It is not in the bible.....but believed

[Joshua☩]

Now i am a liar? Where did I insult you please quote it?

"And it never said you should. You are going to some lenghth to cover up a silly slip. and that is what the pharises would do also its called religeon.
Prety pathetic.
So obviously you cant be told nothing. It was a silly slip of the tounge finger. and you are going to go to the extrme if nessisery with it. get a grip."

Well, there was this entire statement, plus your childish attack on my introduction post.

 

[Sword]

"And it never said you should. You are going to some lenghth to cover up a silly slip. and that is what the pharises would do also its called religeon.
Prety pathetic.
So obviously you cant be told nothing. It was a silly slip of the tounge finger. and you are going to go to the extrme if nessisery with it. get a grip."

Well, there was this entire statement, plus your childish attack on my introduction post.

I suggest you report such a horrible insult to the leaders. I will be reporting yours and let then decide whats an insult and whats not.

 

[Joshua☩]

I suggest you report such a horrible insult to the leaders. I will be reporting yours and let then decide whats an insult and whats not.

Sure, you can report me, it will only prove my point that you can sling insults but you cannot take them. Report me if you want to.

 

[brionne]

the bible certainly does not tell us that she had other children other than Jesus - this is imagined by those who refuse to imagine otherwise - twinc

It does at Matt 13:53-56

 

[Joshua☩]

It does at Matt 13:53-56

The brothers mentioned in this passage are James, Joseph, Simon, and Judas. Simon and Judas were most definitely not His actual brothers, so it could be argued that the use of the term "Brothers" here is a figurative reference to the Apostles. This could likewise be argued for the use of the term "Sisters".
Also, this passage does not state that Mary gave birth to any of them, just that they were known as His Brothers and Sisters.

 

[brionne]

The brothers mentioned in this passage are James, Joseph, Simon, and Judas. Simon and Judas were most definitely not His actual brothers, so it could be argued that the use of the term "Brothers" here is a figurative reference to the Apostles. This could likewise be argued for the use of the term "Sisters".
Also, this passage does not state that Mary gave birth to any of them, just that they were known as His Brothers and Sisters.

cross reference that with Galatians 1:18 and we see that James is named as 'the brother of the Lord' as opposed to Cephus who is named an Apostle.

It certainly is not sacrilege for Mary to have had children. there is no shame in that Mary and Joseph had children. The mosaic law was clear that a husband and wife were to engage in sexual relations. If she was married and if she obeyed the law, she would have had sex with her husband... its Gods will.

 

[Joshua☩]

cross reference that with Galatians 1:18 and we see that James is named as 'the brother of the Lord' as opposed to Cephus who is named an Apostle.

It certainly is not sacrilege for Mary to have had children. there is no shame in that Mary and Joseph had children. The mosaic law was clear that a husband and wife were to engage in sexual relations. If she was married and if she obeyed the law, she would have had sex with her husband... its Gods will.

I agree with you that it is of no consequence if she did have sex and other children, and in all likelihood she did.

But, there is nothing in the Bible that explicitly states that she did. The only evidence is the references to "Brothers" and "Sisters" which could mean that she had other children, or that Joseph had children from a previous marriage, or that these terms are being used figuratively to refer to Disciples.

 

[brionne]

I agree with you that it is of no consequence if she did have sex and other children, and in all likelihood she did.

But, there is nothing in the Bible that explicitly states that she did. The only evidence is the references to "Brothers" and "Sisters" which could mean that she had other children, or that Joseph had children from a previous marriage, or that these terms are being used figuratively to refer to Disciples.

The bible doesn say that Joseph was previously married either. So i guess if we base our theology on what the bible does not say, we can create any story we like from it....enter davinchi code, enter Jesus lived in India before he founded christinity, Jesus had a sexual relationship with Mary Magdalene and they had kids... it can go on and on.

 

[Joshua☩]

The bible doesn say that Joseph was previously married either. So i guess if we base our theology on what the bible does not say, we can create any story we like from it....enter davinchi code, enter Jesus lived in India before he founded christinity, Jesus had a sexual relationship with Mary Magdalene and they had kids... it can go on and on.

That is exactly what I've been saying. Worrying about what is not in the Bible is of far less value than worrying about what is in the Bible.

