Silly question, but a thought provoking one:

[Jane_Doe22]

Thank you for this info as i never delved into Mormonism. Now i see why people get upset over Truth.

David, the information Truth7t7 is copy/pasting here is grossly inaccurate. To touch on just 2 points:

Members of the Church of Jesus Christ 100% believe in the Bible, and Jesus Christ therein. Jesus Christ has always existed, in the 100% divine and only Son of God. The only Savior of the world.

God the Father is the spiritual Father of all. Which technically makes everyone spiritual siblings: you, me, Elvis, Hitler, Mother Teresa, etc. That by no means makes everyone the same level of righteousness—Mother Teresa and Hitler are extremely in that regard. And the two most extreme differences would be Christ (who’s all about the Father’s will being done) and Lucifer/Satan (whom led a rebellion against the Father). They could not be more different.

 

[amadeus]

i do not like being falsely accused - do you?

I doubt that anyone does. When I posted that verse it was not my intention to accuse you. If you took it way, I apologize.

 

[David in NJ]

David, the information Truth7t7 is copy/pasting here is grossly inaccurate. To touch on just 2 points:

Members of the Church of Jesus Christ 100% believe in the Bible, and Jesus Christ therein. Jesus Christ has always existed, in the 100% divine and only Son of God. The only Savior of the world.

God the Father is the spiritual Father of all. Which technically makes everyone spiritual siblings: you, me, Elvis, Hitler, Mother Teresa, etc. That by no means makes everyone the same level of righteousness—Mother Teresa and Hitler are extremely in that regard. And the two most extreme differences would be Christ (who’s all about the Father’s will being done) and Lucifer/Satan (whom led a rebellion against the Father). They could not be more different.

Therefore, the One whom you worship without knowing, Him I proclaim to you: God, who made the world and everything in it, since He is Lord of heaven and earth, does not dwell in temples made with hands. Nor is He worshiped with men’s hands, as though He needed anything, since He gives to all life, breath, and all things. And He has made from one blood every nation of men to dwell on all the face of the earth, and has determined their pre-appointed times and the boundaries of their dwellings, so that they should seek the Lord, in the hope that they might grope for Him and find Him, though He is not far from each one of us; for in Him we live and move and have our being, as also some of your own poets have said, ‘For we are also His offspring.’ Therefore, since we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Divine Nature is like gold or silver or stone, something shaped by art and man’s devising. Truly, these times of ignorance God overlooked, but now commands all men everywhere to repent, because He has appointed a day on which He will judge the world in righteousness by the Man whom He has ordained. He has given assurance of this to all by raising Him from the dead.” Acts 17

i am very happy that you believe in Christ and that HE was always Divine with the Father - Yes/No?

 

[David in NJ]

I doubt that anyone does. When I posted that verse it was not my intention to accuse you. If you took it way, I apologize.

Yes, that is how it came across - but today is a new day and yesterday is gone and forgiven(hopefully you feel the same).

i do not hold on to the past and look forward to this New Day that we have together in Christ.

Today we hear His Voice - Rise above the noise and confusion
Let our hearts be mended by Holy Spirit Fusion

 

[Wrangler]

David, the information Truth7t7 is copy/pasting here is grossly inaccurate

Worse, driven my some kind of personal animus.

I understand there are 30K Christian denominations. I don’t attack those denominations who adhere to doctrines I don’t share. Why did this thread get twisted into bashing one denomination?

 

[Jane_Doe22]

Therefore, the One whom you worship without knowing, Him I proclaim to you: God, who made the world and everything in it, since He is Lord of heaven and earth, does not dwell in temples made with hands. Nor is He worshiped with men’s hands, as though He needed anything, since He gives to all life, breath, and all things. And He has made from one blood every nation of men to dwell on all the face of the earth, and has determined their pre-appointed times and the boundaries of their dwellings, so that they should seek the Lord, in the hope that they might grope for Him and find Him, though He is not far from each one of us; for in Him we live and move and have our being, as also some of your own poets have said, ‘For we are also His offspring.’ Therefore, since we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Divine Nature is like gold or silver or stone, something shaped by art and man’s devising. Truly, these times of ignorance God overlooked, but now commands all men everywhere to repent, because He has appointed a day on which He will judge the world in righteousness by the Man whom He has ordained. He has given assurance of this to all by raising Him from the dead.” Acts 17

i am very happy that you believe in Christ and that HE was always Divine with the Father - Yes/No?

100% always divine, always with the Father, always one with the Father (John 1, John 17, etc).

 

[Enoch111]

It is amazing how often trinitarians point to Scripture that does not explicitly teach their doctrine - AS IF it does.

