Reader Poll - Would you be a Christian if there was no afterlife?

[Aunty Jane]

Did they? I don't see "governing body " in my Bible, is it in the NWT?

Wonder of wonders!…you’ve never read Acts 15:1-33???

There is a governing body in Jerusalem to whom Paul and Barnabas took the hotly debated topic of circumcision for Gentiles to be resolved. After a decision was reached, a letter was sent to all the congregations with the intention of ending the divisions among the Jewish believers and their Gentiles brothers.

Having a central governing body is essential for unity, and oneness of belief and purpose. (1 Cor 1:10)
If it was good enough for the first Christians, it’s good enough for us.

You can do as you please…..it makes no difference to anyone, as no one has ever heard of your group.
People cannot hate you and persecute you if they have no idea that you exist…..(John 15:18-21)

 

[Berean]

Wonder of wonders!…you’ve never read Acts 15:1-33???

There is a governing body in Jerusalem to whom Paul and Barnabas took the hotly debated topic of circumcision for Gentiles to be resolved. After a decision was reached, a letter was sent to all the congregations with the intention of ending the divisions among the Jewish believers and their Gentiles brothers.

Having a central governing body is essential for unity, and oneness of belief and purpose. (1 Cor 1:10)
If it was good enough for the first Christians, it’s good enough for us.

You can do as you please…..it makes no difference to anyone, as no one has ever heard of your group.
People cannot hate you and persecute you if they have no idea that you exist…..(John 15:18-21)

Okay, let's take a look at some verses. Let's look at Acts 15:2

"after quite a bit of dissension and disputing by Paul and Barʹna·bas with them, it was arranged for Paul, Barʹna·bas, and some of the others to go up to the apostles and elders in Jerusalem regarding this issue." (NWT)​

​

Instead of showing that there were just a few leaders called a governing body, Acts talks about a big meeting. This meeting included the apostles, older men known as elders, Paul and Barnabas who were traveling missionaries, and others. This big group came together to make a decision on an important issue that affected the local congregations.

The story of Apostle Paul also shows that there wasn't a central governing body leading the early Christians. After Paul changed his life, he didn't meet with a governing body or go to Jerusalem to get a job. Instead, he started his missionary work right away, guided by the Holy Spirit. Paul didn't go to Jerusalem for the first time until three years after he changed, and even then, he only met with Peter and James, not a group of leaders.

"nor did I go up to Jerusalem to those who were apostles before I was, but I went to Arabia, and then I returned to Damascus. Then three years later I went up to Jerusalem to visit Ceʹphas, and I stayed with him for 15 days. But I did not see any of the other apostles, only James the brother of the Lord." (NWT)​

​

So, Paul didn't return to Jerusalem for another fourteen years (Galatians 2:1-3), probably for the event mentioned in Acts 15.

Schaff's History of the Christian Church indicates that once the circumcision issue was settled, "we have no trace of Councils before the middle of the second century."

What does the passage in chapter 15 really say? Does it mention the phrase "governing body"? Does it claim that only the apostles were part of this important decision about doctrine? Not even close.

"Then the apostles and the elders, together with the whole congregation, decided to send chosen men from among them to Antioch, along with Paul and Barʹna·bas; they sent Judas who was called Barʹsab·bas and Silas, who were leading men among the brothers. They wrote this and sent it through them:“The apostles and the elders, your brothers, to those brothers in Antioch, Syria, and Ci·liʹcia who are from the nations: Greetings!" - 15:22, 23 (NWT)​

Decision making wasn't just in the hands of a few leaders. Instead, everyone in the congregation, like the apostles, elders, Paul, and Barnabas, worked together to agree on the issue and write the letter to share their conclusions. A small group of leaders didn't have all the power over the early Christian congregations.

