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Jesus says look for these Signs to know when My Return is Near.

Discussion in 'Eschatology & Prophecy Forum' started by GISMYS_7, Jan 10, 2018.

  1. Stranger

    Stranger Well-Known Member

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    So? They have not yet been saved at the time of the rapture.

    Stranger
     
  2. GISMYS_7

    GISMYS_7 Active Member

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    Read Revelation and do some research on the Millennial kingdom Jesus rules with the returned raptured believers!
     
  3. Jay Ross

    Jay Ross Active Member

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    It would seem that you have been told that this is so but you do not know the scriptures to back up your adopted opinion and your expressed claims that "on the Millennial Kingdom Jesus rules with the returned raptured believers."

    It is your claim that I am asking for you to provide the scriptural confirmation. If you cannot or will not provide that scriptural confirmation, or any one else who agrees with this adopted opinion, then I can only assume that I can ignore your claim(s) as being a furphy and take no heed of them.

    In Revelation, it speaks of the saints {Please note that there is no mention of these saints being raptured.}, who enter the Millennium Age will have a priestly role over the nations and people groups in line with Christ's priestly role during the Millennium Age. A humble servant's role. Not the arrogant kingly role I seem to be hearing in your posts. If what I am hearing, is true, the arrogance expressed in your above posts in your anticipation of being raptured soon, would, in my understanding of scripture, deny you any hope of being raptured when it will occur.

    Now if your opinion on being raptured and then returning to rule with Christ is true as you claim, then it behoves you to provide the proof without palming it off to others who may come to a very different conclusion/understanding of these same scriptures in Revelation, contrary to what you are claiming.

    If it is true what you are claiming, then it should be very simple for you to provide the proof. If you will not provide that proof, then I and others can only assume that the claimed proof in Revelations does not exist.

    The ball is really in your court to prove your case, not mine as you have suggested above.
     
  4. GISMYS_7

    GISMYS_7 Active Member

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    JUDE 14_15 Jesus returns with the "raptured" saints.
    2 Timothy 2:12 12 if we endure, we will also reign with him. If we disown him, he will also disown us;
    “I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony for Jesus and because of the word of God…. They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years…. This is the first resurrection” (Revelation 20:4–5). So, these saints join the others who will reign with Christ in the kingdom.
     
  5. "ByGrace"

    "ByGrace" Well-Known Member

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    The Kingdom is ALWAYS at hand... @GISMYS_7 ..you have taken your eyes away from the "Kingdom now" and have you focus on some "event"
    You have substituted a moment by moment relationship with the Lord now for some "future event".
    The way that you thread after thread go on and on about this one subject obsession of yours.. ...is a dangerous very sign that you have built yourself a IDOL...anything which take the place of Jesus in our life..today, now, is an idol.

    You talk more about "the rapture" than anything else! It has become your god, obsession, idol, worship, focus.....

    Praying for you.
     
  6. GISMYS_7

    GISMYS_7 Active Member

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    Yes!! There is NO greater event in the life of believers dead or alive than the ""very near""Rapture (catching up of all believers dead and alive and given new immortal bodies and then return to heaven with Jesus. Will you be left behind?? Come quickly Lord Jesus!!
     
  7. "ByGrace"

    "ByGrace" Well-Known Member

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    Wow...you are totally DECEIVED by the enemy...because what I made read, that you wrote..is a lie from the Pit.
    So this "event" has become to you the "greatest thing" !!!

    You dwell in a little world of you own, and lost the focus of what The Good News is really all about.
    If this one Event was "the most important thing in our life" THE BIBLE WOULD SAY AS MUCH... and it does not. It is one of the least subjects spoken about in the bible...

    Again, YOU have made it an IDOL...
     
  8. Guestman

    Guestman Active Member

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    Because of the inaccuracy of many Bibles, such as the King James Bible, as at Matthew 24, those who read them are naturally misled. At Matthew 24:3, the King James Bible reads: "And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be ?(of the temple in Jerusalem being destroyed) and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world ?"

    Did Jesus disciples say "what will be the sign of thy coming ?" No. Let's look more accurately at what Jesus disciples said. They asked: "Tell us, when will these things be, and what will be the sign of your presence and of the conclusion of the system of things ?"

    Jesus disciples were asking Jesus regarding his invisible "presence", not "coming", for they used the Greek word parousia meaning "to be beside" and not the Greek word erchomai meaning "coming" that Jesus used at Matthew 24:30, in which he said that "they (nations of the earth) shall see the Son of man coming (Greek erchomai) in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory".

    At Matthew 24:37-39, Jesus parallels his invisible "presence" with the "days of Noah" that lasted some 120 years (Gen 6:3), saying: "For just as the days of Noah were, so the presence (Greek parousia) of the Son of man will be. For as they were in those days before the Flood, eating and drinking, men marrying and women being given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, and they took no note until the Flood came and swept them all away, so the presence (Greek parousia) of the Son of man will be".

