Logical reason to believe in God
- Thread starter Jennifer Rogers
- Start date
-
Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.
You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
Sure.....
The necessity for Christ to come in the form of a human child who would grow up and offer to die for mankind became necessary when Adam and his wife disobeyed the command of God, not to eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. God had generously provided every kind of fruit bearing tree for them to enjoy, but just one tree he claimed as his own. To steal from that tree carried the death penalty. Stealing from their Sovereign was a capital crime.
This disobedience came from the influence of a rebel spirit creature who became "satan the devil". Masquerading as a serpent, he lied to the woman in order to separate her from God so that he could gain human worship for himself. Of course, he wanted them both, but plotted a way to deceive the woman (the younger and less educated and experienced) so to force the man to divide his loyalties.....obey his God and lose his wife.... or obey his wife and lose everything? He chose to side with his wife. The old tactic of "divide and conquer" was born.
His plan worked and he got both of them to break God's law, thereby becoming their god and ruler.
The woman was deceived but the man was not. Adam could have made a different decision which would have had a different outcome, but he didn't.....and condemned all of his children to death. (Romans 5:12)
Their sin led to eventual death, but their children were born in sin through no fault on their part. Disobedience carried the death penalty as they all knew, but sin entered into the world in a way that the humans could not have imagined. Sin led to physical and spiritual imperfection, and as the humans aged, sickness and bad behavior was manifested. Within one generation, a murderer was produced....and humans have been murdering one another ever since.
Right there in the garden God uttered his first prophesy, addressed to the serpent...."I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and her offspring; he shall bruise your head, and you shall bruise his heel.” (ESV)
This prophesy was mysterious because God did not identify the players specifically and it was left open until the coming of Jesus as the Messiah in 29CE.
God's law given to Israel declared..."Your eye shall not pity. It shall be life for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot."
So God's law called for equivalency. If someone took a life, their own life was to be forfeited. In the case of the first humans, the lives they took were those of their children. They died for their disobedience, but the curse of death remained for all their offspring. "The wages of sin is death" (Romans 6:23) so because all humans sinned, it meant that they would all die, and unless someone came to repay the debt that Adam left for them, it would remain unpaid indefinitely.
This is where Jesus comes in. Like someone who steps in front of another to take a bullet for them, so Christ came to offer his sinless life for the sinless life we never got to live. Only a 'sinless life for a sinless life' would pay the redemption price. Since no other human was sinless, Jesus had to come from heaven, to be born as a sinless human to offer his life for ours. This he did willingly....an act for which we are eternally grateful and which Jesus told us to remember as we gather together to commemorate this event.
It falls on this coming Friday (April 15th) after sundown, on a night of the full moon.
As God does not operate in earth time, it seems to be taking such a long time to accomplish his purpose in connection with the sacrifice of his son, but when we realize that the apostle Peter wrote.... "But do not overlook this one fact, beloved, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day." (ESV)...we can see that its only been less than a week to him. We can be patient however because the trials of this life, brought about by Adam's sin, and the devil's rulership of this world, will seem like nothing, when everlasting life is restored to mankind and the purpose of God to have perfect humans enjoying life in paradise on earth forever will be restored. (Isaiah 55:11; Isaiah 65:17)
Revelation 21:2-4
"And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 3 And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Behold, the dwelling place of God is with man. He will dwell with them, and they will be his people, and God himself will be with them as their God. 4 He will wipe away every tear from their eyes, and death shall be no more, neither shall there be mourning, nor crying, nor pain anymore, for the former things have passed away.” (ESV)
That is how the Bible explains Christ's sacrifice to me....
Please don't hesitate to ask questions....if something is not clear....
Johann
Well-Known Member
Capitalize the small god to GodMaybe god is listening to your mind
Blessings
J.
Thank you for your reply, after reading your comment I have learned a lot. I will do more research so that I can discuss it with you in new articles. Hope to have the opportunity to talk with you in the future. Blessing!Sure.....
