Salvation is by Grace through Faith.

[Ernest T. Bass]

God does not work against one's will, He does not strive with the flesh.
God makes people born again, and their will is changed as their very nature is changed.
The old enmity is gone then and everything is become new in the relationship.
Unless your born again you will never 'see' the kingdom of God, as in perceive, comprehend, or want anything to do with it, and Christ, so you will never believe unless born again first.

Now in the Old Covenant times, like with Israel, God strove with their flesh and it was a failure, it had faults. They continually rebelled, so this NC works different in the God makes people born again. You, Bass, are like living and teaching and believing from the OC perspective, do this, do that, dont do that, must teach people to know God, trying to force compliance with the ways of God. God simply dispenses with all of that in the NC, for by grace (not faith by itself, that grace comes first and that grace God manifests in you by making you born again first as an act of God) you have been saved.

example of OC problems

Romans 10:20-21 New King James Version, v20 is how the NC works.
20 But Isaiah is very bold and says:

“I was found by those who did not seek Me;
I was made manifest to those who did not ask for Me.”

21 But to Israel he says: is how the OC works

“All day long I have stretched out My hands
To a disobedient and contrary people.”

Hebrews 8, lots of people talk about the sin and sacrifice change in the NC, but they miss the part how God writes His laws on their hearts, and PUTS His laws into their minds, which is how it works so much better. He can only do that by making people born again FIRST, so they can believe at all. So yeah the NC is invasive against the natural antagonistic will of a man in that it does that removing the enmity man has against Christ.

A New Covenant
7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then no place would have been sought for a second. 8 Because finding fault with them, He says: “Behold, the days are coming, says the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah— 9 not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they did not continue in My covenant, and I disregarded them, says the Lord. 10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. 11 None of them shall teach his neighbor, and none his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ for all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them. 12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more.”

13 In that He says, “A new covenant,” He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.

God does not force the new birth upon men against their will. Men choose to be born again, hence those not born again is due to their own culpability and not God's culpability. It requires DOING on the part of man to see the kingdom of God, Matthew 7:21. Those that are obedient to God's word are the one's sanctified by the word John 17:17. Sanctification and entering the kingdom do not occur separate and apart from the word and obedience to that word. Those that do not obey will not be sanctified and not enter the kingdom.

Hebrews 8:11 "And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest."

Under the old covenant, a Jew was physically born into that covenant then he would go about learning about God. But under the NT covenant one would first be taught BEFORE he could be born again/enter the kingdom. One must hear and believe, have the NT law in the heart before becoming a child of God under the NT John 1:12-13. This is a major distinction between the OT and NT...the OT was written in stone, NT written on the mind/heart. 2 Corinthians 2:2-3. With the new law taught them it is now written in their hearts they were then to work out their own salvation according to that new law taught them that was now in their mind/heart. This new covenant does instruct men on what to do and not do, the NT commandments are on the heart not upon stone. The law in stone controlled the physical, external acts but this new law would control the heart...

Law in stone: Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:
Law in heart: whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

So the new law does not dispense law and is grace only. Romans 8 Paul refutes grace only. Because the Christian is saved by grace does not give the Christian license to sin for Christians are dead to sin. And the only way to be dead to sin is "obedience unto righteousness" Romans 6:16 for without this obedience to NT law one would be serving "sin unto death". Therefore grace and obedience are not antagonistic..obedience is necessary to keep from serving sin unto death and grace is necessary for one's obedience will not be perfect hence grace closes the gap between God and man that imperfect obedience can create. Since non-perfect obedience requires grace, man cannot boast about his obedience. No walking in the light (no obedience), no cleansing away of sin, 1 John 1:7...grace teaches one to be obedient, Titus 2:11-12 so disobedience is rejection of grace. Grace is accessed by an obedient faith, Romans 5:2.

