Questions for Sabbatarians
- Thread starter Big Boy Johnson
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The only commandments the Lord calls greater and greatest are loving God and our neighbors from the heart.
All other commandments are the same:
For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
You err by your own tradition taught as doctrine of God.
There is no OT 4th commandment of Sabbath in the NT.
You have your NT freewill sabbath only. You have nothing to do with God's OT 4th commandment that commands the death penalty if broken.
God did when it was His 4th commandment for the OT children of Israel.
No one should even preach it as NT commandment, nor judge by it, and especially not kill with it.
Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.
So, you now agree with the unbelieving Jews, they should have killed Him. You got your wish, when they had Him killed. This is the result of trying to teach the commandments and law of Christ, based upon your own understanding. You're teaching your own sabbath, as though it were the OT 4th commandment.
From which some having swerved have turned aside unto vain jangling;
Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm.
But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;
The 4th commandment only forbid working for profit and pay, not grinding food to eat, rescuing people and animals, nor healing.
The Jews had added many traditional rules of their own to the Sabbath, that God never said in His commandment. They then judged by the Lord Himself as a 'transgressor' of their traditions.
Likewise, you don't know what the OT 4th commandant is, and so like the Jews don't know how to keep it nor enforce it as written. And so you end up supporting them in having Jesus killed as a 'transgressor'.
For I say unto you, that this that is written must yet be accomplished in me, And he was reckoned among the transgressors: for the things concerning me have an end.
The OT 4th commandment was God's for all the children of Israel.
The NT voluntary sabbath is the believer's own for oneself alone, and those they congregate with on their sabbath.
Correct, and so after His resurrection, all power and authority are given Him, so that He has right to command or not command a NT Sabbath day. He doesn't.
Christians are all free to keep a sabbath day, but no Christian has right to command one and judge others by.
Exactly. So, you are a sabbath keeper by freewill choice. You are a Sabbath keeper by OT 4th comamdne. This is why you are free to work on your sabbath, if necessary, nor execute anyone for doing the same.
The great Christian hypocrisy is pretending to preach the OT 4th commandment, and then making exceptions to break it. The worst insult is by making their unlawful sabbath payday into corban.
God's commandments have no exceptions. No adultery, stealing, murder, nor sabbath breaking was ever allowed exception by the Lord in the OT.
Now, the Lord allows no exceptions for adultery, stealing, nor murder. There is no exception needed for a 'NT sabbath', because it's not by commandment but by freewill only.
The voluntary NT sabbath kept by some Christians, is not the OT 4th commandment kept by all obedient Israelites.
True. That's our point.
That's not the point of sabbath commanders that make the day all-important as by law.
There is no 4th NT commandment. Once you cease thinking you are keeping and teaching the OT 4th commandment, then you'll not be confusing your personal voluntary sabbath with the OT 4th commandment.
You'll also stop carnally numbering the NT commandments of the Lord Jesus Christ.
There are only two NT commandments by number. The 1st and 2nd great commandments to love God and our neighbors from our hearts.
For you. Not me. I have no such dilemma, because I know the NT children of God have no such commandment to keep a sabbath day. Neither do I have any delimma over any circumcision by law.
All such confusing dilemmas are only manufactured by people, who confuse OT law of Moses with NT law of Christ.
So long as you're not trying to teach the OT 4th commandment to obey, then hugs back at you.
Ziggy
Well-Known Member
You should read more of my posts that I have posted on this subject and see if we are in agreement.
Hugs
Ziggy
Well-Known Member
Ah I see where we got our messages crossed lol.
You thought I was condoning killing Jesus for eating and healing on the sabbath.
I know it sounds like I said that but it wasn't my intent, sorry.
I believe ALL the law is fulfilled when we Love God and Love our neighbor as Jesus said.
If we obey these two, we can't go wrong.
I believe Jesus is our Sabbath day that we rest in To day, which is everyday, daily.
He is our bread of Life which when we pray to God to give us this day our daily bread, that we are asking for Christ's words to feed us.
Daily.
I hope this clears things up and explains better where I stand on the subject.
Hugs
So long as you are not preaching the OT 4th commandment to keep, then we agree enough.
NT people of God neither circumcise by law, nor keep sabbath by commandment.
Keeping a voluntary sabbath by personal faith is the liberty of all Christians, whether circumcision, sabbaths, meats...
All OT Scriptures are good for freewill practice, but only NT Scriptures are law of Christ by His resurrection from the dead.
Absolutely. God speed in any Sabbath you keep by faith.Ah I see where we got our messages crossed lol.
You thought I was condoning killing Jesus for eating and healing on the sabbath.
I know it sounds like I said that but it wasn't my intent, sorry.
I believe ALL the law is fulfilled when we Love God and Love our neighbor as Jesus said.
If we obey these two, we can't go wrong.
I believe Jesus is our Sabbath day that we rest in To day, which is everyday, daily.
He is our bread of Life which when we pray to God to give us this day our daily bread, that we are asking for Christ's words to feed us.
Daily.
I hope this clears things up and explains better where I stand on the subject.
Hugs
The old covenant Saturday sabbath has been made obsolete because... our rest now is in Jesus.
Under the New Covenant... the Lord has provided people with an obvious upgrade!
Those that desires to keep using the old obsolete junk from the old covenant are missing the boat!
It's the only one of the OT 'Ten' commandments, that is not commanded in the NT law of Christ.
'Ten' Commandments is actually a misnomer. There were much more than ten commandments in the OT. IN fact, the law of Moses contained all the commandments, judgments, ordinances, and statutes of God. None were any greater than the other, and all were to be obeyed equally without exception.
That's why they are all summed up as the law of the Lord.
O how love I thy law! it is my meditation all the day. I hate and abhor lying and vain thoughts: but thy law do I love.
The word of the Lord also included specific prophecy given by the Spirit of Christ to the prophets.
It's called being born again of the Spirit of God, so that we can worship God in the spirit and in truth daily.
The OT Sabbath commandment never said anything about being special for worship, but only to rest the body from working labors.
That's why it included animals and land rest. It was a purely carnal commandment for physical health and blessing. Keeping it holy simply sanctified and set apart from other natural days.
I wouldn't call it obsolete junk, since all Scripture is still good for use. It's simply a day of physical rest. It no longer pertains to law of God with punishment of death by transgression.
If anyone on earth practices a day of rest, the Bible calls it good to do. Like tithing offerings, calling it a sabbath is simply to formalize it as a vow.
The great error and junk of Christians, is to pretend they are keeping the OT Sabbath as by commandment of law.
Here are the junk the deceive themselves with:
1. That it is a special 'worship' day. (Which of course counteracts worshipping in spirit and in truth daily.)
2. That it is a special day of 'spiritual' rest. (Which once again counteracts walking in the Spirit without works of our own righteousness)
Afterall, how worshipful and spiritual are oxen and land?
