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amigo de christo

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I may as well out love warn our friend devin . Devin , you need to flee rome .
I say this not as an attack , not to be mean , but cause i love you my friend . Now flee it .
Let us just return to our bibles and learn THAT JESUS and that Doctrine .
 

amadeus

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I was awake at the time and I saw two white spirits, Heavenly Father and Heavenly Mother and they were presented to me and gave me a message of salvation for me, and I was filled with tremendous love and peace that lasted for a few hours afterwards. It was like I was in heaven with God or something.

But I just now heard a talk from a Catholic priest that mentioned that there was a white spirit or woman of some type that appeared to a woman some long years ago and it was only after pressing God about the visitations of the woman that she was told it was the Virgin Mary.

So I'm now left wondering, does Heavenly Mother mean the Virgin Mary? She might be considered to be our heavenly mother in many ways.

Thanks for your time, Devin.
In the scripture the Mother or heavenly mother would be the Church. A proper church that is a part of the Church is nourishing her children, the newer members, who need help in growing, to become mature properly fitted members of the Body, the Body of Christ.

Mary the mother of the man of flesh, Jesus, would be a type or shadow of the Mother, which is the Church. She was a very good type, but still a type. The Reality is the perfected Church, perfected by the Holy Spirit working through the ministers given by God for that purpose.

Simply saying that the Church is the Mother may not be easy to understand although I do believe it. Perhaps God will help us all to understand it better and agree:

"And Naomi said unto her two daughters in law, Go, return each to her mother's house: the LORD deal kindly with you, as ye have dealt with the dead, and with me." Ruth 1:8

Which mother was Naomi speaking of? And then which Mother did Ruth choose?

"And Ruth said, Entreat me not to leave thee, or to return from following after thee: for whither thou goest, I will go; and where thou lodgest, I will lodge: thy people shall be my people, and thy God my God:" Ruth 1:16

Orpah went back to her natural mother, but Ruth, a gentile as we are (or have been) gentiles, chose a new and better Way, a better Mother [Naomi was also a better shadow of the true Mother Church than her own natural mother back in Moab].

And then...

"For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.

But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise.

Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.

For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.

But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all." Gal 4:22-26

"So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free" Gal 4:31

"Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?

Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit." John 3:3-6


Who is the Mother giving birth as per John 3?

"And a certain man lame from his mother's womb was carried, whom they laid daily at the gate of the temple which is called Beautiful, to ask alms of them that entered into the temple;" Acts 3:2

"Then Peter said, Silver and gold have I none; but such as I have give I thee: In the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth rise up and walk.

And he took him by the right hand, and lifted him up: and immediately his feet and ankle bones received strength.

And he leaping up stood, and walked, and entered with them into the temple, walking, and leaping, and praising God." Acts 3:6-8

What Mother gave new Life to that man who had been born lame to his natural mother?

So who or what is Jerusalem? One literal translation of the word Jerusalem: "set ye double peace". [That brings to my mind the double portion that Jacob gave to Joseph. But that's another and a perhaps deeper subject.]

"And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband." Rev 21:1-2

Consider that a mother has children. We know how Ruth (Bride) had children effectively for her dead husband the son of Naomi (Mother Church) via Boaz. We can make it complicated, but it doesn't have to be if we trust God to help us in it:

"There are threescore queens, and fourscore concubines, and virgins without number.

My dove, my undefiled is but one; she is the only one of her mother, she is the choice one of her that bare her. The daughters saw her, and blessed her; yea, the queens and the concubines, and they praised her." Song of Solomon 6:8-9

The only one of her Mother, the Church, is the Bride of Christ, born again among older brothers and sisters who as the Mother nourished each child until that child could become a member of the Bride.

"And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:
From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love." Eph 4:11-16


The Church is the spiritual Mother that took us in and nourished us properly with the flesh and blood of Jesus so that we could have the Life which he is... so that we could speak that words of the Father as Jesus did... so that we could walk the walk that Jesus walked along the "highway of holiness".
 
