Questions for Sabbatarians

[BarneyFife]

There is NO call to action... given in the New Covenant instructing Christians to observe Saturday sabbath

There ARE calls to action concerning other teachings that Christians are instructed in God's Word to follow and observe... so if Saturday sabbath was a thing for Christians there would be a call to action in the New Covenant for this... and there is not.

Not to mention there are NO corrections or warnings given to Christians in the New Covenant telling us not observing Saturday sabbath is a sin or would result in not being righteous with the Lord.

So, the SDA has nothing but speculation seeing their pet doctrine has NO call to action in the New Covenant.

This is just made up nonsense, the latest flavor of your expression of argument-from-silence doubling down on something for which you've criticized others.
Could you possibly be any more hypocritical?
You might as well just say "uh-uhh" between lollipop licks.

The SDA peoples do think of themselves as being more righteous because they observe Saturday sabbath...

This is just absurd, corporate, mind-reading drivel.

.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

In Jeremiah 31:33, the New Covenant involves God putting the Mosaic Law in our minds and writing it on our hearts, which includes the command to keep the Sabbath holy.

That's your eisegesis reading in to scripture something it does not say... God's moral law does NOT require one to observe Saturday sabbath and to only count one day a week as being holy unto the Lord.

In the New Covenant we see the Law of Christ is the standard, which is a higher standard than the Law of Moses.

It's too bad you apparently reject the upgrade the Lord provides in the New Covenant which can only be found abiding IN Christ.

 

[Soyeong]

That's your eisegesis reading in to scripture something it does not say... God's moral law does NOT require one to observe Saturday sabbath and to only count one day a week as being holy unto the Lord.

In the New Covenant we see the Law of Christ is the standard, which is a higher standard than the Law of Moses.

It's too bad you apparently reject the upgrade the Lord provides in the New Covenant which can only be found abiding IN Christ.

In Jeremiah 31:33, it uses the Hebrew word "Torah", so if you wanted I could equivalently say that the New Covenant involves putting the Torah in our minds and writing it on our hearts and one of the laws of the Torah is to keep the Sabbath holy. In Deuteronomy 30:1-10, it prophesies about a time when the Israelites will return from exile, God will circumcise their hearts, and they will return to obedience to the Torah, which is the basis for the New Covenant. In Ezekiel 36:26-27, the context is in regard to the New Covenant and the Israelites returning from exile and describes God as circumcising our heart by means of the Spirit by saying that He will take away our heart of stone, give us hearts of flesh, and send His Spirit to lead us to obey His law, which is also what Jeremiah 31:33 is speaking about. In Romans 2:25-29, the way to recognize that a Gentile has a circumcised heart is by observing their obedience to the Torah and circumcision of the heart is a matter of the Spirit, which is in contrast with Acts 7:51-53, where those who have uncircumcised hearts resist the Spirit and do not obey the Torah. So the New Covenant is all about Israel returning to obedience to the Torah.

The existence of the category of moral law implies that we can be acting morally while disobeying the laws that are part of that category, however, there is no example in the Bible of this and I don't see any justification for thinking that it can ever be moral to disobey God. Morality is in regard to what we ought to do and we ought to obey God, so all of God's laws are inherently moral laws. Legislators give laws according to what they think ought to be done, so for you to claim that the Sabbath or any of God's other laws are not part of the moral law is to claim that God made a moral error about what ought to be done when He gave those laws and is therefore to claim to have greater moral knowledge than God.

There is nothing in the NT that says that we should no longer obey God's command to keep the 7th day holy or that we should now keep one day a week as holy to the Lord instead. Christ spent his ministry teaching his followers to obey the Torah by word and by example, so I don't see any justification for thinking that the Law of Christ is something other than or contrary to what Christ taught. God is not in disagreement with Himself about which laws we should follow, so the Law of Christ is the same as the Law of the Spirit and the Law of the Father, which was given to Moses. In Deuteronomy 4:2, it is a sin to add to or subtract from the Torah, so the position that Christ taught a higher standard than it is the position that he sinned and is therefore not our Savior. Likewise, in Deuteronomy 13:1-5, the way that God instructed His people to determine that someone is a false prophet who is not speaking for Him was if they taught against obeying the Torah, so if Jesus has done that, then according to God we should consider Him to be a false prophet.