3. That it allows them to judge and condemn others as transgressors of their 'sabbath'. (Which Paul rebukes plainly)
4. They don't keep it. They provide 'exceptions' for people with jobs and careers that can mandate any day of the week to work. Especially gvt employees, emergency responders, law enforcement, hospitals, fast food chains, grocery stores, online businesses, etc... (I mean, you can't even get entry level work at a Dollar Tree without first working weekends.)
Basically in the modern economy, there are few jobs and businesses that do not require possible 7 day employment. And the ones that don't, are Sundays only! (So much for the real hardcore exact Sabbath commandoes, that declare it to be Saturday only.)
What it really means is that to be a true OT sabbath keeper, someone would need to have the ancient economy of farming and marketing only.
5. At least some of these sabbath specialists also make their sabbath working pay day to be 'corban', in order to soothe the conscience, and pathetically try to call it 'mercy work'. They literally try to compare it to charitable activity 'without pay'. They insult true charitable work volunteers.
You see, it's not even so much the pseudo-sabbath they keep, but it's the insults to intelligence they come up with to justify breaking it with pay.
Some honest sabbath keepers acknowledge that it is only a personal practice of religious liberty for themselves. They do not declare it as the OT 4th commandment, nor do they judge others that do not keep it as transgressors.
The hardcore pretenders of keeping the OT 4th commandments make themselves a separatist cult based upon their special Sabbath. And they further pretend that the purely carnal practice of it, is now made 'spiritual' and 'worshipful'. And if they were actually keeping it faithfully, then I could at least respect their dutifulness and discipline, if not the event itself.
I suppose, that's why only on farms do we really find such faithful sabbath communities.
No questions about the OT 4th commandment sabbath.
It was a carnal ordinance only. Physical rest for people, animals, and land from working labors.
It's holiness was only a matter of physical sanctification and separation from labors.
Nowhere does any Bible speak of the OT sabbath as a special day of worship nor spirituality.
Like all carnal ordinances, they were tests of obedience, that also produced good and successful living, such as food and drink codes.
This is how the 4th commandment was separate from the other '10' commandments listed in Exodus 20 and Deut 5: It was not a moral nor spiritual commandment.
It was only a carnal test of obedience and covenant keeping to the God of Israel. It was a certain day where obedience or disobedience could be proven physically.
And that is exactly what it is done with today by sabbath keepers by law: they judge the carnal obedience or disobedience of those keeping the new covenant of Jesus Christ.
Paul of course plainly denounces such carnal judgment along with moons and meats, etc.., Such bogus judgment is also denounced by James:
There is one lawgiver, who is able to save and to destroy: who art thou that judgest another?
Whether it be outward circumcision by law or sabbath keeping by commandment, it's nothing but pretensions law-makers, that judge others according to their own Judaizing tendencies.
I believe some of it comes from Christian nostalgia for the Hebrew and Jewish days of old, much like pilgrimage and tourist trips to the 'holy land'.
Frankly, I'd rather go to Greece and check out the ancient Hellenic cities and culture of old...
It was a carnal ordinance only. Physical rest for people, animals, and land from working labors.
It's holiness was only a matter of physical sanctification and separation from labors.
Nowhere does any Bible speak of the OT sabbath as a special day of worship nor spirituality.
Like all carnal ordinances, they were tests of obedience, that also produced good and successful living, such as food and drink codes.
This is how the 4th commandment was separate from the other '10' commandments listed in Exodus 20 and Deut 5: It was not a moral nor spiritual commandment.
It was only a carnal test of obedience and covenant keeping to the God of Israel. It was a certain day where obedience or disobedience could be proven physically.
And that is exactly what it is done with today by sabbath keepers by law: they judge the carnal obedience or disobedience of those keeping the new covenant of Jesus Christ.
Paul of course plainly denounces such carnal judgment along with moons and meats, etc.., Such bogus judgment is also denounced by James:
There is one lawgiver, who is able to save and to destroy: who art thou that judgest another?
Whether it be outward circumcision by law or sabbath keeping by commandment, it's nothing but pretensions law-makers, that judge others according to their own Judaizing tendencies.
I believe some of it comes from Christian nostalgia for the Hebrew and Jewish days of old, much like pilgrimage and tourist trips to the 'holy land'.
Frankly, I'd rather go to Greece and check out the ancient Hellenic cities and culture of old...
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Hobie
Well-Known Member
We see it before the Ten Commandments were given....
Exodus 16:22-23
22 And it came to pass, that on the sixth day they gathered twice as much bread, two omers for one man: and all the rulers of the congregation came and told Moses.
23 And he said unto them, This is that which the Lord hath said, To morrow is the rest of the holy sabbath unto the Lord: bake that which ye will bake to day, and seethe that ye will seethe; and that which remaineth over lay up for you to be kept until the morning.
And Abraham was keeping what was from God, and we see what it says..
Genesis 26:5
Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.
The Ten Commandments are the only thing that the Creator of Heaven and Earth, and the Sabbath, personally spoke and then personally etched His Law into stone tablets with His own finger, here stands the commandments of God given on the two tablets as everlasting.
Exodus 31:18
And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God.
So it was not a law from Moses but from God. Now the questions on what is lawful to do on the Sabbath were answered by Christ Himself..
Mark 3:4
And he saith unto them, Is it lawful to do good on the sabbath days, or to do evil? to save life, or to kill? But they held their peace.
Luke 6:9
Then said Jesus unto them, I will ask you one thing; Is it lawful on the sabbath days to do good, or to do evil? to save life, or to destroy it?
Notice what the answer of the ones accusing Him of breaking the Sabbath was. nothing. The Pharisees had made the Sabbath a burnden with all their little rabbinical traditions and petty rules and Christ laid out the true principles and purpose behind it. I posted this in one of the threads on this...
Jesus was without sin. He needed to be a spotless lamb with no sin, and he was a spotless lamb. In being accused of breaking the Law by the Pharisee, Jesus made this clear in His challenge basically asking them who can charge me of any sin?
Mark 3:1-5
1And he entered again into the synagogue; and there was a man there which had a withered hand.
2 And they watched him, whether he would heal him on the sabbath day; that they might accuse him.
3 And he saith unto the man which had the withered hand, Stand forth.
4 And he saith unto them, Is it lawful to do good on the sabbath days, or to do evil? to save life, or to kill? But they held their peace.
5 And when he had looked round about on them with anger, being grieved for the hardness of their hearts, he saith unto the man, Stretch forth thine hand. And he stretched it out: and his hand was restored whole as the other.
