JW Non-Millennialism: Jesus comes again 'in the flesh'

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WPM

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As pointed out before. It's a silly suggestion, that everything in the Millennium of Jesus be found in Rev 20. It's the same as demanding every thing about the coming of Jesus be found Isaiah 53.


We're certainly coming to a close, unless you come up with something new to consider. Or you address any of my points specifically.

Other than that, it's just you saying nah-ah, and repeating yourself.

What would help is: when you make sweeping claims about a future millennium if you would quote actual Scripture. Your opinions do not cut it. Amils do this all the time in their posts. Premils do not because what they claim and what Rev 20 says are often 2 different things.
 
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WPM

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Churlish senselessness is not an argument of adults.

Your spit ball mentality has gotten old.



However many Gog and Magog may be, they will be them that obey outwardly, because of punishment of law, but not inwardly with faith and the Spirit.

Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity.

Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

Your obvious disdain for the great harvest of souls by Jesus and His saints during His Millennium, while only looking for the burning up of all people not like yourself, plainly shows the spirit you are of, and that you no doubt fit the bill for having only an outward form of godliness.

The Pharisees were equally disdainful of any person that did not agree with them.

Your spirit and love of wrath needs to be repented of.

For the wrath of man worketh not the righteousness of God.

Your prophesy of Jesus coming again to kill off all unbelieving flesh, is false. He will still be coming to save them that would believe and obey Him from the heart, during His earthly reign.

The truth hurts. This is the reality of what you believe.

Do you believe a temple in Jerusalem will be rebuilt in your millennium?
Do you believe there will be a priesthood set up in the temple in your millennium?
Do you believe that they will make blood sacrifices in your millennium?
 

robert derrick

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To be fair they believe the resurrection is in the future. They believe the Millennium is happening now and the second coming is future as is the rapture and resurrection.
To be correct, their millennium is not God's of Scripture, no more than another gospel made by man, is God's gospel that Paul preached.

They don't believe in The Millennium of Jesus Christ, but a symbolic millennium of their own.

1. They reject the millennium of one thousand years.
2. They reject Jesus and His resurrected saints ruling natural people on this earth.

The spiritual reign of Christ on earth today, ruling over His people's lives is true, but it's not His Millennium.

I simply believe in the Millennium reign of Christ, as I endeavor to do all teachings of plain Scripture. All other teachings of His millennium are just as false, as any other false teaching, that twists Scripture to produce.

There are Christians believing and teaching a created christ. That doesn't mean they believe in Jesus Christ of Scripture.

And so, in conclusion, Christians can believe whatever they want from the Bible. I only care about proper handling of scripture, so as to only teach the true things of the Lord God.

Heresies come and go, but the truth of Scripture remains forever. I prefer knowing the truth, rather than having fun with my own ideas and imagination.
 

robert derrick

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You need to take time and find out what Amils really believe before trying to present yourself as some end-time authority. You do not have a clue what Amils believe. If you did you would not come out with these false charges all the time. The only thing you are exposing here is your own ignorance.
Let's see now, this is about the 3rd or 4th time I've heard this recording.

Yes, things are definitely drawing to a close.
 

robert derrick

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The truth hurts. This is the reality of what you believe.

Do you believe a temple in Jerusalem will be rebuilt in your millennium?
The temple in Ezekiel will be built and entered into by the Lord with His glory on earth.

Waters to swim in will run out of His house, to clease the Dead Sea.

There is no sea on the new earth, much less a dead one needing cleansing.


Do you believe there will be a priesthood set up in the temple in your millennium?
The same priesthood of outwardly and inwardly circumcised Hebrews and Jews, as that prophesied in Ezekiel.



Do you believe that they will make blood sacrifices in your millennium?
They will be His natural priesthood for all the earth with blood sacrifices, even as first promised in Ex 19.

All the earth will be land of the King, and all nations will be His subjects, and His earthly priesthood will make sacrifices for their sins.

The yearly feast of the tabernacle will be kept by all nations, or lose their rain.

The law of the Lord will be enforced righteously over all the earth.