It is kind of hard to support the claim that Jesus taught a higher standard than the Torah when everything that is recorded that he taught is in accordance with the Torah, but even if Jesus could have raised the bar to a higher standard than the Torah without disqualifying himself as our Savior, then at the very least we should obey the Torah plus whatever else he supposedly raised the bar to. In 1 John 2:6, those who abide in Christ are obligated to walk in the same way he walked, so the verses that speak about those who are in Christ are only speaking about those who are walking in obedience to the Torah. Jesus is God's word made flesh, so he is not a higher standard than God's word, but rather he is the embodiment of the same standard expressed through living in sinless obedience to the Torah.

 

[BarneyFife]

In the New Covenant we see the Law of Christ is the standard, which is a higher standard than the Law of Moses.

When God was about to speak the law to Israel, of what did He tell Moses to remind them?
"Tell the children of Israel; Ye have seen what I did unto the Egyptians, and how I bare you on eagles' wings, and brought you unto Myself." Ex. 19: 3, 4.

What covenant did He propose to make with them?
"Now therefore, if ye will obey My voice indeed, and keep My covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto Me above all people: for all the earth is Mine: and ye shall be unto Me a kingdom of priests, and a holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel." Ex. 19:5, 6.

What is a covenant?
"A mutual agreement of two or more persons or parties, in writing and under seal, to do or to refrain from some act or thing; a contract." Webster.

When Moses told the people what the Lord had proposed, what did they say?
"And all the people answered together, and said, all that the Lord hath spoken we will do. And Moses returned the words of the people unto the Lord." Ex. 19:7, 8.

In the Covenant which the Lord proposed to make with Israel, what did He say that they were to do?
"Now therefore, if ye will obey My voice indeed, and keep My covenant." Ex. 19:5, first part.

What was His covenant which they were to keep as their part of the mutual agreement or covenant between Him and them?"
"And he declared unto you His covenant, which He commanded you to perform, even ten commandments; and He wrote them upon two tables of stone." Deut. 4:12, 13.

What relation did the ten commandments bear to the covenant made between God and the children of Israel?
As seen by the last text quoted, the ten commandments were the "covenant" to which the Lord referred, when in proposing a covenant with Israel, He said, "Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine:" Ex. 19:5.
NOTE. - The ten commandments were termed God's covenant before the covenant was made with Israel. They were not an agreement made, but something which God commanded them to perform, and He promised them something, provided they would keep them. Thus the ten commandments, God's covenant, became the basis of the covenant made between Him and Israel. The ten commandments, in all their details, are "all these words," concerning which the covenant was made. See Ex. 24:8.

After God had spoken His law (the "covenant which He commanded," Ex. 20:3-17), did He continue speaking to the people?
"And He added no more. And He wrote them in two tables of stone, and delivered them unto me." Deut. 5:22.

What was the nature of the instruction afterward given to Moses (Ex. 20:22, 23)?
It was a practical application or explanation of the ten commandments, so that the people might be able better to understand what was involved in the keeping of them. The reference to the altar, how it should be built, and how approached, in Ex. 20:24-26, simply shows the care that God would have taken in His worship. In Ex. 23:14-19 we have other commandments also concerning worship.

As reported in Ex. 24:3, Moses told the people all the words of the Lord, and they promised to be obedient. What did Moses then do, that there might be no misunderstanding?
"And Moses wrote all the words of the Lord, and rose up early in the morning, and builded an altar under the hill, and twelve pillars, according to the twelve tribes of Israel... And he took the book of the covenant, and read in the audience of the people." Ex. 24:4, 7.

When the people had again heard the words of the Lord, and again promised obedience (verse 7), what was done to ratify the covenant which had thus been made?
"And Moses took the blood, and sprinkled it on the people, and said, Behold the blood of the covenant, which the Lord hath made with you concerning all these words." Ex. 24:8. "And sprinkled both the book and all the people, Saying, This is the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you." Heb. 9:19, 20.
NOTE. - We have here the complete account of the making of the first covenant. It consisted of a promise of obedience to the ten commandments, on the part of the children of Israel, and the statement by the Lord of what He would do for them provided they obeyed His voice.