And they're not able to bring any charge against him, because to love God and your fellowman and do good for your fellowman is in essence of the Law. And we see who really were the Law Breakers...
Mark 3:6
And the Pharisees went forth, and straightway took counsel with the Herodians against him, how they might destroy him.
And we see it in more context in Matthew 12...
Matthew 12:1-14
1 At that time Jesus went on the sabbath day through the corn; and his disciples were an hungred, and began to pluck the ears of corn and to eat.
2 But when the Pharisees saw it, they said unto him, Behold, thy disciples do that which is not lawful to do upon the sabbath day.
3 But he said unto them, Have ye not read what David did, when he was an hungred, and they that were with him;
4 How he entered into the house of God, and did eat the shewbread, which was not lawful for him to eat, neither for them which were with him, but only for the priests?
5 Or have ye not read in the law, how that on the sabbath days the priests in the temple profane the sabbath, and are blameless?
6 But I say unto you, That in this place is one greater than the temple.
7 But if ye had known what this meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice, ye would not have condemned the guiltless.
8 For the Son of man is Lord even of the sabbath day.
9 And when he was departed thence, he went into their synagogue:
10 And, behold, there was a man which had his hand withered. And they asked him, saying, Is it lawful to heal on the sabbath days? that they might accuse him.
11 And he said unto them, What man shall there be among you, that shall have one sheep, and if it fall into a pit on the sabbath day, will he not lay hold on it, and lift it out?
12 How much then is a man better than a sheep? Wherefore it is lawful to do well on the sabbath days.
13 Then saith he to the man, Stretch forth thine hand. And he stretched it forth; and it was restored whole, like as the other.
14 Then the Pharisees went out, and held a council against him, how they might destroy him.
Hobie
Well-Known Member
Now on the confusion of the 'Lords Day', lets look at scripture and see what day it truly was...
Exodus 20:8-11
8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: 10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: 11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
It is the Sabbath of the Lord thy God, not Moses' sabbath, or the Jews sabbath, or anyone Else's sabbath.
Leviticus 23:3 Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation; ye shall do no work therein: it is the sabbath of the LORD in all your dwellings.
We see the same.
Deuteronomy 5:12-13
12 Keep the sabbath day to sanctify it, as the LORD thy God hath commanded thee. 13 Six days thou shalt labour, and do all thy work: 14 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, nor thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thine ox, nor thine ass, nor any of thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates; that thy manservant and thy maidservant may rest as well as thou.
Again the same.
Exodus 31:13 Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the LORD that doth sanctify you.
It was not 'Moses' sabbath.
Leviticus 19:1-2
1And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, 2 Speak unto all the congregation of the children of Israel, and say unto them, Ye shall be holy: for I the LORD your God am holy. 3 Ye shall fear every man his mother, and his father, and keep my sabbaths: I am the LORD your God.
Leviticus 19:30 Ye shall keep my sabbaths, and reverence my sanctuary: I am the LORD.
Leviticus 26:2 Ye shall keep my sabbaths, and reverence my sanctuary: I am the LORD.
Isaiah 56:4-6
4 For thus saith the LORD unto the eunuchs that keep my sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant; 5 Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off. 6 Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;
Ezekiel 20:12-13
12Moreover also I gave them my sabbaths, to be a sign between me and them, that they might know that I am the LORD that sanctify them. 13 But the house of Israel rebelled against me in the wilderness: they walked not in my statutes, and they despised my judgments, which if a man do, he shall even live in them; and my sabbaths they greatly polluted: then I said, I would pour out my fury upon them in the wilderness, to consume them.
Ezekiel 20:16 Because they despised my judgments, and walked not in my statutes, but polluted my sabbaths: for their heart went after their idols.
Ezek 20:19-24
19I am the LORD your God; walk in my statutes, and keep my judgments, and do them;
20 And hallow my sabbaths; and they shall be a sign between me and you, that ye may know that I am the LORD your God. 21 Notwithstanding the children rebelled against me: they walked not in my statutes, neither kept my judgments to do them, which if a man do, he shall even live in them; they polluted my sabbaths: then I said, I would pour out my fury upon them, to accomplish my anger against them in the wilderness. 22 Nevertheless I withdrew mine hand, and wrought for my name's sake, that it should not be polluted in the sight of the heathen, in whose sight I brought them forth. 23 I lifted up mine hand unto them also in the wilderness, that I would scatter them among the heathen, and disperse them through the countries; 24 Because they had not executed my judgments, but had despised my statutes, and had polluted my sabbaths, and their eyes were after their fathers' idols.
Ezekiel 22:8 Thou hast despised mine holy things, and hast profaned my sabbaths.
Ezekiel 22:26 Her priests have violated my law, and have profaned mine holy things: they have put no difference between the holy and profane, neither have they shewed difference between the unclean and the clean, and have hid their eyes from my sabbaths, and I am profaned among them.
Ezekiel 23:38 Moreover this they have done unto me: they have defiled my sanctuary in the same day, and have profaned my sabbaths.
The Lord claims the sabbath as His very own. It is a day, therefore it is literally, the Lord's day. This clear so how many times must the Lord call the sabbath His day to understand that there is only one day in the scriptures that would be referred to as the Lord's day? Other than the seventh day sabbath, the Lord's day can also refer to the day on which He will return to this earth. That is all. Sunday, or the first day of the week is never referred to as the Lord's day in the scriptures.
This title was only applied to Sunday later on, to cover their deception. It was applied by those who began the apostasy and abomination which was the result of the amalgamation of apostate Christianity and pagan sun worship.
Exodus 20:8-11
8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: 10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: 11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
It is the Sabbath of the Lord thy God, not Moses' sabbath, or the Jews sabbath, or anyone Else's sabbath.
Leviticus 23:3 Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation; ye shall do no work therein: it is the sabbath of the LORD in all your dwellings.
We see the same.
Deuteronomy 5:12-13
12 Keep the sabbath day to sanctify it, as the LORD thy God hath commanded thee. 13 Six days thou shalt labour, and do all thy work: 14 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, nor thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thine ox, nor thine ass, nor any of thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates; that thy manservant and thy maidservant may rest as well as thou.
Again the same.
Exodus 31:13 Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the LORD that doth sanctify you.
It was not 'Moses' sabbath.
Leviticus 19:1-2
1And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, 2 Speak unto all the congregation of the children of Israel, and say unto them, Ye shall be holy: for I the LORD your God am holy. 3 Ye shall fear every man his mother, and his father, and keep my sabbaths: I am the LORD your God.
Leviticus 19:30 Ye shall keep my sabbaths, and reverence my sanctuary: I am the LORD.
Leviticus 26:2 Ye shall keep my sabbaths, and reverence my sanctuary: I am the LORD.
