Phoneman777 said:
ATP, there will be countless people on the Day of Judgment who "believed" they had eternal life and "believed" they were sealed by the Holy Spirit, but will be told to depart from Jesus.
But wouldn't that make God a liar. Scripture also mentions that we are sealed until the Day of Judgment. It's not our will that we not lose salvation, it's God's. Salvation is a gift, so how can we lose something we never earned in the first place.
1 Peter 1:3-5 NIV Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! In his great mercy he has given us new birth into a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4
and into an inheritance that can never perish, spoil or fade. This inheritance is kept in heaven for you, 5who through faith are
shielded by God’s power until the coming of the salvation
that is ready to be revealed in the last time.
John 6:39 NIV
And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all those he has given me,
but raise them up at the last day.
Phoneman777 said:
Bro, faith without works is DEAD.
The idiocy of OSAS is that it offers an entrance to heaven - which we all agree is obtained by living faith - to those who have DEAD faith.
I agree, but it's simply stating a fact Phoneman. Where do you see believers losing salvation here? God says our works are to trust, believe and have faith in
Him...
John 6:28-29 NIV Then they asked him, "What must we do to do the works God requires?" 29 Jesus answered, "
The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent."
Rom 4:2-6 NIV If, in fact, Abraham was justified by works, he had something to boast about--but not before God. 3 What does the Scripture say? "Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness." 4 Now when a man works, his wages are not credited to him as a gift, but as an obligation. 5
However, to the man who does not work but trusts God who justifies the wicked, his faith is credited as righteousness. 6 David says the same thing when he speaks of the blessedness of the man to whom God credits righteousness apart from works:
Rom 9:30-33 NIV What then shall we say? That the Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have obtained it, a righteousness that is by faith; 31 but Israel, who pursued a law of righteousness, has not attained it. 32 Why not?
Because they pursued it not by faith but as if it were by works. They stumbled over the "stumbling stone." 33 As it is written: "See, I lay in Zion a stone that causes men to stumble and a rock that makes them fall, and the one who trusts in him will never be put to shame."
Rom 11:5-7 NIV So too, at the present time there is a remnant chosen by grace. 6
And if by grace, then it is no longer by works; if it were, grace would no longer be grace. 7 What then? What Israel sought so earnestly it did not obtain, but the elect did. The others were hardened,
1 Cor 3:13-15 NIV his work will be shown for what it is, because the Day will bring it to light. It will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test the quality of each man's work. 14 If what he has built survives, he will receive his reward. 15 If it is burned up, he will suffer loss;
he himself will be saved, but only as one escaping through the flames.
1 Cor 15:10 NIV But by the grace of God I am what I am, and his grace to me was not without effect.
No, I worked harder than all of them--yet not I, but the grace of God that was with me.
Eph 2:8-9 NIV For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9
not by works, so that no one can boast.
2 Tim 1:9 NIV He has saved us and called us to a holy life--
not because of anything we have done but because of his own purpose and grace. This grace was given us in Christ Jesus before the beginning of time,
Titus 3:5 NIV he saved us,
not because of righteous things we had done, but because of his mercy. He saved us through the washing of rebirth and renewal by the Holy Spirit,
Phoneman777 said:
Sure, and quenching a fire means you won't freeze to death either.
Looks like we're still saved........
1 Cor 3:13-15 NIV his work will be shown for what it is, because the Day will bring it to light. It will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test the quality of each man's work. 14 If what he has built survives, he will receive his reward. 15 If it is burned up, he will suffer loss;
he himself will be saved, but only as one escaping through the flames.
Phoneman777 said:
So, the devils believe everything the Bible says about Jesus, but because they don't "declare it by mouth" they will be destroyed? Wow, how stupid those devils must be. No, friend, the devils believe alright, but they won't ACT according to what they know to be true and that is why they will be lost. It will be the same for OSAS Christians who claim their dead faith can provide to themselves only what true living faith can.
Rom 10:9 is Christianity 101 brother. 1 Cor 3:1-2 NIV Brothers and sisters, I could not address you as people who live by the Spirit but as people who are still worldly—mere infants in Christ. 2I gave you milk, not solid food, for you were not yet ready for it. Indeed, you are still not ready.
Not only are we saved by believing Rom 10:9 NIV, but we are also sealed until the day of redemption Eph 1:13-14 NIV and also granted eternal life John 3:14-15 NIV, John 3:16 NIV, John 5:24 NIV, John 6:40 NIV, John 6:47 NIV, Acts 13:46-48 NIV, 1 John 5:13-14 NIV. Either you believe the Word of God or you don't, and I see that you do not. Are you covered in the blood of Jesus Phoneman?
Phoneman777 said:
I'm afraid you're wrong, bro. What about all the past sins we've committed before our conversion? Who's going to take the penalty for them, that we may inherit eternal life? Yes, our Savior Jesus would still have to do bear them on the Cross as well, else we would be eternally condemned by them.
Jesus Christ died for all sins past, present and future for every human being that has ever walked the earth and for every human being that will ever walk the earth. Jesus died for the sins since Adam and Eve all the way through to the last man standing in the Great Tribulation. He bore the pain and suffering of everyone and every sin ever committed.
Acts 13:38-39 NIV "Therefore, my brothers, I want you to know that through Jesus the forgiveness of sins is proclaimed to you. 39
Through him everyone who believes is justified from everything you could not be justified from by the law of Moses.
Rom 4:7-8 NIV “Blessed are those whose transgressions are forgiven,
whose sins are covered. 8Blessed is the one whose sin the Lord will
never count against them.”
Rom 6:10 NIV The death he died,
he died to sin once for all; but the life he lives, he lives to God.
Col 2:13-15 NIV When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made you alive with Christ.
He forgave us ALL our sins, 14having canceled the charge of our legal indebtedness, which stood against us and condemned us; he has taken it away, nailing it to the cross. 15And having disarmed the powers and authorities, he made a public spectacle of them,
triumphing over them by the cross.
Heb 7:27 NIV Unlike the other high priests, he does not need to offer sacrifices day after day, first for his own sins, and then for the sins of the people.
He sacrificed for their sins once for all when he offered himself.
Heb 10:12 NIV But when this priest had offered
for all time one sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God,
1 John 2:2 NIV He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours
but also for the sins of the whole world.
Rev 1:4-5 NIV John, To the seven churches in the province of Asia: Grace and peace to you from him who is, and who was, and who is to come, and from the seven spirits before his throne, 5and from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth. To him who loves us and
has freed us from our sins by his blood,