Is the covenant made at Sinai the only covenant which God made with Israel?
"Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers, in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which My covenant they brake, although I was a husband unto them, saith the Lord." Jer. 31:31, 32.

What comparison does God make between the two covenants?
"But now hath He obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also He is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises. For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second." Heb. 8:6, 7.

In what respect was the first covenant faulty?
It must have been faulty in the very particulars wherein the second was better, namely, in the promises, as seen by the last part of verse 6: "He [Christ] is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises."

What are the promises of the new covenant?
"For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put My laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts; and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to Me a people: and they shall not teach every man his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know Me, from the least to the greatest." Heb. 8:10-11. "For I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more." Jer. 31:34, last part.

Are these promises stated in the order of their fulfillment?
It is evident that in Jer. 31:33, 34, where the promises of the new covenant are more fully stated than in Heb. 8:10, 11, those promises are not stated in the regular order of their fulfillment; because forgiveness of sins is mentioned last, whereas it must necessarily precede the writing of the law in the heart; remembering sin no more, or blotting out of sin; and translating the people to the heavenly Jerusalem, where all shall see and know the Lord. See Isa. 54:11-13; Rev. 21:2-4.

In the first covenant, to what was Israel's promise really equivalent?
In the first covenant the people promised to keep all the commandments of God, so as to be worthy of a place in His kingdom. This was a virtual promise to make themselves righteous; for God did not promise to help them. But says Christ, "Without Me ye can do nothing." John 15:5. And the prophet says, "All our righteousnesses are as filthy rags." Isa. 64:6. The only perfect righteousness is God's righteousness, and that can be obtained only through faith in Christ. See Rom. 3:20-26. The only righteousness that will insure us an entrance into the kingdom of God, is "the righteousness which is of God by faith." Phil. 3:9. Of those who shall inherit the kingdom of God, the Lord says, "Their righteousness is of Me" (Isa. 54:17); and the prophet says of Christ, when He has taken His place as king over all the true Israel, "This is His name whereby He shall be called, the Lord our Righteousness." Jer. 23:6.

To be continued...

 

[BarneyFife]

Continued...

Yet what must be done in order to have eternal life?
"If thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments." Matt. 19:17, last part; see also Rev. 22:14.

Then how could ancient Israel have any chance for eternal life?
"How much more shall the blood of Christ who through the eternal Spirit offered Himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God? And for this cause He is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance." Heb. 9:14, 15.
NOTE. - The fact that Christ, as mediator of the second covenant, died for the remission of the transgressions that were under the first covenant, shows that there was no forgiveness by virtue of that first covenant.

How alone can the good works required by the law be manifested in the lives of men?
See John 15:4, 5; Phil. 2:13; Eph. 2:10; Heb. 13:20, 21; 1 Cor. 15:10; Gal. 2:20.

In order to have God make us "perfect in every good work to do His will," what must be our position?
"Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the Devil, and he will flee from you." James 4:7. "Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God." Rom. 6:13.

What is said of the law in the second, or new covenant?
"I [the Lord] will put My law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts." Jer. 31:33.

Since no such promise was made in the old covenant (see Ex. 19: 5-8; 24:3-7), were not the promises of the new covenant much "better" than those of the old?

When and how was the second covenant ratified?
By the death of Christ: "And He shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week He shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease." Dan. 9:27. "For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator. For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth." Heb. 9:16, 17.

Then how could the Israelites, or any people before the first advent, derive any benefit from it?
By faith in the promised Redeemer. See. Heb. 6:13, 16-20; Rom. 4:17.

How and in whom was the covenant with Abraham confirmed?
In Christ. See Heb. 6:13, 16-20; Gal. 3:17.

Is there anything in the second covenant that was not in the Abrahamic covenant?
"And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise." Gal. 3:29, 6-9.
NOTE. - None should allow themselves to be confused by the terms first covenant and second covenant. While the covenant made at Sinai is called "the first covenant," it is by no means the first covenant that God ever made with man. Long before He made a covenant with Abraham, and He also made a covenant with Noah, and with Adam.