 

[Aunty Jane]

Okay, let's take a look at some verses. Let's look at Acts 15:2

"after quite a bit of dissension and disputing by Paul and Barʹna·bas with them, it was arranged for Paul, Barʹna·bas, and some of the others to go up to the apostles and elders in Jerusalem regarding this issue." (NWT)Instead of showing that there were just a few leaders called a governing body, Acts talks about a big meeting. This meeting included the apostles, older men known as elders, Paul and Barnabas who were traveling missionaries, and others. This big group came together to make a decision on an important issue that affected the local congregations.

The “big meeting“ involved the dissenters and those arguing for circumcision for their Gentile brothers.
“The apostles and elders” were “in Jerusalem“ and Paul and Barnabas were “sent” to them to clear up this divisive argument. After much prayer and debate, a decision was handed down by God’s spirit…..all complied with that. And the congregations were informed about it so that no lingering question about it remained.

The story of Apostle Paul also shows that there wasn't a central governing body leading the early Christians. After Paul changed his life, he didn't meet with a governing body or go to Jerusalem to get a job. Instead, he started his missionary work right away, guided by the Holy Spirit. Paul didn't go to Jerusalem for the first time until three years after he changed, and even then, he only met with Peter and James, not a group of leaders.

The apostles continued to be the ones directing worship as they appointed elders in the congregations to govern what was taught, and to deal with dissenters. (Hebrews 13:17) Any who wanted to practice sin, or who wanted to bring in their own ideas were shown the door. The elders had the authority to expel wrongdoers. (1 Cor 5:9-13; 2 John 9-11)
Without a central governing body (or call it whatever you like) unity is lost, and divisions are inevitable.

How do you think Christendom got to be such a mess?

 

[Berean]

The “big meeting“ involved the dissenters and those arguing for circumcision for their Gentile brothers.
“The apostles and elders” were “in Jerusalem“ and Paul and Barnabas were “sent” to them to clear up this divisive argument. After much prayer and debate, a decision was handed down by God’s spirit…..all complied with that. And the congregations were informed about it so that no lingering question about it remained.

The apostles continued to be the ones directing worship as they appointed elders in the congregations to govern what was taught, and to deal with dissenters. (Hebrews 13:17) Any who wanted to practice sin, or who wanted to bring in their own ideas were shown the door. The elders had the authority to expel wrongdoers. (1 Cor 5:9-13; 2 John 9-11)
Without a central governing body (or call it whatever you like) unity is lost, and divisions are inevitable.

If this is true, why aren't other councils of this "Governing Body" mentioned in the scriptures? You'd think there would be several occasions when the Apostles got together. Yet there is not one letter sent out to various congregations signed by a first-century "Governing Body" or Apostles.

How do you think Christendom got to be such a mess?

Probably the same way the Watchtower Society did ... "certain men have crept in unnoticed, who long ago were marked out for this condemnation, ungodly men, who turn the grace of our God into lewdness and deny the only Lord [a]God and our Lord Jesus Christ." - Jude 4

 

[Aunty Jane]

If this is true, why aren't other councils of this "Governing Body" mentioned in the scriptures? You'd think there would be several occasions when the Apostles got together. Yet there is not one letter sent out to various congregations signed by a first-century "Governing Body" or Apostles.

Probably the same way the Watchtower Society did ... "certain men have crept in unnoticed, who long ago were marked out for this condemnation, ungodly men, who turn the grace of our God into lewdness and deny the only Lord [a]God and our Lord Jesus Christ." - Jude 4

All of your posts to me are thinly veiled criticisms of Jehovah’s Witnesses…you have an agenda and we know how desperate some people can be in trying to push their own views, when they are not upheld by Scripture.

If you are the “Christians” that Jesus said would be “preaching the good news of the Kingdom in all the inhabited earth for a witness to all the nations” until “the end” of this current world system (Matt 24:14)…..then surely people would be hearing from you in any way possible. How did the first Christians get their message out to the people?

