Once Saved Always Saved ?

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Christina

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According to the post I have been reading...I think there going to HELL. Sounds like theywill need a fire suit. They ain't got a chance in HELL.Logabe P.S. Thank's for the reply Jordan and Tom.
What are you talking Christ died for all sin past and present that hasn't a thing to do with OSASand Jordan is right the verses you give take place in the millenium after we are all changed and again it has nothing to do with OSASDoes rightly divide the Word mean anything here guys you are taking verses about the millieum about the Elect does the Word subject and object apply to your doctrines anywhereYou seem to mistake what a saint is for many (christains will be called but few will be chosen) you must be chosen to become one of the saints OsAs imply you can sin fall away do whatever you like and your still saved ...and among the saints... wrong ..you must stay in faith there are certain criteria for saints and not all will make it. .......Because theres no such doctrine as OSAS The word saint comes from the Greek word "hagios" which means “consecrated to God, holy, sacred, pious."The idea of the word “saint” is a group of people set apart for the Lord and His kingdom. There are three references referring to godly character of saints; "that you receive her in the Lord in a manner worthy of the saints …" (Romans 16:2). "For the equipping of the saints for the work of service, to the building up of the body of Christ" (Ephesians 4:12). "But immorality or any impurity or greed must not even be named among you, as is proper among saints" (Ephesians 5:3).Therefore, Scripturally speaking, the “saints” are the body of Christ, True .but not everyone makes to be the bride, the body of ChristThose that do overcome and make it are the Elect the first resurrected .... a OSAS doctrine isnt even nessary for them it is by faith they walk ...the only people that need a once saved always doctrine is the sinner and the one that wants an excuse to not learn Gods Words and hear his warnings. the true Elect the true faithful know where there salvation and hope lay they dont need a safety net of a lie OSASP.S. Glad to see ya logabe
 

tomwebster

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Well, them Levites are going to DIE. Thank's Jordanfor your input.Logabe
The tribe of Levi will be restored along with the other tribes. The Zadok will even have a special place. Look at Ezekiel!
 

RichardBurger

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Most all "religious" people are seeking to produce good works in their lives to earn salvation. This is a never-ending battle that is filled only with frustration and defeat. Until they accept the true gospel of Jesus Christ, they will never be able to rest in His finished work on the cross and consequently will never be able to experience the liberty of new life in Christ.True liberty can come only in Christ. Only when we realize that we are SECURE in Him can we cease from our own works and rest in His work on the cross. This gives us a position of complete peace with God.Heb 3:11-12 (NKJ)11 So I swore in My wrath, 'They shall not enter My rest.' "12 Beware, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of ""unbelief"" in departing from the living God;Heb 4:1-3 (NKJ)1 Therefore, since a promise remains of entering His rest, let us fear lest any of you seem to have come short of it.2 For indeed the gospel was preached to us as well as to them; but the word which they heard did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in those who heard it.***3 For we who have believed ""do enter that rest,"" as He has said: "So I swore in My wrath, they shall not enter My rest," although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.Heb 4:9-11 (NKJ)9 There remains therefore a rest for the people of God.Note verse 1010 For he who """"has""" entered His rest has himself also ceased from his works as God did from His.11 Let us therefore be diligent to enter that rest, lest anyone fall according to the same example of disobedience. (unbelief = disobedience, see Heb 3:11-12 and Heb. 4:2,3)We enter His rest and cease from our own works when we believe in Him (have faith, trust, confidence, and hope in His work on the cross), and not in our own works.To be disobedient is to NOT believe (unbelief = disobedience) in what God has done on the cross, and instead, believe that you can be saved by what you do.Richard
 

logabe

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Wow Tom, that is very interesting...so the tribe ofLevi and the other tribes will have a second chance. But that also presents a problem because, I believethey were saved in the old testament and Eli the HighPriest allowed his Levite sons to have sex with the women in the church (1st Sam. 2:22). Sounds likethey fell from GRACE. So this is interesting...you saythey will have Levites that will have another chance to repent, right? Correct me if I am wrong.Tom, do you believe in "OSAS"? It sure sounds like it.I am not trying to be disrespectful but, if God is going to restore them...why can't He (GOD) restore everyonethat has displeased HIM that were saved and fell backinto sin? This sounds like a double standard.Is God unjust in this matter? Just food for thought. Also, to answer Krissie's statement...the reason I askabout whether the Levites were going to HELL, was I believe they were saved because they were priestbut, they disqualified themselves when they startedhaving sex with the women worshipers among otherthings (1st Sam. 2:13-17). You quoted Krissie...OsAs imply you can sin fall away do whatever you like and your still saved...and among the saints... wrong ..you must stay in faith there are certain criteria for saints and not all will make it. .......Because theres no such doctrine as OSAS.I agree partially with you Krissie...but does that apply tothe Levites also...because if it does, Tom is in disagreementwith us. He says, The tribe of Levi will be restored along with the other tribes.Sounds like double standard. Could you please clarify thesestatements.Logabe
 