Neither must it be supposed that the first or old covenant existed for a period of time as the only covenant with the people before the promise of the second or new covenant could be shared. If that had been the case, then during that time there would have been no pardon for the people. What is called the "second covenant" virtually existed before the covenant was made at Sinai; for the covenant with Abraham was confirmed in Christ (Gal. 3:17), and it is only through Christ that there is any value to what is known as the second covenant. There is no blessing that can be gained by virtue of the second covenant, that was not promised to Abraham.

And we, with whom the second covenant is made, can share the inheritance which it promises, only by being children of Abraham. To be Christ's is the same as to be children of Abraham (Gal. 3:29); all who are of faith are the children of Abraham, and share in his blessing (Gal. 3:7-9); and since no one can have anything except as children of Abraham, it follows that there is nothing in what is called the second covenant that was not in the covenant made with Abraham. The second covenant existed in every feature long before the first, even from the days of Adam. It is called "second" because both its ratification by blood and its more minute statement, were after the ratification of the covenant made at Sinai. More than this, it was the second covenant made with the Jewish people. The one from Sinai was the first made with that nation.

Then why was the covenant made at Sinai?
The Lord was just giving His law. The promise of the Israelites to keep it perfectly, and their failure, brought them face to face with the consequences of violating the law of God. The consciousness of guilt, and a sense of its consequences, would be much more forcibly impressed upon their minds than if they had not made the promise which they did. And being thus brought face to face with their sin, and realizing its full enormity, they would be driven to the only source of help, ample provision for which had been made in the covenant with their father Abraham. Thus it might be said that the first covenant was made in order to bring the second covenant (all the terms of which were the Abrahamic covenant) into bolder relief, and to secure its acceptance by the people.

When it was demonstrated that the first covenant, the Sinai covenant, contained no provisions for pardon of sins, some will at once say, "But they did have pardon under that covenant." The trouble arises from a confusion of terms. It is not denial that under the old covenant, i.e., during the time when it was specially in force, there was pardon of sins, but that pardon was not offered in the old covenant, and could not be secured by virtue of something else, as shown by Heb. 9:15. Not only was there the opportunity of finding free pardon of sins, and grace to help in time of need, during the time of the old covenant, but the same opportunity existed before that covenant was made, by virtue of God's covenant with Abraham, which differs in no respect from that made with Adam and Eve, except that we have the particulars given more in detail. We see, then, that there was not necessity for provisions to be made in the Sinai covenant for forgiveness of sins. The plan of salvation was developed long before the gospel was preached to Abraham (Gal. 3:8), and was amply sufficient to save to the uttermost all who would accept it; the covenant at Sinai was made for the purpose of making the people see the necessity of accepting the gospel.

Hebrews 9:1 is a text that hinders many from seeing that all God's blessings to man are gained by virtue of the second covenant, and not by the first. That text reads: "Then verily the first covenant had also ordinances of divine service, and a worldly sanctuary." This, together with the fact that when men complied with these ordinances of divine service, they were forgiven (Leviticus 4), seems to some conclusive evidence that the old covenant contained the gospel and its blessings. But forgiveness of sins was not secured by virtue of those offerings. "for it is not possible that the blood of bulls and goats should take away sins." Heb. 10:4. Forgiveness was obtained only by virtue of the promised sacrifice of Christ (Heb. 9:15), the mediator of the new covenant, their faith in whom was shown by their offerings. So it was by virtue of the second or new covenant that pardon was secured to those who offered the sacrifices provided for in the ordinances of divine service connected with the old or first covenant.

Moreover, those "ordinances of divine service" formed no part of the first covenant. If they had, they must have been mentioned in the making of that covenant; but they were not. They were connected with it, but not a part of it. They were simply the means by which the people acknowledged the justice of their condemnation to death for the violation of the law which they had covenanted to keep, and their faith in the mediator of the new covenant.

In brief, then, God's plan in the salvation of sinners, whether now or in the days of Moses, is: The law went home emphatically to the individual, to produce conviction of sin, and thus to drive the sinner to seek freedom; then the acceptance of Christ's gracious invitation, which was extended long before, but which the sinner would not listen to; and lastly, having accepted Christ, and being justified by faith, the manifestation of the faith, through the ordinances of. the gospel, and the living of a life of righteousness by faith in Christ.

 

[BarneyFife]

That's your eisegesis reading in to scripture something it does not say... God's moral law does NOT require one to observe Saturday sabbath and to only count one day a week as being holy unto the Lord.