There will be no wars allowed by the King, between His subject nations.
 

WPM

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Let's see now, this is about the 3rd or 4th time I've heard this recording.

Yes, things are definitely drawing to a close.

I will keep repeating until you start telling the truth. I notice you have a major difficulty with apologizing when you are wrong. That is religious pride!
 

WPM

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The temple in Ezekiel will be built and entered into by the Lord with His glory on earth.

Waters to swim in will run out of His house, to clease the Dead Sea.

There is no sea on the new earth, much less a dead one needing cleansing.



The same priesthood of outwardly and inwardly circumcised Hebrews and Jews, as that prophesied in Ezekiel.




They will be His natural priesthood for all the earth with blood sacrifices, even as first promised in Ex 19.

All the earth will be land of the King, and all nations will be His subjects, and His earthly priesthood will make sacrifices for their sins.

The yearly feast of the tabernacle will be kept by all nations, or lose their rain.

The law of the Lord will be enforced righteously over all the earth.

There will be no wars allowed by the King, between His subject nations.

Amils reject this error. They believe Jesus was the final sacrifice for sin. There will never again be a competing priesthood of rival sin offerings.

What is the purpose of these blood sacrifices of the innocent in your so-called future millennium?
 

robert derrick

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Your claim is a joke, a complete distraction

Jesus returns in fire and final judgment (The End) at this time the resurrection and catching up takes place in the "Twikling Of An Eye" (The End)
This is a classic sloppy reading of Scripture to prophecy one's on prophecy.

In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

The resurrection of dead bodies and changing of them alive, is in a moment of time.

Them being caught up ascending in the air, is in plain sight of men, just as with Jesus and His two witnesses.

For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.


They are not caught up in a twinkling, in order to avoid fire of God from heaven, which would pass through the air to earth, anyway.

And, you still don't believing in the Lord's Millennium reign on earth for a thousand years.
 

robert derrick

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What would help is: when you make sweeping claims about a future millennium if you would quote actual Scripture. Your opinions do not cut it. Amils do this all the time in their posts. Premils do not because what they claim and what Rev 20 says are often 2 different things.
Been there and done that with you. I don't waste time being ignored more than once or twice at most. I don't do endless debates.
 

WPM

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The book of Ezekiel is not error.

The Symbol Man's Bible is a joke.

When Jesus cried it is finished, the old covenant sacrifice system was finished. This was reinforced by the ripping of the temple curtain in two. Christ was the final sacrifice for sin.

Hebrews 7:27 says of Christ and His final atonement, “Who needeth not daily, as those high priests, to offer up sacrifice, first for his own sins, and then for the people's: for this he did once, when he offered up himself.”


Hebrews 9:28 explains that "Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many.”


Hebrews 10:10 says, “we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.”


Hebrews 10:12 says, “this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God.”


Hebrews 10:14 says, For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.”


There it is! Clear and irrefutable! This is the sacrifice to end all sacrifices forever!!! "Forever" actually means "forever."

Romans 6:10 says, he died unto sin once.”


1 Peter 3:18 says, “For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit.”


Hebrews 9:12 explains, “by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.”


Christ put an end of sin by this final transaction for sin, thus making an end of sin forever for those who would believe. There will never again be a sacrifice for sin. Christ’s atonement satisfied heaven’s holy demands and ensured that there would never again be another sacrifice/offering for sin carrying God’s blessing.
 

robert derrick

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That was old covenant. Hello! We have moved into the new covenant. Time to let the old go.
The old covenant and law of Moses is past decaying.

The prophecies of Jesus coming again and His millennial reign on earth, is not yet fulfilled.
 

robert derrick

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When Jesus cried it is finished, the old covenant sacrifice system was finished. This was reinforced by the ripping of the temple curtain in two. Christ was the final sacrifice for sin.

Hebrews 7:27 says of Christ and His final atonement, “Who needeth not daily, as those high priests, to offer up sacrifice, first for his own sins, and then for the people's: for this he did once, when he offered up himself.”


Hebrews 9:28 explains that "Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many.”

