Jesus is Jehovah the YHWH of the Old Testament

[Jack]

Jesus is clearly God of the Bible!

 

[Wrangler]

This is a core Christian principle if you truly believe... What did Jesus mean when He said, “I and the Father are one” (John 10:30)? | GotQuestions.org

No one needs to go to an eisegesis website to know being one with another person is not same as one being.

This is language usage we still invoke today.

 

[Wrangler]

The mystery of the Godhead is hard to grasp

Hard to grasp. Nonsense. Not the same thing.

Round Squares are not "hard to grasp" they are a contradiction in terms, as is the doctrine you advocate.

 

[MatthewG]

Yahavah, is the Father.
The Word of God, was spoken by the Father.
For whatever reason the Father (Yahavah/Yahweh), gave his Word power to create.
The Father spoke, Word - Let there be light and there was.

Genesis 1

:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.

4 And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.

5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.

The Father had a plan to send his Word to earth, who was named Jesus, Immanuel.
In the End you can see that the Lord Yeshua, returns to his prior position by sitting on the throne with his Father (Revelation 3 - 4).
Combining again making the LORD GOD ALMIGHTY.

Revelation 3:

13 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

14 And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;

15 I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.

16 So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.

17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:

18 I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

22 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

Revelation 4

After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.

2 And immediately I was in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne.

3 And he that sat was to look upon like a jasper and a sardine stone: and there was a rainbow round about the throne, in sight like unto an emerald.

4 And round about the throne were four and twenty seats: and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of gold.

5 And out of the throne proceeded lightnings and thunderings and voices: and there were seven lamps of fire burning before the throne, which are the seven Spirits of God.

6 And before the throne there was a sea of glass like unto crystal: and in the midst of the throne, and round about the throne, were four beasts full of eyes before and behind.

7 And the first beast was like a lion, and the second beast like a calf, and the third beast had a face as a man, and the fourth beast was like a flying eagle.

8 And the four beasts had each of them six wings about him; and they were full of eyes within: and they rest not day and night, saying, Holy, holy, holy, Lord God Almighty, which was, and is, and is to come.

9 And when those beasts give glory and honour and thanks to him that sat on the throne, who liveth for ever and ever,

10 The four and twenty elders fall down before him that sat on the throne, and worship him that liveth for ever and ever, and cast their crowns before the throne, saying,

11 Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.

Jesus has never a position over his Father, but he had a position as the Word before leaving that prior place.

1 Corinthians 15:
27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.

Yes, Jesus as the Word helped the Creator create, as he created when God spoke, his Word. The Word created all things. From light, to the sun, to the moon, to the clay in the earth.

Hebrews 1: Before, all things were set up under the feet of Jesus, Jesus at one time sat at the right hand of the Father, before his victory. (Revelation 3-4 above)

1God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,

2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:

4 Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.

I believe there is difference... and Jesus is not the Father... That would be silly seeing Jesus pray to himself... He prayed to Yahavah, Yahweh. And we continue to pray to Yahweh, Yahavah, and pray in the Lord Jesus Name, having relationship, being adopted into being Yahavah's Child.

 

[MatthewG]

Did you read everything that I had shared? I dont care you have a problem with the name @Jack. (Sorry sometimes your comments just seems like you have some type of authority over God's name.) I could be overthinking though, but you address it constantly. (very annoying.)

 

[Wrangler]

And why is it that nearly every time there is opposition to say your take on Jesus and his Father and your religious interpretation of scripture, they label them all as JW? Ignorance abounds indeed.

Not merely ignorance but Appeal to Ad Homenim. I don't need to refute your claim, only call you a pejorative term. You are a "JW," which means nothing you say can possibly have any validity for anyone put in this horrible category has already been demonized, dehumanized and excommunicated from the Body of Christ.

Who needs an argument when name calling will do?

I love how he just comes back with "read your Bible," which implies he's right on the facts and you are wrong. No need to actually make the case ... You're a JW. Read your Bible ... it works on so many levels.

 

[APAK]

Not merely ignorance but Appeal to Ad Homenim. I don't need to refute your claim, only call you a pejorative term. You are a "JW," which means nothing you say can possibly have any validity for anyone put in this horrible category has already been demonized, dehumanized and excommunicated from the Body of Christ.

Who needs an argument when name calling will do?

I love how he just comes back with "read your Bible," which implies he's right on the facts and you are wrong. No need to actually make the case ... You're a JW. Read your Bible ... it works on so many levels.

It's their get-out-of-jail card every time they are placed into a corner.

 

[Jack]

Did you read everything that I had shared?

I've read plenty of what you have said. I quoted several. Should I again?

I dont care you have a problem with the name @Jack.

It's YOU who has a problem with God's Name. Stop playing the victim.

(Sorry sometimes your comments just seems like you have some type of authority over God's name.)

I'm not the one making up a name for God with ZERO proof.

I could be overthinking though, but you address it constantly. (very annoying.)

Stop trying to rewrite our Bible. That leads to Hell fire whether you believe in Hell or not! You're not qualified. Write your own 'bible'. That's what you're trying to do anyway. You'll get burned playing with fire.

Still waiting on Chapter and verse for your attack on God's Name.

