Nondenominational Christianity

[Marymog]

Mary....Really? From post #180.

Lol....I apologize. Post #180 is part of what I said.

What I meant to say is read the entire context from the BEGINNING of this conversation when it started 1-2 weeks ago(?).

mary

 

[Marymog]

Mary....He doesn't make it clear. I came into this never having read his work... But now I have. Mary... READ YOUR OWN REFERNCES
So now you have me arguing the discussion! You are good at your craft!

I believe Hippoytus makes it clear HOW he came to the conclusion.

Readers digest version of what he wrote: He calculated eight days before the Kalends of January, the fourth day, while Augustus was in his forty-second year.....

hope that helps

Mary

 

[Marymog]

Which as far as I can see was a poor attempt to show Constantine wasn't picking the date with pagan influences, which fails especially when church fathers said birthday celebrations qere pagan!

I feel like I have covered this already but instead of scrolling back thru all my post to see if I have I will make it clear this time:

It was suggested (I don't remember by whom) that Constantine choose December 25th because it was a pagan holiday. I simply stated a FACT that December 25th was suggested by Hippolytus HUNDREDS of years before Constantine. Therefor it was already in Christian circles, talk and writings LONG BEFORE CONSTANTINE that December 25th (among other dates) was a possible date.

For one to say the Constantine chose that date for pagan reasons one would have to provide HISTORICAL DOCUMENTATION that is what happened. There is NO historical documentation for that theory. There IS DOCUMENTATION that he POSSIBLY chose that date due to Hippolytus and others writings and the practices of the Early Church.

I have evidence to back up what I believe. The person that made the suggestion has no evidence.

Mary

 

[Marymog]

Not necessarily so... I have those who believe he picked it because of believing Jewish fables. Granted, I already debunked that(here I am helping you) but there is still the reasoning even though he never said it. And you have zero evidence that he picked it otherwise.

Lol.....Thank you for your help and honesty.

Mary

EDIT: I don't mean LOL in a bad way....like I am laughing at you. You made me chuckle when you said, here I am helping you. It was refreshing to see someone being humble on this site.

All in love, mary

 

[CoreIssue]

Jesus said to Peter in Matthew 16:19, I will give YOU the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever YOU bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever YOU loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.

Please dear friend, show me where he said this to another Apostle.

Patient Mary

It was not a conversation strictly between Peter in Christ. It was with all the apostles.

As with the rock issue, think of it this way. Christ pointed at Peter and called him Petros, then pointed at himself and called himself Petra.

We do not know the body language of that conversation between Christ and the apostles, but we do know that Petros is not the foundation of the church, Petra was.

Remember something Christ did state to Peter only

23 Jesus turned and said to Peter, “Get behind me, Satan! You are a stumbling block to me; you do not have in mind the concerns of God, but merely human concerns.”

Peter did not like to deal with Gentiles and was criticized for that. He was never a bishop of Rome. He was not the first pope. He never was in Rome.

 

[Marymog]

It was not a conversation strictly between Peter in Christ. It was with all the apostles.

Stop twisting scripture to your own destruction. You should take the time to read scripture instead of anti-Catholic literature.

Simon Peter answered......And Jesus answered him, “Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah!.....I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.

I asked you to give it to me and you FAILED to give any scripture that shows Jesus gave ANYONE ELSE BUT PETER the keys.

bible study Mary

 

[Marymog]

It was not a conversation strictly between Peter in Christ. It was with all the apostles.

As with the rock issue, think of it this way. Christ pointed at Peter and called him Petros, then pointed at himself and called himself Petra.

Wrong again. Read Scripture.

And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

Nooooooo where in that passage did Jesus point to himself and call himself Petra and no where in scripture does Jesus call himself a rock.....Unless you can show me, I can't find it.

Bible study Mary

 

[Marymog]

He never was in Rome.

Really? Soooooo your Protestant scholars, the ones who affirm that he was in Rome, are lying for the Catholics? What do they have to gain by doing that?

Curious mary

 

[Anthony D'Arienzo]

CoreIssue,
[I am a non denominational bible only Christian. I reject all denominations and their creeds.]
This sounds wonderful except if anyone examines it. I have had Mormons tell me they were Christians. Do you agree with them?
As soon as people ask you what the bible teaches, you have a creed. Is Jesus God? What did He come to do? Who did He do it for?
Is he going to return? When? Are we in the Kingdom now?

[What are you?]
A reformed baptist

 

[CoreIssue]

CoreIssue,
[I am a non denominational bible only Christian. I reject all denominations and their creeds.]
This sounds wonderful except if anyone examines it. I have had Mormons tell me they were Christians. Do you agree with them?
As soon as people ask you what the bible teaches, you have a creed. Is Jesus God? What did He come to do? Who did He do it for?
Is he going to return? When? Are we in the Kingdom now?

[What are you?]
A reformed baptist

Using your definition of creed my creed is the Bible.

Reformed Baptist is a Baptist that is a Calvinist.

 

[CoreIssue]

Really? Soooooo your Protestant scholars, the ones who affirm that he was in Rome, are lying for the Catholics? What do they have to gain by doing that?