Matt 10:11-14….Jesus sent his disciples out to the people…..he did not tell them to sit in a building, reading their Bibles, and waiting for the sheep to wander in.…it was virtually a search and rescue mission.
Jesus told them…
“Now whatever city or town you enter, inquire who in it is worthy, and stay there till you go out. And when you go into a household, greet it. If the household is worthy, let your peace come upon it. But if it is not worthy, let your peace return to you. And whoever will not receive you nor hear your words, when you depart from that house or city, shake off the dust from your feet. Assuredly, I say to you, it will be more tolerable for the land of Sodom and Gomorrah in the day of judgment than for that city!” (NKJV)

Acts 20:19-21..…Paul’s words…
“serving the Lord with all humility, with many tears and trials which happened to me by the plotting of the Jews; how I kept back nothing that was helpful, but proclaimed it to you, and taught you publicly and from house to house, testifying to Jews, and also to Greeks, repentance toward God and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ.“ (NKJV)

Why was this necessary? Why did Jesus command that this be the way to get his message out to the people? Because their response to the message determined whether they were “worthy” or not. The peace that they wished the household, if their message was rejected, was to return to the messenger….who was to “shake the dust off their feet” because the customary foot washing as an act of hospitality, was denied and was counted as a rejection of the Christ, under whose authority they had come.

Any who think that this preaching work is unnecessary, are simply looking for excuses not to participate in it because it’s a difficult thing to approach strangers with the Christian message….but as Paul also said….
Rom 10:13-15….
“For “whoever calls on the name of the LORD shall be saved.” [quoting Joel 2:32] How then shall they call on Him in whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard? And how shall they hear without a preacher? And how shall they preach unless they are sent? As it is written:“How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the gospel of peace,Who bring glad tidings of good things!” (NKJV)

Make all the excuses you like…but Jesus said he would be “with” his disciples in this work to the very end.….

”Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, to the end of the age.” (Matt 28:19-20 NKJV)

 

[Berean]

All of your posts to me are thinly veiled criticisms of Jehovah’s Witnesses…you have an agenda and we know how desperate some people can be in trying to push their own views, when they are not upheld by Scripture.

I'm sorry Jane, I just can't anymore, you say I have an agenda and it seems YOUR agenda is to never answer my questions. It seems it doesn't matter what the subject is, we could be talking about belly buttons, and somehow it always comes back to "we're the only ones fulfilling the great commission Jesus gave us, blah blah blah." Great way to avoid answering me.

Take care!

 

[Aunty Jane]

I'm sorry Jane, I just can't anymore, you say I have an agenda and it seems YOUR agenda is to never answer my questions. It seems it doesn't matter what the subject is, we could be talking about belly buttons, and somehow it always comes back to "we're the only ones fulfilling the great commission Jesus gave us, blah blah blah." Great way to avoid answering me.

Take care!

No mate…it just shows you the smoke screening you use to justify not carrying out “the great commission”….(Matt 28:19-20; Matt 24:14)
You guys couldn't do it sustainably if you tried….neither can anyone else. You need a global brotherhood who are all on the same page, and who all teach and believe the same truth. (1 Cor 1:10) You will see them as a visible presence in most cities and even in remote places.

I had a local clergyman call at the home I was working at some years ago, and he said he was doing a Bible education work in the area. When I told him I was one of Jehovah’s Witnesses has face dropped, and after a moment he said….”can I ask you a question?” He said he knew this work is what Jesus commanded his disciples to do, and yet he said “you people are the only ones I see doing it, and have been as long as I can remember”.….he said “How do you encourage your people to go out preaching”…..“do you get paid? I have tried to get my parishioners out in the work but they never stay at it.“

He was all alone and so disappointed that he had somehow failed his congregation….but I said to him, if you have the truth in your heart, it’s like fire in your bones that cannot be contained….as Paul said…

“For if I preach the gospel, I have nothing to boast of, for necessity is laid upon me; yes, woe is me if I do not preach the gospel! For if I do this willingly, I have a reward; but if against my will, I have been entrusted with a stewardship. “ (1 Cor 9:16-17 NKJV)

There is a reward for our obedience, but we cannot do it solely for the reward.
Even if we go out in the work unwillingly because of feelings of inadequacy, or shyness, Jesus said he would be “with” us in the work….we overcome those feelings and we have a solid Bible education backing us up. It is a “stewardship”.…a personal responsibility. The more we do it, the better we feel about it, because to us it is a search and rescue mission. When we help people see that the future is not so bleak, it encourages them, and also encourages us to keep going.

