Run AWAY from Calvinism!

[Eternally Grateful]

i am not like sifted wheat, i hold fast to the Biblical doctrine of calvinism. I wont ever change on that. Why would I? I dont change denominations every other week like some do.

then by your own definition you are closed minded

You believe scripture supports calvinism. Thats your right.

Others do not. Thats their right, and it does not make them closed minded.

Once again, you should not accuse someone of being closed minded to your view. When you are closed minded to their view. It does not make you look good.

 

[reformed1689]

No, Calvin's teaching is not based on scripture and a little bit of leaven leavens the whole lump
J.

Which part is not based on Scripture?

 

[APAK]

Do you take the scriptures at face value or reading the commentaries and writings of others?
J.

I first pray even if it only a quick thought prayer, or a few words before I get serious and ask for wisdom and guidance to know especially awkward scripture. This is very important to me as the spirit of Christ within me is always willing to help me translate and gain scripture knowledge. Now it may take days and weeks and even years to get it all right. I have placed aside many scripture because their inquiries are not complete yet. In other words I need to be patient and relook at these area from time to time.

So I do follow good methods of hermeneutics, attempting to interpret and understand meanings in words (in Greek, Hebrew Aramaic and Old English and Latin), words in verse, verses in Chapters, all with their own context that all should harmonize. Context understanding is very important and usually overlooked by most people.

Yes, I view commentaries of other people from time to time, and I find myself writing commentaries of my own when I really believe I have a conquered an area of scripture that is note-worthy to me and even others. In fact I have a Bible companion Book I'm still working on today. It is over 600 pages long and counting. Full of mostly original commentaries. You cannot get away from using words or knowledge based on others when you agree with them, and especially when they might say it much better that you.

The problem with just taking scripture as face-value is that you tend to view the context as for the modern reader in today's world. Scripture was mainly given to audiences of that time frame or a few generations forward, not directly given to folks 2000 years later or more. And so when we do this face value interpretation all the time, we get it all wrong, and make it too simplistic and wrong!

There are places in scripture that are certainly correct and are taken at face-value only. Like Christ praying to his Father before his death on the Cross. You would think this is an easy area of scripture to understand, and yet can be the most controversial if one has an agenda to maintain and prove. This is my concern.....too many people deliberately or blindly twist or just plainly ignore scripture when it has a valuable input into the doctrine or subject under study...I cold go on...

Great Day Johann..

 

[reformed1689]

The problem with just taking scripture as face-value is that you tend to view the context as for the modern reader in today's world. Scripture was mainly given to audiences of that time frame or a few generations forward, not directly given to folks 2000 years later or more. And so when we do this face value interpretation all the time, we get it all wrong, and make it too simplistic and wrong!

Bingo

 

[Johann]

Great Day Johann..

Shalom to you and family
J.

 

[APAK]

Very, very wrong..to have an "open mind"...
J.

'Open mind' used here, by me, has a specific context Johann. It means to NOT have a bias or an agenda that maybe incorrect that will blur your vision and insight...i.e. no colored religious lens permitted. Keep then out, at the front door...

 

[reformed1689]

Jesus’ death was SUFFICIENT for every person, but it was EFFICIENT for the elect. Not everyone is saved, which proves the above statement to be true.

Not everyone is called either.

Exactly. Only those the Father grants can come to Christ. Jesus himself said that.

 

[Johann]

Not everyone is called either.

So if I understand you correct, you do not know whether you are called, elect or chosen?
See that is the problem I have with Calvinism and Lordship salvation, sowing just enough seeds of doubt to overthrow the faith of precious weak and immature Christians.

We are talking about eternal life or everlasting damnation and the Reformers and Calvin are not giving much assurance re these questions now do they?

When the Scriptures says the opposite, that we DO have the assurance NOW and have everlasting life NOW in Christ, sealed with the Holy Spirit.

Read the 3 little Johns and do look up the "knows" and the "assurance" that believers have right now as opposed to what the Reformers are saying.

We are to test the pneumati friend in the light of the Scriptures, not the other way round.

Blessings
J.

 

[Johann]

Exactly. Only those the Father grants can come to Christ. Jesus himself said that.

..now with the glorious resurrection of our Lord Jesus EVERYONE is drawn not just a select few.
J.

 

[Johann]

.i.e. no colored religious lens permitted. Keep then out, at the front door...

I understand what you are saying APAK, sometimes, when in dialogue there is a tendency to talk past each other and not to each other.
Blessings
J.

 

[reformed1689]

..now with the glorious resurrection of our Lord Jesus EVERYONE is drawn not just a select few.
J.

That's not what Scripture states.

 

[reformed1689]

So if I understand you correct, you do not know whether you are called, elect or chosen?
See that is the problem I have with Calvinism and Lordship salvation, sowing just enough seeds of doubt to overthrow the faith of precious weak and immature Christians.

We are talking about eternal life or everlasting damnation and the Reformers and Calvin are not giving much assurance re these questions now do they?

When the Scriptures says the opposite, that we DO have the assurance NOW and have everlasting life NOW in Christ, sealed with the Holy Spirit.

Read the 3 little Johns and do look up the "knows" and the "assurance" that believers have right now as opposed to what the Reformers are saying.

We are to test the pneumati friend in the light of the Scriptures, not the other way round.

Blessings
J.

What makes you think Calvinism sows seeds of doubt? We have assurance.

 

[Johann]

What makes you think Calvinism sows seeds of doubt? We have assurance.

What assurance do you have?

 

[reformed1689]

What assurance do you have?

The same assurance any other believer has, why do you think it is different?

 

[Johann]

The same assurance any other believer has, why do you think it is different?

@reformed1689

Are you assured of your present salvation?
Sealed with the Holy Spirit?
Is regeneration preceded by faith or is faith preceded by regeneration?
Does "all" means ALL in Scripture or is it reserved to only the elect. if only the elect how do you know you are part of the elect?
J.

 

[reformed1689]

@reformed1689

Are you assured of your present salvation?
Sealed with the Holy Spirit?
Is regeneration preceded by faith or is faith preceded by regeneration?
Does "all" means ALL in Scripture or is it reserved to only the elect. if only the elect how do you know you are part of the elect?
J.

1. Yes
2. Yes
3. Simultaneous in my view.
4. Which all are you referring to? You can't just say all. You need to tell me which verse so we can look at context.

 

[Johann]

That's not what Scripture states.

And what does the Scriptures say on this?

 

[Johann]

1. Yes
2. Yes
3. Simultaneous in my view.
4. Which all are you referring to? You can't just say all. You need to tell me which verse so we can look at context.

https://www.northlandchurch.com/content.cfm?id=316&download_id=2173

Please check and then we can discuss...

 

[Johann]

. Simultaneous in my view

...in your view?
It is either/or...

 

[reformed1689]

And what does the Scriptures say on this?

Only those granted by the Father can come to Christ. God chose before the foundation of the world those that would be in Christ.