Isaiah 56:4-6
4 For thus saith the LORD unto the eunuchs that keep my sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant; 5 Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off. 6 Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;
Ezekiel 20:12-13
12Moreover also I gave them my sabbaths, to be a sign between me and them, that they might know that I am the LORD that sanctify them. 13 But the house of Israel rebelled against me in the wilderness: they walked not in my statutes, and they despised my judgments, which if a man do, he shall even live in them; and my sabbaths they greatly polluted: then I said, I would pour out my fury upon them in the wilderness, to consume them.
Ezekiel 20:16 Because they despised my judgments, and walked not in my statutes, but polluted my sabbaths: for their heart went after their idols.
Ezek 20:19-24
19I am the LORD your God; walk in my statutes, and keep my judgments, and do them;
20 And hallow my sabbaths; and they shall be a sign between me and you, that ye may know that I am the LORD your God. 21 Notwithstanding the children rebelled against me: they walked not in my statutes, neither kept my judgments to do them, which if a man do, he shall even live in them; they polluted my sabbaths: then I said, I would pour out my fury upon them, to accomplish my anger against them in the wilderness. 22 Nevertheless I withdrew mine hand, and wrought for my name's sake, that it should not be polluted in the sight of the heathen, in whose sight I brought them forth. 23 I lifted up mine hand unto them also in the wilderness, that I would scatter them among the heathen, and disperse them through the countries; 24 Because they had not executed my judgments, but had despised my statutes, and had polluted my sabbaths, and their eyes were after their fathers' idols.
Ezekiel 22:8 Thou hast despised mine holy things, and hast profaned my sabbaths.
Ezekiel 22:26 Her priests have violated my law, and have profaned mine holy things: they have put no difference between the holy and profane, neither have they shewed difference between the unclean and the clean, and have hid their eyes from my sabbaths, and I am profaned among them.
Ezekiel 23:38 Moreover this they have done unto me: they have defiled my sanctuary in the same day, and have profaned my sabbaths.
The Lord claims the sabbath as His very own. It is a day, therefore it is literally, the Lord's day. This clear so how many times must the Lord call the sabbath His day to understand that there is only one day in the scriptures that would be referred to as the Lord's day? Other than the seventh day sabbath, the Lord's day can also refer to the day on which He will return to this earth. That is all. Sunday, or the first day of the week is never referred to as the Lord's day in the scriptures.
This title was only applied to Sunday later on, to cover their deception. It was applied by those who began the apostasy and abomination which was the result of the amalgamation of apostate Christianity and pagan sun worship.
Hobie
Well-Known Member
Now the word for the seventh day of the week still means rest or Sabbath in many languages. This gives evidence that the weekly Sabbath was given at Creation to all mankind. Here are a few:
Hebrew (ancient and modern) - Shab-bath = Sabbath
Ancient Syriac - Shab-ba-tho = Sabbath
Babylonian - Sa-ba-tu = Sabbath
Assyrian - Sa-ba-tu = Sabbath
Arabic (ancient and modern) - as-Sabt = The Sabbath
Maltese - Is-sibt = The Sabbath
Ge-ez or Ethiopic - San-bat = The Sabbath
Coptic (Egypt, a dead language for 200 years) - pi sabbaton = The
Sabbath
Tamashek or Towarek - a-hal es-sabt = The Sabbath day
(from ancient Lybian or Numidian, Atlas Mountains, Africa)
Hausa (Central Africa) - assebatu = The Sabbath
Greek - Savvato
Portuguese - Sabado
Romanian - Sambata
Russian - Subbota
Gothic (oldest Germanic language) - Sabbato dags
Italian - Sabato
Spanish - Sabado
Hebrew (ancient and modern) - Shab-bath = Sabbath
Ancient Syriac - Shab-ba-tho = Sabbath
Babylonian - Sa-ba-tu = Sabbath
Assyrian - Sa-ba-tu = Sabbath
Arabic (ancient and modern) - as-Sabt = The Sabbath
Maltese - Is-sibt = The Sabbath
Ge-ez or Ethiopic - San-bat = The Sabbath
Coptic (Egypt, a dead language for 200 years) - pi sabbaton = The
Sabbath
Tamashek or Towarek - a-hal es-sabt = The Sabbath day
(from ancient Lybian or Numidian, Atlas Mountains, Africa)
Hausa (Central Africa) - assebatu = The Sabbath
Greek - Savvato
Portuguese - Sabado
Romanian - Sambata
Russian - Subbota
Gothic (oldest Germanic language) - Sabbato dags
Italian - Sabato
Spanish - Sabado
Hobie
Well-Known Member
Now to your questions on the various verses that seem to indicate a first day worship in the Bible, here is a excerpt from a book by Kenneth A. Strand, The Sabbath in Scripture and History.
"...The word Sunday is not found in the Bible. In the New Testament the first day of the week is mentioned eight times. In none of the eight instances is the first day said to be a day of worship, never is it said to be the Christian substitute for the Old Testament Sabbath, and never do the texts suggest that the first day of the week should be regarded as a memorial of Christ's resurrection. Let us briefly consider each of the eight New Testament passages that mention the first day of the week.
Matthew 28:1, "After the sabbath, as the first day of the week was dawning, Mary Magdalene and the other Mary went to see the tomb. And suddenly there was a great earthquake. . . ." Jesus was crucified on Friday. He rested in the tomb over the Sabbath and rose early on Sunday morning. The verse indicates that the women disciples returned to the tomb at the very first opportunity after the death and burial of Jesus. Because the Sabbath came so soon after His burial, they could not approach the tomb again until after sundown on Sabbath evening. (The Sabbath began at sundown on the sixth day and ended at sundown on the seventh day; compare Lev. 23:32; Neh. 13:19; Mark 1:21, 32) Early Sunday morning was the most convenient time for them to visit the tomb.
Mark 16:1, 2, "When the sabbath was over, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James, and Salome bought spices, so that they might go and anoint him. And very early on the first day of the week, when the sun had risen, they went to the tomb."Mark records the same events as Matthew with the additional information that the women visited the tomb early on the Sunday morning for the express purpose of anointing Jesus' body with spices.
Mark 16:9, "Now after he rose early on the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, from whom he had cast out seven demons."This verse simply records that, after His resurrection early on the Sunday morning, Jesus appeared to Mary Magdalene.