And because this is God’s work…he provides the motivation to keep preaching until Jesus says the work is finished. Only he knows when the last sheep is in the pen.

This is what Jesus foretold for our time….deny it if you like, but nothing you bring up is more important than what Jesus said would identify the main focus of his disciples in this “time of the end”.

Its not my fault that you can’t justify your own position. You don’t have to answer to me.

 

[shepherdsword]

Having a central governing body is essential for unity, and oneness of belief and purpose. (1 Cor 1:10)
If it was good enough for the first Christians, it’s good enough for us.

But which governing Body? The Vatican? New Apostolic Reformation? The LDS' 15 "apostles"? The Watchtower society?

 

[Aunty Jane]

But which governing Body? The Vatican? New Apostolic Reformation? The LDS' 15 "apostles"? The Watchtower society?

For most mainstream religious institutions there is a central Governing Body…..that determines doctrine and practices for its members. Is that some sort of a surprise?
For JW’s it is our Governing Body who determines beliefs and practices….they are the ones who take the lead in our worship as the Scriptures outline they should. (Heb 13:17) we are told to obey them…..and this is for us and no one else.

If a person decides to become one of Jehovah’s Witnesses, they will study the Bible for a good all round understanding of what it means to be a Christian, and will undergo Christian baptism where they pledge to obey the teachings of Jesus Christ from that day forward. You cannot “join” Jehovah’s Witnesses…you have to choose to become one. You are not free to introduce your own ideas because that is what destroys unity.

People are free to choose whomever they see as the right religious “body” for themselves, if they accept their beliefs and agree that they teach the truth from God’s word.….but in the understanding that the fractured nature of Christendom means that there is no Governing Body for the claimed “body of Christ”….the “born again” Christians who really can’t explain what that means, and why their experiences are all so different.

It is denominations within Christendom who have those governing bodies….how many “bodies” does Christ have? How many truths are there?

 

[David Lamb]

It is denominations within Christendom who have those governing bodies….how many “bodies” does Christ have? How many truths are there?

Some denominations do, but by no means all. I am a Baptist, and there is no such thing as a Baptist central governing body, no equivalent to the Roman Catholic Vatican, or the Anglican synod. Each local Baptist church is autonomous under Christ. Some local Baptist churches may voluntarily join a grouping of Baptist churches, but the grouping has no authority over the local church.

 

[Berean]

But which governing Body? The Vatican? New Apostolic Reformation? The LDS' 15 "apostles"? The Watchtower society?

Shepherd, let me ask, how many of those "governing body's" you just mentioned change doctrines and practices as much as a baby's diaper and claim "this is what the Lord God revealed to us today ..." only to change it tomorrow and claim "this is what the Lord God revealed to us today ..."

How can you bring people into a church, claiming "this is the Truth that leads to eternal life" only to change those so-called truths later. Apparently what was taught previously was neither "everlasting" or "Truth."

 

[MatthewG]

I don't think I would exist already.

 

[Aunty Jane]

Shepherd, let me ask, how many of those "governing body's" you just mentioned change doctrines and practices as much as a baby's diaper and claim "this is what the Lord God revealed to us today ..." only to change it tomorrow and claim "this is what the Lord God revealed to us today ..."

How can you bring people into a church, claiming "this is the Truth that leads to eternal life" only to change those so-called truths later. Apparently what was taught previously was neither "everlasting" or "Truth."

More cheap shots…. seriously?…..perhaps you need to ask why you are not out in the work that Jesus assigned to all of his disciples, instead of wasting your time telling us what we ought to be doing….

Have we had clarifications about things over time? Yes, because things are always revealed incrementally in God’s word. Did Jesus’ apostles know that they were going to heaven when Jesus left to return to his Father? That was not revealed until Pentecost.