 

[Scott Downey]

God does not force the new birth upon men against their will. Men choose to be born again, hence those not born again is due to their own culpability and not God's culpability. It requires DOING on the part of man to see the kingdom of God, Matthew 7:21. Those that are obedient to God's word are the one's sanctified by the word John 17:17. Sanctification and entering the kingdom do not occur separate and apart from the word and obedience to that word. Those that do not obey will not be sanctified and not enter the kingdom.

Hebrews 8:11 "And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest."

Under the old covenant, a Jew was physically born into that covenant then he would go about learning about God. But under the NT covenant one would first be taught BEFORE he could be born again/enter the kingdom. One must hear and believe, have the NT law in the heart before becoming a child of God under the NT John 1:12-13. This is a major distinction between the OT and NT...the OT was written in stone, NT written on the mind/heart. 2 Corinthians 2:2-3. With the new law taught them it is now written in their hearts they were then to work out their own salvation according to that new law taught them that was now in their mind/heart. This new covenant does instruct men on what to do and not do, the NT commandments are on the heart not upon stone. The law in stone controlled the physical, external acts but this new law would control the heart...

Law in stone: Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:
Law in heart: whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

So the new law does not dispense law and is grace only. Romans 8 Paul refutes grace only. Because the Christian is saved by grace does not give the Christian license to sin for Christians are dead to sin. And the only way to be dead to sin is "obedience unto righteousness" Romans 6:16 for without this obedience to NT law one would be serving "sin unto death". Therefore grace and obedience are not antagonistic..obedience is necessary to keep from serving sin unto death and grace is necessary for one's obedience will not be perfect hence grace closes the gap between God and man that imperfect obedience can create. Since non-perfect obedience requires grace, man cannot boast about his obedience. No walking in the light (no obedience), no cleansing away of sin, 1 John 1:7...grace teaches one to be obedient, Titus 2:11-12 so disobedience is rejection of grace. Grace is accessed by an obedient faith, Romans 5:2.

you said this
"Men choose to be born again, hence those not born again is due to their own culpability and not God's culpability."

There is no scripture that teaches a man chooses to be born again.
On the contrary, there are scriptures that proves getting born again is under the choice of the Holy Spirit.
John 3, proves this by Jesus teaching the Holy Spirit moves like the wind, invisibly BLOWING WHERE HE WISHES, and making people born again.

3 Jesus answered and said to him, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”

4 Nicodemus said to Him, “How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother’s womb and be born?”

5 Jesus answered, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 7 Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’ 8 The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit.”

9 Nicodemus answered and said to Him, “How can these things be?”

10 Jesus answered and said to him, “Are you the teacher of Israel, and do not know these things? 11 Most assuredly, I say to you, We speak what We know and testify what We have seen, and you do not receive Our witness. 12 If I have told you earthly things and you do not believe, how will you believe if I tell you heavenly things?

See here in v12, this is a heavenly thing, God's choice over who is born again.
Not an earthly thing, as if a man's will was the decision maker.

And this is not the only scriptural proof, there is also John 1

13 who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

You are quite mistaken.

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

you said this
"Men choose to be born again, hence those not born again is due to their own culpability and not God's culpability."

There is no scripture that teaches a man chooses to be born again.
On the contrary, there are scriptures that proves getting born again is under the choice of the Holy Spirit.
John 3, proves this by Jesus teaching the Holy Spirit moves like the wind, invisibly BLOWING WHERE HE WISHES, and making people born again.

3 Jesus answered and said to him, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”

4 Nicodemus said to Him, “How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother’s womb and be born?”

5 Jesus answered, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 7 Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’ 8 The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit.”

9 Nicodemus answered and said to Him, “How can these things be?”

10 Jesus answered and said to him, “Are you the teacher of Israel, and do not know these things? 11 Most assuredly, I say to you, We speak what We know and testify what We have seen, and you do not receive Our witness. 12 If I have told you earthly things and you do not believe, how will you believe if I tell you heavenly things?

