Michael is Jesus?
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Not necessarily. The JWs have this doctrine, possibly others.
Satan thrives on confusion! It must be really sad when your savior Michael is barely mentioned in the Bible. Thank God my Savior Jesus is mentioned MANY times!
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quietthinker
Well-Known Member
Sounds like a blueprint straight out of the philosophies from the East, Ziggy
quietthinker
Well-Known Member
Do numbers make anything right or wrong? You can be certain if this is relied on and pushed something is amiss.
Ziggy
Well-Known Member
I have no idea what the east believe in, unless you mean east coast USA?
If it is it came from my heart and not my head.
Remember, I have a 6th grade education, I don't have a lot of philosophies floating in my head.
I just hear what I read in the bible and what it says to me.
All I can do is try and translate what it is it says to me.
Sometimes things get lost in translation.
Hugs
quietthinker
Well-Known Member
By using the word East I mean pagan philosophies. These ideas you have floated surface repetitively in New Age views which are in themselves a rehash of Hinduism.
The God of Creation is not his Creation anymore than a generator is the electricity it generates.
Ziggy
Well-Known Member
quietthinker
Well-Known Member
Reducing God to the sum of Creation makes a mockery of the Atonement and blinds the human mind to the value of this unspeakable gift.
The natural inclination of men is to bring God down to their level of operation, subsequently god's are invented that thrive on bloodshed, injustice and arbitrariness.
Men simultaneously elevate themselves to the level of 'gods' and in their blindness and conceit deliver the injustices the World's history is renown for.
Ziggy
Well-Known Member
I never said that God was reduced to his creation.
On the contrary.
He is His creation and the creator of it.
And God created man in his image and likeness, in the image of God created he them.
The Universe and everything in it is a living breathing entity.
Time is elastic, space is elastic, they breathe.
These would not exist without taking breath from the creator himself.
He breathes into his creation, it becomes a part of Him.
It originated in Him. He breathed forth creation.
There would be no life unless all life was connected to the Only life.
The creator himself.
God is all and in all
Hugs
On the contrary.
He is His creation and the creator of it.
And God created man in his image and likeness, in the image of God created he them.
The Universe and everything in it is a living breathing entity.
Time is elastic, space is elastic, they breathe.
These would not exist without taking breath from the creator himself.
He breathes into his creation, it becomes a part of Him.
It originated in Him. He breathed forth creation.
There would be no life unless all life was connected to the Only life.
The creator himself.
God is all and in all
Hugs
Ziggy
Well-Known Member
God painted a picture and then put himself into it.
The picture became a living and breathing entity.
This is the Light that lighteth every man that comes into the world.
The world is the canvas the picture is painted on that God painted.
And then he placed himself inside the picture, and yet still holds the brush of the painter himself from outside the canvas.
He is both near and far, within and without, bystander and partaker simultaneously.
God is HUGE
Hugs
The picture became a living and breathing entity.
This is the Light that lighteth every man that comes into the world.
The world is the canvas the picture is painted on that God painted.
And then he placed himself inside the picture, and yet still holds the brush of the painter himself from outside the canvas.
He is both near and far, within and without, bystander and partaker simultaneously.
God is HUGE
Hugs
Very good! I suspect our once again missing friend @ScottA would be able to see this also. His was more to do with 'time', but perhaps both visions [yours and his] work on manifesting for the others the truth of the matter. Back to Pontius Pilate's question: 'What is truth?'
Ziggy
Well-Known Member
I do not believe Pilate would have understood the answer.
I AM.
I AM the Lord thy God.
There is no other Truth.
I AM the TRUTH.
Hugs
early Christian tradition is that Pilate became a believer. there were several pseudographical letters attributed to him ((probably none authentic)) in the first few centuries. Tertullian, for example, describes him as having become a Christian.
the fact of history is that he was called back to Rome soon after the crucifixion, for 'mishandling' of a riot in AD 36 ((according to Josephus)). the emperor died about this time in AD 37, presumably before Pilate stood before him - and secular history records nothing more of Pilate. he was replaced in Samaria by a different governor.
a question that needs to be asked and examined concerning this is why Jesus revealed Himself to Pilate, saying that He is indeed the King of the Jews - but with a kingdom not of this world ((John 18)). search the NT -- is there anyone Christ so directly spoke to, saying that He Himself is the Messiah, who was not then saved? the woman at the well ((John 4)) is a key example for comparison: she is also a Gentile, and to her also Jesus clearly, openly and directly reveals Himself as Messiah.
a second question that needs to be looked into is whether the dream of Pilate's wife came from God or from Satan? she calls Christ "innocent" and "just" -- are these things Satan would tell her? early Christian tradition is also that she believed, and was saved.