tomwebster

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Wow Tom, that is very interesting...so the tribe ofLevi and the other tribes will have a second chance. ....Sounds like double standard. Could you please clarify thesestatements.Logabe
Logabe,First, have you read any of my posts in the many OSAS threads in this forum? If you had you would know my stand on OSAS. Let me ask you, who does the saving? Does Christ fail? Salvation is a free gift, paid for by the blood of Christ. It does have to be received by the individual; God will not force Himself on anyone. We all need to accept His free gift of salvation. That is our part. Then we need to repent of our sin when we commit them.
1Jn 1:1 That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life; 1Jn 1:2 (For the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us;) 1Jn 1:3 That which we have seen and heard declare we unto you, that ye also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ. 1Jn 1:4 And these things write we unto you, that your joy may be full. 1Jn 1:5 This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all. 1Jn 1:6 If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth: 1Jn 1:7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin. 1Jn 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 1Jn 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 1Jn 1:10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.
Who is the Truth? (v.6) Who is the Word? (v.10). Is confession of sin a one time only thing or is it continuous?
I believe they were saved in the old testament….Sounds like they fell from GRACE.
Second, are the Old Testament people under grace or the law? Does the law "save anyone?" If it did or does why would Christ need to die on the cross? When did grace start? It is important to "rightly divide the Word of Truth." Does Scripture not say that when Christ was in the grave He went and preached to those held captive? Did any of them accept what He taught them? They had not had a first chance before that so how could it have been a second chance?
 

RichardBurger

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This is a long thread about OSAS. It is a pity that some say they have enough faith to think Jesus' death on the cross pays for sins but do not seem to have enough faith/confidence to think He can keep them saved. --- So sad.Richard
 

Christina

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Also, to answer Krissie's statement...the reason I askabout whether the Levites were going to HELL, was I believe they were saved because they were priestbut, they disqualified themselves when they startedhaving sex with the women worshipers among otherthings (1st Sam. 2:13-17). You quoted Krissie...OsAs imply you can sin fall away do whatever you like and your still saved...and among the saints... wrong ..you must stay in faith there are certain criteria for saints and not all will make it. .......Because theres no such doctrine as OSAS.I agree partially with you Krissie...but does that apply tothe Levites also...because if it does, Tom is in disagreementwith us. He says, The tribe of Levi will be restored along with the other tribes.Sounds like double standard. Could you please clarify thesestatements.Logabe
What??? God never says the whole Levite priest hood was going to hell for the sins of two ... Thats dosent bode well for all the false preachers of today ...then does it ... God killed these two .. and whether they are forgiven or not is Gods business not ours ..to turn around and say the Levite priest hood is going to hell is a ridiculous statement ..we are not judged by what others do ... Secondly you have just defeated your own argument if you believe this ... So according to you all the priests of Levites are going to hell for the sins of two yet many were faithful believers So they shouldn't they be OSAS ?you cant have it both ways.OSAS is a modern man made doctrine for the weak of faith for those who need a crutch all faithful believers who will be chosen called saints will be sealed they know the promise made to us and trust their father we know we have a duty to stay in faith to him. The very test of faith is in things not seen ....yet you would have a seen OSAS safety net so you can fall away be a sinner and say OSAS.. poppycock a true believer Knows who he is and where his faith lies his foundation is on the rock ... If you need a double insurance policy ... Well just in case God was lying ..lets say OSAS is a doctrine too ....Verse after verse denies this doctrine ....
 

