Premillennialism contradicts scripture (1 Corinthians 15:50-54) by having mortal flesh and blood inheriting the kingdom of God when Jesus returns.
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CadyandZoe
Well-Known Member
CadyandZoe
Well-Known Member
CadyandZoe
Well-Known Member
CadyandZoe
Well-Known Member
You often demonstrate why we discourage the practice of proof-texting, taking single verses out of context to force them to say whatever you want them to say. Others should follow my lead and completely ignore such "newbie" mistakes.
Speak to the issue.
You have repeated your claim many times to no effect. Why? Because you can't find a single city or town in the world where Jesus is in charge. You have not considered or won't consider that Jesus' sovereignty is his inheritance and just like any inheritance, Jesus has been promised authority but has not yet taken power and begun to rule all things.
As Jesus said, he is like the nobleman who went away to a far country to receive a kingdom, which is what he did. He doesn't begin to rule over the world until he returns.
CadyandZoe
Well-Known Member
Well, he isn't "enforcing" ...executing, exerting... that control as people think that control would or should look. Which certainly can give us the impression that He is not in control. But... His thoughts are not our thoughts, His ways not our ways. What we do know is, no purpose of His can be thwarted, His Word never returns to Him void but always accomplishes the purposes for which it is sent, and, for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to His purpose.
On an unrelated note, it is just astounding how mean-spirited and lacking in humility and grace various posters are on this... supposedly... Christian website...
Grace and peace to all.
You deny the deity of Christ. You deny His current kingship. You deny He is reigning over all, including His enemies. You do!
CadyandZoe
Well-Known Member
What did I ignore? Why is it so difficult to understand that since Jesus was going away, he sent his apostles another Paracletos? Your view that Jesus is omnipresent is undermined by the Upper Room discourse. If Jesus was omnipresent as you suggest, he wouldn't need to comfort his disciples concerning his absence. He wouldn't warn them about obeying him in his absence. He wouldn't warn them to treat their fellow servants well in his absence. And he certainly wouldn't need to send ANOTHER Paracletos to help them with their mission, IN HIS ABSENCE.
The sentence you quoted, taken out of context, is part of a passage where Jesus warns his disciples about his impending departure. He is going away, and he knows how stressful this will be for them.
The chapter begins
John 14:1-3 Do not let your heart be troubled; believe in God, believe also in Me. In My Father’s house are many dwelling places; if it were not so, I would have told you; for I go to prepare a place for you. If I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself, that where I am, there you may be also.
In this passage, our Lord speaks about dwelling places that are found in His Father's house. Jesus is going to His Father’s house to prepare these dwelling places for His disciples. He comforts them by promising to return and receive them. His intention is to bring them to the dwelling places He has prepared, so that they may be there with Him as well.
This addresses your incorrect belief that Jesus is omnipresent. The promise he made to his disciples is clearly locative: first, Jesus departs, and then he returns. Movement only makes sense for beings that are not present everywhere. Since Jesus is not omnipresent, he must leave to prepare the dwelling places, and he must also return to gather them.
Jesus often speaks cryptically, and so his disciples often ask for clarification.
John 14:22-25 Judas (not Iscariot) *said to Him, “Lord, what then has happened that You are going to disclose Yourself to us and not to the world?” Jesus answered and said to him, “If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our abode with him. He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine, but the Father’s who sent Me.
In this passage, the Lord speaks about a time when He will reveal Himself to His disciples but not to the rest of the world. At that moment, they were unaware that Jesus would be crucified, buried in a tomb, and then rise again from the grave. After His resurrection, Jesus appeared to a limited number of people, including several women, two individuals on the road to Emmaus, and the eleven disciples. Additionally, according to Paul, He later appeared to about 500 other witnesses.
But he didn't reveal himself to the world. That role will be given to the Eleven and Paul, working with the Holy Spirit. Eventually, as Jesus said earlier in the chapter, he will return to gather his disciples and take them into his fathers' house, where he has prepared dwelling places for them. That is where they will make their abode with him and his Father.
God has always been reigning over the affairs of man, He always will be. Jesus (the Son of God) is reigning over His enemies - by causing or permitting what is happening. His ultimate sovereign will shall unfold. He cannot be thwarted. He will finally subdue His enemies when He comes. God in His infinite wisdom has given man a free will to sin. But with that He has placed boundaries upon him that cannot be breached. Satan is restrained in his activities since the cross, but he wll be loosed before the end to wreak havoc. Christ will eternally eliminate that when He comes. Man come out just do whatever he wants. His actions our governed by the Lord. God turns what is meant for evil for good.