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justbyfaith

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I don't think that a Heavenly Mother is mentioned anywhere in holy scripture; and therefore I consider it safer not to form any doctrine around the subject.
 

dev553344

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In the scripture the Mother or heavenly mother would be the Church. A proper church that is a part of the Church is nourishing her children, the newer members, who need help in growing, to become mature properly fitted members of the Body, the Body of Christ.

Mary the mother of the man of flesh, Jesus, would be a type or shadow of the Mother, which is the Church. She was a very good type, but still a type. The Reality is the perfected Church, perfected by the Holy Spirit working through the ministers given by God for that purpose.

Simply saying that the Church is the Mother may not be easy to understand although I do believe it. Perhaps God will help us all to understand it better and agree:

"And Naomi said unto her two daughters in law, Go, return each to her mother's house: the LORD deal kindly with you, as ye have dealt with the dead, and with me." Ruth 1:8

Which mother was Naomi speaking of? And then which Mother did Ruth choose?

"And Ruth said, Entreat me not to leave thee, or to return from following after thee: for whither thou goest, I will go; and where thou lodgest, I will lodge: thy people shall be my people, and thy God my God:" Ruth 1:16

Orpah went back to her natural mother, but Ruth, a gentile as we are (or have been) gentiles, chose a new and better Way, a better Mother [Naomi was also a better shadow of the true Mother Church than her own natural mother back in Moab].

And then...

"For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.

But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise.

Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.

For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.

But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all." Gal 4:22-26

"So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free" Gal 4:31

"Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?

Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit." John 3:3-6


Who is the Mother giving birth as per John 3?

"And a certain man lame from his mother's womb was carried, whom they laid daily at the gate of the temple which is called Beautiful, to ask alms of them that entered into the temple;" Acts 3:2

"Then Peter said, Silver and gold have I none; but such as I have give I thee: In the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth rise up and walk.

And he took him by the right hand, and lifted him up: and immediately his feet and ankle bones received strength.

And he leaping up stood, and walked, and entered with them into the temple, walking, and leaping, and praising God." Acts 3:6-8

What Mother gave new Life to that man who had been born lame to his natural mother?

So who or what is Jerusalem? One literal translation of the word Jerusalem: "set ye double peace". [That brings to my mind the double portion that Jacob gave to Joseph. But that's another and a perhaps deeper subject.]

"And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband." Rev 21:1-2

Consider that a mother has children. We know how Ruth (Bride) had children effectively for her dead husband the son of Naomi (Mother Church) via Boaz. We can make it complicated, but it doesn't have to be if we trust God to help us in it:

"There are threescore queens, and fourscore concubines, and virgins without number.

My dove, my undefiled is but one; she is the only one of her mother, she is the choice one of her that bare her. The daughters saw her, and blessed her; yea, the queens and the concubines, and they praised her." Song of Solomon 6:8-9

The only one of her Mother, the Church, is the Bride of Christ, born again among older brothers and sisters who as the Mother nourished each child until that child could become a member of the Bride.

"And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:
From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love." Eph 4:11-16


The Church is the spiritual Mother that took us in and nourished us properly with the flesh and blood of Jesus so that we could have the Life which he is... so that we could speak that words of the Father as Jesus did... so that we could walk the walk that Jesus walked along the "highway of holiness".
Thanks for taking the time to explain that to me. I will ponder it as I await an answer from God as to the meaning of the Heavenly Mother. She appeared but didn't speak.
 
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theefaith

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Jhn 16:13, Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

Here, the Spirit of truth guides us into all truth apart from people in the church.

Also, we are the true church who believe in Jesus Christ for salvation.

The Catholic denomination does not have a monopoly on the truth.

We receive the Holy Spirit by placing our faith in Jesus (Galatians 3:14, Ephesians 1:13-14).

If we have the Holy Spirit He will guide us into all truth.

The Holy Spirit is not the church; although He dwells within the hearts of His people, the true church (all those who believe on Jesus Christ for salvation).