Were the Jews aware that the Kingdom was going to rule from heaven, or did they think it was an entirely earthly arrangement?
Did Jesus disciples know what it meant to be “born again”….no! Not until they received the holy spirit.

“The faithful and wise slave” was to feed his fellow slaves their “food at the proper time”, (Matt 24:45) which means that they were told what they needed to know, when they needed to know it. I think your food is rather stale by now.

“The light on the path gets brighter as the day dawns”…..or it should if you are not left behind in the dark….

 

[Aunty Jane]

Some denominations do, but by no means all. I am a Baptist, and there is no such thing as a Baptist central governing body, no equivalent to the Roman Catholic Vatican, or the Anglican synod. Each local Baptist church is autonomous under Christ. Some local Baptist churches may voluntarily join a grouping of Baptist churches, but the grouping has no authority over the local church.

I guess this is why there are some Baptist churches that have differences with others of the same denomination…
True Christianity has to fit what Paul said…..
1 Cor 1:10 NKJV…
”Now I plead with you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.“

Does this in any way describe Christendom?

 

[shepherdsword]

Shepherd, let me ask, how many of those "governing body's" you just mentioned change doctrines and practices as much as a baby's diaper and claim "this is what the Lord God revealed to us today ..." only to change it tomorrow and claim "this is what the Lord God revealed to us today ..."

How can you bring people into a church, claiming "this is the Truth that leads to eternal life" only to change those so-called truths later. Apparently what was taught previously was neither "everlasting" or "Truth."

and claiming that anyone of them promotes "unity" is just as outrageous

 

[shepherdsword]

More cheap shots…. seriously?…..perhaps you need to ask why you are not out in the work that Jesus assigned to all of his disciples, instead of wasting your time telling us what we ought to be doing….

How is pointing out error a "cheap shot"?

Have we had clarifications about things over time? Yes, because things are always revealed incrementally in God’s word. Did Jesus’ apostles know that they were going to heaven when Jesus left to return to his Father? That was not revealed until Pentecost.

Any false prophet can use this same reasoning to justify their error.

Were the Jews aware that the Kingdom was going to rule from heaven, or did they think it was an entirely earthly arrangement?
Did Jesus disciples know what it meant to be “born again”….no! Not until they received the holy spirit.

True...but they didn't claim an authorotative revelation from God about it before it was revealed. Big difference.

“The faithful and wise slave” was to feed his fellow slaves their “food at the proper time”, (Matt 24:45) which means that they were told what they needed to know, when they needed to know it. I think your food is rather stale by now.

This isn't a justification for claiming a divine revelation and then changing it whenever the whim suits you. Look, I am not trying to insult you. You are obviously a sincere and studied person. There are many highly intelligent people trapped in cults. However, I would check my own plate if I were you. It's full of lying defecation from a false organization,

“The light on the path gets brighter as the day dawns”…..or it should if you are not left behind in the dark….

2 Co 11:13-14 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.

Lk 11:35 Take heed therefore that the light which is in thee be not darkness.

I would leave the Jehovah Witnesses if I were you

 

[Aunty Jane]

How is pointing out error a "cheap shot"?

He is not pointing out errors, he is referring to refinements in understanding as time progresses. (Prov 4:18)
This is what God has always done with his people….he revealed things over time…..what Paul called “the sacred mystery” (my·steʹri·on) is a mystery no longer. This is something that originates with God, is withheld until his own time, and is revealed only to those to whom he chooses to make it known.

Any false prophet can use this same reasoning to justify their error.

Yes, they are a dime a dozen…..but would people really know one if they fell over them? Look at the thousands of sects all claiming to be “Christians”……does the Christ exist divided? Is his body somehow carved up among them all? Step back and see what God is seeing….