Curious mary

Again, I'm not a Protestant.

What scholars? Name them.

 

[Marymog]

Again, I'm not a Protestant.

What scholars? Name them.

You know how this goes. Anyone that holds beleifs, doctrines etc. that were "revealed" to the reformers or after the Reformation are considered Protestants. It keeps everyone on the same page and the conversation neat and tidy. If your not Catholic, your Protestant. What else is their?

Were your beliefs, doctrines etc practiced by The Church PRIOR to the Reformation?

What is a non denominational bible only Christian? Your statement is an oxymoron. You belong to the DENOMINATION of "bible only Christians". There are thousands of you if not hundreds of thousands of you in your denomination.

When you say you are a "bible only Christian" that suggest that all those that belong to organized churches with hierarchy do not use the bible only to obtain their doctrines or beliefs. I know it makes you feel superior but your theory is actually OPPOSITE of scripture since scripture establishes a hierarchy in the Church. Besides that, you need someone to interpret that bible sooooooo you can't be a "bible only Christian".

If you can show me in the bible a table of contents I will jump the fence and join you as a bible only Christian. You have your bible because of TRADITION and the Church. The Church was first, the bible came second.

If you are only reading bible scholars or historians that say that Peter was not in Rome you have chosen to be ignorant of what scholars teach about Peter being in Rome. That is your choice. Don't ask me to educate you. Take the time to educate yourself so you can better defend your statements.

Mary

 

[CoreIssue]

You know how this goes. Anyone that holds beleifs, doctrines etc. that were "revealed" to the reformers or after the Reformation are considered Protestants. It keeps everyone on the same page and the conversation neat and tidy. If your not Catholic, your Protestant. What else is their?

Were your beliefs, doctrines etc practiced by The Church PRIOR to the Reformation?

What is a non denominational bible only Christian? Your statement is an oxymoron. You belong to the DENOMINATION of "bible only Christians". There are thousands of you if not hundreds of thousands of you in your denomination.

When you say you are a "bible only Christian" that suggest that all those that belong to organized churches with hierarchy do not use the bible only to obtain their doctrines or beliefs. I know it makes you feel superior but your theory is actually OPPOSITE of scripture since scripture establishes a hierarchy in the Church. Besides that, you need someone to interpret that bible sooooooo you can't be a "bible only Christian".

If you can show me in the bible a table of contents I will jump the fence and join you as a bible only Christian. You have your bible because of TRADITION and the Church. The Church was first, the bible came second.

If you are only reading bible scholars or historians that say that Peter was not in Rome you have chosen to be ignorant of what scholars teach about Peter being in Rome. That is your choice. Don't ask me to educate you. Take the time to educate yourself so you can better defend your statements.

Mary

Spoken like a Catholic.

 

[Anthony D'Arienzo]

CoreIssue,
Hello CI.
[Using your definition of creed my creed is the Bible.]

Everyone can say the same thing. The question is not what is our authority, but rather...what does the Bible teach...I do not think you have sorted this out as much as you could. look at what a confession of faith says about the scriptures and tell me what you object to here.

1689 LBC: Chapter 1 "Of the Holy Scriptures"

[Reformed Baptist is a Baptist that is a Calvinist.]

Now that is a good start. Notice the label that people do not like to use begins to zero in on what this reformed baptist might believe the bible teaches. It can be quite helpful.

[Christ and the apostles never encourage such things. In fact, Paul condemned it.]

False....
Jude 3 King James Version (KJV)
3 Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.

CI, for you to obey this from Jude...what is the "common faith"? What is the faith once delivered to the saints.?
there is no way around it...you have a creed. If I go through your posts I could identify it.

 

[Marymog]

Spoken like a Catholic.

Translation: I am unable to articulate a logical answer or a defense of my unscriptural beliefs therefore I will say something that means NOTHING.

I feel sad for you that you can't even back up your own beliefs with scripture, history, facts or anything for that matter.

Can you at least TRY to answer the simplest question I asked you: Were your beliefs, doctrines etc practiced by The Church PRIOR to the Reformation?

I look forward to your response.

Patient Mary

 

[CoreIssue]

Translation: I am unable to articulate a logical answer or a defense of my unscriptural beliefs therefore I will say something that means NOTHING.

I feel sad for you that you can't even back up your own beliefs with scripture, history, facts or anything for that matter.

Can you at least TRY to answer the simplest question I asked you: Were your beliefs, doctrines etc practiced by The Church PRIOR to the Reformation?

I look forward to your response.

Patient Mary

Only a Catholic says it's an logical nonanswer.

 

[Marymog]

Only a Catholic says it's an logical nonanswer.

Always be ready to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear...YOU FAILED.

 

[CoreIssue]

Always be ready to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear...YOU FAILED.

I answered you. You cannot show the Catholic Church.

 

[Marymog]

I answered you. You cannot show the Catholic Church.

No...You didn't...try again.

 

[CoreIssue]

No...You didn't...try again.

You cannot show the the Catholic Church at the time of the apostles.