Christina

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This is a long thread about OSAS. It is a pity that some say they have enough faith to think Jesus' death on the cross pays for sins but do not seem to have enough faith/confidence to think He can keep them saved. --- So sad.Richard
That statement in itself proves the falsehood of OSAS ... What you think you have no responsability here you just say I believe then can do whatever you like and if you get away with it must be ok with Christ he let me do it ...garbage doctrine for light weight Christains .. Who want God to be responsable for them ...to avoid taking any responsability themselves........... typical men thought of today someone else take responsability .......Thats not faith its a copout ... Its Gods fault ...Why dont you tell me what this scripture means Richard sense you say you dont Ignore scripture to suit your own belief please enlighten me Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven." seems to me we have the word doeth here ... that means we do the fathers will .... according to you we sit on our backsides and God doeth ...
 

RichardBurger

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That statement in itself proves the falsehood of OSAS ... What you think you have no responsability here you just say I believe then can do whatever you like and if you get away with it must be ok with Christ he let me do it ...garbage doctrine for light weight Christains .. Who want God to be responsable for them ...to avoid taking any responsability themselves........... typical men thought of today someone else take responsability .......Thats not faith its a copout ... Its Gods fault ...Why dont you tell me what this scripture means Richard sense you say you dont Ignore scripture to suit your own belief please enlighten me Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven." seems to me we have the word doeth here ... that means we do the fathers will .... according to you we sit on our backsides and God doeth ...
I am curious, tell me what you think your responsibility is. Obviously it is works. What you are saying is that WE have to work for our salvation. What Jesus did on the cross just isn't good enough. That is not taught by Paul. Eph 2:9 not of works, lest anyone should boast.Paul preached the gospel of God's grace and the religious persecuted him. The religious are still persecuting those that have faith, trust, confidence and hope in Jesus' work on the cross. Just as you are doing to those that believe God has the power to keep them.It is amazing, to me, that you want others to lose their faith in God to keep them. Is it because you don’t have that faith?According to what I read in the scriptures we are to believe that Jesus is the Son of God and that His work on the cross saves us. Therefore, those that have faith, trust, confidence in Jesus' work on the cross are doing God's will. John 3:16-18. Also John 6:27-29.You want to discount faith in God's work on the cross and say it is sitting on the backsides. For a human it is not easy to place the responsibility for salvation in the hands of someone you can’t see. Obviously you can't. To totally trust in Him to save you is to deny yourself. But it is much easier to think you can be responsible for saving yourself.For those that accuse others of having a ""license to sin,"" I will say this; --- if you think you can sin and then ask for forgiveness, your being able to ask for forgiveness is your ""license to sin."' --- In other words they can decide to commit a sin and then pull out their get out of sin repentance card and God will forgive them. That is their ""license to sin."'Richard
 

Jordan

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That statement in itself proves the falsehood of OSAS ... What you think you have no responsability here you just say I believe then can do whatever you like and if you get away with it must be ok with Christ he let me do it ...garbage doctrine for light weight Christains .. Who want God to be responsable for them ...to avoid taking any responsability themselves........... typical men thought of today someone else take responsability .......Thats not faith its a copout ... Its Gods fault ...Why dont you tell me what this scripture means Richard sense you say you dont Ignore scripture to suit your own belief please enlighten me Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven." seems to me we have the word doeth here ... that means we do the fathers will .... according to you we sit on our backsides and God doeth ...
I am curious, tell me what you think your responsibility is. Obviously it is works. What you are saying is that WE have to work for our salvation. What Jesus did on the cross just isn't good enough. That is not taught by Paul. Eph 2:9 not of works, lest anyone should boast.Paul preached the gospel of God's grace and the religious persecuted him. The religious are still persecuting those that have faith, trust, confidence and hope in Jesus' work on the cross. Just as you are doing to those that believe God has the power to keep them.It is amazing, to me, that you want others to lose their faith in God to keep them. Is it because you don’t have that faith?According to what I read in the scriptures we are to believe that Jesus is the Son of God and that His work on the cross saves us. Therefore, those that have faith, trust, confidence in Jesus' work on the cross are doing God's will. John 3:16-18. Also John 6:27-29.You want to discount faith in God's work on the cross and say it is sitting on the backsides. For a human it is not easy to place the responsibility for salvation in the hands of someone you can’t see. Obviously you can't. To totally trust in Him to save you is to deny yourself. But it is much easier to think you can be responsible for saving yourself.For those that accuse others of having a ""license to sin,"" I will say this; --- if you think you can sin and then ask for forgiveness, your being able to ask for forgiveness is your ""license to sin."' --- In other words they can decide to commit a sin and then pull out their get out of sin repentance card and God will forgive them. That is their ""license to sin."'RichardNo Christina is not saying that at all.Richard, you clearly don't understand at all.The word 'works' from both Apostle Paul and James are both two completely different meaning. You just want to be with your tradition of men.Colossians 2:8 - Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.
 