The devil is a counterfeiter….and he has deluged the world with false religion, (catering to every spiritual appetite) knowing that we are created to be spiritually minded, with an intense need to be fed spiritually……and to worship……so if satan provides “food” that tastes good, but is spiritual poison, then it is gulped down with no recognition that it is death dealing.
Those who will rejected by Christ at the judgment are completely shocked, and desperately offer their excuses to him, but to no avail because as he says to them…”I never knew you! Get away from me you workers of lawlessness”. (Matt 7:21-23)
“NEVER” means “not ever”.
So, who are these who call Jesus their “Lord” but who practice a religion that he never taught?

True...but they didn't claim an authorotative revelation from God about it before it was revealed. Big difference.

Our Governing Body has never claimed authoritative revelation from God….they are shepherds, not dictators. They are spirit anointed brothers in the faith, appointed to “take the lead” as God has always done with his people. If we accept them as such, we are told to obey them. (Heb 13:17)

No one has said you must obey them…..we do because we accept them as our leaders.

Do you have such shepherds in your denomination? Are you even a member of a denomination?
Who determines what you believe? You? Is that how Christianity was to operate?

The Bible must be our measuring rod…..it is what I have studied carefully like a Beroean for decades.
Every single teaching is something I have carefully compared with the Bible’s overall narrative and not once have I been shaken by a clarification or adjustment in our understanding. It follows the pattern revealed in the Bible among God’s people.
If I was ever to discover that they taught errors, then I would not have stayed with them for over 50 years.

This isn't a justification for claiming a divine revelation and then changing it whenever the whim suits you. Look, I am not trying to insult you. You are obviously a sincere and studied person. There are many highly intelligent people trapped in cults. However, I would check my own plate if I were you. It's full of lying defecation from a false organization,

I hope you understand that every denomination that follows a single human leader is a cult.
I have checked my plate very carefully…..but have you? It’s so easy to point fingers because of someone else’s say so….but how thoroughly have you checked out your own beliefs and their origins?

I was raised in Christendom, but in my early twenties I was so disturbed by the hypocrisy and blatant disobedience of my church that I got a divorce….
Thinking that it was my denomination that was at fault, I set out to examine other denominations, but to my horror, I found them all doing the same thing under different banners. I then went on a quest to find God…the one that the Bible spoke about, and to know his son as the Bible taught about him……but they were nowhere to be found in Christendom.
The god they promoted was a completely different entity.

As for their conduct….they were up to their necks in politics and sanctioning the bloodshed of political wars, putting clergy in the war zone to slave troubled consciences, when they were killing fellow “Christians”….as we still see happening to this day. Russia and Ukraine both profess to be “Christian” (both under Orthodox labels) and yet the US and her allies are right there supporting the bloodshed.…like good “Christians”….

Where are the “Christians” if Jesus taught us to “love our enemies” and to “pray” for them? (Matt 5:43-44)
What happened to being “no part of the world”? (John 17:16; 18:36)

You tell me….? You can’t claim to love God and his Christ if you disobey them.

2 Co 11:13-14 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.

Lk 11:35 Take heed therefore that the light which is in thee be not darkness.

What if that admonition is actually speaking to people like you…..and the ones who took Christianity off course, actually did so a very long time ago? So long ago that no one seems aware that a derailment even happened? What a clever devil to produce a counterfeit that step by step changed everything that Jesus taught and has people worshipping a god who does not exist? Jesus told us about “the wheat and the weeds”….did nobody notice? (Matt 13:24-30; 36-42)

Pointing a finger means that three are pointed back at you. Be careful that your own confidence is not misplaced….(1 Cor 10:12)

I would leave the Jehovah Witnesses if I were you

LOL…..Where on earth would I go? There is no one else out there who is even remotely close to teaching Bible truth…or following Jesus teachings to the letter.
My brotherhood ticks all the boxes for me….they are globally united in worship, they have discarded all the false teachings that have crept in over centuries of “church” history, and they refuse to take up weapons to harm their fellow man because they are not patriots first….they are Christians first. (Romans 12:17-21)

They are foremost preachers and teachers, as Jesus said we must be (Matt 24:14; 28:19-20)…..and our activities are well known in the whole world….you will find us doing what Christ commanded in every nation, not always visible in nations that ban our work.…but this is nothing new, as the early Christians also went underground when persecution threatened their work and worship. (John 15:18-21)

Show me who else ticks those boxes.

