Proof that Jesus is God

[Cooper]

Well, you did cut out the rest of my sentence, which was not Jesus. He is not mentioned until v14.

That so many desperately reach for the figurative language of John 1:1 shows how weak the argument is. And of course, you have to ignore many verses that proof Jesus is not God, like John 20:17, Jesus going to his God.

In John 20:17 Jesus, in the image of man, tells us who his Father is. It is not Joseph.
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[kcnalp]

Amen brother. How ridiculous is it for a bunch of intellectually superior mystics to brag about their unitarian Jewish brethren in order to say Jesus is not God, and then part from their fellow Jewish Religion unbelievers, by not recognizing that the prophecies of the Messiah were concerning the Lord God Himself coming to earth to redeem His people Personally.

Which is why they knew Jesus was trying to make Himself God by claiming to be the Christ and Son of the blessed. They had Him crucified for being God, NOT for being a created angelic, sort of godlike, creational helper!

P.s. Jesus is the express image of His Person, not the created figurative outlook of His mind...

As I said. Those people are not a serious people, and only a fool would engage them.

Unless, you want to discuss the merits of apples over oranges, I suppose. I myself like the taste of oranges better, but apples are better for the kidneys. Or so I've heard. Any of you Jehovaites want to weight in on that one? But if you 'go to the Greek', I'm outta here.

I think it's interesting discussing Scripture with them to see how they twist the Bible to suit their beliefs.

 

[Curtis]

Hello this is the way my view is : robert derrick

Colossians 2:1-10
Young's Literal Translation

2 For I (Paul) wish you to know how great a conflict I have for you and those in Laodicea, and as many as have not seen my (Pauls) face in the flesh,

2 that their hearts may be comforted, being united in love, and to all riches of the full assurance of the understanding, to the full knowledge of the secret of the God and Father,

and of the Christ,

3 in whom are all the treasures of the wisdom and the knowledge hid,

4 and this I (Paul) say, that no one may beguile you in enticing words,

5 for if even in the flesh I am absent -- yet in the spirit I am with you, joying and beholding your order, and the stedfastness of your faith in regard to Christ;

6 as, then, ye did receive Christ Jesus the Lord, in him walk ye,

7 being rooted and built up in him, and confirmed in the faith, as ye were taught -- abounding in it in thanksgiving. (Paul is writing to the people of Colossians Gods Saints; of the people in colosse; (Colossians 1:1-3)

8 See that no one shall be carrying you away as spoil through the philosophy and vain deceit, according to the deliverance of men, according to the rudiments of the world, and not according to Christ,

9 because in him doth tabernacle all the fulness of the Godhead bodily,

(In Christ does God dwell with-in His Son the man Jesus Christ ~ Who was the Word of God -> made flesh (in the body - the Father dwells by His Spirit with-in - The Holy Spirit descended like a dove - and so does Gods Spirit dwelled in Gods (WORD) Son the Son of Man, the Son of God - Jesus Christ the Lord of Lord an King of Kings.)

We are baptized Christ Jesus in the same manner that He was by the holy spirit/spirit of Christ which is given from the Son and the Father, for us to have comfort in our life by their love they have for us while we are living on this planet. Knowing we have a loving God, and Lord here to help us through this life that is and can be very difficult especially without the holy spirit with-in us as believers.​

10 and ye are in him made full, who is the head of all principality and authority,

And you as believers - are in him made full ~ The Lord Jesus Christ who is the head of all principality, and authority ~. (All authority and Heaven and on Earth have been given to me ~ Said the Lord Jesus Christ)​

Godhead is Theotes in the Greek, if memory serves, and a lexicon defines it as: the state of being God.

Thus the verse means that in Christ dwells all the fullness of the state of being God, bodily.

And Isaiah calls Messiah, the mighty God, the everlasting Father.

 

[Cooper]

29 Yeshua answered, “The most important is, [Hear, O Isra’el, the LORD our God, the LORD is one], 32 he is one, and that there is no other besides him
Mark 12:29, 32 (CJB)

The trinity is not in the Bible. The entire Bible is written by monotheist Jews who reject the trinity to this day. Therefore, projecting trinitarian doctrine onto unitarian text is futile.

