I believe the secular and the religious will join together to persecute God's people the Church before the end. The whore (false religion) will ride on the back of the beast (the antichrist secular system).
It is time to give Pretrib a decent burial
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Lol. So, anyone who disagrees with what you teach should be avoided? That is a load of nonsense. We all disagree on this forum. That is not what it's talking about.
This is all a smokescreen to mask you having no answer to the simple biblical questions. The ironic thing is that you are totally and utterly incapable of presenting one proof text to support your paradigm. You have absolutely nothing. The reason why you're running is because you are bereft of any biblical warrant.
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Rom 16:
[17] Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.
Since so many have learned differently, and scripture can not be broken, then many people are believing lies. Paul wrote this for those who follow the apostles doctrines, as taught by the apostles. And all the apostles are gone. So we must pay close attention to the scriptures as that is showing the true light. Anyone using the above scripture, while believing lies, and avoiding the apostles and Christ's doctrines, is a double hypocrite. God will be the judge of it.
James 3
My brethren, let not many of you become teachers, knowing that we shall receive a stricter judgment. 2 For we all stumble in many things. If anyone does not stumble in word, he is a [a]perfect man, able also to bridle the whole body. 3 [b]Indeed, we put bits in horses’ mouths that they may obey us, and we turn their whole body. 4 Look also at ships: although they are so large and are driven by fierce winds, they are turned by a very small rudder wherever the pilot desires. 5 Even so the tongue is a little member and boasts great things.
See how great a forest a little fire kindles! 6 And the tongue is a fire, a world of [c]iniquity. The tongue is so set among our members that it defiles the whole body, and sets on fire the course of [d]nature; and it is set on fire by [e]hell. 7 For every kind of beast and bird, of reptile and creature of the sea, is tamed and has been tamed by mankind. 8 But no man can tame the tongue. It is an unruly evil, full of deadly poison. 9 With it we bless our God and Father, and with it we curse men, who have been made in the [f]similitude of God. 10 Out of the same mouth proceed blessing and cursing. My brethren, these things ought not to be so. 11 Does a spring send forth fresh water and bitter from the same opening? 12 Can a fig tree, my brethren, bear olives, or a grapevine bear figs? [g]Thus no spring yields both salt water and fresh.
Spiritual Israelite
Well-Known Member
Spiritual Israelite
Well-Known Member
And, yet, no pre-tribs here have any ability whatsoever to exegete scripture and back up their pre-trib rapture theory. I would say it's completely dead, if the pre-tribs here are any indication.
You guys are out of control. You cannot address the Scriptures. You cannot answer any biblical questions. All is you have is ad hominem.
Yes you do. You cannot prove it by any Scripture. Show us hard Scripture that teaches a rapture of the Church followed by a tribulation followed by a third coming. That is what you profess but that is not what you can prove.
I simply expose your avoidance and hatred. The evidence is on every page. Facts are stubborn things.
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Is the rapture not a coming of Christ?
Is the Rev 19 not another coming of Christ?
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Who do you think you are to question my salvation just because I reject the teaching of Pretrib?
It is near impossible to get you Pretribbers to address biblical arguments. You want to wallow in ad hominem. Please address the biblical evidence that you have carefully avoided. You ask a question and when I give you a detailed biblical response you avoid it. That is the pattern of Pretribbers.
The Greek word parousia appears 24 times in the New Testament. It is rendered “coming” in 22 passages and “presence” in 2. The word can be interpreted coming, arrival or presence and simply expresses in the Greek what it implies in the English. The word parousia is mostly applied in Scripture to the second coming of the Lord although it is not solely restricted to that Advent. In II Thessalonians 2:9 the word is applied to the arrival of antichrist. The word is also used in other passages to describe the coming or arrival of a person (1 Corinthians 16:17 and 2 Corinthians 7:6).
Notwithstanding, the first time we encounter the word parousia in relation to the coming of the Lord is in Matthew 24. The word is found in the disciples’ response to the Lord’s statement outside the temple – “verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down” (v2).
The disciples then question the Lord on the detail, meaning and timing of this solemn prophecy and of the end of the world by way of two questions in Matthew 24:3, asking,
(1) “Tell us, when shall these things be?” and
(2) “what shall be the sign of thy coming (or parousia), and of the end (or sunteleías, or completion, or consummation) of the world?”
In this passage, "the end of the world" is plainly identified with the coming of the Lord.
The Lord employs the word parousia in reply to the disciples second question in Matthew 24:23-28, when He says, “if any man shall say unto you (before the one final future second coming of the Lord), Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. Behold, I have told you before. Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the parousia of the Son be. Wheresoever is the carcase, there will be gathered together the eagles.”
Christ continues in Matthew 24:29-31, speaking of this one final future coming, “Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.”
This is the end! Jesus clearly comes “after the tribulation.”
Matthew 24:35-41 continues: “Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away. But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only. But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming (or parousia) of the Son of man be. For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. Then shall two be in the field; the one ‘shall be taken’ [Gr. paralambano], and the other left. Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one ‘shall be taken’ [Gr. paralambano], and the other left.”
After telling us that “heaven and earth shall pass away,” Jesus immediately tells us: “of that day and hour knoweth no man.” This final day that is approachingis coming unexpectedly. This fits in with the “thief in the night” scenario found elsewhere in Scripture. It would seem to confirm that the day that Christ returns is the day when the current corrupt natural order (both the creature and creation) is gloriously changed. The wicked and all corruption are destroyed when Jesus comes. The Lord here identifies the passing away of “heaven and earth” with “the coming of the Son of man.”
Christ describes this day as an unanticipated day for many – one that will find many unprepared. For those who are playing at religion they will be caught on. They will face the same punishment as the “hypocrite” when He comes: “there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.” The wicked are an all-inclusive group; they include every Christ-rejecter – from the religious professors to the outright profane hypocrites. They will all be caught in the destruction when they are left behind and the “heaven and earth ... pass away.”
The Lord uses the word parousia again in v 37 to equate the days preceding His coming to the days preceding Noah’s entry into the ark, saying, “as the days of Noe were, so shall also the parousia of the Son of man be.” In His reply, Christ confirmed, what the disciples already seem to have rightly comprehended, in their questioning, that His next Coming is His last and only future coming and that it ushers in “the end of the world (or age)”
We note three particular characteristics of this day, which will be repeated at the second coming of the Lord Jesus Christ. (1) The wicked lived as if there was no judgement coming, verse 38 says, “they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage.” (2) The wicked were caught unexpected, verse 39 says, they “knew not until the flood came.” And finally, (3) the wicked were ALL destroyed, verse 39 says, “the flood came, and took them all away.”
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What other Scripture in the Bible teaches that Jesus is coming on a literal physical white horse?
Taken
Well-Known Member
Keep your false accusations to yourself. Thankfully you are not God or most of us would be damned. The scary part is, the judgment you meet at on us is met back on you some day.
All you have is ad hominem.
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I'm done talking to you until you apologize, act like a Christian, stop judging people's salvation and start addressing Scripture instead of hurling ad hominem.Boo Hoo.
I don’t Judge you.
I recognize your Devious Tactics.
The Lord God Shall Judge you…
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