CadyandZoe
Well-Known Member
What did I ignore? Why is it so difficult to understand that since Jesus was going away, he sent his apostles another Paracletos? Your view that Jesus is omnipresent is undermined by the Upper Room discourse. If Jesus was omnipresent as you suggest, he wouldn't need to comfort his disciples concerning his absence. He wouldn't warn them about obeying him in his absence. He wouldn't warn them to treat their fellow servants well in his absence. And he certainly wouldn't need to send ANOTHER Paracletos to help them with their mission, IN HIS ABSENCE.
The sentence you quoted, taken out of context, is part of a passage where Jesus warns his disciples about his impending departure. He is going away, and he knows how stressful this will be for them.
The chapter begins
John 14:1-3 Do not let your heart be troubled; believe in God, believe also in Me. In My Father’s house are many dwelling places; if it were not so, I would have told you; for I go to prepare a place for you. If I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself, that where I am, there you may be also.
In this passage, our Lord speaks about dwelling places that are found in His Father's house. Jesus is going to His Father’s house to prepare these dwelling places for His disciples. He comforts them by promising to return and receive them. His intention is to bring them to the dwelling places He has prepared, so that they may be there with Him as well.
This addresses your incorrect belief that Jesus is omnipresent. The promise he made to his disciples is clearly locative: first, Jesus departs, and then he returns. Movement only makes sense for beings that are not present everywhere. Since Jesus is not omnipresent, he must leave to prepare the dwelling places, and he must also return to gather them.
Jesus often speaks cryptically, and so his disciples often ask for clarification.
John 14:22-25 Judas (not Iscariot) *said to Him, “Lord, what then has happened that You are going to disclose Yourself to us and not to the world?” Jesus answered and said to him, “If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our abode with him. He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine, but the Father’s who sent Me.
In this passage, the Lord speaks about a time when He will reveal Himself to His disciples but not to the rest of the world. At that moment, they were unaware that Jesus would be crucified, buried in a tomb, and then rise again from the grave. After His resurrection, Jesus appeared to a limited number of people, including several women, two individuals on the road to Emmaus, and the eleven disciples. Additionally, according to Paul, He later appeared to about 500 other witnesses.
But he didn't reveal himself to the world. That role will be given to the Eleven and Paul, working with the Holy Spirit. Eventually, as Jesus said earlier in the chapter, he will return to gather his disciples and take them into his fathers' house, where he has prepared dwelling places for them. That is where they will make their abode with him and his Father.
CadyandZoe
Well-Known Member
CadyandZoe
Well-Known Member
What did I ignore? Why is it so difficult to understand that since Jesus was going away, he sent his apostles another Paracletos? Your view that Jesus is omnipresent is undermined by the Upper Room discourse. If Jesus was omnipresent as you suggest, he wouldn't need to comfort his disciples concerning his absence. He wouldn't warn them about obeying him in his absence. He wouldn't warn them to treat their fellow servants well in his absence. And he certainly wouldn't need to send ANOTHER Paracletos to help them with their mission, IN HIS ABSENCE.
The sentence you quoted, taken out of context, is part of a passage where Jesus warns his disciples about his impending departure. He is going away, and he knows how stressful this will be for them.
The chapter begins
John 14:1-3 Do not let your heart be troubled; believe in God, believe also in Me. In My Father’s house are many dwelling places; if it were not so, I would have told you; for I go to prepare a place for you. If I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself, that where I am, there you may be also.
In this passage, our Lord speaks about dwelling places that are found in His Father's house. Jesus is going to His Father’s house to prepare these dwelling places for His disciples. He comforts them by promising to return and receive them. His intention is to bring them to the dwelling places He has prepared, so that they may be there with Him as well.
This addresses your incorrect belief that Jesus is omnipresent. The promise he made to his disciples is clearly locative: first, Jesus departs, and then he returns. Movement only makes sense for beings that are not present everywhere. Since Jesus is not omnipresent, he must leave to prepare the dwelling places, and he must also return to gather them.
Jesus often speaks cryptically, and so his disciples often ask for clarification.
John 14:22-25 Judas (not Iscariot) *said to Him, “Lord, what then has happened that You are going to disclose Yourself to us and not to the world?” Jesus answered and said to him, “If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our abode with him. He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine, but the Father’s who sent Me.
In this passage, the Lord speaks about a time when He will reveal Himself to His disciples but not to the rest of the world. At that moment, they were unaware that Jesus would be crucified, buried in a tomb, and then rise again from the grave. After His resurrection, Jesus appeared to a limited number of people, including several women, two individuals on the road to Emmaus, and the eleven disciples. Additionally, according to Paul, He later appeared to about 500 other witnesses.
But he didn't reveal himself to the world. That role will be given to the Eleven and Paul, working with the Holy Spirit. Eventually, as Jesus said earlier in the chapter, he will return to gather his disciples and take them into his fathers' house, where he has prepared dwelling places for them. That is where they will make their abode with him and his Father.
Heb 1:13 KJV But to which of the angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool?
