Jesus became Immortal

[David in NJ]

As you well know, much in this thread challenges the traditional understanding of the Gospel. If you're confident that these verses and facts are incorrect, then addressing them directly should be straightforward. I think you'd agree that those who have attempted to do so have failed, and many, yourself included, haven't made any real attempt at all.

i understand that which you are contemplating

Today i am working - at the end of the day i should be free to continue

 

[David in NJ]

I did engage with your posts, you understand nothing, you need to press your memory reset button forget everything you know about religion and read the bible again with a clear mind and an open heart, until you do you will remain the same.

When the LORD saved me and i began reading the bible, i did exactly according to the wisdom that you stated:
a.) forget everything we've been taught from religion
b.) Begin with a clear mind, open heart
c.) prayer and study and prayer and then listening

 

[LoveYeshua]

As you well know, much in this thread challenges the traditional understanding of the Gospel. If you're confident that these verses and facts are incorrect, then addressing them directly should be straightforward. I think you'd agree that those who have attempted to do so have failed, and many, yourself included, haven't made any real attempt at all.

1000% confident! that John is legit and totally inspired. No man could have written what John wrote without the Holy Spirit. you were mislead in believing otherwise.

 

[LoveYeshua]

When the LORD saved me and i began reading the bible, i did exactly according to the wisdom that you stated:
a.) forget everything we've been taught from religion
b.) Begin with a clear mind, open heart
c.) prayer and study and prayer and then listening

I understand, as an ex Catholic I did the same and saw the truth. I am now non denominational and have not yet found a church that follows correctly the words of Christ so far But God Guides me in my study so it's O.K. for now.

Blessings

 

[marks]

You know this to be true

Right-o!

Much love!

 

[David in NJ]

I understand, as an ex Catholic I did the same and saw the truth. I am now non denominational and have not yet found a church that follows correctly the words of Christ so far But God Guides me in my study so it's O.K. for now.
Blessings

We are twins = ex-catholic here as well

i am looking for a church to pastor = a church who only wants TRUTH

SHALOM

 

[Hiddenthings]

1000% confident! that John is legit and totally inspired. No man could have written what John wrote without the Holy Spirit. you were mislead in believing otherwise.

Sorry what is this in reference to? Are you saying your interpretation of John 1:1?

 

[Hiddenthings]

@bdavidc @PS95

I thought I would add this here as another proof text for Jesus being made immortal

In 1 Corinthians 15:45, Paul writes: “The first man Adam became a living being”; the last Adam became a life-giving spirit.

Jesus being the only one to live a sinless life God not only made him immortal but placed in him Life for all those who believe through him.

The reason you can receive Life is because he did
The reason you can be raised from the dead is because he was
In fact, you don't have your own faith - its his!

God has chosen to reconcile everything in the Last Adam.

 

[Aunty Jane]

I understand, as an ex Catholic I did the same and saw the truth. I am now non denominational and have not yet found a church that follows correctly the words of Christ so far But God Guides me in my study so it's O.K. for now.

Blessings

We are twins = ex-catholic here as well

i am looking for a church to pastor = a church who only wants TRUTH

SHALOM

Of all the people I have studied the Bible with over many years, those who were the most shocked, and most appreciative of the truth of the Bible were former Catholics, taught the value of blind obedience to ritual, but never taught how to have a relationship with God and his son on a personal level.…and never taught the value of scripture over church tradition.
I see that the both of you are in limbo (pardon the pun).
No one can be a Christian in isolation from other Christians, but with so many making the claim, how does one discern who is telling the truth? When Scripture is mistranslated and misinterpreted how can any of us know who God’s “people” are?

The apostle Paul revealed that all who are genuine disciples of Christ must all subscribe to the same truth with no divisions among them….(1 Cor 1:10)….so the “body of Christ” or those who make up the “bride“ that Christ will take to heaven, must of necessity all be on the same page, theologically speaking. That leaves the ‘lone rangers’ out on a limb.…knowing that the church system has failed them, but not finding any among those professing “Christians” to uphold what they believe is the truth. So where is God for those wandering in this “no man’s land”?