Luke 23:54 & 24:1, "It [the day of Jesus' death and burial] was the day of Preparation, and the sabbath was beginning. The women who had come with him from Galilee followed, and they saw the tomb and how his body was laid. Then they returned, and prepared spices and ointments. On the sabbath they rested according to the commandment. But on the first day of the week, at early dawn, they came to the tomb, taking the spices that they had prepared." The Sabbath came a few hours after Jesus' death on the cross. The women disciples "rested the sabbath day according to the commandment" (Luke 23:56, KJV). Then very early in the morning of the first day they visited the tomb to anoint the body of Jesus. The fact that they observed the Sabbath rest is sufficient indication that Jesus had never attempted to change the day or to suggest that after His death the first day would replace the Sabbath. Writing years after the event, Luke gave not the slightest hint that, even though the women disciples of Jesus observed the Sabbath, such a practice was no longer expected of Christians. He simply recorded that the Sabbath day "according to the commandment," which Jesus' followers were careful to observe, was the day after the crucifixion day (Friday), and before the resurrection day (Sunday).
John 20:1, "Early on the first day of the week, while it was still dark, Mary Magdalene came to the tomb and saw that the stone had been removed from the tomb."Mary Magdalene visited the tomb early the first day of the week. Nothing is said of Sunday as a day of worship or rest.
John 20:19, "When it was evening on that day, the first day of the week, and the doors of the house where the disciples had met were locked for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood among them and said, 'Peace be with you.'" On the evening of the first day of the week the disciples were assembled behind locked doors "for fear of the Jews." Jesus appeared to them at that time. The passage does not say that henceforth Sunday was to be the day for worship. Since it was the evening of the first day of the week that Jesus appeared to the disciples, it was after sundown. According to Jewish reckoning this was actually the beginning of the second day (Monday; compare Gen. 1:5, 8). A week later when Thomas happened to be present, Jesus met with the disciples again (verse 26). But, writing years later, John records nothing regarding Sunday as a day of Christian worship. John's narrative gives no warrant for regarding Sunday as a substitute for the Sabbath or as a day to be distinguished by Christians above any other day of the week. And there is no indication in the passage that Sunday should henceforth be observed as a memorial of Christ's resurrection.'...
"...The word Sunday is not found in the Bible. In the New Testament the first day of the week is mentioned eight times. In none of the eight instances is the first day said to be a day of worship, never is it said to be the Christian substitute for the Old Testament Sabbath, and never do the texts suggest that the first day of the week should be regarded as a memorial of Christ's resurrection. Let us briefly consider each of the eight New Testament passages that mention the first day of the week.
Matthew 28:1, "After the sabbath, as the first day of the week was dawning, Mary Magdalene and the other Mary went to see the tomb. And suddenly there was a great earthquake. . . ." Jesus was crucified on Friday. He rested in the tomb over the Sabbath and rose early on Sunday morning. The verse indicates that the women disciples returned to the tomb at the very first opportunity after the death and burial of Jesus. Because the Sabbath came so soon after His burial, they could not approach the tomb again until after sundown on Sabbath evening. (The Sabbath began at sundown on the sixth day and ended at sundown on the seventh day; compare Lev. 23:32; Neh. 13:19; Mark 1:21, 32) Early Sunday morning was the most convenient time for them to visit the tomb.
Mark 16:1, 2, "When the sabbath was over, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James, and Salome bought spices, so that they might go and anoint him. And very early on the first day of the week, when the sun had risen, they went to the tomb."Mark records the same events as Matthew with the additional information that the women visited the tomb early on the Sunday morning for the express purpose of anointing Jesus' body with spices.
Mark 16:9, "Now after he rose early on the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, from whom he had cast out seven demons."This verse simply records that, after His resurrection early on the Sunday morning, Jesus appeared to Mary Magdalene.
Luke 23:54 & 24:1, "It [the day of Jesus' death and burial] was the day of Preparation, and the sabbath was beginning. The women who had come with him from Galilee followed, and they saw the tomb and how his body was laid. Then they returned, and prepared spices and ointments. On the sabbath they rested according to the commandment. But on the first day of the week, at early dawn, they came to the tomb, taking the spices that they had prepared." The Sabbath came a few hours after Jesus' death on the cross. The women disciples "rested the sabbath day according to the commandment" (Luke 23:56, KJV). Then very early in the morning of the first day they visited the tomb to anoint the body of Jesus. The fact that they observed the Sabbath rest is sufficient indication that Jesus had never attempted to change the day or to suggest that after His death the first day would replace the Sabbath. Writing years after the event, Luke gave not the slightest hint that, even though the women disciples of Jesus observed the Sabbath, such a practice was no longer expected of Christians. He simply recorded that the Sabbath day "according to the commandment," which Jesus' followers were careful to observe, was the day after the crucifixion day (Friday), and before the resurrection day (Sunday).
John 20:1, "Early on the first day of the week, while it was still dark, Mary Magdalene came to the tomb and saw that the stone had been removed from the tomb."Mary Magdalene visited the tomb early the first day of the week. Nothing is said of Sunday as a day of worship or rest.
John 20:19, "When it was evening on that day, the first day of the week, and the doors of the house where the disciples had met were locked for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood among them and said, 'Peace be with you.'" On the evening of the first day of the week the disciples were assembled behind locked doors "for fear of the Jews." Jesus appeared to them at that time. The passage does not say that henceforth Sunday was to be the day for worship. Since it was the evening of the first day of the week that Jesus appeared to the disciples, it was after sundown. According to Jewish reckoning this was actually the beginning of the second day (Monday; compare Gen. 1:5, 8). A week later when Thomas happened to be present, Jesus met with the disciples again (verse 26). But, writing years later, John records nothing regarding Sunday as a day of Christian worship. John's narrative gives no warrant for regarding Sunday as a substitute for the Sabbath or as a day to be distinguished by Christians above any other day of the week. And there is no indication in the passage that Sunday should henceforth be observed as a memorial of Christ's resurrection.'...
Hobie
Well-Known Member
...Acts 20:7, "On the first day of the week, when we met to break bread, Paul was holding a discussion with them; since he intended to leave the next day, he continued speaking until midnight."Since the meeting was held at night on the first day of the week, it may have been Saturday night. According to Jewish reckoning, the Sabbath ended and the first day of the week began at sundown of the seventh day. If it were Sunday evening, the event gives no suggestion that Sunday should be observed as a day of worship. The following verses record that Paul preached a sermon on Thursday. The next day after the meeting recorded in Acts 20:7 (Monday), Paul and his party set sail for Mitylene (Acts 20:13, 14). The following day (Tuesday) they arrived opposite Chios (verse 15). The next day (Wednesday) they passed Samos (verse 15), and the day after that (Thursday) they arrived at Miletus (verse 15). The elders of the church of Ephesus met Paul at Miletus, and he preached to them (Acts 20:16-36). Because a Christian service was held on Thursday, do we conclude that Thursday is a day for regular Christian worship replacing the observance of the seventh-day Sabbath? A religious service on Sunday, Thursday, or any other day certainly did not make that day a replacement for the seventh-day Sabbath or a day of regular Christian worship and rest. There is no special significance in the disciples breaking bread at this first-day meeting, for they broke bread "daily" (Acts 2:46). We are not told that it was a Lord's Supper celebration, nor are we told that henceforth Sunday should be the day for this service to be conducted. To read Sunday sacredness or Sunday observance into Acts 20:7 is to do violence to the text.