Matt said, "Yahavah, is the Father."

 

[Hobie]

No. From Tetragrammaton - Wikipedia: "to be", "to exist", "to cause to become", or "to come to pass"

The VOICE translation uses the word eternal to more closely cover the meaning, which is much more than merely "I am." Aristotle referred to it

Not quite sure what you mean..

 

[Wrangler]

Not quite sure what you mean

What Jesus' God said in Ex 3:14 is more along the lines that he is eternal, "I was, am and am becoming." It is not the straight forward I exist or I am that it is frequently translated. This is what the tetragram of the divine name, YHWH, means.

 

[Jack]

Gen 1:26 God called Himself US and OUR.

Father and Son.

 

[Hobie]

What Jesus' God said in Ex 3:14 is more along the lines that he is eternal, "I was, am and am becoming." It is not the straight forward I exist or I am that it is frequently translated. This is what the tetragram of the divine name, YHWH, means.

You dont understand what He was saying...
'Jesus, in response to the Pharisees’ question “Who do you think you are?” said, “‘Your father Abraham rejoiced at the thought of seeing my day; he saw it and was glad.’ ‘You are not yet fifty years old,’ the Jews said to him, ‘and you have seen Abraham!’ ‘I tell you the truth,’ Jesus answered, ‘before Abraham was born, I am!’ At this, they picked up stones to stone him, but Jesus hid himself, slipping away from the temple grounds” (John 8:56–59). The violent response of the Jews to Jesus’ “I AM” statement indicates they clearly understood what He was declaring—that He was the eternal God incarnate. Jesus was equating Himself with the "I AM" title God gave Himself in Exodus 3:14.

 

[Wrangler]

You dont understand what He was saying...

I understand perfectly what he was saying. Just not reading into it as you.

The violent response of the Jews to Jesus’ “I AM” statement indicates they clearly understood what He was declaring—that He was the eternal God incarnate.

No. Everyone says I am. It is not a claim of deity and God never said it as I explained. No one says I am eternal but the God of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and Jesus.

Jesus claimed to be older than someone else. Not God. Can you be older than someone else and not be God? Jesus great I am statement is
High Priest: Are You God’s Anointed, the Liberating King, the Son of the Blessed One?
Jesus: I am.
Mark 14:61-62 (VOICE)

If Jesus claimed to be God you could quote the verse. The very fact that you have to rely on such extreme eisegesis shows how very weak the claim is. By contrast, I read yesterday John 14:1 where he said "believe in God and also believe in me." This proves he was not God nor thought of himself as God - and requires no reading into the text. Why else would you refer to two people, God and yourself?

 

[Fred J]

Based on the title of the topic, it is plain heresy, just as an unlearned and unstable who twist the teaching and scripture to their own destruction.

For it is written, 'GOD (JEHOVAH), who at sundry times and divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, Hath in these last days spoken unto us by HIS Son (The Word became Jesus).' (Heb 1:1&2)

And, 'But I would have you know, that the Head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the HEAD of Christ (the Word became Jesus) is GOD (JEHOVAH).' (1 Cor 11:3)

Jesus is not JEHOVAH, but rather the express image and brightness glory of the invisible JEHOVAH who art in Heaven and in secret. (Col 1:15/Heb 1:3)

Jesus is Lord and God the Son, who laid the foundation of the earth and the Heavens are the works of His hands. (Heb 1:8-10/Col 1:16&17)

 

[Fred J]

In addition is written, 'But unto the Son (the Word became Jesus) HE (JEHOVAH) saith, "Thy throne, O God (the Word became Jesus), is forever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom. Thou (the Word became Jesus) hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God (the Word became Jesus), even thy GOD (JEHOVAH), hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows. And, thou, Lord ((the Word became Jesus), in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the Heavens are the works of thine hands: ......................."

 

[MonoBiblical]

Not quite sure what you mean..

His name is two transitive verbs which mean to begin. The "roots" are passive forms from passive stems.

 

[Grailhunter]

Jehovah is the Hebrew name for God in the Old Testament.

Jehovah is not the Hebrew name for Yahweh in the Old Testament.

Any one or person or place that you read has a name that starts with a J it is actually a Y. The letter J and it pronunciation did not come out until the 1400's AD. No biblical language has words that that sounded like a J. This is not hard to prove, look in any linguistic resource....the strongs are any Lexicon and look how the words are actually pronounced and you will see they are pronounced with a Y.

 

[MonoBiblical]

Jehovah is not the Hebrew name for Yahweh in the Old Testament.

Any one or person or place that you read has a name that starts with a J it is actually a Y. The letter J and it pronunciation did not come out until the 1400's AD. No biblical language has words that that sounded like a J. This is not hard to prove, look in any linguistic resource....the strongs are any Lexicon and look how the words are actually pronounced and you will see they are pronounced with a Y.

I may actually be a hard ee sound followed by a Y sound. Everything is guesswork.

 

[Grailhunter]

I may actually be a hard ee sound followed by a Y sound. Everything is guesswork.

You are correct and it is not guesswork.

 

[MonoBiblical]

You are correct and it is not guesswork.

You mean we can be certain based on certain transliterations.