Could it be that they are looking n the wrong place for the hidden treasure?
According to scripture, Jesus told his disciples some important details about those who are saved….

1) He said that they would be “few” among “many“ who are rejected. (Matt 7:13-14; 21-23) We all have the choice of two paths…one leads to life and the other to destruction. At the end of the day we are all either “sheep or goats”….or….”wheat or weeds”. God does not read labels…he reads hearts.

2) He said that they would be hated and persecuted, and lies told about them. (John 15:18-21; Matt 5:11)
Just as in Jesus’ day, people like to believe the lies rather than what the truth would reveal about the validity of their worship. Are they slaves to religious traditions that have no place among God’s people?
What is the place that God’s people have to remove themselves from? How can we identify “Babylon the great”? (Rev 18:4-5)

3) They had to “know the only true God AND the one he sent, Jesus Christ”. (John 17:3)

With just that criteria, we can eliminate most of Christendom, and also many of the ‘lone rangers’ who seem to be in a constant state of frustration at not being able to locate a suitable church…..we cannot worship the true God in isolation from other Christians, especially now when “the end” is so close. (Heb 10:24-25; Matt 24:14; 28:19-20)

The witness is being given, but “just like the days of Noah”…who is paying attention to the messengers? (Matt 24:37-39)

 

[Hiddenthings]

Hi @David Lamb

We are going to be looking at immortality and how Jesus was the first to receive this change of nature in himself.

We will consider these verses in their context to gain an understanding of why it was so necessary for the Christ to the first to be blessed with immortality.

In my second post we will look at Acts 2:28 in more detail.

Jesus Became Immortal:

"You have made known to me the paths of life." Acts 2:28

Though once subject to death, Jesus now lives forever, immortal, unchanged, and eternal.

We have looked at Acts 2:28 and its context all of which testifies the Lord Jesus received LIFE from His Father and now has become the source of Eternal Life because God the giver of Life has made access to Himself and that Life TROUGH Jesus.

Jesus laid down his life to take it up again:

"I lay down my life, that I may take it up again." John 10:17
"I am he who lives and was dead, and behold, I am alive forevermore." Revelation 1:18

Now it's time to consider the Lords own words from Revelation 1:18

Does it convey the distinction between a mortal life and LIFE everlasting?

 

[Aunty Jane]

@bdavidc @PS95

I thought I would add this here as another proof text for Jesus being made immortal

In 1 Corinthians 15:45, Paul writes: “The first man Adam became a living being”; the last Adam became a life-giving spirit.

Jesus being the only one to live a sinless life God not only made him immortal but placed in him Life for all those who believe through him.

The reason you can receive Life is because he did
The reason you can be raised from the dead is because he was
In fact, you don't have your own faith - its his!

God has chosen to reconcile everything in the Last Adam.

I believe that the one truth that is not acknowledged in this argument is that an immortal cannot die, no matter what form they are living in.
If an entity can die or be destroyed, they are mortal because they can die, or be eliminated from existence.
That means that even angels are not immortal because the lake of fire is a symbol of eternal death. It never was a place of eternal suffering…..”the church” invented that concept as a means to use fear to enforce compliance.
God has no reason or desire to keep incorrigible rebels in existence. He has been weeding them out for centuries. Where did Jesus consign the Pharisees? To “gehenna”…but it isn’t “hell”. It’s another name for the lake of fire…. a place where even any future rebels will end up if they try to usurp God‘s Sovereignty again.
Death and hades will be eliminated but the lake of fire remains forever. (Rev 20:13-14)

Christ was granted immortality after his resurrection because it was a reward for his faithful service to mankind and to his God and Father. Like those who will follow him to heaven, immortality will also be granted.
This is not to be confused with everlasting life, which was granted to our mortal first parents. They had the opportunity to never die, as long as they obeyed their Creator. He provided the means to extend their lives indefinitely, but that means was removed from their grasp because they chose a course that resulted in the death penalty.…which was in turn passed on to all their children.