1 Corinthians 16:1, 2, "Now concerning the collection for the saints: you should follow the directions I gave the churches of Galatia. On the first day of every week, each of you is to put aside and save whatever extra you earn, so that collections need not be taken when I come. And when I arrive, I will send any whom you approve with letters to take your gift to Jerusalem."These verses may be literally translated from the Greek as follows: "And concerning the collection for the saints, as I instructed the churches of Galatia, so also you do. On the first day of the week let each of you place (or 'lay') by himself, storing up whatever he might be prospered, so that when I come there might be no collections." (Italics supplied.) The phrase "by himself" (par' heauto), followed by the participle "storing up" or "saving" (thesaupizon), rules out the possibility that this is a reference to an offering taken up in a worship service. The Christian believer was to check his accounts on Sunday and put by at home the money that he wished to give to Paul for the support of the church. When Paul arrived, then the offerings of each individual would be collected.
None of these eight New Testament references to the first day of the week (Sunday), provides any evidence that Jesus or His disciples changed the day of worship from the seventh to the first day. Nor is the first day of the week represented as a time to memorialize the resurrection of Christ. Whatever special significance was given to Sunday in the later history of the church, it had no basis in the teaching or practice of Jesus and His apostles.
As pointed out in the previous chapter, Jesus instructed His disciples to observe the Sabbath after His death (Matt. 24:20). Jesus' instruction was incorporated into His interpretation of Daniel 8 (compare Matthew 24:15 ff.). Daniel predicted that the work of the little horn power would continue until the setting up of God's kingdom (Dan. 8:25). Hence, Jesus' instruction to flee from the little horn power was not confined to Christians at the time of the destruction of Jerusalem (A.D. 70). Toward the end of time, during the great tribulation of Matthew 24:21, of which earlier tribulations were a type or preview, God's people will be obliged to flee again. Jesus' instruction that we pray that our flight will not be on the Sabbath day emphasizes His will that we engage in only those activities on the Sabbath that are consistent with worship and spiritual rest.
The record of the book of Acts (chapters 13, 16 &18) establishes that the apostles consistently kept the Sabbath day as a time for worship and fellowship. This observance was not merely a means of meeting the Jews in the synagogue on their Sabbath day. In Philippi, Paul and his companions met for worship by the riverside. Luke says, "On the sabbath day we went outside the gate to the riverside, where we supposed [or "thought" or "assumed" : Greek nomizo] there was a place for prayer. . . ." (Acts 16:13). The apostles selected a place by the river that they thought would be appropriate for their Sabbath worship service, and there they prayed and witnessed for their Lord.
Jesus and the apostles kept the seventh-day Sabbath and instructed others to do likewise, so it wasn't changed by them....."STRAND, Kenneth A. The Sabbath in Scripture and History.pdf | Genesis Creation Narrative | Shabbat
1 Corinthians 16:1, 2, "Now concerning the collection for the saints: you should follow the directions I gave the churches of Galatia. On the first day of every week, each of you is to put aside and save whatever extra you earn, so that collections need not be taken when I come. And when I arrive, I will send any whom you approve with letters to take your gift to Jerusalem."These verses may be literally translated from the Greek as follows: "And concerning the collection for the saints, as I instructed the churches of Galatia, so also you do. On the first day of the week let each of you place (or 'lay') by himself, storing up whatever he might be prospered, so that when I come there might be no collections." (Italics supplied.) The phrase "by himself" (par' heauto), followed by the participle "storing up" or "saving" (thesaupizon), rules out the possibility that this is a reference to an offering taken up in a worship service. The Christian believer was to check his accounts on Sunday and put by at home the money that he wished to give to Paul for the support of the church. When Paul arrived, then the offerings of each individual would be collected.
None of these eight New Testament references to the first day of the week (Sunday), provides any evidence that Jesus or His disciples changed the day of worship from the seventh to the first day. Nor is the first day of the week represented as a time to memorialize the resurrection of Christ. Whatever special significance was given to Sunday in the later history of the church, it had no basis in the teaching or practice of Jesus and His apostles.
As pointed out in the previous chapter, Jesus instructed His disciples to observe the Sabbath after His death (Matt. 24:20). Jesus' instruction was incorporated into His interpretation of Daniel 8 (compare Matthew 24:15 ff.). Daniel predicted that the work of the little horn power would continue until the setting up of God's kingdom (Dan. 8:25). Hence, Jesus' instruction to flee from the little horn power was not confined to Christians at the time of the destruction of Jerusalem (A.D. 70). Toward the end of time, during the great tribulation of Matthew 24:21, of which earlier tribulations were a type or preview, God's people will be obliged to flee again. Jesus' instruction that we pray that our flight will not be on the Sabbath day emphasizes His will that we engage in only those activities on the Sabbath that are consistent with worship and spiritual rest.
The record of the book of Acts (chapters 13, 16 &18) establishes that the apostles consistently kept the Sabbath day as a time for worship and fellowship. This observance was not merely a means of meeting the Jews in the synagogue on their Sabbath day. In Philippi, Paul and his companions met for worship by the riverside. Luke says, "On the sabbath day we went outside the gate to the riverside, where we supposed [or "thought" or "assumed" : Greek nomizo] there was a place for prayer. . . ." (Acts 16:13). The apostles selected a place by the river that they thought would be appropriate for their Sabbath worship service, and there they prayed and witnessed for their Lord.
Jesus and the apostles kept the seventh-day Sabbath and instructed others to do likewise, so it wasn't changed by them....."STRAND, Kenneth A. The Sabbath in Scripture and History.pdf | Genesis Creation Narrative | Shabbat
Hobie
Well-Known Member
So how about Paul as many christians feel he supports the changing of the Sabbath from Saturday to Sunday:
"...In his writings, Paul consistently accepted the authority of the Ten Commandments as the standard of righteousness. "Do we then overthrow the law by this faith? By no means! On the contrary, we uphold the law" (Rom. 3:31). Paul identified the law that faith upholds as the Ten Commandments. "What then should we say? That the law is sin? By no means! Yet, if it had not been for the law, I would not have known sin. I would not have known what it is to covet if the law had not said, 'You shall not covet.'. . . So the law is holy, and the commandment is holy and just and good. . . . For we know that the law is spiritual; but I am of the flesh, sold into slavery under sin" (Rom. 7:7, 12, 14). Christ died "so that the just requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not according to the flesh but according to the Spirit" (Rom. 8:4).