When one is water baptized one is born again and men do choose to obey the command to be water baptized or not. So those who are not water baptized/not born again is of their own culpability. If God alone determines which individuals will or will not be born again, then God is culpable for those not born again and God is respecter of persons when He is neither. How can Nicodemus be condemned for not being born again if being born again is out of his control completely. Why would Jesus tell Nicodemus 'you MUST be born again' if being born again was out of control of Nicodemus?

John 3:8 when one is born again/water baptized, we can see a person being water baptized but we do not see the spiritual aspect of what is taking place like we cannot see the wind. When one is water baptized, God does the work of cutting away the body of sin, a spiritual circumcision made without hands, man cannot see this taking place. As one cannot see the wind but one can see the effects of the wind. Likewise one cannot see the spiritual aspect of what God does when one is water baptized. Nicodemus understood the fleshly, physical aspects of the OT law and could not see the spiritual aspect of the NT's new birth. Jesus was showing it was the spiritual part of man which is not seen that is born again and not the physical part of man that is seen that is to be born again....a purification of the soul takes place when one is born again (1 Peter 1:22-23) which is not seen and not a purification of the flesh as took place in the OT that can be seen.

As Calvinist Albert Barnes puts it, we cannot see the wind but we can see the effects of, that is, we cannot see the spiritual aspects of the new birth but can see the effects of it when men who were "sinful become holy; the thoughtless become serious; the licentious become pure; the vicious, moral; the moral, religious; the prayerless, prayerful; the rebellious and obstinate, meek, and mild, and gentle."
"Everyone that is born of the Spirit is, in some respects, like the effects of the wind. You see it not, you cannot discern its laws, but you see its effects,” and you know therefore that it does exist and operate. Nicodemus’ objection was, that he could not “see” this change, or perceive “how” it could be. Jesus tells him that he should not reject a doctrine merely because he could not understand it. Neither could the “wind” be seen, but its effects were well known, and no one doubted the existence or the power of the agent."

 

[brightfame52]

The Bible does not teach salvation by grace alone apart from obedience.

Where does the Bible define obedience to God's will a work of merit done to earn God's free gift????

Yes it does teach that Salvation is by Grace alone, apart from works, for it cant be from both. Rom 11:5-6

5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

Yes it does teach that Salvation is by Grace alone, apart from works, for it cant be from both. Rom 11:5-6

5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

Paul refutes grace alone in Rom 6. Even though Christians are saved by grace, God forbid that gives the Christian license to sin for Chrisitans are "dead to sin". Sin is transgression of God's law 1 John 3:4 and the only solution to not sinning is obeying God's law. Not obeying makes one lost serving "sin unto death" (Romans 6:16). Therefore the Christian must serve "obedience unto righteousness" to be dead to sin, to not be serving sin unto death.

Hence salvation is by obedience and grace, obedience keeps one dead to sin from serving sin unto death and grace is need for man's obedience will not be perfect so grace bridges the gap between God and man that sinning creates.

If grace alone saves then all men universally would unconditionally be saved titus 2:11

Works in Rom 11:6 refer to perfect flawless works required by the OT law one would do to merit salvation, not obedience to God's will as those who obeyed in not bowing to Baal.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

If grace alone saves then all men universally would unconditionally be saved



The Grace Of God is out there and available for everybody......most people fail to “ cash in” on it with Faith in Jesus Plus Nothing.....

It was said of Lydia in Acts that God “ opened her heart” to not only hear , but to actually BELIEVE the Gospel.....why would it be different for anybody else? The Initiative to Save belongs to God—- “NOBODY comes to God lest the Spirit draw them......” Pray that God will give you “ ears to hear” .....

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

If grace alone saves then all men universally would unconditionally be saved



The Grace Of God is out there and available for everybody......most people fail to “ cash in” on it with Faith in Jesus Plus Nothing.....

It was said of Lydia in Acts that God “ opened her heart” to not only hear , but to actually BELIEVE the Gospel.....why would it be different for anybody else? The Initiative to Save belongs to God—- “NOBODY comes to God lest the Spirit draw them......” Pray that God will give you “ ears to hear” .....