And it is amazing how the heretics simply ignore the Scriptures which explicitly reveal the Trinity (the triune Godhead, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit).

 

[David in NJ]

100% always divine, always with the Father, always one with the Father (John 1, John 17, etc).

100% BEAUTIFUL

 

[David in NJ]

And it is amazing how the heretics simply ignore the Scriptures which explicitly reveal the Trinity (the triune Godhead, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit).

Let Us make man in Our Image according to Our Likeness.....The PLAN from the Beginning from the Eternal THREE

 

[Stumpmaster]

Billy to Bible study teacher: Why did God have to send himself down to earth to become his own son to sacrifice himself just to convince himself to forgive us?

Did you hear about the clergyman's son who was getting another flogging from his father and asked, "If Jesus died for my sins why am I being punished for them?"

 

[Wrangler]

always with the Father

I could have sworn Jesus, on Earth, telling us to pray to our Father, who is in heaven.

 

[Wrangler]

And it is amazing how the heretics simply ignore the Scriptures which explicitly reveal the Trinity (the triune Godhead, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit).

Undoubtedly, you will invent a new meaning for explicit, like 'For us, there is one God, the Father.'

There is no such scripture verse anything like The nature of God is a trinity - consisting of the F, S & HS, who are co-substantial, co-eternal and co-equal - and if you don't believe this you cannot be saved.

 

[David in NJ]

I could have sworn Jesus, on Earth, telling us to pray to our Father, who is in heaven.

Have you never read where Yehovah/Jesus IS, WAS and IS to COME from???

No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father,
He(Jesus) has declared(to lead, show the way; met: I unfold, narrate, declare) Him. John 1:18

I and My Father are One. - John 10:30

What then if you should see the Son of Man ascend where He was before? John 6:62-64
It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.

"But there are some of you who do not believe.”

 

[Grailhunter]

Have you never read where Yehovah/Jesus IS, WAS and IS to COME from???

No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father,
He(Jesus) has declared(to lead, show the way; met: I unfold, narrate, declare) Him. John 1:18

I and My Father are One. - John 10:30

What then if you should see the Son of Man ascend where He was before? John 6:62-64
It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.

"But there are some of you who do not believe.”

The New Testament Yeshua gives us a clearer explanation of the oneness concept. Speaking to God the Father (He is not talking to Himself) Yeshua says this about the concept of one...John 17:22 “And the glory which to them; that they may be one just as We are one.” Because Yeshua says “just as” this is an exactness, a duplication of a condition that we can achieve, and He states that this condition of “oneness” can apply to us, but it has nothing to do with absorption or singularity, but rather a condition of spiritual union and solidarity between God and us. The next verse further defines this by describing a unity with Christ that would cause the same condition with us as it did with them, a condition of perfection. Again, not talking to Himself, in John 17:23 “I in them, and You in Me, that they may be perfected in unity, that the world may know that You did send Me, and do love them, even as you do love Me.” In this context millions of people could be made one...one being a abstract concept of one, but a more literal meaning of unity, solidarity, and perfection and even a “body” that is considered one....the body of Christ or the body of the Church. And then, the next verse is probably one of the best verses to put this oneness concept into perspective. The leading verses are speaking of the works of the Holy Spirit and then ends with this explanation. 1st Corinthians 12:11-13 “But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually just as He wills. For even as the body is one and yet has many members, and all the members of the body, though they are many, are one body, so also is Christ. For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and were all made to drink of one Spirit. For the body is not one member, but many.”.....So the "Oneness" is something that applies or will apply to all of us and we are not gods nor will we ever be gods.

Beyond that the scriptures give literally hundreds or proofs that the One God formula for the Trinity is false.
All of the My Father scriptures....like 59 of the them and some of referring to His Father in Heaven. God designated Himself as God the Father so we would understand His position in our terms. He designated Christ as His Son so we would understand His position in our terms.

God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son.....God did not give Himself nor is God the Father, God the Son.

The Father sent the Son....not Himself.

The Father gave authority to the Son...He gave Himself nothing, and Christ did not give anything to the Father.

In My Father's house there are many mansions....not In My house there are many mansions.

To those who sold doves he said, “Get these out of here! Stop turning my Father’s house into a market!” The Temple was His Father's house not His.

Christ did not do His will, but the will of the Father.

Christ did not have the authority to grant the mother of James and John a seat on thrones.

The Father new the end of time...not the Son.

Christ prayed to the Father and made requests.

God the Son loves the Father and the Father loves the Son....God did not love Himself.

Christ said He had to go for the Holy Spirit to come...He did not say I am the Holy Spirit or because I am here the Holy Spirit is here to.

Yeshua ascended to the Father....He did not ascend to Himself.

