Saved, which means what?

[Eternally Grateful]

Don't mix physical life with the Life that Jesus brought. Men had physical life before Jesus came. What He brought was the Life which had been missing since Adam and Eve disobeyed God. To God everyone of us was dead until and if we received the Life brought by Jesus.

True

but physical life is meaningless if we are still dead spiritually

the physically alive will die

only the spiritually alive who have been SAVED will see life eternal.

 

[amadeus]

@Christophany
In making your comparison between the growth of a physical baby and the growth in someone who is born from above [born again or born of God], you omitted something vital... proper nourishment. Jesus tells us what to eat and drink here:

"Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.
Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.
He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him.
As the living Father hath sent me, and I live by the Father: so he that eateth me, even he shall live by me.
This is that bread which came down from heaven: not as your fathers did eat manna, and are dead: he that eateth of this bread shall live for ever." John 6:53-58

What happens if a baby does not eat and drink? What happens if a baby eats and drinks the wrong things? What is the flesh and blood that we are to consume in order to have Life?

 

[amadeus]

If I may


Colossians 2:13
And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses,

Eph 2:1 And you He made alive, who were dead in trespasses and sins,

Ephesians 2:5 even when we were dead in trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved),

So then he who has received this Life must do what in order to avoid the error and punishment of Adam and Eve?

 

[ChristisGod]

@Christophany
In making your comparison between the growth of a physical baby and the growth in someone who is born from above [born again or born of God], you omitted something vital... proper nourishment. Jesus tells us what to eat and drink here:

"Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.
Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.
He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him.
As the living Father hath sent me, and I live by the Father: so he that eateth me, even he shall live by me.
This is that bread which came down from heaven: not as your fathers did eat manna, and are dead: he that eateth of this bread shall live for ever." John 6:53-58

What happens if a baby does not eat and drink? What happens if a baby eats and drinks the wrong things? What is the flesh and blood that we are to consume in order to have Life?

Those who are born from above seek the pure milk of the word as nourishment. No fruit, no life in the vine. Those who have life in the vine bear fruit.

hope this helps !!!

 

[amadeus]

Those who are born from above seek the pure milk of the word as nourishment. No fruit, no life in the vine. Those who have life in the vine bear fruit.

hope this helps !!!

Yes, and the time must come when the baby moves from milk to meat, crawling to walking and from babble to clear speech. If the baby remains a baby requiring the help of an adult all of his life, will he bear good fruit for God?

What happens to a born again person who fails to continuously partake of the flesh and blood of Jesus?

 

[ChristisGod]

Yes, and the time must come when the baby moves from milk to meat, crawling to walking and from babble to clear speech. If the baby remains a baby requiring the help of an adult all of his life, will he bear good fruit for God?

What happens to a born again person who fails to continuously partake of the flesh and blood of Jesus?

Paul has the answer below.

1 Cor 3:1-3
1 Brothers and sisters, I could not address you as people who live by the Spirit but as people who are still worldly—mere infants in Christ. 2 I gave you milk, not solid food, for you were not yet ready for it. Indeed, you are still not ready. 3 You are still worldly. For since there is jealousy and quarreling among you, are you not worldly? Are you not acting like mere humans?

 

[amadeus]

Paul has the answer below.

1 Cor 3:1-3
1 Brothers and sisters, I could not address you as people who live by the Spirit but as people who are still worldly—mere infants in Christ. 2 I gave you milk, not solid food, for you were not yet ready for it. Indeed, you are still not ready. 3 You are still worldly. For since there is jealousy and quarreling among you, are you not worldly? Are you not acting like mere humans?

That speaks of babies not ready for meat because it was too soon or they were simply unwilling to take another step forward toward Jesus. Their problems may overlap with what I was considering...

I was thinking more of babies who had the right ingredients at the start and they have been around long enough... but their growth has been stunted because they eat improperly or they don't eat at all of the flesh and blood of Jesus... Consider the brother or sister who has been sitting faithfully in the same pew in a church building each time the doors are open for a service, but these days never opens a Bible to read and never talks to the Lord outside of that building. Some of them in the beginning may have actually met Jesus and walked with Him as new born to toddler age until something happened to them... Perhaps they grew weary of well doing. Perhaps they listened to much to dead ministers instead to God. What do you think of them?

 

[GTW27]

"I thank thee, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that thou hast hidden these things from the wise and understanding, and revealed them to babes; yea father, for such was thy gracious will."

 

[ChristisGod]

That speaks of babies not ready for meat because it was too soon or they were simply unwilling to take another step forward toward Jesus. Their problems may overlap with what I was considering...

I was thinking more of babies who had the right ingredients at the start and they have been around long enough... but their growth has been stunted because they eat improperly or they don't eat at all of the flesh and blood of Jesus... Consider the brother or sister who has been sitting faithfully in the same pew in a church building each time the doors are open for a service, but these days never opens a Bible to read and never talks to the Lord outside of that building. Some of them in the beginning may have actually met Jesus and walked with Him as new born to toddler age until something happened to them... Perhaps they grew weary of well doing. Perhaps they listened to much to dead ministers instead to God. What do you think of them?

Personally I don't think such people are saved. Its natural when one is born again to seek God, pursue Him, learn from Him by reading, studying, praying on a daily basis.

I like to compare the physical to the spiritual in this case.

We sure never skip meals very often in out daily lives when it comes to breakfast, lunch and dinner. We nourish our physical bodies, exercise, diet and everything else under the sun.

Why is the Spiritual any different ?