So you yourself admit that receiving grace is CONDITIONAL upon man having faith. Yet man having faith does not earn the grace.

Since Jesus saves those who obey Him (Hebrews 5:9) then faith includes obedience and faithful obedience is meeting the condition and earns nothing no more than Noah obedient work in build the ark earned his salvation from the flood or Naaman's obedient work earned his healing.

God opens men's hearts, NOT in any miraculous way apart from the word.

"And on the sabbath we went out of the city by a river side, where prayer was wont to be made; and we sat down, and spake unto the women which resorted thither. And a certain woman named Lydia, a seller of purple, of the city of Thyatira, which worshipped God, heard us: whose heart the Lord opened, that she attended unto the things which were spoken of Paul. And when she was baptized, and her household, she besought us, saying, If ye have judged me to be faithful to the Lord, come into my house, and abide there. And she constrained us."

--the purpose of "The Macedonian Call" was for "us for to preach the gospel unto them". (Acts of the Apostles 16:10). No need to even send Paul and others there "to preach" if the HS is going to miraculously open the hearts, enlighten the understanding of people APART from the word, APART from the word being preached.

--the order of events with Lydia was Paul "spake unto the women" and they "heard us" THEN it says the Lord opened her heart. Lydia's heart was opened by the word of God being spoken to her. Lydia attended to those things spoken to her by Paul and she was baptized. Obviously baptism was of those words spoken to her. Peter said of the Gentiles in Acts 11:14 they would be saved by "words". Acts 8 why would the Spirit send Phillip to preach to the eunuch? Why didn't the Spirit just miraculously illuminate the eunuch's understanding and then "Spirit baptize" the eunuch? Phillip preached Jesus, the eunuch heard and obeyed as seen in his being baptized as happened with Lydia. It is God's plan that men be saved by "preaching" (1 Corinthians 1:21) not by some miraculous, unconditional, random acts of the HS apart from the word being preached and heard.

--note also Lydia was NOT "totally depraved" and had to first be "regenerated" before she could understand....Lydia "worshipped God", she was willing to listen to Paul and understand what Paul preached and able to attend unto the things Paul preached...no total depravity here. Just as the lost Jews in Acts 2 were willing, able to hear and understand, be pricked in the heart and obey what was commanded them all while lost, spiritually dead.

 

[Faither]

So you yourself admit that receiving grace is CONDITIONAL upon man having faith. Yet man having faith does not earn the grace.

Since Jesus saves those who obey Him (Hebrews 5:9) then faith includes obedience and faithful obedience is meeting the condition and earns nothing no more than Noah obedient work in build the ark earned his salvation from the flood or Naaman's obedient work earned his healing.

God opens men's hearts, NOT in any miraculous way apart from the word.

"And on the sabbath we went out of the city by a river side, where prayer was wont to be made; and we sat down, and spake unto the women which resorted thither. And a certain woman named Lydia, a seller of purple, of the city of Thyatira, which worshipped God, heard us: whose heart the Lord opened, that she attended unto the things which were spoken of Paul. And when she was baptized, and her household, she besought us, saying, If ye have judged me to be faithful to the Lord, come into my house, and abide there. And she constrained us."

--the purpose of "The Macedonian Call" was for "us for to preach the gospel unto them". (Acts of the Apostles 16:10). No need to even send Paul and others there "to preach" if the HS is going to miraculously open the hearts, enlighten the understanding of people APART from the word, APART from the word being preached.

--the order of events with Lydia was Paul "spake unto the women" and they "heard us" THEN it says the Lord opened her heart. Lydia's heart was opened by the word of God being spoken to her. Lydia attended to those things spoken to her by Paul and she was baptized. Obviously baptism was of those words spoken to her. Peter said of the Gentiles in Acts 11:14 they would be saved by "words". Acts 8 why would the Spirit send Phillip to preach to the eunuch? Why didn't the Spirit just miraculously illuminate the eunuch's understanding and then "Spirit baptize" the eunuch? Phillip preached Jesus, the eunuch heard and obeyed as seen in his being baptized as happened with Lydia. It is God's plan that men be saved by "preaching" (1 Corinthians 1:21) not by some miraculous, unconditional, random acts of the HS apart from the word being preached and heard.