Hebrews 10:10 says, “we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.”

Hebrews 10:12 says, “this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God.”

Hebrews 10:14 says, For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.”

There it is! Clear and irrefutable! This is the sacrifice to end all sacrifices forever!!! "Forever" actually means "forever."

Romans 6:10 says, he died unto sin once.”


1 Peter 3:18 says, “For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit.”

Hebrews 9:12 explains, “by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.”

Christ put an end of sin by this final transaction for sin, thus making an end of sin forever for those who would believe. There will never again be a sacrifice for sin. Christ’s atonement satisfied heaven’s holy demands and ensured that there would never again be another sacrifice/offering for sin carrying God’s blessing.
His sacrifice for the lamb is for all that believe and obey Him, to be forgiven of past sins and to go and sin no more.

The natural priesthood of the King, will be offering sacrifice in blood for the errors of all His subjects on earth, whether saved or not.

Those priests will be saved Hebrews and Jews with both outward circumcision of the flesh, and inward circumcision of Christ.

Sacrifice of the Lamb of God saves and purifies the soul. It does not forbid sacrifice of bulls and goats, which cannot cleanse the conscience, but only puts off judgement for sins.

People can still sacrifice any animal they wish, just not for purifying to the spirit and flesh, which only comes by circumcision of the Spirit of Christ.

They can also eat their meat in the shambles, so long as it is not offered up to idols.

If the Lord commands animal sacrifice during His reign on earth, no man nor doctrine can forbid Him.
 

WPM

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His sacrifice for the lamb is for all that believe and obey Him, to be forgiven of past sins and to go and sin no more.

The natural priesthood of the King, will be offering sacrifice in blood for the errors of all His subjects on earth, whether saved or not.

Those priests will be saved Hebrews and Jews with both outward circumcision of the flesh, and inward circumcision of Christ.

Sacrifice of the Lamb of God saves and purifies the soul. It does not forbid sacrifice of bulls and goats, which cannot cleanse the conscience, but only puts off judgement for sins.

People can still sacrifice any animal they wish, just not for purifying to the spirit and flesh, which only comes by circumcision of the Spirit of Christ.

They can also eat their meat in the shambles, so long as it is not offered up to idols.

If the Lord commands animal sacrifice during His reign on earth, no man nor doctrine can forbid Him.

Is this practiced under the old covenant, the new covenant or a new old covenant?
 

Timtofly

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Continued.....

What are "the mountains" for us today? Because the dual fulfillment of Jesus' prophesy carries us forward to our day when a greater tribulation is prophesied at the time of Jesus' return. (Matthew 24:21)
The "disgusting thing" is the United Nations pretending to be 'the political expression of God's Kingdom on earth' and this will cause many in Christendom to welcome her promises of "peace and security"....but it will be a false hope.

1 Thessalonians 5:1-4 says...
"Now as for the times and the seasons, brothers, you need nothing to be written to you. 2 For you yourselves know very well that Jehovah’s day is coming exactly as a thief in the night. 3 Whenever it is that they are saying, “Peace and security!” then sudden destruction is to be instantly on them, just like birth pains on a pregnant woman, and they will by no means escape. 4 But you, brothers, you are not in darkness, so that the day should overtake you as it would thieves"...

True Christians will have already 'fled to the mountains'.....they have removed themselves from Babylon the great and they are ready for what is about to happen......whenever it happens.


You think angels are the literal stars? You think that they are going to be on the earth? Where does it say this?



The prophesy mentions Christ's "parousia" which means "presence"......it must include his arrival because his" presence" cannot occur without him arriving at some point. The last days were to begin with the sign he gave, and they were to finish with his judgment. Two separate events....one unseen by the world....the other a visible manifestation of his presence.


I have no idea what that is supposed to mean, and without scriptural backup, your words are rather empty.
It is all written in God's Word. The Second Coming is obviously going to be way more different than you all are expecting.

Matthew 25:31 declares Jesus as King sits on a glorious throne. If you doubt it is in a temple in Jerusalem, do you have another building or city in mind?
 