So unless we understand the difference between immortality and everlasting life, not much will make sense.

 

[Hiddenthings]

I believe that the one truth that is not acknowledged in this argument is that an immortal cannot die, no matter what form they are living in.
If an entity can die or be destroyed, they are mortal because they can die, or be eliminated from existence.
That means that even angels are not immortal because the lake of fire is a symbol of eternal death. It never was a place of eternal suffering…..”the church” invented that concept as a means to use fear to enforce compliance.
God has no reason or desire to keep incorrigible rebels in existence. He has been weeding them out for centuries. Where did Jesus consign the Pharisees? To “gehenna”…but it isn’t “hell”. It’s another name for the lake of fire…. a place where even any future rebels will end up if they try to usurp God‘s Sovereignty again.
Death and hades will be eliminated but the lake of fire remains forever.

Christ was granted immortality after his resurrection because it was a reward for his faithful service to mankind and to his God and Father. Like those who will follow him to heaven, immortality will also be granted.
This is not to be confused with everlasting life, which was granted to our mortal first parents. They had the opportunity to never die, as long as they obeyed their Creator. He provided the means to extend their lives indefinitely, but that means was removed from their grasp because they chose a course that resulted in the death penalty.…which was in turn passed on to all their children.

So unless we understand the difference between immortality and everlasting life, not much will make sense.

Because you have an incorrect view of angels (and the apocalypse) there is some error in your post. Angels cannot die - they are immortal.

Any being which cannot die is immortal - Christs words stand true!

Luke 20:36"...for they cannot die anymore, because they are equal to angels and are sons of God, being sons of the resurrection."

The reason you're confused is that you're misinterpreting apocalyptic symbolism and wrongly applying it to angels.

But you are correct in saying Jesus was rewarded with immortality.

 

[PS95]

@bdavidc @PS95

I thought I would add this here as another proof text for Jesus being made immortal

In 1 Corinthians 15:45, Paul writes: “The first man Adam became a living being”; the last Adam became a life-giving spirit.

Jesus being the only one to live a sinless life God not only made him immortal but placed in him Life for all those who

Of all the people I have studied the Bible with over many years, those who were the most shocked, and most appreciative of the truth of the Bible were former Catholics, taught the value of blind obedience to ritual, but never taught how to have a relationship with God and his son on a personal level.…and never taught the value of scripture over church tradition.
I see that the both of you are in limbo (pardon the pun).
No one can be a Christian in isolation from other Christians, but with so many making the claim, how does one discern who is telling the truth? When Scripture is mistranslated and misinterpreted how can any of us know who God’s “people” are?

The apostle Paul revealed that all who are genuine disciples of Christ must all subscribe to the same truth with no divisions among them….(1 Cor 1:10)….so the “body of Christ” or those who make up the “bride“ that Christ will take to heaven, must of necessity all be on the same page, theologically speaking. That leaves the ‘lone rangers’ out on a limb.…knowing that the church system has failed them, but not finding any among those professing “Christians” to uphold what they believe is the truth. So where is God for those wandering in this “no man’s land”?

Could it be that they are looking n the wrong place for the hidden treasure?
According to scripture, Jesus told his disciples some important details about those who are saved….

1) He said that they would be “few” among “many“ who are rejected. (Matt 7:13-14; 21-23) We all have the choice of two paths…one leads to life and the other to destruction. At the end of the day we are all either “sheep or goats”….or….”wheat or weeds”. God does not read labels…he reads hearts.