--note also Lydia was NOT "totally depraved" and had to first be "regenerated" before she could understand....Lydia "worshipped God", she was willing to listen to Paul and understand what Paul preached and able to attend unto the things Paul preached...no total depravity here. Just as the lost Jews in Acts 2 were willing, able to hear and understand, be pricked in the heart and obey what was commanded them all while lost, spiritually dead.

Can you describe the obedient acts that meet the condition to recieve the Spirit of Christ?

 

[brightfame52]

Paul refutes grace alone in Rom 6. Even though Christians are saved by grace, God forbid that gives the Christian license to sin for Chrisitans are "dead to sin". Sin is transgression of God's law 1 John 3:4 and the only solution to not sinning is obeying God's law. Not obeying makes one lost serving "sin unto death" (Romans 6:16). Therefore the Christian must serve "obedience unto righteousness" to be dead to sin, to not be serving sin unto death.

Hence salvation is by obedience and grace, obedience keeps one dead to sin from serving sin unto death and grace is need for man's obedience will not be perfect so grace bridges the gap between God and man that sinning creates.

If grace alone saves then all men universally would unconditionally be saved titus 2:11

Works in Rom 11:6 refer to perfect flawless works required by the OT law one would do to merit salvation, not obedience to God's will as those who obeyed in not bowing to Baal.

Rom 11:5-6

5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

 

[Curtis]

The grace always comes before the faith, God's gift of faith is according to His grace for by grace are you saved through faith.

You have that backwards, as all Calvinists are forced to do.

Faith comes first, it’s how we access grace. By grace are we saved THROUGH faith.

Through, via, by way of.

By grace we are saved via faith, by way of faith.

Rom 5:2 By whom also we have access BY faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.

You get in your house THROUGH the door.

You get into grace THROUGH faith.

Note the sequence in scripture, such as Acts 16:38, the jailer asked how to be saved - the answer is 1. Believe (have faith) in Jesus and 2. be saved.

Faith, then salvation. Faith, then grace.

Calvinism is forced to put the cart before the horse, and claim faith is the response to grace.

 

[brightfame52]

curtis

You get into grace THROUGH faith.

One believes because of grace ! Acts 18:27

27 And when he was disposed to pass into Achaia, the brethren wrote, exhorting the disciples to receive him: who, when he was come, helped them much which had believed through/on account of grace:

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

Rom 11:5-6

5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

"no more of works"...the works here is not referring to obedience to God's will for those who obey God have always been God's people, as those who obeyed by not bowing to Baal....

"But what saith the answer of God unto him? I have reserved to myself seven thousand men, who have not bowed the knee to the image of Baal.
Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace."

"even so" means "likewise"...Paul is comparing those under the OT who obeyed God by not bowing to Baal to those under the NT gospel ("at this present time") who obeyed the gospel ("election of grace"). There was just a "remnant" of Jews who obeyed the gospel, 3000 in Acts 2 at Pentecost repented and were baptized. Those obedient were of God's election of grace.

"And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work."

Paul is NOT contrasting obedience and grace for the Bible NEVER defines obedience to God's will as a work of merit. No one's obedience is going to be perfectly sinless whereby they would merit grace. Christians sin therefore in need of grace. What Paul IS contrasting is grace from earning, meriting. The Jew did not earn/merit grace simply because of their physical descendancy from Abraham (see Matthew 3:9).