logabe

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Logabe,First, have you read any of my posts in the many OSAS threads in this forum? If you had you would know my stand on OSAS. Let me ask you, who does the saving? Does Christ fail? Salvation is a free gift, paid for by the blood of Christ. It does have to be received by the individual; God will not force Himself on anyone. We all need to accept His free gift of salvation. That is our part. Then we need to repent of our sin when we commit them.Yes I have Tom but...when you said the Levites were going to berestored...that puzzled me because the Levites were chosen of God...but God replaced them. They had wrote their own interpretations ofthe Law and "God replaced them". That sounds like they were saved and in need of being put back in good standings or as you said (restored). So please explain why God would restore the rebelliousLevites "who knew better" but He will destroy common people thatdidn't know any better.Logabe Who is the Truth? (v.6) Who is the Word? (v.10). Is confession of sin a one time only thing or is it continuous? Second, are the Old Testament people under grace or the law? Does the law "save anyone?" If it did or does why would Christ need to die on the cross? When did grace start? It is important to "rightly divide the Word of Truth." Does Scripture not say that when Christ was in the grave He went and preached to those held captive? Did any of them accept what He taught them? They had not had a first chance before that so how could it have been a second chance?
Yes Tom...grace "AGE" came by Jesus Christ. Did God usegrace in the Old Testament? You know the Law doesn't saveanyone. Was Joshua and Caleb saved...how about David? Ibelieve God gave them favor in their day. Jesus died beforethe foundation of the world...didn't He?Logabe
 

RichardBurger

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No Christina is not saying that at all.Richard, you clearly don't understand at all.The word 'works' from both Apostle Paul and James are both two completely different meaning. You just want to be with your tradition of men.
Yes Christina is saying it when she says someone wants to sit back and do nothing.James was writing to the Jews who were still under the Law of Moses. His using the word "works" are the works of the Law.Paul said we are no longer under the Law of Moses and therefore works are not required.Richard
 

Jordan

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No Christina is not saying that at all.Richard, you clearly don't understand at all.The word 'works' from both Apostle Paul and James are both two completely different meaning. You just want to be with your tradition of men.Colossians 2:8 - Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.
Yes Christina is saying it when she says someone wants to sit back and do nothing.James was writing to the Jews who were still under the Law of Moses. His using the word "works" are the works of the Law.Paul said we are no longer under the Law of Moses and therefore works are not required.RichardAgain, no, Christina is not saying that. All you are doing is twisting her words.Whatever you want to believe Richard. It's YOUR free will to stick with your traditions of men. I will follow God. That's my free will.
 