Aunty Jane

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It is all written in God's Word. The Second Coming is obviously going to be way more different than you all are expecting.
Either that, or it will not be what Christendom is expecting....which could be a variety of outcomes judging by what is revealed on these threads....I like to just let the Bible explain itself, which it does beautifully unless people want to complicate what is a relatively simple story...introducing concepts that are not in the Bible at all.
Matthew 25:31 declares Jesus as King sits on a glorious throne. If you doubt it is in a temple in Jerusalem, do you have another building or city in mind?
The location of God's grand Temple is not on the earth now....this is in "New Jerusalem, also called "heavenly Jerusalem. (Rev 21:1-2; Hebrews 12:22)
When God allowed the Romans to destroy his earthly Temple in 70 C.E. it was because his purpose in connection with earthly Jerusalem and fleshly Israel was finished. They could never keep their covenants and constantly disobeyed the Commandments that Jehovah gave them.
Once Jehovah had fulfilled his promise to Abraham to provide a seed from his descendants, God was finished with them, but only after he had given them first option to become "a kingdom of priests and a holy nation"....(Exodus 19:4-6)....this of course was only held our to that "remnant" of fleshly Israel who came to Christ, accepting him as Messiah. We know that the nation as a whole rejected him, and still do to this day.

As Paul said, much of what took place on earth foreshadowed something heavenly.....Jerusalem was the earthly location of God's Temple, which was the seat of God's worship at that time. When God was finished with natural Israel, he chose a new nation to serve his interests here on earth...the disciples of his son. (Acts 15:14) These Paul called, "the Israel of God", (Gal 6:16) made up of fleshly Jews and Gentiles who came to Christ from the nations.

Jesus told the Samaritan woman at the well something about the place to worship God in the future....
She said to him..."Our forefathers worshipped on this mountain, but you people say that in Jerusalem is the place where people must worship.” 21 Jesus said to her: “Believe me, woman, the hour is coming when neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem will you worship the Father. 22 You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, because salvation begins with the Jews. 23 Nevertheless, the hour is coming, and it is now, when the true worshippers will worship the Father with spirit and truth, for indeed, the Father is looking for ones like these to worship him. 24 God is a Spirit, and those worshipping him must worship with spirit and truth.”

Because the worship of the true God was to become international, (Acts 1:8) a geographical location for God's Temple and seat of worship, would make no sense. The Temple of God is now in heaven, where spiritually, every person can worship God no matter where they live on the earth. There is a priesthood serving in that Temple with Jesus as High Priest. (Hebrews 3:1) All can access God through this arrangement during the 1000 years of Christ's rulership.

Revelation 21:1-5....
"And I saw a new heaven and a new earth; for the former heaven and the former earth had passed away, and the sea is no more. 2 I also saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God and prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 3 With that I heard a loud voice from the throne say: “Look! The tent of God is with mankind, and he will reside with them, and they will be his people. And God himself will be with them. 4 And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former things have passed away."

5 And the One seated on the throne said: “Look! I am making all things new.” Also he says: “Write, for these words are faithful and true.”

The 'new heaven and new earth' are not the literal planet and the universe....they were created perfect, so there is no need to replace them....what will happen was prefigured in Noah's day...a complete cleansing of the earth, wiping away all wickedness....and starting again with righteous people...only this time the reset will last forever.
Jesus and his angelic forces will accomplish this, his disciples will not be involved.....we will just be bystanders watching our amazing Lord Jesus and his angels wiping this earth clean of all who practice what God hates.
 

Truth7t7

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we will just be bystanders watching our amazing Lord Jesus and his angels wiping this earth clean of all who practice what God hates.
Scripture teaches this present earth will be "Dissolved" by fire, down to its very "Elements"

Your claim that this earth is wiped clean, is contrary to scripture

2 Peter 3:10-12KJV
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
 

Truth7t7

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I only care about proper handling of scripture, so as to only teach the true things of the Lord God.

I prefer knowing the truth, rather than having fun with my own ideas and imagination.
Real Big Smiles!

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