Christ is God, and it was His own will that He be crucified in exactly this manner. He told Pilate that he had no authority over Him except it was given from heaven -- given by Christ Himself, who affirms, no one is able to take His life from Him, but He only lays it down of His own will: and takes it up again. so i do not think that anyone should condemn Pilate to hell because he did Christ's will. Pilate wanted to release Him, and said there is no fault in Him: as the examining of the red heifer by the priesthood, as the examining of the Paschal lamb -- there is no spot in Him, and it is certified.
Ziggy
Well-Known Member
The first one that comes to mind is Pharoah of Egypt.
Through Moses God spoke directly to Pharoah.
Exo 5:1 And afterward Moses and Aaron went in, and told Pharaoh, Thus saith the LORD God of Israel, Let my people go, that they may hold a feast unto me in the wilderness.
Exo 5:2 And Pharaoh said, Who is the LORD, that I should obey his voice to let Israel go? I know not the LORD, neither will I let Israel go.
As a shadow or a type of that which was to come.
thinking..
hugs
Moses & Aaron going to the one who holds God's people captive as slaves is as Christ speaking to the pharisees and teachers of the law. He speaks to them in parables and signs.
an OT complement of Christ before Pilate is more likely Joseph before a different Pharaoh & Daniel before Nebuchadnezzar. there are dreams involved. Pilate's wife dreams. there is imprisonment, and the imprisoned speaking to the imprisoner. Moses & Aaron are not imprisoned.
which things are necessary to look into, but you miss my point: who in the gospels does Jesus directly, clearly, plainly tell that He is the Messiah?
here are two, add to the list: the woman at the well, and Pilate. both are Gentile. are both saved?
Still waiting on Scriptures that say Michael is our God and Savior. There aren't any. None! Only God and Jesus is our Savior. Just because you have convinced each other that Michael is God and Savior doesn't make it true. You have ZERO Scripture.
At the moment when he asked that question with Jesus standing before him, he certainly did not understand. Did he come to understand later? God knows!
Ziggy
Well-Known Member
I believe every person will have an opportunity to know the Truth.
And the Truth shall set them free.
There are many peoples and nations and generations upon generations that have never heard the Truth.
These have all fallen asleep still captive to death.
The verse that comes to mind is:
Psa 24:9 Lift up your heads, O ye gates; even lift them up, ye everlasting doors; and the King of glory shall come in.
Even those who have been led astray by false prophets having never known the Truth,
will also learn the Truth.
Now what they do with that knowledge....
They can either run and hide as Adam and Eve did, or they can come to him willingly, having their sins washed away.
Pilate tried by washing his own hands and claiming himself not guilty.
I don't think that counts.
He would be judging himself "righteous" but there is another that Judges him.
And us all.
Best leave that to the Judge.
Hugs
And the Truth shall set them free.
There are many peoples and nations and generations upon generations that have never heard the Truth.
These have all fallen asleep still captive to death.
The verse that comes to mind is:
Psa 24:9 Lift up your heads, O ye gates; even lift them up, ye everlasting doors; and the King of glory shall come in.
Even those who have been led astray by false prophets having never known the Truth,
will also learn the Truth.
Now what they do with that knowledge....
They can either run and hide as Adam and Eve did, or they can come to him willingly, having their sins washed away.
Pilate tried by washing his own hands and claiming himself not guilty.
I don't think that counts.
He would be judging himself "righteous" but there is another that Judges him.
And us all.
Best leave that to the Judge.
Hugs
every knee will bow, and every tongue will confess He is LORD -- but not everyone will be saved. Adam wasn't deceived; he sinned fully understanding it was sin: and the condemnation is that Light came into the world but men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
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