It is inconceivable that one who had such a confirmed respect for the Ten Commandment law of God should summarily reject one of the commandments as no longer valid for Christians. Raoul Dederen pertinently comments: "It is to be noted, however, that the attempt to connect the Sabbath of the Decalogue with the 'days' mentioned in this passage is not convincing for everyone.(3) Who could have a divine commandment before him and say to others: 'You can treat that commandment as you please; it really makes no difference whether you keep it or not'? No apostle could conduct such an argument. And probably no man would be more surprised at that interpretation than Paul himself, who had utmost respect for the Decalogue, God's law, which is 'holy, and just, and good' (chap. 7:12). Christ, the norm of all Pauline teaching, was indisputably a Sabbathkeeper. And Paul himself, who evidently cannot be reckoned among the 'weak,' worshiped on the Sabbath 'as was his custom' (Acts 17:2, R.S.V.; cf. Luke 4:16).
The Bible records no dispute between the Christians and the Jews concerning the observance of the Sabbath day. There was a dispute whether the Gentile converts to Christianity were to be circumcised or not. A dispute so great that a general church council was held to settle the matter.(Acts 15) The fact that there is absolutely no council held nor dispute concerning Sabbath observance proves that Christians kept the same day as the Jews did.
The Apostle Paul was accused by the Jews of teaching against the Law, but other than saying circumcision is no longer of the flesh but of the heart, he denied this allegation against him. Paul was arrested on this charge, notice his own defense before the governor Felix, Acts 24:13-14 -"Nor can they prove to you the charges of which they now accuse me. But this I admit to you, that according to the Way which they call a sect (Christianity) I do serve the God of our fathers, BELIEVING EVERYTHING that is in ACCORDANCE WITH THE LAW and that is written in the Prophets." Sabbath observance was Law.
Never in the Scriptures was Paul accused of teaching against Sabbath observance. The Sabbath is mentioned fifty-nine times in the New Testament alone, and always with respect, bearing the same title it had in the Old Testament, -"the Sabbath Day."
"There is no conclusive evidence to the contrary. Paul was in no doubt as to the validity of the weekly Sabbath. Thus, to assume that when they were converted to Christianity by Paul, Gentiles or Jews would be anxious to give up the 'Jewish' Sabbath for their 'own day' is hardly likely. This could be expected only at some later time in the history of the Christian church, and for other reasons."(4)..."(Kenneth A. Strand, The Sabbath in Scripture and History.)
I hope this answers some of your questions and clears up some of the confusion on this..
"...In his writings, Paul consistently accepted the authority of the Ten Commandments as the standard of righteousness. "Do we then overthrow the law by this faith? By no means! On the contrary, we uphold the law" (Rom. 3:31). Paul identified the law that faith upholds as the Ten Commandments. "What then should we say? That the law is sin? By no means! Yet, if it had not been for the law, I would not have known sin. I would not have known what it is to covet if the law had not said, 'You shall not covet.'. . . So the law is holy, and the commandment is holy and just and good. . . . For we know that the law is spiritual; but I am of the flesh, sold into slavery under sin" (Rom. 7:7, 12, 14). Christ died "so that the just requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not according to the flesh but according to the Spirit" (Rom. 8:4).
It is inconceivable that one who had such a confirmed respect for the Ten Commandment law of God should summarily reject one of the commandments as no longer valid for Christians. Raoul Dederen pertinently comments: "It is to be noted, however, that the attempt to connect the Sabbath of the Decalogue with the 'days' mentioned in this passage is not convincing for everyone.(3) Who could have a divine commandment before him and say to others: 'You can treat that commandment as you please; it really makes no difference whether you keep it or not'? No apostle could conduct such an argument. And probably no man would be more surprised at that interpretation than Paul himself, who had utmost respect for the Decalogue, God's law, which is 'holy, and just, and good' (chap. 7:12). Christ, the norm of all Pauline teaching, was indisputably a Sabbathkeeper. And Paul himself, who evidently cannot be reckoned among the 'weak,' worshiped on the Sabbath 'as was his custom' (Acts 17:2, R.S.V.; cf. Luke 4:16).
The Bible records no dispute between the Christians and the Jews concerning the observance of the Sabbath day. There was a dispute whether the Gentile converts to Christianity were to be circumcised or not. A dispute so great that a general church council was held to settle the matter.(Acts 15) The fact that there is absolutely no council held nor dispute concerning Sabbath observance proves that Christians kept the same day as the Jews did.
The Apostle Paul was accused by the Jews of teaching against the Law, but other than saying circumcision is no longer of the flesh but of the heart, he denied this allegation against him. Paul was arrested on this charge, notice his own defense before the governor Felix, Acts 24:13-14 -"Nor can they prove to you the charges of which they now accuse me. But this I admit to you, that according to the Way which they call a sect (Christianity) I do serve the God of our fathers, BELIEVING EVERYTHING that is in ACCORDANCE WITH THE LAW and that is written in the Prophets." Sabbath observance was Law.
Never in the Scriptures was Paul accused of teaching against Sabbath observance. The Sabbath is mentioned fifty-nine times in the New Testament alone, and always with respect, bearing the same title it had in the Old Testament, -"the Sabbath Day."
"There is no conclusive evidence to the contrary. Paul was in no doubt as to the validity of the weekly Sabbath. Thus, to assume that when they were converted to Christianity by Paul, Gentiles or Jews would be anxious to give up the 'Jewish' Sabbath for their 'own day' is hardly likely. This could be expected only at some later time in the history of the Christian church, and for other reasons."(4)..."(Kenneth A. Strand, The Sabbath in Scripture and History.)
I hope this answers some of your questions and clears up some of the confusion on this..
Hobie
Well-Known Member
If one goes to history you will see the fraud that has been instituted on the believers:
"This [Constantine's Sunday decree of March, 321] is the 'parent' Sunday law making it a day of rest and release from labor. For from that time to the present there have been decrees about the observance of Sunday which have profoundly influenced European and American society. When the Church became a part of State under the Christian emperors, Sunday observance was enforced by civil statutes, and later when the Empire was past, the Church, in the hands of the papacy, enforced it by ecclesiastical and also by civil enactments."--Walter W. Hyde, "Paganism to Christianity in the Roman Empire," 1946, p. 261.
"Constantine's decree marked the beginning of a long, though intermittent series of imperial decrees in support of Sunday rest."-- Vincent J. Kelly, "Forbidden Sunday and Feast-Day Occupations," 1943, p. 29.
