Jehovah is either God or He is not, correct?

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stunnedbygrace

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Thank you....all we can do is convey what we believe and why we believe it....and leave the rest to God and the individual seeker.....

To my way of thinking, God is the one who gave us our sense of logic, so when things relate to things on earth, they must of necessity be logical, which is what I always find when I delve into deep subjects. He always uses terminology that we understand, like his relationship with his son.....they describe themselves as father and son....it isn't something humans decided. So the familial relationship does not indicate equality, but the superiority of Father to son. Jesus is called "the only begotten" son of God before his earthly sojourn. Since Adam is also called a "son of God" even in his human flesh, (Luke 3:38) Jesus had to have existed before him, just as he existed before Abraham.....he pre-existed all living things as "the firstborn of all creation"...."the beginning of God's creation". (Col 1:15; Revelation 3:14)

Matters relating to the spirit realm I don't think we will ever comprehend and were probably never supposed to, since God put us here on planet Earth for a reason....and intended it to be our permanent home. He went to a lot of trouble to make it the most idyllic place to live and to ensure that we had the very best start, he gave us a blueprint of what he wanted the whole world to look like. Mankind would be given the privilege of transforming the untamed world out side the garden till the whole planet was "subdued" and a fitting place for man to worship his creator and appreciate all the beautiful things that he had made, just for their enjoyment.

I think the Bible answers that question for us.....I don't think its obvious to many people that God can only work with willing and teachable hearts...he cannot "make a silk purse out of a sow's ear"....but rather allows us to show him who we are at heart by our decisions and actions.
If John 6:44, 65 is true....
"No man can come to me unless the Father, who sent me, draws him. . . . .“This is why I have said to you, no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father.”....then this is the basis upon which God selects the citizens of his kingdom. He will choose from among mankind those whom he deems to be "sheep" and reject those who prove that they are "goats".....and the destiny of both is there in the scriptures for us. These mean opposite destinations.....Everlasting life or everlasting death....there is no fence in the middle...
When Christ comes a judge, the decision will be final.


I guess this is something unique to yourself and apparently causes you no distress. Do you see it as something supernatural?
I remember having the entire conversation. I think you have some denominational error, as we discussed. I don’t think having the conversation again would be any more fruitful yet. It’s still where you want to stay.

As to your last question, yes, it is supernatural because it’s something God does to us, but it’s not crazy. I sometimes describe it as the true fast, not from food, but where He seems to disappear for a time and you walk in the dryness of pure trust that He knows what He is doing and is working to prosper you, not harm you, even though it feels awful to you, like He has shut out your prayers and turned against you.
Men have described it in many different ways, both in scripture and out.
 

tigger 2

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For David H, #510 above

I couldn't find your quote by Polycarp. Please give citations for all quotes.

Justin Martyr (c. 100-165 A.D.)

Justin, whom the trinitarian The Oxford Dictionary of the Christian Church (p. 770) called “the most outstanding of the ‘Apologists,’” wrote:

God alone is unbegotten and incorruptible, and therefore He is God, but all other things after him are created and corruptible {Justin has just concurred that the world was begotten by God} .... take your stand on one Unbegotten, and say this is the Cause of all. - ANF 1:197 (‘Dialogue’). [ANF is the Ante-Nicene Fathers, Eerdmans, 1993.]

But,

Jesus Christ is the only proper Son who has been begotten by God, being His Word and first-begotten - ANF 1:170 (‘Apology’).

And thus do we also, since our persuasion by the Word, stand aloof from them (i.e., the demons), and follow the only unbegotten God through His Son - ANF 1:167 (‘Apology’).

Nevertheless, in Justin’s picture, as later in Tertullian’s, the generation of the Logos takes place only with a view to the world’s creation. The Son, therefore, is not co-eternal with God; Moreover, he exists to provide a mediator between God and the cosmos in creation and revelation, as the language of John 1:3 and 1:18, not to mention 1 Corinthians 8:6, seemed to suggest. Thus, the Logos theology appeared to introduce a ‘second God’ {deuteros theos ‘a second god’ was the well-known term used by Philo and many of the second century Christian writers - see the LOGOS study} inconsistently with the principle of monotheism; and further, it suggested that the Logos represented a secondary grade or kind of divinity. It ‘subordinated’ the Son to the Father. - p. 84, A History of the Christian Church, Walker (trinitarian), Scribner’s, 1985 printing.

