Once in Heaven, can you lose your salvation?

[Triumph1300]

Sin is sin, whether its in heaven or earth.

A bit absurd that you assume there could be sin in heaven.
Maybe I missed something new.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Save your long list for another. I've answered these in the past. Did you read through the posts that I wrote? The point of the thread is, because we cannot lose our salvation in Heaven, then we cannot lose it here either. That which secures us forever in heaven, was done for us here when we placed faith in Christ. The very reasons we cannot lose our salvation in Heaven are the reasons we cannot lose it here.

If you disagree, then explain what was done to secure our salvation in Heaven, so that we can never be lost or sin there, that was not accomplished for us here in our experience of salvation.

Stranger

First of all - you haven't "answered" any of those verses.
A single flat denial of all of them is not answering ANY of them.

Secondly - just because we can't lose our salvation once we're in Heaven does NOT mean that we can't lose it here before we die.
If you bothered to read the litany of verses I presented, you would know this.

Please address the verses I presented . . .

 

[Stranger]

First of all - you haven't "answered" any of those verses.
A single flat denial of all of them is not answering ANY of them.

Secondly - just because we can't lose our salvation once we're in Heaven does NOT mean that we can't lose it here before we die.
If you bothered to read the litany of verses I presented, you would know this.

Please address the verses I presented . . .

I have answered them all in our discussions in the past. And once I answer them, you will go to your ready internet and type up some more. So, no thanks, I have answered them before.

The point of this discussion is, I repeat as usual, our salvation in Heaven is secure due to the works of God. And those very works of God that secures us in Heaven forever, also secures our salvation here forever.

Now, tell me why we cannot lose our salvation in Heaven but you believe we can lose it here. See the difference. This thread is not just, can you lose your salvation, with which you throw up your ready made lists. This thread requires some 'thinking'. I realize it is much easier just to have an internet list. But try and exercise that grey matter a little.

If you can't, I understand. Being of the Roman Church, you are told exactly what to believe and thinking for yourself is quite an effort.

Stranger

 

[Dcopymope]

A bit absurd that you assume there could be sin in heaven.
Maybe I missed something new.

You wouldn't have Satan if it wasn't possible, much less a "war in heaven", as is prophesied to occur. What is truly absurd are most Christians assumptions about what they claim heaven really is, pretending to know more than what is written in Gods word.

 

[Stranger]

A bit absurd that you assume there could be sin in heaven.
Maybe I missed something new.

The first sin was in Heaven. Nothing new.

Stranger

 

[Triumph1300]

The first sin in the universe was pride and the first being to sin was Lucifer,
an Arch angel who dwelled in the very presence of God in heaven.
But does not mean there's sin in heaven now.

 

[mjrhealth]

Without Jesus Christ in the picture, it ain't gonna matter where you are. Sin is sin, whether its in heaven or earth. I made this quite clear before in my thread "Why the fall had to occur". Things are different now that sin has been atoned for and eradicated.

And we wont get to heaven without Jesus so how can we than sin in heaven, is Gods plan flawed or is is not???. Or is Christianity the biggest joke since religion began,... and all the other religions are a better option.

 

[Dcopymope]

The first sin in the universe was pride and the first being to sin was Lucifer,
an Arch angel who dwelled in the very presence of God in heaven.
But does not mean there's sin in heaven now.

Perhaps.

And we wont get to heaven without Jesus so how can we than sin in heaven, is Gods plan flawed or is is not???. Or is Christianity the biggest joke since religion began,... and all the other religions are a better option.

"we won't get to heaven without Jesus"

Ok, here is the deal. I suggest you go get "caught up in the spirit" and ask God how Moses and Elijah got to heaven without the blood atonement of Jesus Christ. You claim to have a personal one on one relationship with him, so I'm being serious. Based on what is known, to claim no one gets to heaven without Jesus is to limit the power of God almighty. Scripture states that no one gets to the Father but through Jesus, I don't recall it ever saying that about heaven itself. And once again, Gods plan was not "flawed". The plan was simple, the plan was to send his only begotten son to destroy sin. Him not doing so would have far reaching implications beyond what most Christians have even bothered to ponder. That is what he was sent for, not so we can chill out in "heaven".

 

[BreadOfLife]

I have answered them all in our discussions in the past. And once I answer them, you will go to your ready internet and type up some more. So, no thanks, I have answered them before.

The point of this discussion is, I repeat as usual, our salvation in Heaven is secure due to the works of God. And those very works of God that secures us in Heaven forever, also secures our salvation here forever.

Now, tell me why we cannot lose our salvation in Heaven but you believe we can lose it here. See the difference. This thread is not just, can you lose your salvation, with which you throw up your ready made lists. This thread requires some 'thinking'. I realize it is much easier just to have an internet list. But try and exercise that grey matter a little.

If you can't, I understand. Being of the Roman Church, you are told exactly what to believe and thinking for yourself is quite an effort.

Stranger

We can't lose our salvation in Heaven because there, we will be perfect.

Rev. 21:27 tells us that NOTHING unclean or impure can enter Heaven.
1 John 1:32 says that we will be LIKE HIM for we will see Him as He is.