2) He said that they would be hated and persecuted, and lies told about them. (John 15:18-21; Matt 5:11)
Just as in Jesus’ day, people like to believe the lies rather than what the truth would reveal about the validity of their worship. Are they slaves to religious traditions that have no place among God’s people?
What is the place that God’s people have to remove themselves from? How can we identify “Babylon the great”? (Rev 18:4-5)

3) They had to “know the only true God AND the one he sent, Jesus Christ”. (John 17:3)

With just that criteria, we can eliminate most of Christendom, and also many of the ‘lone rangers’ who seem to be in a constant state of frustration at not being able to locate a suitable church…..we cannot worship the true God in isolation from other Christians, especially now when “the end” is so close. (Heb 10:24-25; Matt 24:14; 28:19-20)

The witness is being given, but “just like the days of Noah”…who is paying attention to the messengers? (Matt 24:37-39)

Hey AuntyJane- where you been? glad to see you are ok. I was wondering..
Catholics are very receptive to people who show them bible verses because they generally didn't read it much since the priests said that only they could interpret it. Now JWs are told the same thing, and come out to show others the VERSES they have memorized. The trouble is, they are out of context most times Or they apply 2 meanings to a verse - one for them and one for you..
Being told the others sheep are not the Gentiles is an error, and that the great crowd therefore, do not need to be born again is also an error. It's a very serious error, Jane. Teaching that your physical death erases your sins so as no need for forgiveness of personal sins by being washed in the blood of the savior is an error. I will stop here...
People tend to focus on the trinity as that's your pet topic- but the forest has many trees, and JWs are so lost in the forest on so many other topics that they should not be teaching anyone a thing.
Sadly while there is not full agreement on everything amongst Christians, and one day that may change, we did see variances in the apostles days-- one held one day above another- one did not- one ate meat- one did not- one ate pork - one did not etc- we still see those things today in Christianity. We do not walk in lockstep conformity teachings lies. We have Jws for that.
What we do agree on is truth. Jesus is God's Unique Son who paid for our personal sins with His blood, and we must be born again and only by God's spirit in us we are saved.

I believe in the power of God's Word going forth and accomplishing His purpose through and in Christ. However, you impose interpretations onto John 1:1 that simply aren’t there, and you overlook how Christ became the Word made flesh.

This is why I'm holding you to what has been shown from prophecies such a Psalm 21:4 and quoted by Jesus in John 5:26 and confirmed by the Apostle Paul!

"The Father has life in Himself, and He has granted the Son also to have life in Himself."

The word granted is key to the teaching you need to address, along with the many other verses that show the apostles clearly understood that Jesus became immortal.

If you can engage with these texts directly, without diverting or imposing preconceived interpretations onto other scriptures, then we have much to discuss!


No, that's like your hope, Jesus was born from Heaven!

You are no different

"Our hope is anchored behind the curtain, firm and secure, where Jesus has entered on our behalf." Heb 6:19

It appears your understanding of Hebrews 6 is a weakness, would I be right in saying this?

The only difference comparing you with the Lord Jesus Christ is he was given conception by the Holy Spirit Power.

Christs eternal nature and reward (inheritance) also came from behind the curtain which God tore.


The part I've highlighted in red is precisely where your argument falls apart. If I were to examine your comment more closely, I’d have to point out that there’s an element of self deception and inconsistency (if not dishonesty) not because your view conflicts with mine, but because it contradicts the apostles' clear teaching about the true nature of Christ and the reward he received for his obedience.

Right now, you're not making a distinction between Christ in the flesh and the glorified, risen Christ (you actually can't).

It might be best for you to revisit those earlier posts, which present the correct understanding of how Christ was glorified. Once you've reflected on those, you can come back and engage meaningfully with “Jesus became” or “was made perfect”

But thank you for taking part in the discussion.

Hiddenthings, Why do you continue tagging me? I am not paying attention to this thread. You deleted my verses from your responses and asked that I stop posting them. We disagree on a huge thing-
Whether Jesus was the Word who was with God who became flesh and walked among us..
I see no point is discussing a single thing with you beyond that point. It's pointless. It causes you and I to be at a standstill.