The trinitarian The Encyclopedia of Religion, Macmillan Publishing Co., 1987, tells us:

“ ... another sentence from {Justin Martyr} ... ‘There is, as has been said, another god and lord {the Son of God} below the Creator of the universe’ ” - Vol. 9, p. 15.

Justin Martyr (c. 100 - c. 165) in a dialogue with the Jew Trypho says:

God begat before all creatures a Beginning, [who was] a certain rational power [proceeding] from Himself, who is called by the Holy Spirit, now the Glory of the Lord, now the Son, again Wisdom, again an angel, then God {'a god,' anarthrous theos}, and then Lord and Logos .... For He can be called by all those names, since he ministers to the Father’s will, and since He was begotten of the Father by an act of will .... The Word of Wisdom ... speaks by Solomon {Prov. 8:22-30} the following: ‘.... The Lord {‘Jehovah’, original Hebrew manuscripts - cf. ASV} made me the beginning of His ways for His works.’ ANF 1:227-228 (‘Dialogue’).

And later in the same dialogue with Trypho Justin again relates the words of Wisdom, the pre-existent Son of God,

‘The Lord created me the beginning of His ways for His works ...’ You perceive, my hearers, if you bestow attention, that the Scripture has declared that this Offspring was begotten by the Father before all things created... - ANF 1:264 (‘Dialogue’).

A saying of Justin Martyr indicates what lack of clarity there was with regard to the development of the doctrine of the Trinity as late as the middle of the second century .... He admits that Christians indeed reject the false pagan gods, but, he goes on to say, they do not deny the true God, who is the Father of justice and chastity and of all other virtues, and who will have nothing to do with that which is evil. He then says, ‘Both him {The Father, God alone} and the Son who came forth from Him and taught us these things, and the host of other good angels who follow and are made like to Him, and the prophetic Spirit, we worship and adore, because we honor {them?} in reason and truth.’ As if it were not enough that in this enumeration angels are mentioned as beings which are honored and worshiped {but see the WORSHIP study} by Christians, Justin does not hesitate to mention angels before naming the Holy Spirit. The sequence in which the beings that are worshiped are mentioned (God the Father, Christ, the {OTHER} angels, the Spirit) is noteworthy. - pp. 43, 44, A Short History of Christian Doctrine, Lohse (trinitarian), Fortress Press, 1985.

Respected church historian, Robert M. Grant (trinitarian), likewise notes concerning the above:

“[Justin] ... identifies the God whom Christians worship as ‘most true and Father of justice.... And he goes on to speak of reverencing and worshiping ‘the Son who came from him and taught us these things, and the army of other good angels who follow and resemble him, as well as the prophetic spirit.’” - p. 59 [quoting from “The First Apology of Justin,” Ch. VI]. “This is why Justin could place the ‘army of angels’ ahead of the ‘prophetic spirit,’ as we have seen: for him the Spirit was not ... personal [in fact Grant calls the Spirit ‘it’ - p. 63].” - p. 62, Greek Apologists of the Second Century, The Westminster Press, 1988.

Trinitarian scholar Dr. H. R. Boer tells us that the very first Christians to really discuss Jesus' relationship with God in their writings were the Apologists,

Justin and the other Apologists therefore taught that the Son is a creature. He is a high creature, a creature powerful enough to create the world but, nevertheless, a creature. In theology this relationship of the Son to the Father is called subordinationism. The Son is subordinate, that is, secondary to, dependent upon, and caused by the Father. - p. 110, Boer, A Short History of the Early Church, Eerdmans (trinitarian), 1976.