 

[Nancy]

Hi St.Steven!
Yes, I would still follow Jesus as only good things come from His hand and, we were created to praise and worship Him. It may seem selfish but, why would I choose evil over good?

 

[Berean]

More cheap shots…. seriously?…..perhaps you need to ask why you are not out in the work that Jesus assigned to all of his disciples, instead of wasting your time telling us what we ought to be doing….

I rest my case. Here you are again, arguing about the ministry. Let me ask you, Jane, what makes you think we don't witness? We're small, as we should be - think "Little Flock" with an emphasis on "little". But we're international.

Have we had clarifications about things over time? Yes, because things are always revealed incrementally in God’s word. Did Jesus’ apostles know that they were going to heaven when Jesus left to return to his Father? That was not revealed until Pentecost.

Were the Jews aware that the Kingdom was going to rule from heaven, or did they think it was an entirely earthly arrangement?
Did Jesus disciples know what it meant to be “born again”….no! Not until they received the holy spirit.

“The faithful and wise slave” was to feed his fellow slaves their “food at the proper time”, (Matt 24:45) which means that they were told what they needed to know, when they needed to know it.

How can your "faithful and wise slave" give you "food at the proper time" when they themselves don't know what it is? How many changes have they made in the last 10, 5, 2 years? Think about it, you believe the Lord returned in 1914, chose you guys as his earthly representatives, because he saw ... what ... prospect? Then He turns you completely upside. You say it all started with Russell, but then claim in 1919, he chose you, dismissing everything that was taught and believed from 1879-1919. Does that make sense? He's like "Those guys are doing a good work, I'm gonna choose them to represent me". Then He tells you, "hey, everything you believe, throw out the window, I'm gonna teach you in increments. And then for the next 100 years, he teaches you one thing, then changes His mind and teaches you another, going back and forth, back and forth. I'm sorry, that's not food at the proper time, that's complete CONFUSION. And YOU know it, having been with them for 50-plus years. YOu will NEVER know the Truth from these men, because they don't have it. They are modern-day pharisees.

I think your food is rather stale by now.

How would you know, if you've never feasted at that table.

“The light on the path gets brighter as the day dawns”…..or it should if you are not left behind in the dark….

That's actually a train, so get off the tracks

 

[Aunty Jane]

I rest my case. Here you are again, arguing about the ministry. Let me ask you, Jane, what makes you think we don't witness? We're small, as we should be - think "Little Flock" with an emphasis on "little". But we're international.

Who has ever heard of you? Why have I never encountered a member of your brotherhood in person?

How can your "faithful and wise slave" give you "food at the proper time" when they themselves don't know what it is? How many changes have they made in the last 10, 5, 2 years? Think about it, you believe the Lord returned in 1914, chose you guys as his earthly representatives, because he saw ... what ... prospect? Then He turns you completely upside. You say it all started with Russell, but then claim in 1919, he chose you, dismissing everything that was taught and believed from 1879-1919. Does that make sense? He's like "Those guys are doing a good work, I'm gonna choose them to represent me". Then He tells you, "hey, everything you believe, throw out the window, I'm gonna teach you in increments. And then for the next 100 years, he teaches you one thing, then changes His mind and teaches you another, going back and forth, back and forth. I'm sorry, that's not food at the proper time, that's complete CONFUSION. And YOU know it, having been with them for 50-plus years. YOu will NEVER know the Truth from these men, because they don't have it. They are modern-day pharisees.

In your opinion….that is all you have. But instead of doing as Jesus asked, you never miss an opportunity to tells us what we are doing wrong….what about you correct your own brotherhood?

How would you know, if you've never feasted at that table.

Are you serious?….what you hold as the complete meal, was just the appetizer….you‘ve missed the main course and the dessert will be enjoyed by those who didn’t stop eating.

That's actually a train, so get off the tracks

LOL…I guess we will all find out when the judge does his job…..or is it yours?