Paul taught that revelation 20:4 is a present reality

[Truth7t7]

Verse 9 is not the second coming. Revelation 19 is and there's no fire.

Jesus Returns In Fire And Judgement

Daniel 7:10KJV
10 A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him: thousand thousands ministered unto him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him: the judgment was set, and the books were opened.

2 Thessalonians 1:7-9KJV
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

Malachi 3:2KJV
2 But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:

Psalm 50:3KJV
3 Our God shall come, and shall not keep silence: a fire shall devour before him, and it shall be very tempestuous round about him.

Isaiah 66:15KJV
15 For, behold, the Lord will come with fire, and with his chariots like a whirlwind, to render his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire.

 

[Marty fox]

Marty you also deny the future visible, literal, second coming is seen below, as you claim this isn't a literal, visible, coming of the Lord, but its a 70AD judgment upon Israel, hard to believe

The best illustration of the literal, visible, second coming in scripture below, and you deny its seen

2.) Denial Matthew 24:30 is the visible, literal, second coming of Jesus Christ in the heavens

"They Shall See The Son Of Man Coming"

Matthew 24:29-21KJV
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Did you see post #135?

 

[ewq1938]

Jesus Returns In Fire And Judgement

Sure but fire is not a weapon he uses to kill. He uses a symbolic sword.

None of the verses posted are about the second coming either.

Here are the correct verses:

Rev 19:11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.
Rev 19:12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.
Rev 19:13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.
Rev 19:14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.
Rev 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.
Rev 19:16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.
Rev 19:17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God;
Rev 19:18 That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great.
Rev 19:19 And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.
Rev 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.
Rev 19:21 And the remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.


No fire killing anyone!

 

[Marty fox]

Marty you also deny the future visible, literal, second coming is seen below, as you claim this isn't a literal, visible, coming of the Lord, but its a 70AD judgment upon Israel, hard to believe

The best illustration of the literal, visible, second coming in scripture below, and you deny its seen

2.) Denial Matthew 24:30 is the visible, literal, second coming of Jesus Christ in the heavens

"They Shall See The Son Of Man Coming"

Matthew 24:29-21KJV
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Why are you not addressing my post? You just avoided it

 

[Timtofly]

Marty the second coming is the firey stream "Before Him" the Lord is coming in fire behind the fire stream, same as all the other verses below clearly teach

You can claim the second coming isn't seen all you want, all the verses below are the same event in the Lord's second coming in fire, that you deny is seen in Daniel 7:10 below

The Lord returns with thousands and thousands of his ministering angels "With His Mighty Angels"

The scripture presented is basic, 6th grade reading comprehension is exaggerating

You quickly identify pre-tribbers misusing 1 Thess 4:16-17 to claim a pre-trib rapture, and your in the same ballpark with Daniel 7:10 & Matthew 24:30

Daniel 7:10KJV
10 A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him: thousand thousands ministered unto him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him: the judgment was set, and the books were opened.

2 Thessalonians 1:7-9KJV
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

Malachi 3:2KJV
2 But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:

Psalm 50:3KJV
3 Our God shall come, and shall not keep silence: a fire shall devour before him, and it shall be very tempestuous round about him.

Isaiah 66:15KJV
15 For, behold, the Lord will come with fire, and with his chariots like a whirlwind, to render his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire.

6th grade level and Amil still cannot see what a 6th grader can read about a 1,000 year reign of Christ?

 

[Truth7t7]

Did you see post #135?

Post #135 states absolutely nothing about Matthew 24:30 as seen below

Marty you also deny the future visible, literal, second coming is seen below, as you claim this isn't a literal, visible, coming of the Lord, but its a 70AD judgment upon Israel, hard to believe

The best illustration of the literal, visible, second coming in scripture below, and you deny its seen

2.) Denial Matthew 24:30 is the visible, literal, second coming of Jesus Christ in the heavens

"They Shall See The Son Of Man Coming"

Matthew 24:29-21KJV
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

 

[Truth7t7]

6th grade level and Amil still cannot see what a 6th grader can read about a 1,000 year reign of Christ?