“The modern popular doctrine of the Trinity ... derives no support from the language of Justin [Martyr]” - Alvan Lamson, The Church of the First Three Centuries.

Justin Martyr’s ‘Apology’ and ‘Dialogue {With Trypho}’ “are preserved but in a single ms (Cod. Paris, 450, A.D. 1364)” - Britannica, 14th ed.
 
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WalterandDebbie

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Don't you feel a tad silly saying 'God the Son,' when it is not in Scripture one time? When Scripture states 'God the Father,' trinitarians have convinced themselves that implies other Gods. All it means is emphasizing the Supreme Being and our proper relationship to him, his adopted children.

Today, people still speak this way in America, only reverse the order, such as, 'My Daddy, the President.' It does not mean there are other President's.
Opinionated
 

stormymonday

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This was all well before Constantine, and some were disciples of the Apostles themselves. The fact that it was placed into a creed was indicates the trinity's wide acceptance by the Faithful in the church by the time of the Nicene creed. Even the Nicene creed was dated 325 AD which the church has adhered to throughout the centuries.
I think you have to look at what took place. It wasn't because of wide acceptance that the trinity was devised. There were bitter battles and riots between Arius and the so-called saint Athanasius. Rome was falling apart, and Constantine knew he had to do something and pick one side or the other to keep the Empire intact. So he sided with the more brutal and powerful Athanasius.

Then who knows how many people were tortured and burned over this one doctrine afterwards.
Opinionated
Not his opinion but the opinion of the entire bible.
 
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Aunty Jane

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My point was that the trinity was not an invention of the 4th century Catholic church, But rather goes back to the writings of the Apostles in the NT.
It was not made an official doctrine of "the church" until the 4th century because, as has been mentioned, there was great controversy over it. Those who knew it wasn't Bible based opposed it but those who wanted to introduce it finally got their way.....it took centuries to force it into dogma.

The New Catholic Encyclopedia admits: The formulation ‘one God in three Persons’ was not solidly established, certainly not fully assimilated into Christian life and its profession of faith, prior to the end of the 4th century. But it is precisely this formulation that has first claim to the title the Trinitarian dogma. Among the Apostolic Fathers, there had been nothing even remotely approaching such a mentality or perspective.—(1967), Vol. XIV, p. 299.

A pagan Roman emperor would never have been able to influence genuine Christians in the first century....it was only after the apostles had passed away that the foretold apostasy gained momentum. These men who were 'wolves in sheep's covering' were going to infiltrate the congregations and carry off people as their prey.....so from the second century onward the apostasy took hold, just as Jesus said it would. The "weeds" would be trying to choke the "wheat" out of existence.
Why does Christendom deny that this happened?
The Romans turned Zeus into Jesus and renamed all the pagan Roman festivals to make them acceptable to the "Christians" who by that time were not genuine Christians at all. Counterfeit Christianity is all people know because that is all they have seen practiced for almost 2,000 years......we all need to do our homework. Knowledge dispels ignorance. (John 17:3)
For example, what were the Apostle Thomas' first words after he was born again?
His first words after he was "born again"???...sorry, but Jesus had not yet ascended to the Father, and his parting instruction to his apostles before he left was very specific...
"During the forty days after he suffered and died, he appeared to the apostles from time to time, and he proved to them in many ways that he was actually alive. And he talked to them about the Kingdom of God.

4 Once when he was eating with them, he commanded them, “Do not leave Jerusalem until the Father sends you the gift he promised, as I told you before. 5 John baptized with water, but in just a few days you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.”
(NASB)
Their anointing with holy spirit did not take place until after Jesus left to return to heaven.