What is to endure throughout all generations?
"Thy name, O Lord, endureth forever; and thy memorial, O Lord, throughout all generations." Psalm 135:13.
NOTE: -Memorial. - "Anything intended to preserve the memory of a person, an occurrence, or the like; something which serves to keep something else in remembrance; a monument." Webster.

Does the Bible give any illustration of this definition?
"And these stones shall be for a memorial unto the children of Israel forever." Joshua 4:7.

What were these stones to commemorate?
"And he spake unto the children of Israel, saying, When your children shall ask their fathers in time to come, saying, What mean these stones? then ye shall let your children know, saying, Israel came over this Jordan on dry land." Joshua 4:21, 22.
NOTE: These stones were to be a standing memorial of that people's coming dry shod over the Jordan.

What was another memorial instituted to commemorate another signal providence in behalf of the Israelites?
"And this day shall be unto you for a memorial, and ye shall keep it a feast to the Lord throughout your generations; ye shall keep it a feast by an ordinance forever." Exodus 12:14 (Exodus 13:3-9).
NOTE: This was a periodical memorial, to be observed as often as the fourteenth day of the first month arrived, which was the day the Israelites were delivered from Egyptian bondage, and its celebration was in commemoration of that event.

Does God design that His power in creating the world shall be remembered, as well?
"The works of the Lord are great, sought out of all them that have pleasure therein. His work is honorable and glorious; and His righteousness endureth forever. He hath made His wonderful works to be remembered." Psalm 111:2-4.

What memorial has He given by which to remember it?
"Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labor, and do all thy work: but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord thy God; . . . for in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day; wherefore [for this reason] the Lord blessed the Sabbath day, and hallowed it." Exodus 20:8-11.

For what reason does He say again that He gave the Sabbath to the children of Israel?
"Moreover also I gave them My Sabbaths to be a sign between Me and them, that they might know that I am the Lord that sanctify them." Ezekiel 20:12.
NOTE: It is manifest that if the object of the Sabbath was to keep God as the Creator in mind, and it had been faithfully kept from the first, there would not now be a heathen on the face of the earth.

How long was the Sabbath to be a sign, or memorial, of the true God?
"It is a sign between Me and the children of Israel forever; for in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day He rested, and was refreshed." Exodus 31:17.

Who are the children of Israel?
Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children:... but the children of the promise are counted for the seed." Romans 9:7, 8.

What did the promises to Abraham embrace?
"Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ." Galatians 3:16.

When we receive Christ, what relation do we sustain to Abraham and the promises?
"And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise." Galatians 3:29.

What does James denominate the Christian church?
"James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting." James 1:1.

When redeemed, will the saints remember God's creative power?
"Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honor and power; for thou hast created all things, and for Thy pleasure they are and were created." Rev. 4:11.

How often will they congregate to worship the Lord?
"And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one Sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before Me, saith the Lord." Isaiah 66:23.

How long will this state of things exist?
"For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before Me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain." Isaiah 66:22.
NOTE: The Sabbath, which is the memorial of God's creative power, will never cease to exist. When this sinful state of things shall give way to a sinless new earth, the fact upon which the Sabbath institution is based will still remain, and those who shall be permitted to live in the new earth, will still commemorate the creative power of God, while singing the song of Moses and the Lamb. Revelation 15:3. Thus the words of David will be proven true: "Thy name, O Lord, endureth forever; and thy memorial, O Lord, throughout all generations." Psalm 135:13.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

1. Where is the proof that any man ever kept the seventh day, except by special commandment, prior to the proclamation of the ten commandments at Mount Sinai? (Gen. 2:2, 3; Ex. 16:23-30; 20:1-17).

1. If Christians are required to keep the seventh day, why do you depart from your dwelling on that day, seeing those to whom the law was given were plainly commanded not to do so? (Ex. 16:29).

1. If you keep one Sabbath – the seventh day – why not keep them all, the seventh year and the year of Jubilee? Who authorized you to make distinction in favor of the seventh day? (Lev. 25 :1-22)

1. If Christians are required to keep the Sabbath, how are they to live in cold climates when it is forbidden to build a fire on the Sabbath? (Ex. 35:1-3).