HOWEVER - we ain't there yet and we still have a free will which is NOT perfectly conformed to God's will.
Now - that being said - address the following verses that you have YET to address on this or any other thread . . .

Romans 11:22
“See, then, the kindness and severity of God: severity toward those who fell, but God's kindness to you, provided you REMAIN in his kindness; otherwise you to will be cut off.”
Paul is warning the faithful to REMAIN in God’s favor or they will lose their salvation. How can they lose what they never had?

Hebrews 10:26-27
“If we sin deliberately AFTER receiving KNOWLEDGE of the truth, there no longer remains sacrifice for sins but a fearful prospect of judgment and a flaming fire that is going to consume the adversaries.”
This is a clear warning that falling away from God will result in the loss of our salvation. The Greek ford for “knowledge” used here is NOT the usual word (oida). This is talking about a full, experiential knowledge (epignosei). This verse is about CHRISTIANS who had an EPIGNOSIS of Christ and who can fall back into darkness and LOSE their salvation by their own doing.

2 Peter 2:20-22
For if they, having escaped the defilements of the world through the KNOWLEDGE of our Lord and savior Jesus Christ, again become entangled and overcome by them, their last condition is worse than their first.

For it would have been better for them not to have KNOWN the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment handed down to them.
Here, Peter illustrates that those who had a full, experiential knowledge (epignosei) of Christ – CHRISTIANS – who can fall back into darkness and LOSE their salvation by their own doing.

Matt. 5:13
You are the salt of the earth. But if salt loses its taste, with what can it be seasoned? It is no longer good for anything but to be thrown out and trampled underfoot.
This one is self-explanatory . . .

1 Cor. 9:27
"I pummel my body and subdue it, lest after preaching to others I myself should be disqualified."
Paul is saying that he wrestles with his own fleshly desires so that he might not fall back into sin.

2 Peter 3:17
Therefore, dear friends, since you already know this, be on your guard so that you may not be carried away by the error of lawless men and fall from your secure position.
Peter is warning the faithful not to fall back into sin and lawlessness.

1 John 2:24
See that what you have heard from the beginning remains in you. IF it does, you also will REMAIN in the Son and in the Father.
This is an admonition to try to remain faithful.

Rev. 3:5
He who overcomes will, like them, be dressed in white. I will never blot out his name from the book of life, but will acknowledge his name before my Father and his angels.
God cannot "blot out" a name that was never there in the first place. He is talking about CHRISTIANS who are already saved and how they can LOSE their salvation.

Rev. 22:19
And if anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away from him his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book.
How can God "take away" somebody’s share of heaven if they never had it to begin with? This is about CHRISTIANS who may or may NOT make it into Heaven.

 

[Stranger]

The first sin in the universe was pride and the first being to sin was Lucifer,
an Arch angel who dwelled in the very presence of God in heaven.
But does not mean there's sin in heaven now.

The first sin occurred in Heaven, as said. It was committed by one who was perfect.

Satan and his angels have a place still there where God has not yet thrown them out. (Rev. 12:7-9) He and they will be thrown out later.

And later a new 'heaven' and earth will be created. Why because sin has contaminated heaven also. (Rev. 21:1)

Stranger

 

[Stranger]

We can't lose our salvation in Heaven because there, we will be perfect.

Rev. 21:27 tells us that NOTHING unclean or impure can enter Heaven.
1 John 1:32 says that we will be LIKE HIM for we will see Him as He is.

HOWEVER - we ain't there yet and we still have a free will which is NOT perfectly conformed to God's will.
Now - that being said - address the following verses that you have YET to address on this or any other thread . . .

Romans 11:22
“See, then, the kindness and severity of God: severity toward those who fell, but God's kindness to you, provided you REMAIN in his kindness; otherwise you to will be cut off.”
Paul is warning the faithful to REMAIN in God’s favor or they will lose their salvation. How can they lose what they never had?

Hebrews 10:26-27
“If we sin deliberately AFTER receiving KNOWLEDGE of the truth, there no longer remains sacrifice for sins but a fearful prospect of judgment and a flaming fire that is going to consume the adversaries.”
This is a clear warning that falling away from God will result in the loss of our salvation. The Greek ford for “knowledge” used here is NOT the usual word (oida). This is talking about a full, experiential knowledge (epignosei). This verse is about CHRISTIANS who had an EPIGNOSIS of Christ and who can fall back into darkness and LOSE their salvation by their own doing.

2 Peter 2:20-22
For if they, having escaped the defilements of the world through the KNOWLEDGE of our Lord and savior Jesus Christ, again become entangled and overcome by them, their last condition is worse than their first.

For it would have been better for them not to have KNOWN the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment handed down to them.
Here, Peter illustrates that those who had a full, experiential knowledge (epignosei) of Christ – CHRISTIANS – who can fall back into darkness and LOSE their salvation by their own doing.

Matt. 5:13
You are the salt of the earth. But if salt loses its taste, with what can it be seasoned? It is no longer good for anything but to be thrown out and trampled underfoot.
This one is self-explanatory . . .