    The apostle Paul further identifies Jesus invisible "presence" as extending to the end of Jesus "thousand year" reign at which point Jesus "hands over the Kingdom to his God and Father, when he has brought to nothing all government and all authority and power".(1 Cor 15:23, 24)

    So Jesus invisible "presence", unseen by the world, but discerned by Jesus genuine disciples because of the "sign of his presence", identifying features that would pin-point the time period. He said: "For nation will rise against nation and kingdom against kingdom, and there will be food shortages and earthquakes in one place after another. All these things are a beginning of pangs of distress".(Matt 24:7, 8)

    Hence, the beginning of Jesus invisible "presence" would be see warfare, food shortages and earthquakes, pointing to the fact that it would cover an extended period of time, like the "beginning of pangs of distress" that a woman feels many weeks in advance of her giving birth, not a moment in time as "coming" or sudden arrival means.

    At Revelation 6, this "beginning" of Jesus invisible "presence" is laid out (that was the unveiling of the scroll "sealed tight with seven seals"[Rev 5:1], saying: "I heard one of the four living creatures say with a voice like thunder: "Come !" And I saw, and look ! a white horse, and the one seated on it had a bow; and a crown was given him, and he went out conquering and to complete his conquest".(Rev 6:1, 2)

    Who is the ' rider on the white horse ' ? Revelation 19 identifies him as Jesus Christ.(Rev 19:11-16) Thus, when Jesus was crowned king of God's Kingdom (or the Messianic Kingdom), he immediately went out "conquering" when he battled "the dragon" Satan and his demons and forcibly cast them down to the earth, bringing great woes on the earth.(Rev 12:7-12)

    But when did Jesus receive his crown that also began his invisible "presence" ? Revelation 6:3, 4 gives us the time, saying: "When he opened the second seal, I heard the second living creature say: "Come ! " Another (rider) came out, a fiery-colored horse, and it was granted to the one seated on it to take peace away from the earth so that they should slaughter one another, and he was given a great sword".

    When was ' peace taken away from the earth ' for the first time in human history ? With the outbreak of World War I on July 28, 1914, so that by the end of the war, some 93 percent of earth's population was involved. For a certainty, peace had been taken away from the earth on a global scale.

    Revelation 6:5, 6 now says: "When he opened the third seal, I heard the third living creature (or angel) say: "Come ! " And I saw, and look ! a (rider on a ) black horse, and the one seated on it had a pair of scales (that carefully weighed out small quantities of food). I heard what sounded like a voice in the midst of four living creatures say: "A quart of wheat for a denarius (or a whole day's pay in the 1st century) and three quarts of barley (seen as inferior to wheat) for a denarius; and do not harm the olive oil and the wine (commodities now considered as luxuries that few could afford)".

    Now food shortages (or famine) were occurring due to the destructive effects of war on the lands where the war was fought and displacement of hundreds of thousands of individuals. How far would 1 quart of wheat or 3 quarts of barley go for a large family ? And how would anyone pay all the other bills since all of the money is used up on just food ?

    At Revelation 6:7, 8, it says: "When he opened the fourth seal, I heard a voice of the fourth living creature say: "Come ! " And I saw, and look ! a (rider on a) pale horse, and the one seated on it had the name Death. And the Grave was closely following him. And authority was given them (Death and the Grave) over the fourth of the earth (large swath), to kill with a long sword (warfare) and with food shortage (famine) and with deadly plague (deadly diseases) and by the wild beasts (political governments or systems that have murdered many people) of the earth".

    About 70 million people died from famines during the 20th century. One authority estimated that "805 million people - about one in nine of the world's population - were chronically undernourished in 2012-14". Another report states: "Hunger kills more people every year than AIDS, malaria, and tuberculosis combined" and that "25,000 people, both adults and children, die every day from hunger and related causes" and "one in seven people goes to bed hungry each night".(United Nations World Food Programme, June 4, 2009)

    And then there is "deadly plague", or diseases and illness that causes death. One such one was the Spanish Flu, that over the course of 1918-20, took the lives of an estimated 50 to 100 million people, several more times the number of the estimated 13 million that lost their lives from World War I. Death and the Grave have no end to its number of victims.

    The "riders of the four horsemen" continues on, but only for a short time longer. (Jesus ride as king of God's Kingdom will continue on until he turns the Kingdom over to God, at which time he will have conquered the "last enemy, (Adamic) death", 1 Cor 15:24-26)
     
  9. pompadour

    pompadour Active Member Encounter Team

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    The two witnesses, as I remember show up 5 days before the anti-Christ is reveled. the anti-Christ can't be reviled until the restrainer is removed. Pomp.
     
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