And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God. (John 20:28) Did Jesus correct him for calling him God? Or did the Spirit reveal this mystery when Thomas was born again? This is why the denial of the deity of Christ merely exposes the Lack of the Spirit in you.
Calling Jesus "theos" does not make him "God"..."theos" to polytheistic Greek understanding meant..."a god or goddess, a general name of deities or divinities". So Thomas was certainly NOT contradicting Paul's statement when speaking on behalf of the collective of the faithful elect...
"There may be so-called gods both in heaven and on earth, and some people actually worship many gods and many lords.
6 But for us, There is one God, the Father,
by whom all things were created,
and for whom we live.
And there is one Lord, Jesus Christ,
through whom all things were created,
and through whom we live.
" (NLT)

To Thomas, Jesus was a divine son of God, fully authorized by him to carry out his ministry, and to give his life as "a ransom in exchange for many". None of the apostles thought that Jesus was equal to their one God....Yahweh.
Paul again states...."But I want you to know that the head of every man is the Christ; in turn, the head of a woman is the man; in turn, the head of the Christ is God." (1 Cor 11:3)
Can God be the head of himself? :doldrums:
You ever read the testimony of Charles Wesley. When he was saved, he was already a missionary in the church. Immediately after he was born again, he penned his most famous hymn "And can it be" which affirms his understanding of the Deity of Christ in manifesting his Love for us.
And is Charles Wesley someone of interest to me? Should he be? I adhere to no teachings of Christendom, having been raised with them, I investigated what the Bible said for myself, and found them all to be adopted from outside of the scriptures.... an invention of Christendom...."the traditions of men".....not the teachings of the Christ.
 

Aunty Jane

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As to your last question, yes, it is supernatural because it’s something God does to us, but it’s not crazy. I sometimes describe it as the true fast, not from food, but where He seems to disappear for a time and you walk in the dryness of pure trust that He knows what He is doing and is working to prosper you, not harm you, even though it feels awful to you, like He has shut out your prayers and turned against you.
Men have described it in many different ways, both in scripture and out.
If what you describe is biblical, can you point me to an experience recorded in the scriptures that is the same as what you have experienced?
I have never heard of this, so I am curious about something that sounds unlike anything I have ever read in the Bible.
 

stunnedbygrace

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If what you describe is biblical, can you point me to an experience recorded in the scriptures that is the same as what you have experienced?
I have never heard of this, so I am curious about something that sounds unlike anything I have ever read in the Bible.
Not to your satisfaction I can’t. Except to point to physical circumcision versus true circumcision in spirit. Or anger in the heart being murder in spirit.
The words are spirit. They aren’t just letter. But you won’t accept that. Nevertheless, I answered.
 

stormymonday

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My point was that the trinity was not an invention of the 4th century Catholic church, But rather goes back to the writings of the Apostles in the NT. For example, what were the Apostle Thomas' first words after he was born again?
And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God. (John 20:28) Did Jesus correct him for calling him God? Or did the Spirit reveal this mystery when Thomas was born again? This is why the denial of the deity of Christ merely exposes the Lack of the Spirit in you. You ever read the testimony of Charles Wesley. When he was saved, he was already a missionary in the church. Immediately after he was born again, he penned his most famous hymn "And can it be" which affirms his understanding of the Deity of Christ in manifesting his Love for us.

  1. And can it be that I should gain
    An int’rest in the Savior’s blood?
    Died He for me, who caused His pain—
    For me, who Him to death pursued?
    Amazing love! How can it be,
    That Thou, my God, shouldst die for me?
    • Refrain:
      Amazing love! How can it be,
      That Thou, my God, shouldst die for me?
  2. ’Tis myst’ry all: th’ Immortal dies:
    Who can explore His strange design?
    In vain the firstborn seraph tries
    To sound the depths of love divine.
    ’Tis mercy all! Let earth adore,
    Let angel minds inquire no more.
  3. He left His Father’s throne above—
    So free, so infinite His grace—
    Emptied Himself of all but love,
    And bled for Adam’s helpless race:
    ’Tis mercy all, immense and free,
    For, O my God, it found out me!
  4. Long my imprisoned spirit lay,
    Fast bound in sin and nature’s night;
    Thine eye diffused a quick’ning ray—
    I woke, the dungeon flamed with light;
    My chains fell off, my heart was free,
    I rose, went forth, and followed Thee.
  5. No condemnation now I dread;
    Jesus, and all in Him, is mine;
    Alive in Him, my living Head,
    And clothed in righteousness divine,
    Bold I approach th’ eternal throne,
    And claim the crown, through Christ my own.

