Most New Christians Live Life With 1/3rd The Power Of Christ!

[Giuliano]

Thank you for directing my attention to 31. Let me get back to you.

I noticed the "being able to move like the wind", and, that is a lot like:

Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

That is what I meant. Some read that passage assuming they understand what "born of the Spirit" means; and when they reach that verse, they skip over it without asking themselves if they really do understand. Then the question is if Nicodemus understood.

If it is Old Testament material, where is it discussed?

 

[amadeus]

And I ask for Scripture which says this. Can you show that? I don't see anything in your post from the Bible that substantiates this statement.
Much love!

If you know your Bible and the first few chapters of Genesis, it may be seen. I cannot give you a vision of this. Our vision and any improvement to our vision comes from God. You have already decided that I am wrong. Citing verses that you already know is not going to change where you are:

"I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase.
So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase." I Cor 3:6-7

 

[amadeus]

Let's talk about this.

We are to "make it a reality" that we will no longer be tested with any chance of us sinning. And that this is prerequisite to our actually, what, being born again? Inheriting eternal life? I want to be sure that I'm speaking in your terms.

This is your point of view? And until that time, we are, what, what happens if I die during a weakness of faith?

Much love!

The "reality" is God and anyone that has Life. Reality for man was lost in the Garden of Eden when he died due to disobedience. Every man born to woman is effectively born dead to God... but he has a glimmer of hope. If he pursues, encounters and takes hold of that hope, which is Jesus, then the glimmer of hope becomes the bright Light of Life. Then we become that Light. [The glimmer is our ability to see enough to seek more Light and thus obtain Life, real Life. That glimmer of light for each of us born to woman [not born again] is here:

"That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world." John 1:9
It is Light, but insufficient by itself to sees through. We need a greater Light in Jesus.

What people on planet Earth today call reality is a temporal thing that will be gone completely for each person who dies [in the flesh] with having received and retained Life to the end of his course [his allotted time].

God will never simply pull the rug out from underneath your feet by allowing you to die [fleshly death] while in error due to a momentary stumble with no opportunity to make it right. If a person stumbles[sins] repeatedly and each time repents [supposedly] anew God will receive it. However if the person becomes sure of himself and God and so then purposely sins presuming that God will accept his renewed repentance as He done so often before, then the person is tempting God.

"There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it." I Cor 10:13

But as Jesus put it:

"...It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God." Matt 4:7

 

[amadeus]

We overcome by faith, not by our works.

Not by our works alone, but by the works which result from our faith. This is only possible through power of God in the us [the Holy Spirit]. We work with all that we have while we are allowing the Holy Spirit to lead us and the power of God will provide any necessary difference.

 

[Giuliano]

Not by our works alone, but by the works which result from our faith. This is only possible through power of God in the us [the Holy Spirit]. We work with all that we have while we are allowing the Holy Spirit to lead us and the power of God will provide any necessary difference.

I am reminded of another verse from John 1:

John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

 

[amadeus]

I am reminded of another verse from John 1:

John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

Amen! Sometimes old friend, I do get weary and have to lean more heavily on Him. Are people so blind? I guess after so long I already know the answer...

 

[marks]

Note the three times Jesus is announced as "son" in the Gospels. I think will help explain how I look at things: Of flesh, of water and of Spirit.

Not sure where you are going here, but I'm listening.

Remember too that Jesus expected Nicodemus to understand what he was talking about. "Born from above" is Old Testament material. I think most Christians read that conversation with an air of superiority, thinking they know more than Nicodemus; but is that right?

I don't know about the air of superiority, but do you not think the New Testament gives a much fuller revelation of what God means when He says, Born again?

Was Nicodemus really stupid? The conversation has more than one nuances that escape many Christian readers. I chuckle when I read how it starts:

John 3:1 There was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews:
2 The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him.

Why would Nicodemus say such a thing? He was a member of the Sanhedrin, so he wouldn't have been serious when he said that.

I suppose I don't share in making this assumption. Why would he not have been serious? He later became a disciple. No one could deny the works Jesus did. Why should we assume that this man overlooked them just because others did? And he wasn't he only one of the rulers to believe in Jesus either.

Deuteronomy 13:13 If there arise among you a prophet, or a dreamer of dreams, and giveth thee a sign or a wonder,
2 And the sign or the wonder come to pass, whereof he spake unto thee, saying, Let us go after other gods, which thou hast not known, and let us serve them;
3 Thou shalt not hearken unto the words of that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams: for the Lord your God proveth you, to know whether ye love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul.
4 Ye shall walk after the Lord your God, and fear him, and keep his commandments, and obey his voice, and ye shall serve him, and cleave unto him.
5 And that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams, shall be put to death; because he hath spoken to turn you away from the Lord your God, which brought you out of the land of Egypt, and redeemed you out of the house of bondage, to thrust thee out of the way which the Lord thy God commanded thee to walk in. So shalt thou put the evil away from the midst of thee.

So Nicodemus couldn't possibly have been serious. He was testing Jesus, probing to see if he could be influenced by flattery. The rest of their conversation is also probably not what many think it is. They are like two rabbis exchanging witty remarks. Nicodemus did know what "born from above" meant; and Jesus demonstrated that he knew too. That is why Nicodemus became a believer.

I don't see it that way at all. I see a man looking for answers, and quickly getting in over his head.

When we ask with an honest heart . . .

9 Nicodemus answered and said unto him, How can these things be?

. . . then we will receive the answers we need.