Ever since I became a believer in 1980 I've always placed more importance on Gods word for nourishment than I do the physical. Don't get me wrong I'm very healthy for my age at 60.

 

[amadeus]

Personally I don't think such people are saved. Its natural when one is born again to seek God, pursue Him, learn from Him by reading, studying, praying on a daily basis.

We apparently differ in what we mean when we say 'saved'. I meant that they were no longer saved, whereas apparently you meant that they never were saved.

I agree that someone who is born again may have and should have the desire or incentive to read, study and pray... but very early in our walk with God if we are pressured by someone who to our mind is much wiser and closer to God than we are, we may be led astray. I have seen even very 'good' leaders do this, and many leaders do not seem to me to very 'good'.

Perhaps it help us understand why Paul was led to write these words:

"Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling." Phil 2:12

Even the most trustworthy of man sometimes cannot be trusted when it comes to our walk with God.

I like to compare the physical to the spiritual in this case.

I do the same thing, but the former is likely in most, if not all, case a type or shadow of the reality of the latter. This means that some of the finer details will not be readily visible.

We sure never skip meals very often in out daily lives when it comes to breakfast, lunch and dinner. We nourish our physical bodies, exercise, diet and everything else under the sun.

Why is the Spiritual any different ?

I strive to make it not so and also ask God to help me make it not so.

Ever since I became a believer in 1980 I've always placed more importance on Gods word for nourishment than I do the physical. Don't get me wrong I'm very healthy for my age at 60.

I would have to say that I became a believer as a 6 year old when they baptized me in the Catholic Church. This was so even though I did not really get an inkling as just what God's Word for another 26 years. That last was more than 40 years ago. God over the years has helped me to understand how little I really know about many things today... in spite of my age and study and experience.
Give God the glory!

 

[historyb]

Salvation is BOTH an accomplished fact and a process. If you were to die tonight, you are either saved or lost, depending on whether you are a child of God. The process is called sanctification, and it culminates in glorification. Sanctification follows justification.

Well I will disagree with that

 

[Eternally Grateful]

So then he who has received this Life must do what in order to avoid the error and punishment of Adam and Eve?

Adam and Eve were perfect, they fell

Christ restored us by justifying us

you can not compair Us with Adam and Eve and you will never achieve what they had. Moral perfection, you always must depend on grac

 

[VictoryinJesus]

You want me to describe that which no eye has seen, nor ear heard, nor the heart of man imagined (1 Corinthians 2:9), the house not made with hands (2 Corinthians 5:1-2), the imperishable (1 Corinthians 15:53-54) qualities of the divine nature, which the saved are destined to inherit (2 Peter 1:4)?

Who can adequately speak about these things... can words even describe them?

never expected you to describe. Honestly, its those things planted in my mind for many years. For instance, was always told it means ‘make friends of the unrighteous mammon so when you (or it) fails ...they will receive you into everlasting habitations—hell —because you will be spending a lot of time there with them.’ asked to get your input on ‘everlasting habitations’ which (imo) is far better than Hell being said to be ‘everlasting habitations’

 

[amadeus]

Adam and Eve were perfect, they fell

Christ restored us by justifying us

you can not compair Us with Adam and Eve and you will never achieve what they had. Moral perfection, you always must depend on grac

You apparently still don't understand what I have been saying. May God bless you as you walk with Him!

 

[Marymog]

Yes, I agree. Yesterday when I was assailed by temptations God one more time was there to help me when I called upon Him. He saved me. Today if another temptation is placed before my eyes if I call upon Him from my heart will He not again save me from sinning? Yesterday, today, tomorrow? When is a person saved? When can a person be saved? As a Catholic I do believe that you believe this similar to the way I do...

Hi,

When you resisted that temptation yesterday, if you would have died, you would have been saved. Today, when another temptation is placed before your eyes, you must resist it to be saved. You ask when a person can be saved...... A person can be saved IF they hold firm to the end......Just like scripture says....Hebrews 3:14, 1 Corinthians 15:2, Matthew 24:13; 10:22, James 1:12, Revelations 2:10 etc.

@BreadOfLife or @Philip James or @historyb may be able to suggest more passages?

 

[Stumpmaster]

Today, when another temptation is placed before your eyes, you must resist it to be saved.

And yet we are saved by grace through faith, not as a result of self righteousness or works. Eph 2:8 The thing which must be held firm to the end is faith for it is the means by which grace is accessed.

 

[Waiting on him]

And yet we are saved by grace through faith, not as a result of self righteousness or works. Eph 2:8 The thing which must be held firm to the end is faith for it is the means by which grace is accessed.

View attachment 10332

And even that is gifted through the Holy Spirit.

 

[icxn]

..they will receive you into everlasting habitations—hell —because you will be spending a lot of time there with them.’ asked to get your input on ‘everlasting habitations’ which (imo) is far better than Hell being said to be ‘everlasting habitations’

But hell is not what is referenced by 'everlasting habitations.' Christ wouldn't have commanded us to make friends by means of the unrighteous mammon so as to be condemned (Luke 16:9). By the word friends, I understand to mean those works of charity that can 'speak' favorably on our behalf on the day of judgement and number us with the sheep (Matthew 25:34-36).

 

[Ezra]

What happens to a born again person who fails to continuously partake of the flesh and blood of Jesus?

how are you/ we born again and not

 

[amadeus]

how are you/ we born again and not

Are you asking a question? You will have to rephrase as I really don't understand what you are saying or asking.