It seems that ATP accepted Christianity because he now have permission to sin without feeling guilty. And they call this "grace".
God, have mercy on us sinners.
God, have mercy on us sinners.
Keeping Jesus' commanads is requirement for salvation
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It's a very sad situation. Mjrhealth is following right along with our friend, ATP.Joyful said:
The blind, leading the blind straight into the pit.
Here we stand, calling to them to repent...what more can we do?
My heart is crying out to God to open their eyes, before it is too late!
Christians still keep the ten commandments.
So how is it "Jesus never gave us the law"? (Maybe I am not understanding what you are saying)
Respectfully, Tom55
Now I'm really confused. I thought Jesus re-affirmed the following of the Ten Commandments in Matthew 19:16-20? He mentions 6 of 10 commandments in that one sentence and he re-affirms the following of the other 4 Commandments throughout the bible. Remember, He was speaking to Jews and they already knew the Commandments but he still re-affirmed with them or reminded them that they still have to follow those Commandments PLUS the love Commandment. Jesus added to the Ten Commandments.mjrhealth said:
So how is it "Jesus never gave us the law"? (Maybe I am not understanding what you are saying)
Respectfully, Tom55
ewq1938
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tom55 said:
Not the Saturday Sabbath. He did not affirm that knowing that he would be our Sabbath/Rest. We can have that any day of the week, everyday if we wish and we can work and cook and travel as much as we want on Saturdays.
Let me ask you all a question, without the LAW, before you became a christian, did you, rape, steal, murder, be evil and horrible, without the law would you do such things???
If you answer no, than why???
In simple terms, there is a jewellry shop that has no security. A man walks past, he can see all the jewelry in side door is locked but doesnt concer him and so he walsk past. Second man walks past, not planning on doing anything wrong, but he sees the shop, notices no one is around so he breaks in and steals. Than a third man comes along, he lready kows the shop has no secuity so he deliberatley breaks in and steals.
Owner isntalls security cameras and alarm. First man walks past, still not concerned and contiues walking. Second man walks past, still not planning anythhing, sees the shop and all teh jewls but notices the securty, thinks its too hard so walks past. The third man knows security is installed but still deliberately breaks in and steals.
See th 1st man walking in love has no concern for laws, as he is not planning to break any, teh second man is just lead by his flesh when the oportunity arsis, the 3rd man, has no concern for anyone but himself, no matter how high a fence you build or how secure you makke a shop he will find a way in
We are supposed to be like the first, we occasioanly slip up like the second , but the third man, see he need rules and laws to convict him and try keep him staright. Which one of them are you??
1Ti_1:9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,
I assume that is why some people need the law, without the law they would do evil things...
In all His Love
If you answer no, than why???
In simple terms, there is a jewellry shop that has no security. A man walks past, he can see all the jewelry in side door is locked but doesnt concer him and so he walsk past. Second man walks past, not planning on doing anything wrong, but he sees the shop, notices no one is around so he breaks in and steals. Than a third man comes along, he lready kows the shop has no secuity so he deliberatley breaks in and steals.
Owner isntalls security cameras and alarm. First man walks past, still not concerned and contiues walking. Second man walks past, still not planning anythhing, sees the shop and all teh jewls but notices the securty, thinks its too hard so walks past. The third man knows security is installed but still deliberately breaks in and steals.
See th 1st man walking in love has no concern for laws, as he is not planning to break any, teh second man is just lead by his flesh when the oportunity arsis, the 3rd man, has no concern for anyone but himself, no matter how high a fence you build or how secure you makke a shop he will find a way in
We are supposed to be like the first, we occasioanly slip up like the second , but the third man, see he need rules and laws to convict him and try keep him staright. Which one of them are you??
1Ti_1:9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,
I assume that is why some people need the law, without the law they would do evil things...