You see the confession of the Deity of Christ is the very seal of God with us that shows us who is of God and who is not.
The Trinity was absolutely devised by the Councils. It was modified 3 times before the final product. Triads of Gods were commonplace in other religions and Christianity simply followed suit. The Sumerians, Egyptians, and Babylonians all had triads of Gods as many do today.

God the Father is ONE. That's what OUR bible says. I believe that. A co-equal Trinity is debunked by Jesus' own words! And the only trinitarian way out is the pull the two natures clause which came about in AD451! The reason for the 'TWO NATURES' is because there is NO OTHER WAY to overcome the blatant Words of Jesus who said THE FATHER IS GREATER - THAT HE DOESN'T KNOW THE DAY OR HOUR OF HIS RETURN - THAT HE CAN DO NOTHING ON HIS OWN! Trinity DEBUNKED by Jesus' own words! It takes a man-made doctrine of two natures to overcome these clear and blatant contradictions!

Peter said and I believe him...

“You men of Israel, listen to these words! Jesus of Nazareth, a man pointed out to you by God by mighty works and wonders and signs, which God did through him in the midst of you, just as you yourselves know."

Peter also said in Acts that Jesus, "Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:

I also believe the author of Hebrews 2:17 who says Jesus was FULLY MAN IN ECERY WAY!

Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

Jesus said he was a man who told the truth...

"But now you are seeking to kill me, a man who has told you the truth that I heard from God; Abraham did not do this!"

I also believe Paul here where he makes a clear distinction between the Father and Jesus, and where God the Father MADE Jesus Lord...

"yet to us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things, AND we are for him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things, and we are through him."

"Therefore, let all the house of Israel know for certain that God has made him—this Jesus whom you crucified both Lord and Christ."

My Lord and my God doesn't mean Jesus is the same person as the Father. We humans are called gods. Thomas was saying that Jesus is Thomas's God. You'll never understand until you know how the word god/God/GOD is used.

John 20:28: by Biblical Unitarian
_______________________________________________________________
1. Jesus never referred to himself as "God" in the absolute sense, so what precedent then did Thomas have for calling Jesus "my God"? The Greek language uses the word theos, ("God" or "god") with a broader meaning than is customary today. In the Greek language and in the culture of the day, "GOD" (all early manuscripts of the Bible were written in all capital letters) was a descriptive title applied to a range of authorities, including the Roman governor (Acts 12:22), and even the Devil (2 Cor. 4:4). It was used of someone with divine authority. It was not limited to its absolute sense as a personal name for the supreme Deity as we use it today. 2. Given the language of the time, and given that Jesus did represent the Father and have divine authority, the expression used by Thomas is certainly understandable. On the other hand, to make Thomas say that Jesus was "God," and thus 1/3 of a triune God, seems incredible.
_____________________________________________________________
 

David H.

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I think you have to look at what took place. It wasn't because of wide acceptance that the trinity was devised. There were bitter battles and riots between Arius and the so-called saint Athanasius. Rome was falling apart, and Constantine knew he had to do something and pick one side or the other to keep the Empire intact. So he sided with the more brutal and powerful Athanasius.

Then who knows how many people were tortured and burned over this one doctrine afterwards.
Like I said to you before, there have always been tares among the wheat right from the get go of the church. The Apostles dealt with them early on in the church. False Prophets, false teachers, Gnostics, Nicolaitans, etc. Satan likes to Usurp what is true and holy. The understanding of the triune Godhead was always existent, It was only during the Nicene creed that it was placed in a creed. My Point is and has always been that the Spirit confirms this doctrine to the Born again believer this being the very unction the Spirit Gives us when we are saved and receive the earnest of the Spirit.

His first words after he was "born again"???
All the Apostles of Christ with the exception of Judas were born again after the resurrection of Christ as shown in John 20 when Jesus Breathed the Spirit on them. This was the earnest of the Spirit, the fullness came at Pentecost when God ascended to heaven. Most Catholics and protestants miss this point because the deny the second move of the Spirit.... seems like you missed this too. Read John 20:22.... Thomas was just late getting there (Verse 24).

Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power: Col. 2:8-10
 
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David H.

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“You men of Israel, listen to these words! Jesus of Nazareth, a man pointed out to you by God by mighty works and wonders and signs, which God did through him in the midst of you, just as you yourselves know."
You assume I am denying the humanity of Christ which I am not. Jesus is God Incarnate (In Human form) A body I have prepared for you.... (Hebrews 10:5)
 
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stunnedbygrace

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All the Apostles of Christ with the exception of Judas were born again after the resurrection of Christ as shown in John 20 when Jesus Breathed the Spirit on them. This was the earnest of the Spirit, the fullness came at Pentecost when God ascended to heaven. Most Catholics and protestants miss this point
Wow…thank you for sharing that.
It almost seems impossible to miss…
 

David H.

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Wow…thank you for sharing that.
This is why Judas is in hell, and Peter is not. (John 17:12) The testament could not come into effect until after the death of the testator. (Hebrews 9:16-17) You will see this play out in acts as well regarding The Samritans (Acts 8:14-17) Apollus (Acts 18:24-25) and the Corinthian believers who had received the Baptism of John (Acts 19:1-6) etc.
 
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stormymonday

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You assume I am denying the humanity of Christ which I am not. Jesus is God Incarnate (In Human form) A body I have prepared for you.... (Hebrews 10:5)
I never said nor assumed you were denying the humanity of Christ. That's quite evident. What you have to prove is this hypostatic union. Where is it found in our bible?

Like I said to you before, there have always been tares among the wheat right from the get go of the church. The Apostles dealt with them early on in the church. False Prophets, false teachers, Gnostics, Nicolaitans, etc. Satan likes to Usurp what is true and holy. The understanding of the triune Godhead was always existent, It was only during the Nicene creed that it was placed in a creed. My Point is and has always been that the Spirit confirms this doctrine to the Born again believer this being the very unction the Spirit Gives us when we are saved and receive the earnest of the Spirit.


All the Apostles of Christ with the exception of Judas were born again after the resurrection of Christ as shown in John 20 when Jesus Breathed the Spirit on them. This was the earnest of the Spirit, the fullness came at Pentecost when God ascended to heaven. Most Catholics and protestants miss this point because the deny the second move of the Spirit.... seems like you missed this too. Read John 20:22.... Thomas was just late getting there (Verse 24).

Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power: Col. 2:8-10
The word Godhead is the word deity and means divinity, divine nature. The word fullness is abundance and completeness. Jesus (as well as believers) was filled with the presence, power, agency, riches of God. Jesus did have the fullness of divinity in that sense because God was with him and he represented God. The verse is not talking about a Trinity - not about Christ being God or having all the attributes of God. This is about God providing Christ with divine 'fullness'. What this verse is saying is made clear earlier in Colossians:

"God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him."

Ephesians 3:19 says that Christians should be filled with “all the fullness of God,

And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye (believers) might be filled with all the fulness of God.

Does that make us believers equal to God?
 
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David H.

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I never said nor assumed you were denying the humanity of Christ. That's quite evident. What you have to prove is this hypostatic union. Where is it found in our bible?
It is not an understanding I can give you that mind of man can comprehend, This fact is confirmed by the Holy Ghost in those who are born again that allows them to proclaim that Jesus is the LORD because they know this in their heart. I Can point you to verses, but your heretical (Opinion) will explain those verses away as so many here like to do. Here is what Got questions writes....

The doctrine of the hypostatic union is an attempt to explain how Jesus could be both God and man at the same time. It is ultimately, though, a doctrine we are incapable of fully understanding. It is impossible for us to fully understand how God works. We, as human beings with finite minds, should not expect to totally comprehend an infinite God. Jesus is God’s Son in that He was conceived by the Holy Spirit (Luke 1:35). But that does not mean Jesus did not exist before He was conceived. Jesus has always existed (John 8:58, 10:30). When Jesus was conceived, He became a human being in addition to being God (John 1:1, 14).