"If every Sunday is to be observed joyfully by the Christians on account of the resurrection, then every Sabbath on account of the burial is to be regarded in execration [cursing] of the Jews."--Pope Sylvester, quoted by S.R.E. Humbert, "Adversus Graecorum Calumnias," in J.P. Migne, "Patrologie," p. 143. [Sylvester (A.D. 314-337) was the pope at the time Constantine 1 was Emperor.]
"All things whatsoever that were prescribed for the [Bible] Sabbath, we have transferred them to the Lord's day, as being more authoritative and more highly regarded and first in rank, and more honorable than the Jewish Sabbath."--Bishop Eusebius, quoted in J.P. Migne, "Patrologie," p. 23, 1169-1172. [Eusebius of Caesarea was a high-ranking Catholic leader during Constantine's lifetime.]
"These Gentile Christians of Rome and Alexandria began calling the first day of the week 'the Lord's day.' This was not difficult for the pagans of the Roman Empire who were steeped in sun worship to accept, because they [the pagans] referred to their sun-god as their 'Lord.' "--EM. Chalmers, "How Sunday Came Into the Christian Church," p. 3.
The following statement was made 100 years after Constantine's Sunday Law was passed: "Although almost all churches throughout the world celebrate the sacred mysteries on the Sabbath every week, yet the Christians of Alexandria and at Rome, on account of some ancient tradition, have ceased to do this."--Socrates Scholasticus, quoted in "Ecclesiastical History," Book 5, chap. 22. [Written shortly after A.D. 439.]
"The people of Constantinople, and almost everywhere, assemble together on the Sabbath, as well as on the first day of the week, which custom is never observed at Rome or at Alexandria."--Hermias Sozomen, quoted in "Ecclesiastical History," vii, 19, in "A Select Library of Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers," 2nd Series, Vol. 2, p. 390. [Written soon after AD. 415.]
"Down even to the fifth century the observance of the Jewish Sabbath was continued in the Christian church, but with a rigor and solemnity gradually diminishing until it was wholly discontinued."--Lyman Coleman, "Ancient Christianity Exemplified" chap. 26, sec. 2, p. 527.
"What began, however, as a pagan ordinance, ended as a Christian regulation; and a long series of imperial decrees, during the fourth, fifth, and sixth centuries, enjoined with increasing stringency abstinence from labor on Sunday."--Huttan Webster, "Rest Days," pp. 122-123, 210.
"This [Constantine's Sunday decree of March, 321] is the 'parent' Sunday law making it a day of rest and release from labor. For from that time to the present there have been decrees about the observance of Sunday which have profoundly influenced European and American society. When the Church became a part of State under the Christian emperors, Sunday observance was enforced by civil statutes, and later when the Empire was past, the Church, in the hands of the papacy, enforced it by ecclesiastical and also by civil enactments."--Walter W. Hyde, "Paganism to Christianity in the Roman Empire," 1946, p. 261.
"Constantine's decree marked the beginning of a long, though intermittent series of imperial decrees in support of Sunday rest."-- Vincent J. Kelly, "Forbidden Sunday and Feast-Day Occupations," 1943, p. 29.
"If every Sunday is to be observed joyfully by the Christians on account of the resurrection, then every Sabbath on account of the burial is to be regarded in execration [cursing] of the Jews."--Pope Sylvester, quoted by S.R.E. Humbert, "Adversus Graecorum Calumnias," in J.P. Migne, "Patrologie," p. 143. [Sylvester (A.D. 314-337) was the pope at the time Constantine 1 was Emperor.]
"All things whatsoever that were prescribed for the [Bible] Sabbath, we have transferred them to the Lord's day, as being more authoritative and more highly regarded and first in rank, and more honorable than the Jewish Sabbath."--Bishop Eusebius, quoted in J.P. Migne, "Patrologie," p. 23, 1169-1172. [Eusebius of Caesarea was a high-ranking Catholic leader during Constantine's lifetime.]
"These Gentile Christians of Rome and Alexandria began calling the first day of the week 'the Lord's day.' This was not difficult for the pagans of the Roman Empire who were steeped in sun worship to accept, because they [the pagans] referred to their sun-god as their 'Lord.' "--EM. Chalmers, "How Sunday Came Into the Christian Church," p. 3.
The following statement was made 100 years after Constantine's Sunday Law was passed: "Although almost all churches throughout the world celebrate the sacred mysteries on the Sabbath every week, yet the Christians of Alexandria and at Rome, on account of some ancient tradition, have ceased to do this."--Socrates Scholasticus, quoted in "Ecclesiastical History," Book 5, chap. 22. [Written shortly after A.D. 439.]
"The people of Constantinople, and almost everywhere, assemble together on the Sabbath, as well as on the first day of the week, which custom is never observed at Rome or at Alexandria."--Hermias Sozomen, quoted in "Ecclesiastical History," vii, 19, in "A Select Library of Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers," 2nd Series, Vol. 2, p. 390. [Written soon after AD. 415.]
"Down even to the fifth century the observance of the Jewish Sabbath was continued in the Christian church, but with a rigor and solemnity gradually diminishing until it was wholly discontinued."--Lyman Coleman, "Ancient Christianity Exemplified" chap. 26, sec. 2, p. 527.
"What began, however, as a pagan ordinance, ended as a Christian regulation; and a long series of imperial decrees, during the fourth, fifth, and sixth centuries, enjoined with increasing stringency abstinence from labor on Sunday."--Huttan Webster, "Rest Days," pp. 122-123, 210.
But we do NOT see it given in the Law of Christ in the New Testament
because... our rest now is abiding IN Christ, not taking off from work on Saturday
BarneyFife
Well-Known Member
The rest spoken of in Hebrews 4 as interpreted to be the rest one finds in salvation in Christ is not new in the history of mankind. It is only new in the individual life experience as one realizes the futility of salvation by works.
It has been required of every person who has ever been or will ever be saved. The New Covenant is the Eternal Covenant—present, forward, and backward.
Adam, Enoch, Noah, Abraham, Moses, Joshua, and all the patriarchs and prophets of old were every bit as needful of that rest as the saints of today are of the weekly rest of Genesis 2 and Exodus 20.
All of the ambiguous proof texts that can be piled up from 2 Cor 3, Rom 14, Col 2, Heb 4, etc., etc. will never prove otherwise.
And doubling down ad infinitum on false claims is even less effective in convincing people of error.
The weekly Sabbath rest is metaphorically symbolic of the rest from from works as a means of salvation, as Hebrews 4 illustrates.
But nowhere in Scripture is one type of rest portrayed as superseding the other. Even science bears this out, just as it always does in vindicating the Author of science—God's Word.
.
Hobie
Well-Known Member
So Who do you think wrote the Law with His own finger, need to think that one over...
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