.

God's promises to Israel are all in and through Christ.

Who is your King of Israel, then?

The saints who will worship the man of sin, the image of the beast being worshiped in the New Testament Temple of God, will be guilty of the same apostasy and lawlessness that the Jews who worshiped the idol in the holy place which was set up by Antiochus IV Epiphanes in the Old Testament temple were guilty of.

I find it stunning that you use the term saints to describe people who will worship the antichrist. Saints will not do that.

Also that is not what Gods Word says. It does say that the man of sin will enter the temple of God and declare himself God. that would be demon possession of saved individuals which is a biblical impossibility.

Gods promises to Israel. Some are fojnd in Jesus, but the rest to the nation itself.

Like Israel will be the center of a worldwide government during the millenial kingdom and gentile nations must send a representative to Jerusalem during feast of tabernavcles or face a year of drought in the land. Even th emost rabid allegorist cannot attribut that in Jesus.

 

[amigo de christo]

The flesh profits nothing . any jew or any gentile that denies JESUS is the CHRIST will surely perish .
Lets follow the example paul gave , PREACHJESUSCHRIST that we might save some .
Whoever taugth that everyone who was born a jew is saved , OBVISOIULY DONT KNOW GOD .
YE MUST BELIEVE IN JESUS CHRIST.
To the jews or gentiles who refuse him , WELL i leave us with JESUS own words.
IF YE LOVED GOD YE WOULD HAVE LOVED ME for i CAME FORTH OF GOD .
SO yeah exactly.
THEN let us look at what else he says .
The jews, WHO BELIEVED NOT ON HIM , said WE HAVE ONE FATHER EVEN GOD .
JESUS later tells them OH ye have a father all right , THE DEVIL . LETS KEEP THAT IN MIND .
TO DENY JESUS CHRIST , IS TO DENY GOD . and that BE A FACT .

 

[PinSeeker]

There is such misunderstanding who is really of Israel, who God's Israel really is and who it is comprised of. But it's all very clear in Romans through Paul:

"For no one is a Jew who is merely one outwardly, nor is circumcision outward and physical. But a Jew is one inwardly, and circumcision is a matter of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter. His praise is not from man but from God." (Paul, Romans 2:28-29)​

​

"For not all who are descended from Israel belong to Israel, and not all are children of Abraham because they are his offspring, but 'Through Isaac shall your offspring be named.' This means that it is not the children of the flesh who are the children of God, but the children of the promise are counted as offspring... in order that God’s purpose of election might continue, not because of works but because of Him Who calls" (Romans 9:6-9)​

​

"What if God, desiring to show His wrath and to make known his power, has endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction, in order to make known the riches of His glory for vessels of mercy, which He has prepared beforehand for glory ~ even us whom He has called, not from the Jews only but also from the Gentiles?" (Romans 9:22-24)​

​

"Lest you be wise in your own sight, I do not want you to be unaware of this mystery, brothers: a partial hardening has come upon Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. And in this way all Israel will be saved..." (Romans 11:25-26)​

Grace and peace to all.

 

[covenantee]

I find it stunning that you use the term saints to describe people who will worship the antichrist. Saints will not do that.

Also that is not what Gods Word says. It does say that the man of sin will enter the temple of God and declare himself God. that would be demon possession of saved individuals which is a biblical impossibility.

Gods promises to Israel. Some are fojnd in Jesus, but the rest to the nation itself.

Like Israel will be the center of a worldwide government during the millenial kingdom and gentile nations must send a representative to Jerusalem during feast of tabernavcles or face a year of drought in the land. Even th emost rabid allegorist cannot attribut that in Jesus.

Utter incoherent nonsense.

The promises were and are to Abraham, Christ, and those in Christ.

There is no "Israel" to be seen.

Genesis 12
1 Now the Lord had said unto Abram, Get thee out of thy country, and from thy kindred, and from thy father's house, unto a land that I will shew thee:
2 And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing:
3 And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.

Genesis 22:18
And in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed; because thou hast obeyed my voice.

Galatians 3:16
Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

Galatians 3:29
And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

2 Corinthians 1:20
For all the promises of God in him are yea, and in him Amen, unto the glory of God by us.

Romans 8:16-17
16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

Hebrews 8:6
But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.