Jesus is both God and man. Jesus has always been God, but He did not become a human being until He was conceived in Mary. Jesus became a human being in order to identify with us in our struggles (Hebrews 2:17) and, more importantly, so that He could die on the cross to pay the penalty for our sins (Philippians 2:5-11). In summary, the hypostatic union teaches that Jesus is both fully human and fully divine, that there is no mixture or dilution of either nature, and that He is one united Person, forever.


Link:

Ultimately this fact is Spiritually discerned, not mentally discerned. Faith precedes understanding, thus faith comes not of the wisdom of men but of the power of God (1 Corinthians 2:5). This is why these things are the test of the Spirit in us. (1 Corinthians 12:3, 1 John 4:1-6).

The word Godhead is the word deity and means divinity, divine nature. The word fullness is abundance and completeness. Jesus (as well as believers) was filled with the presence, power, agency, riches of God. Jesus did have the fullness of divinity in that sense because God was with him and he represented God. The verse is not talking about a Trinity - not about Christ being God or having all the attributes of God. This is about God providing Christ with divine 'fullness'. What this verse is saying is made clear earlier in Colossians:

"God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him."

Ephesians 3:19 says that Christians should be filled with “all the fullness of God,

And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye (believers) might be filled with all the fulness of God.

Does that make us believers equal to God?
Again, this is you giving your opinion (heresy) like so many others do to explain away what you are incapable of seeing with your human finite mind, and have not had the revelation of the Spirit which comes with being born again. Faith comes first then understanding is given by the Spirit's anointing. (1 John 2:27). Go to the cross, if you want this anointing.
 
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stormymonday

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It is not an understanding I can give you that mind of man can comprehend, This fact is confirmed by the Holy Ghost in those who are born again that allows them to proclaim that Jesus is the LORD because they know this in their heart. I Can point you to verses, but your heretical (Opinion) will explain those verses away as so many here like to do. Here is what Got questions writes....

The doctrine of the hypostatic union is an attempt to explain how Jesus could be both God and man at the same time. It is ultimately, though, a doctrine we are incapable of fully understanding. It is impossible for us to fully understand how God works. We, as human beings with finite minds, should not expect to totally comprehend an infinite God. Jesus is God’s Son in that He was conceived by the Holy Spirit (Luke 1:35). But that does not mean Jesus did not exist before He was conceived. Jesus has always existed (John 8:58, 10:30). When Jesus was conceived, He became a human being in addition to being God (John 1:1, 14).

Jesus is both God and man. Jesus has always been God, but He did not become a human being until He was conceived in Mary. Jesus became a human being in order to identify with us in our struggles (Hebrews 2:17) and, more importantly, so that He could die on the cross to pay the penalty for our sins (Philippians 2:5-11). In summary, the hypostatic union teaches that Jesus is both fully human and fully divine, that there is no mixture or dilution of either nature, and that He is one united Person, forever.


Link:

Ultimately this fact is Spiritually discerned, not mentally discerned. Faith precedes understanding, thus faith comes not of the wisdom of men but of the power of God (1 Corinthians 2:5). This is why these things are the test of the Spirit in us. (1 Corinthians 12:3, 1 John 4:1-6).


Again, this is you giving your opinion (heresy) like so many others do to explain away what you are incapable of seeing with your human finite mind, and have not had the revelation of the Spirit which comes with being born again. Faith comes first then understanding is given by the Spirit's anointing. (1 John 2:27). Go to the cross, if you want this anointing.
You have no idea how many times I've heard that line. Now you're building up your case by claiming spiritual superiority. You're going off on the line that I'm incapable because of my FINITE mind because I'm not BORN AGAIN - that you're enlightened and have revelation by the spirit - and I'm not. That you have the spirit's anointing - and I don't - that I'm not born again and need to go to the cross. I should put you on ignore.

Trinity is a mystery because there is no such thing.
 
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