Christina

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I am curious, tell me what you think your responsibility is. Obviously it is works. What you are saying is that WE have to work for our salvation. What Jesus did on the cross just isn't good enough. That is not taught by Paul. Eph 2:9 not of works, lest anyone should boast.Paul preached the gospel of God's grace and the religious persecuted him. The religious are still persecuting those that have faith, trust, confidence and hope in Jesus' work on the cross. Just as you are doing to those that believe God has the power to keep them.It is amazing, to me, that you want others to lose their faith in God to keep them. Is it because you don’t have that faith?According to what I read in the scriptures we are to believe that Jesus is the Son of God and that His work on the cross saves us. Therefore, those that have faith, trust, confidence in Jesus' work on the cross are doing God's will. John 3:16-18. Also John 6:27-29.You want to discount faith in God's work on the cross and say it is sitting on the backsides. For a human it is not easy to place the responsibility for salvation in the hands of someone you can’t see. Obviously you can't. To totally trust in Him to save you is to deny yourself. But it is much easier to think you can be responsible for saving yourself.For those that accuse others of having a ""license to sin,"" I will say this; --- if you think you can sin and then ask for forgiveness, your being able to ask for forgiveness is your ""license to sin."' --- In other words they can decide to commit a sin and then pull out their get out of sin repentance card and God will forgive them. That is their ""license to sin."'Richard
Obviously you would have no idea what you are talking about pleaee dont put your words in my mouth I have never said Works does anything and have argued the point many times so you speak in error your so busy being locked in your little world of proving works dont saves you cant see the forest through the trees ............ Your telling sinners they can go do anything and not worry about it OSAS Works save no one ........they are but our garments in heaven Our duty is to walk in the way of Christ ... stay in faith, hear his Words ... heed his warnings "Lo he comes in the book" When you become a Christian you are accepting Gods grace he offers you ..however you are also agreeing in your heart /mind that if you truly believe in him you also believe his commandments .. Now if I go out and worship another god I have broken my part of the promiseGod doesnt control our minds or free will..only if I stay in faith am I kept.... I must chose to do that regurdless of the tests of life .... then I partake in his promise. It requires my faith ............Many are called few are chosen meaning many are called to the faith but few will follow through with their part and be chosen ... because they have free will ...and theres no such doctrine as OSASThe hebrews were the chosen people God promised them a land .......... he lead them out of Eygpt into the desert ... did they just sit down and wait ....No they wandered in the desert 40 years being refinded did they all make it because God had promised them ?????????? No some fell by the wayside ...does that mean God didnt keep his promise .......No of course not, he did keep his promise ....but each hebrew had free will to chose to do as they wanted ... the ones that didnt make it chose to follow there own rules /ideas ... they didnt pass the test/refining So it is with Christ he will lead us to the promised land as promised but each and everyone have free will to do as we are lead or not do it ...reguardless of the testing we all experience while being refined .. just as the hebrews in the desert had to found worthy so do weJust believing only makes us eligable to receive the promise of the Lord given us by his grace ....the rest depends on us we must be found worthy in our heart/fathful and true .. and many not all will make it today just as then..... If they had followed a OSAS doctrine they all would have made it ..God would have just zapped them to the promised land because he promised it ... It would have been a lie then and its a lie now ....
 

Jordan

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I am curious, tell me what you think your responsibility is. Obviously it is works. What you are saying is that WE have to work for our salvation. What Jesus did on the cross just isn't good enough. That is not taught by Paul. Eph 2:9 not of works, lest anyone should boast.Paul preached the gospel of God's grace and the religious persecuted him. The religious are still persecuting those that have faith, trust, confidence and hope in Jesus' work on the cross. Just as you are doing to those that believe God has the power to keep them.It is amazing, to me, that you want others to lose their faith in God to keep them. Is it because you don’t have that faith?According to what I read in the scriptures we are to believe that Jesus is the Son of God and that His work on the cross saves us. Therefore, those that have faith, trust, confidence in Jesus' work on the cross are doing God's will. John 3:16-18. Also John 6:27-29.You want to discount faith in God's work on the cross and say it is sitting on the backsides. For a human it is not easy to place the responsibility for salvation in the hands of someone you can’t see. Obviously you can't. To totally trust in Him to save you is to deny yourself. But it is much easier to think you can be responsible for saving yourself.For those that accuse others of having a ""license to sin,"" I will say this; --- if you think you can sin and then ask for forgiveness, your being able to ask for forgiveness is your ""license to sin."' --- In other words they can decide to commit a sin and then pull out their get out of sin repentance card and God will forgive them. That is their ""license to sin."'Richard
Obviously you would have no idea what you are talking about pleaee dont put your words in my mouth I have never said Works does anything and have argued the point many times so you speak in error your so busy being locked in your little world of proving works dont saves you cant see the forest through the trees ............ Your telling sinners they can go do anything and not worry about it OSAS Works save no one ........they are but our garments in heaven Our duty is to walk in the way of Christ ... stay in faith, hear his Words ... heed his warnings "Lo he comes in the book" When you become a Christian you are accepting Gods grace he offers you ..however you are also agreeing in your heart /mind that if you truly believe in him you also believe his commandments .. Now if I go out and worship another god I have broken my part of the promiseGod doesnt control our minds or free will..only if I stay in faith am I kept.... I must chose to do that regurdless of the tests of life .... then I partake in his promise. It requires my faith ............Many are called few are chosen meaning many are called to the faith but few will follow through with their part and be chosen ... because they have free will ...and theres no such doctrine as OSASThe hebrews were the chosen people God promised them a land .......... he lead them out of Eygpt into the desert ... did they just sit down and wait ....No they wandered in the desert 40 years being refinded did they all make it because God had promised them ?????????? No some fell by the wayside ...does that mean God didnt keep his promise .......No of course not, he did keep his promise ....but each hebrew had free will to chose to do as they were guided to or not ... the ones that didnt make it chose to follow there own rules /ideas ... So it is with Christ he will lead us to the promised land as promised but each and everyone have free will to do as we are lead or not do it ...reguardless of the refining we experience ... and many not all will make it today as then..... If they had followed a OSAS doctrine they all would have made it God would have just zapped them there ... It would have been a lie then and its a lie now ....Matthew 13:3 - And he spake many things unto them in parables, saying, Behold, a sower went forth to sow;Matthew 13:4 - And when he sowed, some seeds fell by the way side, and the fowls came and devoured them up:Matthew 13:5 - Some fell upon stony places, where they had not much earth: and forthwith they sprung up, because they had no deepness of earth:Matthew 13:6 - And when the sun was up, they were scorched; and because they had no root, they withered away.Matthew 13:7 - And some fell among thorns; and the thorns sprung up, and choked them:Matthew 13:8 - But other fell into good ground, and brought forth fruit, some an hundredfold, some sixtyfold, some thirtyfold.Matthew 13:9 - Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.
 