No amount of works one can do to MERIT forgiveness for forgiveness is a matter of grace and reception of grace is conditional upon OBEDIENCE to God's will. Paul in Romans already made obedience in repentance (Romans 2:45-5) confession (Romans 10:10) and baptism (Romans 6:3-5) necessary in order to be saved. Therefore works of merit and obedience to God's commands are NOT the same thing. Hence "God hath not cast away his people"...who is God's people? The "remnant" Jews that did obey by believing, repenting, confessing and being baptized while the unbelieving, disobedient were cast off (Romans 11:20)

"For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God." Romans 10:3

Two different types of works in this one verse, one work that does not save and work that does save:
1) established their own righteousness (does not save)
2) obeying the righteousness of God (does save)

Those disobedient, unbelieving Jews who were cast off (Romans 11:20) were lost because instead of obeying God which does save they went about establishing their own righteousness. They tried to merit grace by following their own traditions by moral performance, they relied "upon their own religious ceremonies and commandments which they had substituted for God's true commands. Such works of the Israelites were the "works of human righteousness." Coffman

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

Can you describe the obedient acts that meet the condition to recieve the Spirit of Christ?

In order to receive the free gift of salvation requires obedience in believing (John 8:24) repent (Luke 13:3) confess (Matthew 10:32-33) and be baptized (Mark 16:16) live faithful unto death (Revelation 2:10)

 

[ScottA]

What specifically does the "through Faith" portion mean in todays church?

Faith is the God given ability to believe in the existence and promises of an unseen God, to know Him and to hear Him without sight.


PS, Owed to Paul: "Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen." Hebrews 11:1

 

[brightfame52]

"no more of works"...the works here is not referring to obedience to God's will for those who obey God have always been God's people, as those who obeyed by not bowing to Baal....

"But what saith the answer of God unto him? I have reserved to myself seven thousand men, who have not bowed the knee to the image of Baal.
Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace."

"even so" means "likewise"...Paul is comparing those under the OT who obeyed God by not bowing to Baal to those under the NT gospel ("at this present time") who obeyed the gospel ("election of grace"). There was just a "remnant" of Jews who obeyed the gospel, 3000 in Acts 2 at Pentecost repented and were baptized. Those obedient were of God's election of grace.

"And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work."

Paul is NOT contrasting obedience and grace for the Bible NEVER defines obedience to God's will as a work of merit. No one's obedience is going to be perfectly sinless whereby they would merit grace. Christians sin therefore in need of grace. What Paul IS contrasting is grace from earning, meriting. The Jew did not earn/merit grace simply because of their physical descendancy from Abraham (see Matthew 3:9).

No amount of works one can do to MERIT forgiveness for forgiveness is a matter of grace and reception of grace is conditional upon OBEDIENCE to God's will. Paul in Romans already made obedience in repentance (Romans 2:45-5) confession (Romans 10:10) and baptism (Romans 6:3-5) necessary in order to be saved. Therefore works of merit and obedience to God's commands are NOT the same thing. Hence "God hath not cast away his people"...who is God's people? The "remnant" Jews that did obey by believing, repenting, confessing and being baptized while the unbelieving, disobedient were cast off (Romans 11:20)

"For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God." Romans 10:3

Two different types of works in this one verse, one work that does not save and work that does save:
1) established their own righteousness (does not save)
2) obeying the righteousness of God (does save)

Those disobedient, unbelieving Jews who were cast off (Romans 11:20) were lost because instead of obeying God which does save they went about establishing their own righteousness. They tried to merit grace by following their own traditions by moral performance, they relied "upon their own religious ceremonies and commandments which they had substituted for God's true commands. Such works of the Israelites were the "works of human righteousness." Coffman

Rom 11:5-6

5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

Faith is the God given ability to believe in the existence and promises of an unseen God, to know Him and to hear Him without sight.


PS, Owed to Paul: "Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen." Hebrews 11:1

That might be the most clear definition of Faith that I have ever heard....thanks for sharing it

 

[GRACE ambassador]

The meaning of faith does not change from year to year, or from millennium to millennium. And "church" has nothing to do with it either. Each person must exercise faith in Christ and His finished work of redemption. Salvation (justification) is BY GRACE through faith. What this means is that when one believes God and believes on the Lord Jesus Christ, God justifies that person, and imputes the righteousness of Christ to him or her. This is solely by the grace of God, apart from any works, or deeds, or merit. And God can be just, and the justifier of the ungodly, since Christ paid the full penalty for the sins of the whole world, and there is also remission of sins through His blood.