The necessity for Christ to come in the form of a human child who would grow up and offer to die for mankind became necessary when Adam and his wife disobeyed the command of God, not to eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. God had generously provided every kind of fruit bearing tree for them to enjoy, but just one tree he claimed as his own. To steal from that tree carried the death penalty. Stealing from their Sovereign was a capital crime.
This disobedience came from the influence of a rebel spirit creature who became "satan the devil". Masquerading as a serpent, he lied to the woman in order to separate her from God so that he could gain human worship for himself. Of course, he wanted them both, but plotted a way to deceive the woman (the younger and less educated and experienced) so to force the man to divide his loyalties.....obey his God and lose his wife.... or obey his wife and lose everything? He chose to side with his wife. The old tactic of "divide and conquer" was born.
His plan worked and he got both of them to break God's law, thereby becoming their god and ruler.
The woman was deceived but the man was not. Adam could have made a different decision which would have had a different outcome, but he didn't.....and condemned all of his children to death. (Romans 5:12)
Their sin led to eventual death, but their children were born in sin through no fault on their part. Disobedience carried the death penalty as they all knew, but sin entered into the world in a way that the humans could not have imagined. Sin led to physical and spiritual imperfection, and as the humans aged, sickness and bad behavior was manifested. Within one generation, a murderer was produced....and humans have been murdering one another ever since.
Right there in the garden God uttered his first prophesy, addressed to the serpent...."I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and her offspring; he shall bruise your head, and you shall bruise his heel.” (ESV)
This prophesy was mysterious because God did not identify the players specifically and it was left open until the coming of Jesus as the Messiah in 29CE.
God's law given to Israel declared..."Your eye shall not pity. It shall be life for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot."
So God's law called for equivalency. If someone took a life, their own life was to be forfeited. In the case of the first humans, the lives they took were those of their children. They died for their disobedience, but the curse of death remained for all their offspring. "The wages of sin is death" (Romans 6:23) so because all humans sinned, it meant that they would all die, and unless someone came to repay the debt that Adam left for them, it would remain unpaid indefinitely.
This is where Jesus comes in. Like someone who steps in front of another to take a bullet for them, so Christ came to offer his sinless life for the sinless life we never got to live. Only a 'sinless life for a sinless life' would pay the redemption price. Since no other human was sinless, Jesus had to come from heaven, to be born as a sinless human to offer his life for ours. This he did willingly....an act for which we are eternally grateful and which Jesus told us to remember as we gather together to commemorate this event.
It falls on this coming Friday (April 15th) after sundown, on a night of the full moon.
As God does not operate in earth time, it seems to be taking such a long time to accomplish his purpose in connection with the sacrifice of his son, but when we realize that the apostle Peter wrote.... "But do not overlook this one fact, beloved, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day." (ESV)...we can see that its only been less than a week to him. We can be patient however because the trials of this life, brought about by Adam's sin, and the devil's rulership of this world, will seem like nothing, when everlasting life is restored to mankind and the purpose of God to have perfect humans enjoying life in paradise on earth forever will be restored. (Isaiah 55:11; Isaiah 65:17)
Revelation 21:2-4
"And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 3 And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Behold, the dwelling place of God is with man. He will dwell with them, and they will be his people, and God himself will be with them as their God. 4 He will wipe away every tear from their eyes, and death shall be no more, neither shall there be mourning, nor crying, nor pain anymore, for the former things have passed away.” (ESV)
That is how the Bible explains Christ's sacrifice to me....
Please don't hesitate to ask questions....if something is not clear....
Johann
Well-Known Member
bbyrd009
Groper
- Nov 30, 2016
- 33,943
- 12,081
- 113
- Faith
- Christian
- Country
- United States Minor Outlying Islands
imo just be sure that you also find no one may die for another’s sins, and take any religious replies to that with a grain of salt. Esau “needed red stew, or he would die,” and the answer to that question is buried in there i think
Johann
Well-Known Member
Dear brother/sister don't be afraid to speak out...
Why did Jesus have to die? | GotQuestions.org
Blessings
J.
