Scriptures that trinitarians Don't Want You to Know About - #5, Book of Acts

[atpollard]

John 8:54-59 [KJV]

54 Jesus answered, If I honour myself, my honour is nothing: it is my Father that honoureth me; of whom ye say, that he is your God: 55 Yet ye have not known him; but I know him: and if I should say, I know him not, I shall be a liar like unto you: but I know him, and keep his saying. 56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw [it], and was glad.
57 Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham?
58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.
59 Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.​

Setting aside “I AM” (which is the cherry on the sundae), Jesus claimed Sonship of God, relationship and knowledge of/with God and eternal existence (far prior to his birth). No exegesis that focuses on the words “I AM” while ignoring the context can hope to accurately comprehend the situation.

Shalom (peace),

(these sorts of intense “heat without light” debates are not my thing, so I will remain an ignorant trinitarian and leave the non-trinitarians to their superior enlightenment.)

 

[theefaith]

I charge you under oath by the living God: Tell us if you are the Christ, the Son of God" (Matt. 26:63). First of all, we should notice that no one at the trial asked Jesus if he were God

Chiaphas did

mare you the son of God?
The father is God then the sin must be God!
What about Matt 24 his angels?

 

[theefaith]

We are not attacking you or anyone else btw
Only seeking truth and biblical faith or understanding

 

[Mungo]

Yes, I realize that I answered for @Wrangler accidentally. No matter, you do not do scripture yourself so what's the difference. So continue and please answer what you think 'I AM' means in the NT.

I did give scripture in post#20 - the one you responded to without giving any scripture yourself.

 

[APAK]

I did give scripture in post#20 - the one you responded to without giving any scripture yourself.

ok then I did not see it..thanks

 

[theefaith]

John 8:54-59 [KJV]

54 Jesus answered, If I honour myself, my honour is nothing: it is my Father that honoureth me; of whom ye say, that he is your God: 55 Yet ye have not known him; but I know him: and if I should say, I know him not, I shall be a liar like unto you: but I know him, and keep his saying. 56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw [it], and was glad.
57 Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham?
58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.
59 Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.​

Setting aside “I AM” (which is the cherry on the sundae), Jesus claimed Sonship of God, relationship and knowledge of/with God and eternal existence (far prior to his birth). No exegesis that focuses on the words “I AM” while ignoring the context can hope to accurately comprehend the situation.

Shalom (peace),

(these sorts of intense “heat without light” debates are not my thing, so I will remain an ignorant trinitarian and leave the non-trinitarians to their superior enlightenment.)

how could a man hide himself passing right thru them?
Only God can work miracles?
How does a man have angels? Matt 24 his angels

 

[theefaith]

I did give scripture in post#20 - the one you responded to without giving any scripture yourself.

Catholics respond
Protestants ignore

I’ve asked hundreds of questions and given hundreds of verses with no reply
But then again that’s the apologetics game

 

[Wrangler]

You didn't give any scripture.
Claiming scripture says something without giving the quote and reference (or even just the reference if you are lazy) isn't giving scripture.

If I provide the Scripture that states Jesus is the 1st born of all creation, will you concede that he is not God? If not, then your reply is just a smoke screen, right?

 

[Wrangler]

What about it?

No response is what about it. Given that Jesus is the first born of all creation, it means he is not God for he is not the Father.

 

[Wrangler]

The native speakers listening to him that immediately took up stones to kill him for blasphemy disagree with you.

This is just another example of completely absurd reasoning. The historical narrative is not supposed to be evidentiary. For instance, the Jews who condemned him of blasphemy not only realized he was not God incarnate but not even the Messiah. So, that is definitive proof using your standard.

 

[Mungo]

If I provide the Scripture that states Jesus is the 1st born of all creation, will you concede that he is not God? If not, then your reply is just a smoke screen, right?

What I expect is that you give the scripture and then explain why you think that proves that Jesus is not God.
Is that too much to ask?

 

[theefaith]

If I provide the Scripture that states Jesus is the 1st born of all creation, will you concede that he is not God? If not, then your reply is just a smoke screen, right?

acts 4:24 And when they heard that, they lifted up their voice to God with one accord, and said, Lord, thou art God, which hast made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and all that in them is:


col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

 

[theefaith]

No response is what about it. Given that Jesus is the first born of all creation, it means he is not God for he is not the Father.

so the father is God yes?
And the father is the first born?

 

[Wrangler]

What I expect is that you give the scripture and then explain why you think that proves that Jesus is not God.
Is that too much to ask?

Sorry but I do not believe you since this thread already provided such Scripture in the OP and you are not answering my basic question once the Scripture is provided.

Are you seriously saying you never read in Scripture that Jesus was the first born of all creation? That you cannot research the topic yourself? See my thread The Case Against the Trinity | Christian Forums @ Christianity Board.

 

[Wrangler]

col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

For some reason, trinitarians do not realize how scripture goes against their doctrine. Anything that 'is the image of' or 'in the form of' something is NOT that thing, including God.

Logic
Definition
Language Usage

Mirrors reflect what is the image of whoever is in front of it. That does not make mirror's that being, person, vase or water running down the drain.

 

[theefaith]

Sorry but I do not believe you since this thread already provided such Scripture in the OP and you are not answering my basic question once the Scripture is provided.

Are you seriously saying you never read in Scripture that Jesus was the first born of all creation? That you cannot research the topic yourself? See my thread The Case Against the Trinity | Christian Forums @ Christianity Board.

when will you answer my angels question? Matt 24

 

[Wrangler]

so the father is God yes?
And the father is the first born?

Yes to the first. No, Jesus is the first born to the 2nd. You know that.

 

[Wrangler]

when will you answer my angels question? Matt 24

I won't. Your desperate attempt to shift attention to other verses not in the OP is noted.

 

[theefaith]

For some reason, trinitarians do not realize how scripture goes against their doctrine. Anything that 'is the image of' or 'in the form of' something is NOT that thing, including God.

Logic
Definition
Language Usage

Mirrors reflect what is the image of whoever is in front of it. That does not make mirror's that being, person, vase or water running down the drain.

You skipped this

acts 4:24 And when they heard that, they lifted up their voice to God with one accord, and said, Lord, thou art God, which hast made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and all that in them is:


col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

is Jesus the creator and Lord and God?
Waited on your next dodge

 

[theefaith]

I won't. Your desperate attempt to shift attention to other verses not in the OP is noted.

Yes to the first. No, Jesus is the first born to the 2nd. You know that.

I’m starting to see how you twist your way thru scripture