Amen! "GRACE Through faith" in CHRIST, His ALL-Sufficient BLOOD, and
Resurrection, According To The Scriptures! Amen?

Also Eliminates the following type of Misreading/Misinterpreting Of Scriptures!:

You will reply, " i believed in everything you did, said, and promised." He will say, but i don't know you, you never started the relationship with me by a continually surrendered life

Precious friend, we should Always read/study Scripture prayerfully and Carefully:

"Not every one that saith unto Me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven;
but he that doeth the will of My Father Which is in heaven. Many will say to Me in that
day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Thy Name? and in Thy Name have cast out
devils? and in Thy Name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I NEVER Knew you: depart from Me, ye that work iniquity."
(Mat_7:21-23)

Obedience of commandments (SELF-salvation), Without "faith," Correct?

And, In Accordance With 2 Corinthians 2:13, we can Compare the opposite
Plain And Clear Scriptures of this for Clarification of our further understanding of:

"GRACE Through faith" Where "God’s SURE Foundation Has THIS SEAL”:

“The LORD Knoweth them that Are HIS!..." (2 Timothy 2:19 KJB!),
Correct?
+
How Long Has The LORD Known them "That Are His Own"?
(Ephesians 1:4-6)? ALWAYS, Correct?

Thus, this idea is not found in Scripture:

Jesus said: "but i don't know you, you never started the relationship with me by a continually surrendered life"

How about God's Sound Doctrines Concerning "HIS Relationship With us"
vs "our fellowship With HIM!"? Found here: God's Simple Will!

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

Rom 11:5-6

5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

As I showed earlier the "no more of works" here does not include obedience to God's will for the obedience of men in the Bible did not earn God's free gift. Obedience and works of merit are two completely different things.

Works by which a man merits justification, and commands which one must obey to be saved, are distinct matters. It is unfortunate that many religionists cannot, or will not, see this distinction, which should be plainly seen by any Bible reader. Because they fail to make this distinction they conclude that a sinner must do nothing in order to be saved. A man has no real understanding of either works or grace when he thinks conditions of forgiveness make salvation a matter of works and not of grace. Nothing that a sinner can do merits salvation. Many things are of grace, and yet conditional. Is anyone so simple as to think Naaman's healing of leprosy was any less a matter of grace because he had to dip seven times in the river Jordan? Is any so blind that he cannot see that giving sight to the blind man was a matter of grace, even though he had to go wash in the pool of Siloam? If so, he needs his eyes opened as badly as did the blind man." Whiteside

 

[brightfame52]

As I showed earlier the "no more of works" here does not include obedience to God's will for the obedience of men in the Bible did not earn God's free gift. Obedience and works of merit are two completely different things.

Works by which a man merits justification, and commands which one must obey to be saved, are distinct matters. It is unfortunate that many religionists cannot, or will not, see this distinction, which should be plainly seen by any Bible reader. Because they fail to make this distinction they conclude that a sinner must do nothing in order to be saved. A man has no real understanding of either works or grace when he thinks conditions of forgiveness make salvation a matter of works and not of grace. Nothing that a sinner can do merits salvation. Many things are of grace, and yet conditional. Is anyone so simple as to think Naaman's healing of leprosy was any less a matter of grace because he had to dip seven times in the river Jordan? Is any so blind that he cannot see that giving sight to the blind man was a matter of grace, even though he had to go wash in the pool of Siloam? If so, he needs his eyes opened as badly as did the blind man." Whiteside

Salvation is by grace not of works.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

Salvation is by grace not of works.

Those to whom Grace has never been bestowed are forever unable to understand it.......