RichardBurger

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Again, no, Christina is not saying that. All you are doing is twisting her words.Whatever you want to believe Richard. It's YOUR free will to stick with your traditions of men. I will follow God. That's my free will.
If I were following the traditions of men then men would welcome what I say.Richard
 

RichardBurger

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Obviously you would have no idea what you are talking about pleaee dont put your words in my mouth I have never said Works does anything and have argued the point many times so you speak in error Works save no one ........they are but our garments in heaven Our duty is to walk in the way of Christ ... stay in faith, hear his Words ... heed his warnings "Lo he comes in the book" When you become a Christian you are accepting Gods grace he offers you ..however you are also agreeing in your heart /mind that if you truly believe in him you also believe his commandments ..
I have explained what He has commanded of us under the gospel of grace and you have ignored it so obviouly you disagree. We are to place our faith, trust, confidence and hope in what Jesus' (God) did on the cross.Since you can't agree with me then explain what you see as our duty? Don't be vague about it.What commandments are you saying we must keep? Don't be vague about it.Tell me what you see as the commandments we must keep in order to keep ourselves saved? Don't be vague about it.Richard
 

RichardBurger

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Jordan, why do you continue to take up space on the forum server by attaching all the scriptures, taken out of context that you attach to your replies? Do you think it makes you look more religious?Richard
 

Jordan

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(RichardBurger;67464)
Jordan, why do you continue to take up space on the forum server by attaching all the scriptures, taken out of context that you attach to your replies? Do you think it makes you look more religious?Richard
That's lame. The problem is not with me. The problem is with you, inability to understand His Words correctly... leaving you vulnerable. I'll follow God. :study:
 

RichardBurger

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From the book “hard to believe” by John MacArthur.Man-made and demon-designed systems of religion are based on the assumption that we don't really need a Savior, or that we are not fully dependent on Him, because we have the capacity to develop our own righteousness. Just let God give us a little religious environment to aid our natural goodness, dispense a little power to us, or infuse a little strength into us. Give us a few rules, a few religious routines and rituals, and we'll crank up salvation on our own. The lie of human achievement comes under myriad different titles, but it's all the same system, because it's spawned out of the same source: Satan himself. He packages it in different boxes, but it's all the same product. On the other hand, the truth of divine accomplishment is Christianity. And it stands alone.Tragically, most of humanity is religiously speeding down the wide highway of human achievement, convinced it's headed toward some fabulous heavenly destiny because of its own basic goodness, noble works, and religious deeds. By contrast, Jesus said the only true way to heaven is the narrow pathway of trusting Him alone as Lord and Savior.The Jews taught that they could make it on their own. That's why it was so shocking when the apostle Paul said, "Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight" (Rom. 3:20). He also said that the law came in order to stop our mouths from any claim to righteousness and to render the whole world guilty before God. The Law came to show us our sinfulness, but when self-righteous, ego-centered man saw that he was sinful by the Law, he didn't want to face his sinfulness. Fallen people set their sinfulness aside and are constantly inventing new systems that accommodate their shortcomings, then affirming that they are okay before their gods, based on their own personal criteria or religious beliefs and behaviors.Richard