Thinking Christians, as with Jews of old, agree 100% with your signature. In particular the embolden part.
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[Curtis]

In John 20:17 Jesus, in the image of man, tells us who his Father is. It is not Joseph.
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There’s no mystery there. Philippians 2, Jesus emptied Himself to leave the form of God He had by His very nature, and TOOK the form of a man, and humble servant.

As a man on earth, the Father, who is God, is His God, too.

Which does not negate the fact that Jesus is God the Logos, by His very nature.

 

[kcnalp]

Isaiah 48:16-17 (NKJV)
16 "Come near to Me, hear this: I have not spoken in secret from the beginning; From the time that it was, I was there. And now the Lord GOD and His Spirit Have sent Me."17 Thus says the LORD, your Redeemer, The Holy One of Israel: "I am the LORD your God, ...

Jesus is God!

 

[robert derrick]

Godhead is Theotes in the Greek, if memory serves, and a lexicon defines it as: the state of being God.

Thus the verse means that in Christ dwells all the fullness of the state of being God, bodily.

And Isaiah calls Messiah, the mighty God, the everlasting Father.

Without the necessity of Greek, amen brother. Exactly right. The prophecies of old were about the coming of the Lord God, the Messiah. Which is why the real Jews (not these Jehovaite wanna-be's) knew that Jesus declaring Himself Christ and Son of the Blessed was to make Himself God. That is why they had Him crucified. They didnt want the true God Jesus, any more than these Jehovaites. They want their own god that they can label with just a title, Jehovah, and feel really special about it.

And so, they took up stones when He declared before Abraham was, I Am. And again when demanded He answer plainly, He said I Am. And so by two declarations of promise, Jesus is the I Am that I Am.

 

[Curtis]

Thinking Christians, as with Jews of old, agree 100% with your signature.
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Guess what - since the last time you posted your “one verse Charlie proof text”, the word ONE still hasn’t changed it’s Hebrew meaning - ECHAD still proves the trinity, because it still means ONE IN COMPOSITE UNITY, such as ONE sheet of THREE layer plywood, or ONE cluster holding multiple grapes.

No matter how many times you post it, it still refutes you.

 

[Cooper]

True, as in "God with us".

(Well not really with us in Person. But rather sort of with us when we see Jesus, who is sort of like God, but not God)

God is spirit, and that is how Jesus is with us when two or three are gathered together in His name.
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[Cooper]

Guess what - since the last time you posted your “one verse Charlie proof text”, the word ONE still hasn’t changed it’s Hebrew meaning - ECHAD still proves the trinity, because it still means ONE IN COMPOSITE UNITY, such as ONE sheet of THREE layer plywood, or ONE cluster holding multiple graves.

No matter how many times you post it, it still refutes you.

I do not know what you mean. What is the “one verse Charlie proof text?”
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[Cooper]

While Jesus is the true God and Son of God both together, He is not God the Father. They are both God individually and One God together.

The mystery of the Godhead (Col 2:2): the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit is trying to understand how that can be.

And because certain can't understand it in their carnal minds, then they must reject it as impossible. Which is fine, but then to launch off into pagan deism that the Son of God is a created being, who is not really God, but only like Him, and He was only created initially to help in the creation of God...

Can anyone say father Uranus and son Zeus? And you can throw in the 'Blessed Virgin Mary' as mother Gaia...

There is only ONE invisible God in heaven and on earth, and he is with us now, omnipresent, so be careful about dividing him. God is not to be divided. Just because he made himself visible then, and proved he was the miracle working God, is no reason for unbelievers, to foolishly deny Him.

Remember God is One.

Apparently the god of the Jews, JW's, etc is an incompetent, stay at home type, who never did anything after six days, and is hiding himself somewhere the other side of the moon, like the deceiver their god is.
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[robert derrick]

Jehovaites who say God created the Son cannot worship Jesus as Lord. Otherwise they would be worshipping a created being, a creature, rather than the Creator.