 

[101G]

GINOLJC, to all. no, Mary is, and was not a perpetual virgin. (she had other children, which some here have pointed out). yes, she was just as Isaiah said she was in using the word, "Almah". because, bethulah is not a technical term for biological virginity, but rather a social term describing a woman who is separated apart from society, by being under her father's roof or that of another protector. Mary was not under her father's roof, she was under Joseph's roof, her husband, but yet not sexual active with him”.

as for the Lord Jesus, who is God, “diversified” (shared) in natural human flesh, is Spirit, and Glorified, meaning immortal, (which virginity does not apply).

hope this help.

 

[Joshua☩]

GINOLJC, to all. no, Mary is, and was not a perpetual virgin.

Where in the Bible does it explicitly state this? There is absolutely no way to say with complete conclusivity that she was not a perpetual virgin, just like there is no way to say that she was a perpetual virgin.

 

[101G]

to Joshua, Scripture, Luke 2:7 "And she brought forth her firstborn son, and wrapped him in swaddling clothes, and laid him in a manger; because there was no room for them in the inn”. the term “first born” indicate that there was other children that followed

 

[Joshua☩]

to Joshua, Scripture, Luke 2:7 "And she brought forth her firstborn son, and wrapped him in swaddling clothes, and laid him in a manger; because there was no room for them in the inn”. the term “first born” indicate that there was other children that followed

No it doesn't. Firstborn simply means first, It doesn't, of its own accord, mean that there were subsequent children. If a person has one child, that child is simultaneously their first and their only.

 

[101G]

to Joshua, erron your part, scripture, Matthew 1:24 "Then Joseph being raised from sleep did as the angel of the Lord had bidden him, and took unto him his wife: now verse 25 "And knew her not till she had brought forth her firstborn son: and he called his name JESUS". the term "KNEW" here means have sex. well that just ended her virginity.

hope this helped.

 

[Joshua☩]

to Joshua, erron your part, scripture, Matthew 1:24 "Then Joseph being raised from sleep did as the angel of the Lord had bidden him, and took unto him his wife: now verse 25 "And knew her not till she had brought forth her firstborn son: and he called his name JESUS". the term "KNEW" here means have sex. well that just ended her virginity.

hope this helped.

Again, it does not say that he "knew" her after, just that he did not "know" her before.

It is completely impossible to say with certainty that she was not a perpetual virgin.

Furthermore, because I apparently have not made myself clear enough, I believe that Mary and Joseph probably did have other children.

But, as I have said many times, there is not one single statement in the entirety of the Bible that says this explicitly. Every statement that "implies" that they did could be explained in other ways.

 

[101G]

to Joshua, did you not read the scriptures, Matthew 1:25 "And knew her not till she had brought forth her firstborn son: and he called his name JESUS". TILL, TILL she had brought forth her firstborn son. Joshua, understand he had SEX with Mary after she gave birth to our Lord.

 

[Joshua☩]

to Joshua, did you not read the scriptures, Matthew 1:25 "And knew her not till she had brought forth her firstborn son: and he called his name JESUS". TILL, TILL she had brought forth her firstborn son. Joshua, understand he had SEX with Mary after she gave birth to our Lord.

okay, I'm getting a headache, so I should probably stop beating my head against this wall. You obviously didn't read my previous post in which I stated that I agree with you and most others that she probably wasn't a perpetual virgin.

But, again, "TILL" does not mean that they did after, it simply means that they didn't before. I have asked several times for anyone to show me any statement in the Bible that explicitly states that she was not a perpetual virgin, which everyone has failed to do since no such statement exists.

It is remarkable how everyone keeps telling me to pay attention to the scriptures, and yet everyone is telling me that the scriptures contain information which they absolutely do not contain.

 

[101G]

Ok, sorry about that, get some rest, peace in christ Jesus.

 

[mjrhealth]

No it doesn't. Firstborn simply means first, It doesn't, of its own accord, mean that there were subsequent children. If a person has one child, that child is simultaneously their first and their only.

One can have sex without having children, lots of couples do especialy these days.

 

[twinc]

one can go on and on endlessly imagining what is or is not indirectly stated in the bible and so we have here as elsewhere a dilemma except that this has been provided against and in this case as also elsewhere we have an answer or key provided but some refuse to use the key or allow the keyholder to use the key provided as at Matt.16:19 - in many cases and by many what is unlocked by the key and the holder of the key is rejected - twinc