Whether Nicodemas came hoping it influence Jesus by flattery, I don't make that assumption. Various times it is written that someone said something to Jesus to test them, but is that written here? It's not. I'm not inclined to read the account as if it were, I'd just a soon take it at face value. I don't see Jesus as swapping witty repartee with someone who is asking Him asking him about rebirth, in what would be recorded as a foundational teaching of rebirth. But that's me.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Not by our works alone, but by the works which result from our faith.

So then faith plus works?

 

[marks]

If you know your Bible and the first few chapters of Genesis, it may be seen.

Please, be specific. If it is in the Bible, why not show it?

 

[marks]

That is what I meant. Some read that passage assuming they understand what "born of the Spirit" means; and when they reach that verse, they skip over it without asking themselves if they really do understand. Then the question is if Nicodemus understood.

If it is Old Testament material, where is it discussed?

Well of course Jeremiah and Ezekiel both touch on this. There is a lot of hinting. I've not done that study for a long time so I forget the other relevant passages, however, I seem to remember there are others.

Any in particular in mind?

Much love!

 

[marks]

Just always remembering the words of Solomon:

"And further, by these, my son, be admonished: of making many books there is no end; and much study is a weariness of the flesh." Ecc 12:12

Study does not in itself bring anyone to truth. Truth comes to us through the Holy Ghost:

"But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you." John 14:26

Study is required of us an act of obedience, not in order to find the truth.

Why would you separate study of God's word from a search for truth?

Why would you not think that in our study and search the Holy Spirit would not be our teacher?

Much love!

 

[Giuliano]

Not sure where you are going here, but I'm listening.



I don't know about the air of superiority, but do you not think the New Testament gives a much fuller revelation of what God means when He says, Born again?



I suppose I don't share in making this assumption. Why would he not have been serious? He later became a disciple. No one could deny the works Jesus did. Why should we assume that this man overlooked them just because others did? And he wasn't he only one of the rulers to believe in Jesus either.



I don't see it that way at all. I see a man looking for answers, and quickly getting in over his head.

When we ask with an honest heart . . .

9 Nicodemus answered and said unto him, How can these things be?

. . . then we will receive the answers we need.

Whether Nicodemas came hoping it influence Jesus by flattery, I don't make that assumption. Various times it is written that someone said something to Jesus to test them, but is that written here? It's not. I'm not inclined to read the account as if it were, I'd just a soon take it at face value. I don't see Jesus as swapping witty repartee with someone who is asking Him asking him about rebirth, in what would be recorded as a foundational teaching of rebirth. But that's me.

Much love!

Well of course Jeremiah and Ezekiel both touch on this. There is a lot of hinting. I've not done that study for a long time so I forget the other relevant passages, however, I seem to remember there are others.

Any in particular in mind?

We are making zero progress. I give up.

 

[marks]

We are making zero progress. I give up.

I'm sorry you feel that way.

 

[Giuliano]

I'm sorry you feel that way.

It appears to me you have ideas which aren't about to be changed by any discussion we have. That means we'd both be wasting our time.

 

[marks]

It appears to me you have ideas which aren't about to be changed by any discussion we have. That means we'd both be wasting our time.

If you say so.

Much love!

 

[marks]

All I'm ever about is what is written in the word. I do stick very closely to the specific wording, and make every effort not to color the Scriptures with my own assumptions or presuppositions. Just the same, when I see things in the Word that modify my views, I don't hesitate for a moment to embrace whatever I believe God is showing me, from whatever source He may use, even if it's my cat.

much love!

PS . . . I've just realized, you have a delightfully cute new avatar, but I'm serious about the cat business. Had a calico that was absolutely beautiful and affectionate, but her animal nature was too much! I saw many illustrations of Scripture portrayed through that little animal!

 

[marks]

Let's get back to the OP . . .

How do we know God's power in our lives? What is it that opens that door?

much love!

 

[amadeus]

So then faith plus works?

As it is written in James:

"Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: show me thy faith without thy works, and I will show thee my faith by my works." James 2:17-18

 

[amadeus]

Please, be specific. If it is in the Bible, why not show it?

If you know your Bible and the first few chapters of Genesis, it may be seen. I cannot give you a vision of this. Our vision and any improvement to our vision comes from God. You have already decided that I am wrong. Citing verses that you already know is not going to change where you are:

"I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase.
So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase." I Cor 3:6-7

And I ask for Scripture which says this. Can you show that? I don't see anything in your post from the Bible that substantiates this statement.

Much love!

No covering or protection needed:

"And they were both naked, the man and his wife, and were not ashamed." Gen 2:25

"And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat." Gen 3:6

Then with sin they felt themselves completely exposed in need of covering, protection. See their own pitiful efforts to cover themselves:

"And the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together, and made themselves aprons." Gen 3:6-7

God provides a better, but still temporary covering:

"Unto Adam also and to his wife did the LORD God make coats of skins, and clothed them." Gen 3:21

The inadequacy of temporary coverings is seen:

"For the bed is shorter than that a man can stretch himself on it: and the covering narrower than that he can wrap himself in it." Isaiah 28:20

But then from inadequate covering we go now not to a complete covering the Baptist tells of the compete immersion in the Holy Ghost that Jesus will bring:

"John answered, saying unto them all, I indeed baptize you with water; but one mightier than I cometh, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost and with fire" Luke 3:16

And then it comes the promised baptism of the Holy Ghost immersing them [Acts chapter 2]... that is covering them completely... But when a person quenches the Holy Spirit of God he exposes anew his nakedness.

 

[Waiting on him]

Let's get back to the OP . . .

How do we know God's power in our lives? What is it that opens that door?

much love!

For me it would be light, it’s interesting that Nicodemus first comes to Jesus as so many do.... in darkness.