They are trying to worship the Lord's title, not the Lord who's Name is above every name. Unlike the unbelieving Jews that still try to worship God under the Old Covenant, these undecided wayfarers are trying to worship an Old Testament Title, while giving lip service to the name Jesus.

If you briefly review their posts about Jesus, it is always to denounce what He is not. They never to confirm Who He is. Other than he is a created being. Which of course means they cannot worship Jesus as Lord.

And the really sad part? Even the great unitarian Jews they love as kinsmen? They don't want anything to do with them either. They know they are phonies trying to straddle the fence.

"So then because you ar lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue you out of my mouth."

 

[robert derrick]

Jesus is the Lord God. The name the Lord gave for Himself, when He was begotten by His Spirit into the world. Before that, The Lord would not give a Name to Himself, but only a title, Yaweh, Jehovah, etc...(Them that still try to worship a title and no name are as they that tried to worship the unknown god. (Act 17))

1. Jesus is the Lord (1 Cor 12). There is one Lord (Eph 4:5). The Lord He is God (Deut 4). God said I am the Lord (Exodus 6)

Is Jesus Lord? Yes. Is there one Lord? Yes. The Lord is God? Yes. And God is the Lord? yes. Jesus is the Lord that is God and is the Lord. Jesus is the Lord God.

2. I am that I am (Ex 3). I am the Lord your God (Ex 6). Before Abraham was, I am. Are you the Christ, the son of the Blessed? I am.

Jesus is the Lord our God that is I Am.

3. There is one Spirit (Eph 4:5). Prophets of old were moved by the Holy Spirit (2 Peter 1). The Spirit of Christ testified to the prophets of His sufferings (1 Peter 1). The power of the Spirit of God worked with the apostles (Rom 15). The Spirit of God is the Spirit of Christ who dwells in them that believe (Rom 8).

One Spirit, the Spirit of God, the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of Christ: Christ is God who spoke to the prophets of old by His Spirit, and moved with the apostles by His same Spirit in the New. The Spirit of God is the Spirit of Christ. The same Spirit, the same Christ and God. Christ is God.

Those who believe Jesus is a created being cannot therefore worship the creature Jesus as Lord and God, therefore the spirit of God dwells not in them, and they are none of His.

You cannot worship Jehovah and be a believer of Jesus as Lord at the same time, except you confess Jesus is Jehovah come in the flesh (I John 4). It is Scripturally impossible. (But, of course, what does Scripture have to do with a made up mystical incantation anyway?)

"Little children, keep yourselves from idols. Amen." (I John 5)

 

[Curtis]

The risen Jesus accepted the worship of the apostles, who fell at His feet and worshipped Him.

If Jesus is not God the Word, then He sinned by accepting their worship.

Throughout the New Testament, the apostles instantly stopped those who started to worship them, but Jesus accepted it.

Mat 28:7 And go quickly, and tell his disciples that he is risen from the dead; and, behold, he goeth before you into Galilee; there shall ye see him: lo, I have told you.

Mat 28:8 And they departed quickly from the sepulchre with fear and great joy; and did run to bring his disciples word.

Mat 28:9 And as they went to tell his disciples, behold, Jesus met them, saying, All hail. And they came and held him by the feet, and worshipped him.

 

[ByGraceThroughFaith]

In Revelation 1:17, and 22:13, Jesus Christ says of Himself, "I am the first and the last". What does He mean by these words? The Unitarian Greek scholar, Dr Joseph Thayer, in his Greek lexicon, says of these words:

"with the article: ὁ πρῶτος καί ὁ ἔσχατος, i. e. the eternal One, Rev.1:17; Rev.2:8; Rev.22:13"

Jesus Christ IS "The Eternal One", which means that He is UNCREATED, and must be Almighty God! Interestingly, in the Greek Version of the OT, the LXX, in Exodus 3:14, which is Spoken by "The Angle of YHWH" (not God the Father), to Moses, it reads, "Ἐγώ εἰμι ὁ ὤν", "I am The Eternal One". The Hebrew for YHWH is יְהֹוָה, which means "the absolute and unchangeable One, the existing, ever living, as self-consistent"! This is Jesus Christ.