Johann
Well-Known Member
bbyrd009
Groper
- Nov 30, 2016
- 33,943
- 12,081
- 113
- Faith
- Christian
- Country
- United States Minor Outlying Islands
prolly a great first approach, learn the counterfeit first, but No man may die for another's sins has not been repealed, i dont think
Johann
Well-Known Member
...that is what Modern day Orthodox rabbi's (anti-missionaries) believe.
The.."no man may die for another's sins" is debunked by the written graphe as you read Is 53 and Ps 22.
Blessings
J.
Logical reason to believe in God
OP ^
@Jennifer Rogers
Logic is a conclusion a Carnal Mind lands on, by first gathering information, weighing the information, and landing on a conclusion between THIS and THAT...and at any time can gain more information...(even as WARNED, by evil spirits or wicked men)...that can “cunningly” sway a logical Carnal Minded conclusion AWAY from belief in God.
Open ears in this day and era. Who is preaching, a world death threat? Pandemic of an invisible Virus? Wars are always a fruitful fear tactic as is presently the news as the Pandemic is losing its fear grasp.
Answer is “powerful sitting men in nearly 100% of all nations”; “news (propagandists) media’s allowed to keep their platforms and voices in compliance in operation, 24-7; and who is silenced?
And the same, promoting their FEAR 24-7, are also promoting THEY ARE the Answer, the Savior, the Safetynet, the FIx.
The bottom line is;
The Carnal Mind is “wishy washy”, subject to “change” repeatedly.
The Carnal Mind is “naturally” Against God. (Rom 5:7)
Powerful demons do roam the earth, looking for the weak to devour.
Powerful sitting wicked men do sit in Nations Power seats, dictating, mandating, when men MUST DO, according to their whims, and threatening and punishing men who will not acquiesce to them.
The Lord God is the Savior.
The Lord God searches the true thoughts of a mans HEART.
Glory to God,
Taken
OP ^
@Jennifer Rogers
Logic is a conclusion a Carnal Mind lands on, by first gathering information, weighing the information, and landing on a conclusion between THIS and THAT...and at any time can gain more information...(even as WARNED, by evil spirits or wicked men)...that can “cunningly” sway a logical Carnal Minded conclusion AWAY from belief in God.
Open ears in this day and era. Who is preaching, a world death threat? Pandemic of an invisible Virus? Wars are always a fruitful fear tactic as is presently the news as the Pandemic is losing its fear grasp.
Answer is “powerful sitting men in nearly 100% of all nations”; “news (propagandists) media’s allowed to keep their platforms and voices in compliance in operation, 24-7; and who is silenced?
And the same, promoting their FEAR 24-7, are also promoting THEY ARE the Answer, the Savior, the Safetynet, the FIx.
The bottom line is;
The Carnal Mind is “wishy washy”, subject to “change” repeatedly.
The Carnal Mind is “naturally” Against God. (Rom 5:7)
Powerful demons do roam the earth, looking for the weak to devour.
Powerful sitting wicked men do sit in Nations Power seats, dictating, mandating, when men MUST DO, according to their whims, and threatening and punishing men who will not acquiesce to them.
The Lord God is the Savior.
The Lord God searches the true thoughts of a mans HEART.
Glory to God,
Taken
bbyrd009
Groper
- Nov 30, 2016
- 33,943
- 12,081
- 113
- Faith
- Christian
- Country
- United States Minor Outlying Islands
man, as long as you believe that Yah needed a sacrifice to make you ok with Him, go with that!
and i dunno, would a rabbi admit that Christ died for our sins?
Last edited:
It is my understanding that the sacrifice of Christ allows us to be forgiven (his blood washes us clean) and return to the presence of the Father in Heaven. It also provides for the resurrection of the dead (his body). That one day we might be brought back to life, forgiven and brought into Heaven. That way we can truly be family (sons and daughters) with God.
Grailhunter
Well-Known Member
How can I choose to trust God when it hurts so much? How can I trust Him when I do not understand and struggle to grasp His mysterious ways and providence? Join me as we explore the reasons we should trust God.