1. Is it the duty of Christians to put to death those who desecrate the seventh day? (Num. 15:32-36). If yes, who will be the public executioner? If no, what will you do with the law? (Ex. 35:2). If you say that the penalties are abolished, I answer that the same passages that you use to establish this prove beyond the shadow of a doubt that the law, too, is abolished. If you admit that the penalties are still in force-and the proof that they are unanswerable and invincible if the law is in force-there is not a Seventh Dayist on top of the green earth who can escape the vengeance of the broken law!

1. If Christians are under obligation to observe the seventh day, why did Jesus declare that all law and prophecy hang on love instead of the Sabbath, seeing the command to keep it is the one on which you hang your everlasting all? (Matt. 22:34-40; Rom. 13:8-10).

1. Why did Jesus not require the young ruler to keep the Sabbath when enumerating the commandments? (Matt. 19:16-20; Mark 10:17-22; Luke 18:18-24).

1. If Christians are to keep the law of Moses-the Sabbath-why did the apostles and elders who met at Jerusalem leave it out of their address to the churches? (Acts 15 :1-29). This case finds, in some respects, a parallel in your theorizing. Judaizing teachers had gone forth declaring to the brethren that unless they would submit to circumcision and keep the law of Moses they could not be saved. The apostles said, “We gave no such commandment.”

1. If Christians are required to keep the Sabbath, how are we to account for the open violation of the law by Jesus Christ, who is our example, unless by saying that the power that made the law can take it away (John 7 :22-23).

1. If you keep the Sabbath because you think it was kept before the law of Moses, why do you not practice circumcision, seeing it is plainly commanded in these ages? (Gen. 17:1-14; Gal. 5:1-6).

1. When did patriarch, prophet, or apostles, or anybody else, command any Gentile to keep the law of Moses? No dodging here. Proof! Proof! Proof!

1. Paul says the ministration of death written and engraved in stone (Ex. 20:1-17; 31:18; 32 6:15-16; 34:1-28) was done away (2 Cor. 3:1-18). When, where, and by whom was it brought back into force? Name the day, the age, the authority, and give proof from the Book! If your doctrine is true the great apostle of the Gentiles stands convicted of a mistake.

1. If the early Christians kept the Sabbath day, why did they break bread on the first day of the week? (Acts 20:7).

1. If Christians are to keep the Sabbath day, how do you account for the fact that the apostles preached the gospel in Jerusalem, Samaria, to Cornelius the Gentile, and to many others, without commanding a single individual to keep it? Did they, under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit fail to properly instruct their converts? (Acts 2:1-47; 8:1-40; 10:1-48 ;16:1-40).

1. Is it not a fact, according to the book of Acts, that the thing done was of more importance than the day? Acts 20:7.

1. Can you demonstrate that the day you keep is really the seventh day or Sabbath, coming down in regular succession from the day on which God keeps? If not, your day is no better than any other day. Admitting, for argument’s sake, that the law of Moses is still in force, and that the fourth commandment is binding on the whole human race, will you affirm that it is possible for all men to keep the same day?
   
   
   If so, how do you explain the fact that the traveler who starts out to go around the earth, gains, say, if going east, one hour for every thousand miles traveled, or if going west loses an hour for every thousand miles traveled? How far would he go before he lost the count? Do you not see that he would inevitably be behind or in advance? Further, how do you explain the fact that far away toward the extremes of the earth, traveling from the equator, there are periods of six months night and six months day from age to age? Do you not see that it is a geographical impossibility for all men to keep the same day, and that the Law was only intended for one people, one country, and one age?

1. Do you keep the Sabbath day? No dodging, do you? Do you rest, or put in the day promulgating your doctrines? If you do not keep the day according to the Law, you do not keep it at all. If part is done away, then all is done away. Read Exodus 20:8-11; 35:1-3.
   
   

You must be a very tired, exhausted and frustrated man. I pity you

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

Is it not a fact, according to the book of Acts, that the thing done was of more importance than the day? Acts 20:7.