In Revelation 3:14, Jesus says of Himself:

"And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God"

On the word "beginning", ἀρχή, Dr Thayer says, "that by which anything begins to be, the origin, active cause". Which means that Jesus Christ IS The ACTIVE Creator of the entire universe!

In Acts 3:15, we read of Jesus Christ, "And killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses"

The word "Prince" is not right here, the Greek is "ἀρχηγός", which Thayer says means "the author". That the "from Whom all life has its origin", as John says in his Gospel "In Him was life" (1:4)

In Titus 2:13, Paul says of Jesus Christ:

"looking for the blessed hope and appearance of the glory of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ"

On this we have another Unitarian Greek scholar, Dr George Winer, who says:

"In the above remarks it was not my intention to deny that, in point of grammar, σωτηρος ημων (our Saviour) may be regarded as a second
predicate, jointly dependent on the article του (the); but the dogmatic conviction derived from Paul's writings that thisapostle cannot have
called Christ the great God induced me to show that thereis no grammatical obstacle to our taking the clause και σω...Χριστoυ (from,'and to Christ') by itself as referring to a second subject" (A Treatise on the Grammar of New Testament Greek, p.162. 1877 edition. - words in brackets are mine)

What Dr Winer is saying here, is, according the the Greek grammar used by Paul here, Jesus Christ is called "The Great God", and "Saviour", One Person, and not two. However, because he was a Unitarian, who denied the Deity of Jesus Christ, his "theology" could not allow him to see Paul calling Jesus Christ, "The Great God"!

In John 1:1, we read; "εν αρχη ην ο λογος και ο λογος ην προς τον θεον και θεος ην ο λογος"

"In the beginning was The Word, and The Word was with God, and the Word was God"

Here in the first place, "beginning" is not Genesis 1:1, as in the beginning of The Creation, as Creation is only mentioned in John 1:3. This refers to "eternity past", when "The Word", Who is the Lord Jesus Christ, Who "becomes flesh" in John 1:14, has always existed.

When then read that "The Word", was WITH "The God". Here "ο λογος" (the Word) is DISTINCT from "τον θεον" (The God), which is very clearly shown by the use of the Greek preposition, "προς" (with), which actually means, "at the side of, near, towards, in the presense of". Which cannot mean that "The Word" is IDENTICAL to "The God"!

John goes on to say, "και θεος ην ο λογος" (literally, "and God was The Word"). However, because "The Word" here is the subject, and "God" is in the predicate, the order is rightly, "and The Word was God". The predicate is used as a "description" of the subject, that "The Word IS God". However, by very careful Greek grammar, John does not write, "και ο θεος ην ο λογος", repeating the Greek article "ο". This would have made "The Word" and "The God", convertable and IDENTICAL in Person to "The God", in the previous sentence. John is saying here, that "The Word", IS as much as "God", WITH Whom He was!

 

[Cristo Rei]

One thing iv noticed in all these debates is that one can take a passage literally or metaphorically.
Maybe its metaphorical when he says his the son of God...
I personally don't understand the trinity or how Jesus can be God either. So many unanswered questions remain.

 

[ByGraceThroughFaith]

how Jesus can be God either

the Bible says it, and that is all that really matters!

 

[Cristo Rei]

the Bible says it, and that is all that really matters!

My point was that it could just be a metaphor

 

[amadeus]

My point was that it could just be a metaphor

People like to have things in black and white or understood perfect and clear even though Apostle Paul did not see them so clearly himself. People usually have great respect for Paul but they often won't stand with him if it goes against their own position/belief!

"For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known." I Cor 13:12

 

[Wrangler]

That is very figurative of you. I figure you probably have the best figuring in town about all this. Another configuration of desperation may be figuratively rewriting Scripture.

Jehovaites are NOT serious people.

You are a mocker but I am not a Jehovaite. I am a unitarian Christian.