1 Cor. 9:27
"I pummel my body and subdue it, lest after preaching to others I myself should be disqualified."
Paul is saying that he wrestles with his own fleshly desires so that he might not fall back into sin.

2 Peter 3:17
Therefore, dear friends, since you already know this, be on your guard so that you may not be carried away by the error of lawless men and fall from your secure position.
Peter is warning the faithful not to fall back into sin and lawlessness.

1 John 2:24
See that what you have heard from the beginning remains in you. IF it does, you also will REMAIN in the Son and in the Father.
This is an admonition to try to remain faithful.

Rev. 3:5
He who overcomes will, like them, be dressed in white. I will never blot out his name from the book of life, but will acknowledge his name before my Father and his angels.
God cannot "blot out" a name that was never there in the first place. He is talking about CHRISTIANS who are already saved and how they can LOSE their salvation.

Rev. 22:19
And if anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away from him his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book.
How can God "take away" somebody’s share of heaven if they never had it to begin with? This is about CHRISTIANS who may or may NOT make it into Heaven.

Adam and Eve were perfect. Satan was perfect. How are you so sure?

Stranger

 

[Dcopymope]

The first sin occurred in Heaven, as said. It was committed by one who was perfect.

Satan and his angels have a place still there where God has not yet thrown them out. (Rev. 12:7-9) He and they will be thrown out later.

And later a new 'heaven' and earth will be created. Why because sin has contaminated heaven also. (Rev. 21:1)

Stranger

"it has contaminated heaven also"

uh oh, look out, the very notion of heaven being contaminated with sin is absurd to most Christians. They know more about heaven than whats written in Gods word apparently. They forget that Jesus Christ died for the whole creation, not just humanity.

 

[Triumph1300]

Well, I guess it's clear you folks ignored BOL's posted scripture verses and didn't bother to read them......

And ask "How can you be so sure?"
Well, you can be sure about scripture.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Adam and Eve were perfect. Satan was perfect. How are you so sure?

Stranger

Who said Satan was "perfect"??
Who said Adam and Eve were "perfect??

They has a free will of their own that was not perfectly conformed to God's.
That's what "perfect" means (Matt. 5:48).

 

[forrestcupp]

When we're in heaven, we won't be like we are here. We won't be susceptible to our sinful nature.

1 John 3:2 Beloved, now we are children of God, and it has not appeared as yet what we will be. We know that when He appears, we will be like Him, because we will see Him just as He is.

We're going to be changed to be like Him.

1 Corinthians 15:53 For this perishable must put on the imperishable, and this mortal must put on immortality.

It's pretty silly to try to compare how things are in our lives now to how they will be when we're in heaven.

 

[mjrhealth]

Him not doing so would have far reaching implications beyond what most Christians have even bothered to ponder. That is what he was sent for, not so we can chill out in "heaven".

YEs i am well aware of Elijah and enoch, i have never limited God in any way, He is far more wise than I ever will be, but you, seem to think that God has palyed this big joke on mankind, I im going to let them suffer for a few thousand years, let them think they are all saved, than when they get to heaven, im going to pull teh rug out from udnder them and laugh at there demise". is that really what you think of God, dont you have any fraith in His plan for our salvation, or is it in men you trust.

 

[Triumph1300]

It's pretty silly to try to compare how things are in our lives now to how they will be when we're in heaven.

Yes, and that's the bottom line of it.

 

[Pipiripi]

Hello my friend.
I don't believe that once we are saved we can lose out salvation...so even less do I believe that once in heaven we can then lose our salvation.

But I though the OP was a good question....ie, if Lucifer could fall from heaven ( which actually I am not sure that the passage isn't referring to Adam, not Satan...but right here thats not relevant.) and Adam fall in the Paradise of Eden...how come we can't/wont fall.
Very good question

But, I believe the son's are sealed in Jesus...one with Him...

Bless you. Helen.

My sister the Bible teached clearly how God made Adam. And also how Lucifer fall out of heaven. Don't tell me that you don't believe what the Bible teached. Everything in the Bible is true, because the mighty God that I serve, nothing is impossible for HIM!! I love you!! Be blessed. ☺

 

[Dcopymope]

YEs i am well aware of Elijah and enoch, i have never limited God in any way, He is far more wise than I ever will be, but you, seem to think that God has palyed this big joke on mankind, I im going to let them suffer for a few thousand years, let them think they are all saved, than when they get to heaven, im going to pull teh rug out from udnder them and laugh at there demise". is that really what you think of God, dont you have any fraith in His plan for our salvation, or is it in men you trust.

So in other words, you didn't really do what I suggested. No, his plan is not a "joke", never said it was, that's just you talking out of your anus, because you will see what you want to see.

 

[mjrhealth]

So in other words, you didn't really do what I suggested. No, his plan is not a "joke", never said it was, that's just you talking out of your anus, because you will see what you want to see.

Im not the one getting mad, I fully know how they got there, faith and obedience, they loved God, heaven is not a temporary place we go so we can sin and fall from grace a second time, Simple question, once we are in heaven can we sin and loose our salvation. answer. NO. Not unless Gods plane is riddled with holes.