IS IT NOT A FACT? You say it but don't see it? Blind man, Ἐν δὲ τῇ μιᾷ τῶν σαββάτων συνηγμένων ἡμῶν κλάσαι ἄρτον "Still assembling together after we before assembled together for to Lord's Supper, Paul on the First Day of the week dialogued / discussed (itinerary) with them until midnight (that First Day of the week night - after Saturday)".
What is your problem?
Your problem is you believe the Translation Traitors of God's Truth and are too SCARED to death to speak out AGAINST THEM - so you try bully the poor misled and mesmerized by the glory of Antichrist's mouthpiece spokesmen FALSE and feeble scholars pretending translators.
THAT IS YOUR, AND ALL SUNDAY WORSHIPPERS' PROBLEM.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

For EVERYBODY on this forum thread now: The Ten Commandments are/ is not the first nor the great Commandment of God--on the contrary it is very recent (3000 years ago?) given to the saddest of people to entrust the Word of God to. Neither is the Fourth of the Ten Commandments.
ALL the command and commandment of God existed from everlasting in God Himself. He, the Law from eternity to eternity The Law unto Himself The Law, has first been fully revealed, exposed and expounded, in and through God the Son Jesus Christ. Therefore, if you - if whoever - desire to speak about God's Law, let him speak of Jesus Christ, or rather, let Jesus Christ speak FOR HIMSELF IN SCRIPTURE.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

Yep, and it's unlikely that any of the sabbatarians hanging around will be able to answer any of these questions.

Speak for yourself, no sabbatarian hanging around here can possibly be a greater or more unhappy sabbatarian than you, you being so obsessed with being an a-sabbatarian and anti-sabbath sabbatarian all to the glorification of sundayists' sunday-sabbattarianism. Nevertheless I will tell you why the Bible - New Testament - teaches, proclaims and requires the Christian to be a Sabbatarian rather than anything else in all the universe - which reason for and cause of and only Biblical "honour" of the Sabbath is, that it is "MY, holy Day" for being "The Seventh Day SABBATH-REST DAY OF : THE LORD GOD"--JESUS CHRIST HAVING RAISED FROM THE DEAD ON IT, IN THE FULLNESS OF THE SABBATH, AS HE SAID: THE THIRD DAY I RISE".
Where is YOUR reason for denying the LORD'S Day this honour, for to STEAL it from God's Seventh Day Sabbath and bestow it upon Antichrist's Day of its, Antichrist's lord, the sun?
WHERE DO YOU GET IT FROM? FROM ANTICHRIST AND COHORTS, FROM SURRENDERED AND SUBDUED PROTESTANTS AND COWARDS!

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

ello Big Boy Johnson, It is always best to obey the words of the LORD concerning His Sabbaths.

What do you mean by the LORD'S Sabbath-s'? Scripture had it (maybe, wrong?) "the Seventh Day Sabbath of the LORD GOD" - one LORD GOD one Sabbath one Seventh Day, one 'My holy Day', one "Day-of-the-Lord", ONE LORD AND JESUS--Christ Jesus "Lord of the Sabbath" - "the day which is after the Preparation He said, I RISE" on, "the Sabbath before the First Day of the week"?
That, is one "Sabbath"---never more than one 'sabbaths'.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

In Jeremiah 31:33, it uses the Hebrew word "Torah", so if you wanted I could equivalently say that the New Covenant involves putting the Torah in our minds and writing it on our hearts and one of the laws of the Torah is to keep the Sabbath holy.

Yes, you could say that... but you'd be in error if you did.

The New Covenant contains the Law of Christ which is a high standard than the Law of Moses and as such the sabbath is no longer a one day a week thing. But, it's no problem for me if you choose to not come up to the higher standard fgound IN Christ... and remain trying to live under the Law of Moses.

Speak for yourself, no sabbatarian hanging around here can possibly be a greater or more unhappy sabbatarian than you

I'm not a sabbatarian... I'm a New Covenant believer that understands we have been called to a higher standard that those living under the old covenant.

You folks are in error going around telling everyone they are being disobedient to the Lord for not observing Saturday sabbath. This shows you folks don't understand the scriptures. But, it's a free country so, carry on.

WHERE DO YOU GET IT FROM? FROM ANTICHRIST AND COHORTS, FROM SURRENDERED AND SUBDUED PROTESTANTS AND COWARDS!

That's hilarious!

So only adherents to the SDA religion... are saved right?

 

[BarneyFife]

Yes, you could say that... but you'd be in error if you did.