 

[Hiddenthings]

Hiddenthings, Why do you continue tagging me? I am not paying attention to this thread. You deleted my verses from your responses and asked that I stop posting them. We disagree on a huge thing-
Whether Jesus was the Word who was with God who became flesh and walked among us..
I see no point is discussing a single thing with you beyond that point. It's pointless. It causes you and I to be at a standstill.

LOL, you completely failed to address the verses in the original post and all the supporting evidence that followed. And the evidence keeps coming

 

[Hiddenthings]

Whether Jesus was the Word who was with God who became flesh and walked among us..

BTW, we I believe the same! - what we disagree is the How?

 

[PS95]

I believe that the one truth that is not acknowledged in this argument is that an immortal cannot die, no matter what form they are living in.
If an entity can die or be destroyed, they are mortal because they can die, or be eliminated from existence.
That means that even angels are not immortal because the lake of fire is a symbol of eternal death. It never was a place of eternal suffering…..”the church” invented that concept as a means to use fear to enforce compliance.
God has no reason or desire to keep incorrigible rebels in existence. He has been weeding them out for centuries. Where did Jesus consign the Pharisees? To “gehenna”…but it isn’t “hell”. It’s another name for the lake of fire…. a place where even any future rebels will end up if they try to usurp God‘s Sovereignty again.
Death and hades will be eliminated but the lake of fire remains forever.

Christ was granted immortality after his resurrection because it was a reward for his faithful service to mankind and to his God and Father. Like those who will follow him to heaven, immortality will also be granted.
This is not to be confused with everlasting life, which was granted to our mortal first parents. They had the opportunity to never die, as long as they obeyed their Creator. He provided the means to extend their lives indefinitely, but that means was removed from their grasp because they chose a course that resulted in the death penalty.…which was in turn passed on to all their children.

So unless we understand the difference between immortality and everlasting life, not much will make sense.

I am flabbergasted by JWs. The WT says that Michael the archangel's "life force" was put into Mary's ovum and a life force has no personality or anything. But once it was removed from Michael, he went out of existence. Jesus was born and when He was crucified that life force went back to heaven so that Jehovah could re-create Michael. The man Jesus is dead forever.

That is all made up nonsense! And you want to teach us?

 

[PS95]

LOL, you completely failed to address the verses in the original post and all the supporting evidence that followed. And the evidence keeps coming

I read your Op the other day- that's it. Then I read some of your replies to my verses which you did not address..which says everything to me..
So What is your question in a nutshell ?

 

[Hiddenthings]

I read your Op the other day- that's it. Then I read some of your replies to my verses which you did not address..which says everything to me..
So What is your question in a nutshell ?

There’s no question here. If you chose to treat the original post lightly, that’s your decision. But there are plenty of unanswered posts in this thread, a long list of Scripture quotes, all pointing to the same truth: that Christ was made immortal.

We both know what the Second Adam became!

 

[PS95]

There’s no question here. If you chose to treat the original post lightly, that’s your decision. But there are plenty of unanswered posts in this thread, a long list of Scripture quotes, all pointing to the same truth: that Christ was made immortal.

We both know what the Second Adam became!

OK well- If there is no question then why do you continue to reply to me? I have not read your thread. I've told you why. It's always a standstill when we speak and always will be until you recognize who the Word of God is who came in the flesh.

 

[Hiddenthings]

I am flabbergasted by JWs. The WT says that Michael the archangel's "life force" was put into Mary's ovum and a life force has no personality or anything. But once it was removed from Michael, he went out of existence. Jesus was born and when He was crucified that life force went back to heaven so that Jehovah could re-create Michael. The man Jesus is dead forever.

That is all made up nonsense! And you want to teach us?

On this we agree! But Christ started his existence like you!

Galatians 4:4 "But when the fullness of time had come, God sent forth his Son, born of woman, born under the law..."

Of course God is his Father and you were not born under the Law!