In all His Love
Is it not enough for you that Jesus and His apostles kept the Sabbath all their lives? Even Paul kept the Sabbath.ewq1938 said:
But if that is not enough,
Mat 12:11 And he said unto them, What man shall there be among you, that shall have one sheep, and if it fall into a pit on the sabbath day, will he not lay hold on it, and lift it out?
Mat 12:12 How much then is a man better than a sheep? Wherefore it is lawful to do well on the sabbath days.
Mar 2:27 And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:
Mar 2:28 Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.
Luk 6:5 And he said unto them, That the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.
Mar 1:21 And they went into Capernaum; and straightway on the sabbath day he entered into the synagogue, and taught.ewq1938 said:
Mar 6:2 And when the sabbath day was come, he began to teach in the synagogue: and many hearing him were astonished, saying, From whence hath this man these things? and what wisdom is this which is given unto him, that even such mighty works are wrought by his hands
Luk 4:16 And he came to Nazareth, where he had been brought up: and, as his custom was, he went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and stood up for to read.
Luk 4:31 And came down to Capernaum, a city of Galilee, and taught them on the sabbath days.
Luk 6:6 And it came to pass also on another sabbath, that he entered into the synagogue and taught: and there was a man whose right hand was withered.
Act 13:14 But when they departed from Perga, they came to Antioch in Pisidia, and went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and sat down.
Act 13:42 And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next sabbath.
Act 13:44 And the next sabbath day came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God.
Act 16:13 And on the sabbath we went out of the city by a river side, where prayer was wont to be made; and we sat down, and spake unto the women which resorted thither.
Act 17:2 And Paul, as his manner was, went in unto them, and three sabbath days reasoned with them out of the scriptures,
Act 18:4 And he reasoned in the synagogue every sabbath, and persuaded the Jews and the Greeks.
Uh...I think they did.
It is an abomination. Those who practice it will not see the Kingdom of Heaven, no matter how hard they believe.ATP said:
That is seriously reaching, and I think you know it.ewq1938 said:
It says "as His custom was", for one thing.
Jesus says that "it is lawful to do good on the Sabbath." He says "The sabbath is made for man." He says, "I am Lord of the Sabbath."
And He goes into the synagogue on the Sabbath "as His custom was."
All through Acts we see His disciples doing the same thing....just as they had seen Him do, so they also did.
And do you know, His disciples rested on the Sabbath, even after He was crucified, waiting till the first day of the week to bring spices to anoint His body.
Now, you can have it your way...
But as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord.
So ewq..what day of the week do you keep? Probably the pagan rome based first day of the week...yet you refuse to keep God's fourth commandment...the one that goes back to Creation Genesis 2, when God created the seventh day of the week as a rest day, and He blessed this day and set it aside for Holy purposes...well if you would sooner folllow the pope/emperor of rome and his pagan days..knock yourself out..you got free will, to follow God/Jesus or pagan rome and their man made traditions..choice is yours!
But remember Salvation is through the Son of God, God's grace and commandments, and NOT the sungod/satan and his traditions and days of sunday, dec 25th and easter, all of which are non Biblical and of pagan origin!
But remember Salvation is through the Son of God, God's grace and commandments, and NOT the sungod/satan and his traditions and days of sunday, dec 25th and easter, all of which are non Biblical and of pagan origin!
Jesus and His disciples were regularly surrounded by crowds of people...as many as 5,000 at a time. The idea that He would have to go to the synagogue on the Sabbath in order to teach anyone is ludicrous.ewq1938 said:
We see Him teaching in public all through the gospels....as we also see Peter and John doing in Acts, the other Apostles doing in Acts, and later on, Paul as well. Philip didn't go to the synagogue on the Sabbath to find the Ethiopian...
They aren't going to the synagogue on the Sabbath in order to find people to teach. They are going to the synagogue on the Sabbath because that was their custom.
That notion only shows how desperate you are to cling to your man-made tradition, rather than to follow the law of God...
So, Jesus and His disciples are Pagans, then.ewq1938 said:
And here I thought they were Jewish...
Thanks for clearing that up for me.