Christ and his church are one! Acts 22:9
The Holy Spirit is guaranteed to the church thru the teaching authority of the apostles!

The authority of the church founded by Christ on Peter and the apostles and their successors!

Jesus Christ continues HIS ministry in His new covenant church thru Peter, the apostles, and their successors with the same mission, power, and authority!
Mt 16:18 Mt 28:19 Acts 1:17 acts 8:31 & 35 Lk 10:16 Jn 8:32 Jn 13:20 Jn 15:5 Jn 16:13 Jn 20:21-22 acts 9 eph 2:20

Lk 10:16
He who hears you hears me...

John 13:20
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that receiveth whomsoever I send receiveth me; and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.

Jesus Christ does not abandon His holy bride! Matt 28:19-20

Moral authority:
(Teaching)
Necessity of being taught by Christ:
Two edge sword:

Jurisdictional authority:
(Governing / administering)

Spiritual authority:
(Life of Grace)
Sacraments

1 Timothy 3:15
But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.
 

Ronald Nolette

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No one has authority to read or study scripture for himself and form his own doctrine!

We must be taught by the church of Christ!
Lk 1:4 instructed:
Matt 28:19 church of apostles commanded to teach all nations:


And which church is that?
 

theefaith

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That is fine, if one is Catholic, Episcopal or what other denoms. do not encourage their congregation to read the word. Look at the most honorable of all! The Bereans :) They went home and check the scriptures after every preaching to see if those things were so. I trust no man.
Not "every" teacher should be a teacher, not "every" priest should be a priest, and so on. I think we know why that is, in light of all the child abuse. Kind of have a hard time respecting anything at all coming from the mouth of pedophiles, fornicators and such. And NO, I'm not at all putting this on ONLY Catholics, it's in all denominations.
So, you may go by the authority of your own denom, and so do I as, we are encouraged to always have our bibles open, and to go over it at home.
God Bless brother

does the church teach them to do that? No
It is an attack on the church, used to destroy the priesthood
It is the result of communists being put into the seminary’s and Bella Dodd testified before congress that she personally put more than 1100 communists in the priesthood also it is the result of the liberal apostasy that began around the 1960’s and you protestants are not immune from the effects of this liberal apostasy
 

theefaith

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John 6
[43] Jesus therefore answered and said unto them, Murmur not among yourselves.
[44] No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
[45] It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.
Taught of God yes thru Christ and His church Matt 28:19 eph 4:5 Jude 1:3
 

theefaith

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We ALL have the authority to read and study scripture for ourselves. In fact, we have the responsibility to do that!


Right. No one can create their own doctrines. We all must study and discern the doctrines already placed before us in the scriptures. That's what Bible reading and study is for—to learn the doctrines already established in the pages of the Bible, not create new ones.


When we fellowship with other believers—who also read and study the scriptures for themselves—all of us together are the church teaching each other what the scriptures teach.

I hate to say it, but we're at the point now where we can't let an ordained church leader run a fellowship of Bible studying Christians. They can participate in it and lead it in an administrative and control sense, but they cannot be allowed to dictate doctrine. The problem is they are trained in a certain orthodoxy and will only allow discussion and acceptance of doctrine in the vein of what they are already convinced is true and are not open to correction or new learning. They think by virtue of being a church leader they have to be that way and have to have all the answers. They can't perceive that they can be ordained leaders and learn with the rest of us at the same time. I genuinely hurt for them.

jn 8:32 jn 16:13 are guaranteed to the Peter and the apostles and their successors Matt 16:18 matt 28:19 jn 20:21-23
 

theefaith

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And which church is that?

there’s only one church jn 10:16
One
Holy
Catholic
Apostolic

There is only one true church founded by Christ on Peter and the apostles and their successors is the new covenant body of Christ! Matt 16:18 One fold
Jn 10:16 the household of faith! Gal 6:10

1 Timothy 3:15
But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.

Christ and His church are one: acts 22:9 why persecute me?
 