Can a 6th grader find the things claimed by those teaching a Literal 1,000 year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth in Revelation 20:1-6 below?

1.) Physical Earthly Kingdom?
2.) Physical Earthly Throne?
3.) Physical Mortal Humans?

The Above Claims (Don't Exist)

Revelation 20:1-6 Is 100% In The Lords (Spiritual) Angel, Heaven, Devil, Satan, The Souls, The Dead, God, Christ

100% Spiritual Realm, No "Literal" Time

2 Peter 3:8KJV
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Revelation 20:1-6KJV
1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

 

[Truth7t7]

Why are you not addressing my post? You just avoided it

I have addressed your post concerning Daniel 7:10 several times, you deny the second coming is seen, and sluff off the "Stream Of Fire Before Him" as if it's non-existent, exactly the same event as the presented verses

I have also addressed your denial of the literal, visible , second coming seen in Matthew 24:30, that you remove through symbolic allegory, in claims it represents a judgment upon Israel in 70AD, it's not Jesus literally appearing in the heavens

2.) Denial Matthew 24:30 is the visible, literal, second coming of Jesus Christ in the heavens

"They Shall See The Son Of Man Coming"

Matthew 24:29-21KJV
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

 

[ewq1938]

Can a 6th grader find the things claimed by those teaching a Literal 1,000 year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth in Revelation 20:1-6 below?

1.) Physical Earthly Kingdom?

Yes.

Rev 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

2.) Physical Earthly Throne?

Of course, more than one even:

Dan 7:9 I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire.

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

Rev_22:1 And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.

3.) Physical Mortal Humans?

Yes, the thousand years is all about them!

Second coming:

Rev 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

The verb RULE here is in the future tense so it happens after the events of Armageddon are completed.

After the second coming:

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Even Daniel saw beasts still alive after the destruction of the ten horned beast and beasts are kingdoms full of people! That further proves a thousand years of ruling over people!

Dan 7:11 I beheld then because of the voice of the great words which the horn spake: I beheld even till the beast was slain, and his body destroyed, and given to the burning flame.
Dan 7:12 As concerning the rest of the beasts, they had their dominion taken away: yet their lives were prolonged for a season and time.

The peoples who made up these beasts will live on for a season and a time, and that TIME is the thousand years.


Dan 7:13 I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him.
Dan 7:14 And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.

And guess what we have here? Christ comes after the ten horned beast is destroyed and he is given a kingdom! That kingdom begins at the start of the thousand years just as Premillennialism teaches. All of this proves Amillennialism to be false.

The Above Claims (Don't Exist)

That's laughable and sad because the claims are scriptural.

 

[Truth7t7]

Yes.

Rev 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.




Off course, more than one even:

Dan 7:9 I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire.

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

Rev_22:1 And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.





Yes, the thousand years is all about them!

Second coming:

Rev 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

The verb RULE here is in the future tense so it happens after the events of Armageddon are completed.

After the second coming:

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Even Daniel saw beasts still alive after the destruction of the ten horned beast and beasts are kingdoms full of people! That further proves a thousand years of ruling over people!

Dan 7:11 I beheld then because of the voice of the great words which the horn spake: I beheld even till the beast was slain, and his body destroyed, and given to the burning flame.
Dan 7:12 As concerning the rest of the beasts, they had their dominion taken away: yet their lives were prolonged for a season and time.

The peoples who made up these beasts will live on for a season and a time, and that TIME is the thousand years.


Dan 7:13 I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him.
Dan 7:14 And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.

And guess what we have here? Christ comes after the ten horned beast is destroyed and he is given a kingdom! That kingdom begins at the start of the thousand years just as Premillennialism teaches. All of this proves Amillennialism to be false.




That's laughable and sad because the claims are scriptural.

Yes the claims are laughable,(The Souls) and (The Dead) seen below, aren't living mortal humans on this earth as you claim, dream on :)

Can a 6th grader find the things claimed by those teaching a Literal 1,000 year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth in Revelation 20:1-6 below?