The New Covenant contains the Law of Christ which is a high standard than the Law of Moses and as such the sabbath is no longer a one day a week thing. But, it's no problem for me if you choose to not come up to the higher standard fgound IN Christ... and remain trying to live under the Law of Moses.




I'm not a sabbatarian... I'm a New Covenant believer that understands we have been called to a higher standard that those living under the old covenant.

You folks are in error going around telling everyone they are being disobedient to the Lord for not observing Saturday sabbath. This shows you folks don't understand the scriptures. But, it's a free country so, carry on.




That's hilarious! View attachment 40964

So only adherents to the SDA religion... are saved right? View attachment 40965

This ought to be good.

 

[Soyeong]

Yes, you could say that... but you'd be in error if you did.

The New Covenant contains the Law of Christ which is a high standard than the Law of Moses and as such the sabbath is no longer a one day a week thing. But, it's no problem for me if you choose to not come up to the higher standard fgound IN Christ... and remain trying to live under the Law of Moses.

You pretty much just repeated your position without giving any support for it while ignoring everything that I said that showed that your position is wrong.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

You pretty much just repeated your position without giving any support for it while ignoring everything that I said that showed that your position is wrong.

That was your fantasies and vain imaginations claiming you showed anything at all.

 

[WalterandDebbie]

What do you mean by the LORD'S Sabbath-s'? Scripture had it (maybe, wrong?) "the Seventh Day Sabbath of the LORD GOD" - one LORD GOD one Sabbath one Seventh Day, one 'My holy Day', one "Day-of-the-Lord", ONE LORD AND JESUS--Christ Jesus "Lord of the Sabbath" - "the day which is after the Preparation He said, I RISE" on, "the Sabbath before the First Day of the week"?
That, is one "Sabbath"---never more than one 'sabbaths'.

From creation on the Seventh Day Genesis 2:1-3.

 

[Soyeong]

That was your fantasies and vain imaginations claiming you showed anything at all.
View attachment 40978

I see that you do not care for truth, but rather you are opposed to it (Psalms 119:142) and to the embodiment of it (John 14:6).

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

The prohibition against kindling a fire is not part of the fourth commandment of the Ten Commandments. And it is the precepts of the Ten Commandments that are moral and thus eternally binding.

The prohibition against kindling a fire on Sabbath notwithstanding it was "not part of the fourth commandment of the Ten Commandments" was one if of not the most stringiest of laws, the penalty for its transgression having been death (by stoning) without option or mercy.
Have you ever asked, WHY? No, because you have never asked the Word of God, the Bible, WHY?

"According to the Scriptures the most important thing" was and is that "Christ ROSE", "REVIVING on the Seventh Day RESTING" Exodus 32:17. This was God's Rest, his "Sabbath's Rest Reviving" from the dead on God''s Day-of-Rest BY TRIUMPH OF LORDSHIP over death and hell and the FIRES of hell.

WHY was the penalty for lighting a fire on the Sabbath, death without option or mercy? Because lighting a fire on the Sabbath meant defiant rejection of God's Rest on the Sabbath Day in Christ who overcame death and the fires of hell when He rose from the dead "on the Sabbath". God loosed the anguish and pains of death when and as and with Jesus breathing out his last breath, saying: IT IS FINISHED and his flesh as his soul rested in hope of the resurrection having overcome death and hell on the Sabbath Day that He rose from the dead upon. Nothing the one without the other. Christ fulfilled all Promises and Oaths and Laws of God not only in the flesh, but also in time. The Christiam who refuses to see the Will of God revealed in Christ even in things like the lighting of a fire on the Sabbath Day, must earnestly think again about his being a Christian.

The Law pronounced the coming Christ and the arcanist's actions under the Law served "God's Eternal Purpose", which has been to "deliver us from the domain of darkness (hell-fire) and transferred us to the kingdom of his beloved Son, 14in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins." Colossians 1:13.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

I'm not a sabbatarian... I'm a New Covenant believer that understands we have been called to a higher standard that those living under the old covenant.

Braggart! Jesus Christ lived under the old covenant, that one that saYS TO THIS DAY, TODAY IF YOU HEAR HIS VOICE, declaring, "The day you eat of the fruit of this tree, YOU, SHALL, DIE!"
Mate, have you the slightest idea with WHOM, you, braggart, have to do? God have mercy upon us.