Ferris Bueller

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jn 8:32 jn 16:13 are guaranteed to the Peter and the apostles and their successors Matt 16:18 matt 28:19 jn 20:21-23
We know who has pastoral authority by what they teach and how they act. A person doesn't have pastoral or teaching authority just because they were successfully trained in a particular orthodoxy.
 
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theefaith

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We know who has pastoral authority by what they teach and how they act. A person doesn't have pastoral or teaching authority just because they were successfully trained in a particular orthodoxy.

no but by the authority of Christ jn 20:21-23 who sent the apostles and by acts 1 where the apostles send their successors
Apostle means one who does a sent
Even as Christ is an apostle and the peter and the others are sent by Him so they and they alone have authority to send their successors
 

Ronald Nolette

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there’s only one church jn 10:16
One
Holy
Catholic
Apostolic

There is only one true church founded by Christ on Peter and the apostles and their successors is the new covenant body of Christ! Matt 16:18 One fold
Jn 10:16 the household of faith! Gal 6:10

1 Timothy 3:15
But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.

Christ and His church are one: acts 22:9 why persecute me?


Correct! teh small c catholic Church , not the Big C Roman Catholic church. That didn't come until centuries later.
 
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Paul Christensen

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No one has authority to read or study scripture for himself and form his own doctrine!

We must be taught by the church of Christ!
Lk 1:4 instructed:
Matt 28:19 church of apostles commanded to teach all nations:
Roman Catholic doctrine. Many godly martyrs were burned alive because they dared to reject the church's interpretation of the gospel and to believe in justification by faith for themselves.
 

amigo de christo

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I don't think that a Heavenly Mother is mentioned anywhere in holy scripture; and therefore I consider it safer not to form any doctrine around the subject.
actually paul refers to HEAVENLY JERUSALEM as our mother . WHICH is above in heaven .
As far as rome goes . she too is a mother . but it aint of the lambs . oh no . We must return to our bibles
and feed , as does a three day starved lamb , on that book . The decievers these days be as the grains of sand upon the sea shore .
And how they lie in wait to deceive and to allure those who pass on by . The lambs must learn our bibles well .
Be encouraged . And let us praise the glorious Lord .
 

Paul Christensen

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lk 1:4 instruction
Matt 28:19 teach
Eph 4:5 thee faith
Jude 1:3 thee faith
Jn 8:32 16:13 church of the apostles have and teach the truth
1 Timothy 3:15
But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.
Jesus said that it was not to be the church that will teach us all things. He said it is the indwelling Holy Spirit ("the anointing") that will do that. There are thousands on their way to hell because they are allowing Kenny Copeland's church to teach them his interpretation of Scripture.
 
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theefaith

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Correct! teh small c catholic Church , not the Big C Roman Catholic church. That didn't come until centuries later.

The church is one: Jn 10:16
The church has a holy: Matt 16:18
The church is Roman: Dan 2: 44 And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed: and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand for ever.

The church is catholic:
Jn 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Jn 3:17
For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

Jn 1:29
The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.

Matt 5:14
Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid.

Matt 13:38
The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;

Matt 24:14
And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

Matt 28:18-20
And Jesus came and said to them, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.

Mark 16:15-16
And he said to them, Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation. Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.

Jn 1:9
That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.

Jn 4:42
And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviour of the world.

Jn 14:26
But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you.

Jn 6:33 For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world.

Jn 8:12
Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.

Jn 10:36
Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world...

Jn 12:47

And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world

Jn 16:12-13
I still have many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them
now. When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth, for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come.

2 cor 5:18
And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us (the whole world) to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;

World = Universal = Catholic
 

amigo de christo

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Roman Catholic doctrine. Many godly martyrs were burned alive because they dared to reject the church's interpretation of the gospel and to believe in justification by faith for themselves.
The mother of harlots has deceived before and killed before . She decieves now and soon
under her all inclusive gospel will have caused the final world wide betrayal of the lambs .
She has killed before , she will again . MARK THOSE WORDS . write them in a book . FOR THE HOUR draws nigh
when she will have turned the world to be as one right against the few who resisted her lie .