1.) Physical Earthly Kingdom?
2.) Physical Earthly Throne?
3.) Physical Mortal Humans?

The Above Claims (Don't Exist)

Revelation 20:1-6 Is 100% In The Lords (Spiritual) Angel, Heaven, Devil, Satan, The Souls, The Dead, God, Christ

100% Spiritual Realm, No "Literal" Time

2 Peter 3:8KJV
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Revelation 20:1-6KJV
1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

 

[ewq1938]

Yes the claims are laughable,(The Souls) and (The Dead) seen below, aren't living mortal humans on this earth as you claim, dream on :)

Can a 6th grader find the things claimed by those teaching a Literal 1,000 year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth in Revelation 20:1-6 below?

1.) Physical Earthly Kingdom?
2.) Physical Earthly Throne?
3.) Physical Mortal Humans?

The Above Claims (Don't Exist)

I know how to copy and paste too.

Can a 6th grader find the things claimed by those teaching a Literal 1,000 year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth in Revelation 20:1-6 below?

1.) Physical Earthly Kingdom?

Yes.

Rev 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

2.) Physical Earthly Throne?

Of course, more than one even:

Dan 7:9 I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire.

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

Rev_22:1 And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.

3.) Physical Mortal Humans?

Yes, the thousand years is all about them!

Second coming:

Rev 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

The verb RULE here is in the future tense so it happens after the events of Armageddon are completed.

After the second coming:

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Even Daniel saw beasts still alive after the destruction of the ten horned beast and beasts are kingdoms full of people! That further proves a thousand years of ruling over people!

Dan 7:11 I beheld then because of the voice of the great words which the horn spake: I beheld even till the beast was slain, and his body destroyed, and given to the burning flame.
Dan 7:12 As concerning the rest of the beasts, they had their dominion taken away: yet their lives were prolonged for a season and time.

The peoples who made up these beasts will live on for a season and a time, and that TIME is the thousand years.


Dan 7:13 I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him.
Dan 7:14 And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.

And guess what we have here? Christ comes after the ten horned beast is destroyed and he is given a kingdom! That kingdom begins at the start of the thousand years just as Premillennialism teaches. All of this proves Amillennialism to be false.

The Above Claims (Don't Exist)

That's laughable and sad because the claims are scriptural.

 

[Truth7t7]

I know how to copy and paste too.




Yes.

Rev 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.




Of course, more than one even:

Dan 7:9 I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire.

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

Rev_22:1 And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.





Yes, the thousand years is all about them!

Second coming:

Rev 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

The verb RULE here is in the future tense so it happens after the events of Armageddon are completed.

After the second coming:

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Even Daniel saw beasts still alive after the destruction of the ten horned beast and beasts are kingdoms full of people! That further proves a thousand years of ruling over people!

Dan 7:11 I beheld then because of the voice of the great words which the horn spake: I beheld even till the beast was slain, and his body destroyed, and given to the burning flame.
Dan 7:12 As concerning the rest of the beasts, they had their dominion taken away: yet their lives were prolonged for a season and time.

The peoples who made up these beasts will live on for a season and a time, and that TIME is the thousand years.


Dan 7:13 I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him.
Dan 7:14 And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.

And guess what we have here? Christ comes after the ten horned beast is destroyed and he is given a kingdom! That kingdom begins at the start of the thousand years just as Premillennialism teaches. All of this proves Amillennialism to be false.




That's laughable and sad because the claims are scriptural.

Dream On :)

 

[Timtofly]

Can a 6th grader find the things claimed by those teaching a Literal 1,000 year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth in Revelation 20:1-6 below?

1.) Physical Earthly Kingdom?
2.) Physical Earthly Throne?
3.) Physical Mortal Humans?

The Above Claims (Don't Exist)

Revelation 20:1-6 Is 100% In The Lords (Spiritual) Angel, Heaven, Devil, Satan, The Souls, The Dead, God, Christ

100% Spiritual Realm, No "Literal" Time

2 Peter 3:8KJV
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Revelation 20:1-6KJV
1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

They certainly don't have to see it as you do, since you have convinced yourself otherwise.