1. All things are possible with God
He knows the desires of your heart. If you trust Him with what you most desire, He will take care of it. He knows what is best for your life. Think again if you feel like your goals are hard to achieve or even impossible. Whatever it is, all you have to do is have faith.
“‘If you can’?” said Jesus. “Everything is possible for one who.” – Mark 9:23
Let's just put our trust in these words: "Because I know the plans I have for you." God declares: “plans for your welfare, not for disaster, to give you a future and a hope (Jer 29:11 HCSB)”.
2. Our pain and suffering have a purpose.
Every pain we carry has a purpose. It is a preparation for what is to come, for the greater challenges that are certain to come. We need to learn to trust God and rely on Him and His strength during our current seasons of grief to face greater challenges in the future.
God knows everything we are going through at this time and everything we will go through in the future. He knows the best way to handle any situation so that we get the best possible outcome, and we need to trust Him for that. We need to follow His way and trust Him to understand best because He knows.
“But when you ask, you must believe and not doubt, because the one who is like a wave of the sea, blown and tossed by the wind.” – James 1:6
3. God knows what God does
God knows exactly what he wants for your life. He has a purpose for you and has planned everything. He knows who you will marry, how many children you will have, what job you will have, and every other detail of your life. He knows what you will do tomorrow, in the coming future. Do not doubt His plan, for He knows it all and has a perfect plan that He has laid out before. So your job is to keep trusting Him, the rest He will give you a proper answer.
4. God will not forsake us
“Be strong and of good courage, do not fear nor be afraid of them; for Yahweh your God, He is the One who goes with you. He will not leave you nor forsake you” (Deuteronomy 31:6).
How many times have you read this passage and have you believed it? You better believe it, because it's true.
There shouldn't even be a single doubt in your mind. God will never leave you nor forsake you because of that, you can trust God with all your heart (Proverbs 3:5-6). In this statement, God is making a double promise to us. He will not leave us and He will not forget us.
5. God's great love for you
God is love and all He does is for love (1 John 4:7-21). He is the very definition and embodiment of love.
Because God loves you, He will do anything to help you in your time of need. You can always trust Him because He cares about you. He knows what's best for you and He will give you the best - if you're willing to trust Him. You can trust Him with results after trying your best. You can trust Him that He will deliver you from your darkest times and that He will be there with you through life's storms.
Have the questions you asked been answered here?
When seeking, honesty is the best policy.
Unless you are thinking of being a theologian, Christianity and its application is the simplest of religions....as long as you do not let people twist your head up. One of the reasons it is simple is that God loves you....He loved you even before you chose to be a Christian. "But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us" Romans 5:8
It is easy to say..."love God" but to be honest that is part of the Christian walk.
People will try to tell you about what to do and not what to do.....it is easy.....be good and do good.
The walk with Christ....work out your salvation with fear and trembling..."So then, my beloved, just as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your salvation with fear and trembling?" Philippians 2:12
The Christian walk....is a journey....walk with Christ everyday....and discuss your day with Him. You are not dirty rags....you are in the family....a child of God.... See what kind of love the Father has given to us, that we should be called children of God; and so we are... 1st John 3:1 As a young Christian you can be good and as you mature in Christianity the Holy Spirit will even show you how to be better. No one is perfect and as a new Christian you are not an experienced Christian...which only make sense. Your experience comes with your walk with Christ....and we never stop learning.
People are going to tell you negative things and try to confuse you...you know what negative is...have mercy on them....because they stack hot coals on their own head...."but whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to stumble, it would be better for him to have a heavy millstone hung around his neck, and to be drowned in the depth of the sea." Matthew 18:6
"Do the right thing." As a new Christian you may choose the wrong thing....But if it is your intent and you make a habit of it....you will get better at it as you go. And that is the Christian walk.
Now, what not to do....Stay away from the Jehovah's Witnesses, the Calvinists, the once saved always saved crowd, they are the closest thing to demonic doctrines in Christianity.
Last edited:
Hi Jennifer, welcome to the forum. May God Bless you abundantly.
Glory to God,
Taken