Heb 2:5 KJV For unto the angels hath he not put in subjection the world to come, whereof we speak....
"WHEREOF WE SPEAK..."
The writer is referring to what he said In Heb 1:13.
"THE WORLD TO COME,"
It is NOT the present world that is to be in subjection to the one sitting at his right hand, but it is the "world to come".
Heb 2:7-8 KJV 7 Thou madest him [MAN] a little lower than the angels; thou crownedst him with glory and honour, and didst set him over the works of thy hands: 8 Thou hast put all things in subjection under his feet. For in that he put all in subjection under him, he left nothing that is not put under him. But now we see not yet all things put under him. [HIS FEET!]
SO, how can it be both,
1. All things in subjection under his feet
AND
2. Not yet all things put under him. (???)
How can both be true?
It is because the authority given to the one sitting at God's right hand [ALL AUTHORITY] is for authority over the world to come. He has all authority for the world to come. Only the pre-mill understands this.
Be Blessed
The PuP
CadyandZoe
Well-Known Member
Keep studying the Bible and thinking things through. I'm encouraged to see you posting.
I am sorry for any hurtful words I have made toward you that may have caused you to respond like this. I was genuinely troubled about your erratic posts. It was not my heart to offend you. Sorry if I did.
CadyandZoe
Well-Known Member
CadyandZoe
Well-Known Member
Perhaps you didn't know that a "paracletos" is not a person who comforts others. The "paracletos" is more like an advocate, a legal person who is trained and skilled in the art of making an argument for or against a particular social issue or they are hired to make an argument for or against a legal opponent.
With that in view, John the Apostle refers to Jesus as our "paracletos", the one who will advocate for us in the heavenly court.
1John 2:1-2 My little children, I am writing these things to you so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous; 2 and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world.
Jesus serves as our advocate for forgiveness, justification, and salvation. However, rather than being our Advocate, Jesus sent the Holy Spirit to be his advocate. As stated, the Holy Spirit will convict the world regarding sin, judgment, and righteousness. In this role, the Holy Spirit supports Jesus and His Apostles, who are spreading the good news throughout the known world.
Jesus was not a Platonist, so when he says that he and the Father are one, he is referring to the idea that he and the Father teach the same things and share the same attitudes and commitments. They are one in purpose, aims, goals, thinking, desires, and commitments. He isn't saying that he and the Father are of the same nature.
The Upper Room discourse undermines your view that Jesus is omnipresent. If Jesus was omnipresent as you suggest, he wouldn't need to comfort his disciples concerning his absence. He wouldn't warn them about obeying him in his absence. He wouldn't warn them to treat their fellow servants well in his absence. And he certainly wouldn't need to send ANOTHER Paracletos to help them with their mission, IN HIS ABSENCE.
The sentence you quoted, taken out of context, is part of a passage where Jesus warns his disciples about his impending departure. He is going away, and he knows how stressful this will be for them. The verse is found in chapter 14 of John's gospel.
John 14:1-3 Do not let your heart be troubled; believe in God, believe also in Me. In My Father’s house are many dwelling places; if it were not so, I would have told you; for I go to prepare a place for you. If I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself, that where I am, there you may be also.
In this passage, our Lord speaks about dwelling places that are found in His Father's house. Jesus is going to His Father’s house to prepare these dwelling places for His disciples. He comforts them by promising to return and receive them. His intention is to bring them to the dwelling places He has prepared, so that they may be there with Him as well.
This addresses your incorrect belief that Jesus is omnipresent. The promise he made to his disciples is clearly locative: first, Jesus departs, and then he returns. Movement only makes sense for beings that are not present everywhere. Since Jesus is not omnipresent, he must leave to prepare the dwelling places, and he must also return to gather them.
Jesus often speaks cryptically, and so his disciples often ask for clarification.
John 14:22-25 Judas (not Iscariot) *said to Him, “Lord, what then has happened that You are going to disclose Yourself to us and not to the world?” Jesus answered and said to him, “If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our abode with him. He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine, but the Father’s who sent Me.
In this passage, the Lord speaks about a time when He will reveal Himself to His disciples but not to the rest of the world. At that moment, they were unaware that Jesus would be crucified, buried in a tomb, and then rise again from the grave. He kept his word that he wouldn't reveal himself to the world, but only to them. After His resurrection, Jesus appeared to a limited number of people, including several women, two individuals on the road to Emmaus, and the eleven disciples. Additionally, according to Paul, He later appeared to about 500 other witnesses. But he didn't reveal himself to the world.
That role will be given to the Eleven and Paul, working with the Holy Spirit. Eventually, as Jesus said earlier in the chapter, he will return to gather his disciples and take them into his fathers' house, where he has prepared dwelling places for them. That is where they will make their abode with him and his Father.
I do acknowledge that Jesus is God. I don't affirm your belief that Jesus must be divine by nature to be God.
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