 

[Marty fox]

I have addressed your post concerning Daniel 7:10 several times, you deny the second coming is seen, and sluff off the "Stream Of Fire Before Him" as if it's non-existent, exactly the same event as the presented verses

I have also addressed your denial of the literal, visible , second coming seen in Matthew 24:30, that you remove through symbolic allegory, in claims it represents a judgment upon Israel in 70AD, it's not Jesus literally appearing in the heavens

2.) Denial Matthew 24:30 is the visible, literal, second coming of Jesus Christ in the heavens

"They Shall See The Son Of Man Coming"

Matthew 24:29-21KJV
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

So the Father sitting on the throne with a great multitude of people standing in front of Him and then the books being opened isn't the great white throne judgement but the second coming?

 

[Timtofly]

So the Father sitting on the throne with a great multitude of people standing in front of Him and then the books being opened isn't the great white throne judgement but the second coming?

"I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire. A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him: thousand thousands ministered unto him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him: the judgment was set, and the books were opened."

God has been sitting on the throne since the beginning. The books have been opened since the beginning. Thousands have surrounded the throne since the beginning. The one like the son of man has been able to approach the throne since the very beginning. How do you know exactly what point, in time, Daniel is viewing this constant ongoing phenomenon?

Kingdoms have come and gone since at least the Flood. Who knows what thrones meant prior to the Flood?

 

[Marty fox]

"I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire. A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him: thousand thousands ministered unto him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him: the judgment was set, and the books were opened."

God has been sitting on the throne since the beginning. The books have been opened since the beginning. Thousands have surrounded the throne since the beginning. The one like the son of man has been able to approach the throne since the very beginning. How do you know exactly what point, in time, Daniel is viewing this constant ongoing phenomenon?

Kingdoms have come and gone since at least the Flood. Who knows what thrones meant prior to the Flood?

Did you see post #135?

 

[Timtofly]

Did you see post #135?

Daniel is not talking about after heaven and earth have passed away. If heaven does not exist, then Revelation 20:11 is not what Daniel saw. There was no heaven and earth in this verse:

"And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them."

Daniel saw this throne when heaven was still there and thousands were surrounding the throne. Revelation 20:11 is outside of time and creation altogether. Only the dead from Death and sheol were suspended between time and creation. Then tossed into the LOF as they, the dead, came back into reality.

God is constantly judging over mankind. He sent the Flood in Noah's day to end all humanity except 8 souls. What Daniel points out is the GWT has always been there since the beginning. Many think it just suddenly comes into existence at the end of time? No! It is currently on earth and in heaven like always. We just cannot see it in Adam's flesh and blood.

 

[Truth7t7]

So the Father sitting on the throne with a great multitude of people standing in front of Him and then the books being opened isn't the great white throne judgement but the second coming?

Marty you have denied the "Second Coming" is seen in Daniel 7:10

Jesus Returns In Fire And Judgement, at the "Second Coming"

A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him:

A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him:

A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him:

Daniel 7:10KJV
10 A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him: thousand thousands ministered unto him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him: the judgment was set, and the books were opened.

2 Thessalonians 1:7-9KJV
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

Malachi 3:2KJV
2 But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:

Psalm 50:3KJV
3 Our God shall come, and shall not keep silence: a fire shall devour before him, and it shall be very tempestuous round about him.

Isaiah 66:15KJV
15 For, behold, the Lord will come with fire, and with his chariots like a whirlwind, to render his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire.

 

[ewq1938]

Daniel 7:10KJV
10 A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him: thousand thousands ministered unto him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him: the judgment was set, and the books were opened.

A stream of fire not killing anyone doesn't support your false belief that Jesus uses fire to kill people at the second coming. Daniel 7:10 is judgment day not the second coming anyways. You will literally use anything to defend this defenseless doctrine.

 

[Marty fox]

I will just let the scriptures in my opening post in this thread speak for itself.

While Paul was alive he considered himself seated in the heavenly realms.

Thus Revelation 20:4