The Apostles new there was a difference between God the Father and God the Son because they referred to them differently in their writings. Referring to God the Father as God and God the Son as our Lord Jesus Christ.

The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit, be with you all. 2nd Corinthians 13:14

Peace be to the brethren, and love with faith, from God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. Grace be with all those who love our Lord Jesus Christ with a love incorruptible. Ephesians 6:23-24

To our God and Father be glory for ever and ever. Amen. Greet all God’s people in Christ Jesus. The brothers and sisters who are with me send greetings. All God’s people here send you greetings, especially those who belong to Caesar’s household. The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit. Amen. Philippians 4:20-23

May God himself, the God of peace, sanctify you through and through. May your whole spirit, soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. The one who calls you is faithful, and he will do it. Brothers and sisters, pray for us. Greet all God’s people with a holy kiss. I charge you before the Lord to have this letter read to all the brothers and sisters. The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you. 1st Thessalonians 5:23-28

The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you. 2nd Thessalonians 3:18

The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit. Philemon 2:25

Now may the God of peace, who through the blood of the eternal covenant brought back from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great Shepherd of the sheep, equip you with everything good for doing his will, and may he work in us what is pleasing to him, through Jesus Christ, to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.

but grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To Him be the glory, both now and to the day of eternity. Amen. 2nd Peter 3:18

We know that we are children of God, and that the whole world is under the control of the evil one. We know also that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true. And we are in him who is true by being in his Son Jesus Christ. He is the true God and eternal life. 1st John 5:19-20

Anyone who goes too far and does not abide in the teachings of Christ, does not have God; the one who abides in the teachings, he has both the Father and the Son. 2nd John 1:9

There is no possibility that the one God formula is true. There are three full fledged Gods that are united. They are in accord, in union, but not one. Trinity....Tri...unity, not Triune or Tri-one. A Godhead.

The concept of one God having three aspects is strictly Pagan.

 

[David in NJ]

The New Testament Yeshua gives us a clearer explanation of the oneness concept. Speaking to God the Father (He is not talking to Himself) Yeshua says this about the concept of one...John 17:22 “And the glory which to them; that they may be one just as We are one.” Because Yeshua says “just as” this is an exactness, a duplication of a condition that we can achieve, and He states that this condition of “oneness” can apply to us, but it has nothing to do with absorption or singularity, but rather a condition of spiritual union and solidarity between God and us. The next verse further defines this by describing a unity with Christ that would cause the same condition with us as it did with them, a condition of perfection. Again, not talking to Himself, in John 17:23 “I in them, and You in Me, that they may be perfected in unity, that the world may know that You did send Me, and do love them, even as you do love Me.” In this context millions of people could be made one...one being a abstract concept of one, but a more literal meaning of unity, solidarity, and perfection and even a “body” that is considered one....the body of Christ or the body of the Church. And then, the next verse is probably one of the best verses to put this oneness concept into perspective. The leading verses are speaking of the works of the Holy Spirit and then ends with this explanation. 1st Corinthians 12:11-13 “But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually just as He wills. For even as the body is one and yet has many members, and all the members of the body, though they are many, are one body, so also is Christ. For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and were all made to drink of one Spirit. For the body is not one member, but many.”.....So the "Oneness" is something that applies or will apply to all of us and we are not gods nor will we ever be gods.

Beyond that the scriptures give literally hundreds or proofs that the One God formula for the Trinity is false.
All of the My Father scriptures....like 59 of the them and some of referring to His Father in Heaven. God designated Himself as God the Father so we would understand His position in our terms. He designated Christ as His Son so we would understand His position in our terms.

God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son.....God did not give Himself nor is God the Father, God the Son.

The Father sent the Son....not Himself.

The Father gave authority to the Son...He gave Himself nothing, and Christ did not give anything to the Father.

In My Father's house there are many mansions....not In My house there are many mansions.

To those who sold doves he said, “Get these out of here! Stop turning my Father’s house into a market!” The Temple was His Father's house not His.

Christ did not do His will, but the will of the Father.

Christ did not have the authority to grant the mother of James and John a seat on thrones.

The Father new the end of time...not the Son.

Christ prayed to the Father and made requests.

God the Son loves the Father and the Father loves the Son....God did not love Himself.

Christ said He had to go for the Holy Spirit to come...He did not say I am the Holy Spirit or because I am here the Holy Spirit is here to.

Yeshua ascended to the Father....He did not ascend to Himself.

The Apostles new there was a difference between God the Father and God the Son because they referred to them differently in their writings. Referring to God the Father as God and God the Son as our Lord Jesus Christ.

The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit, be with you all. 2nd Corinthians 13:14

Peace be to the brethren, and love with faith, from God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. Grace be with all those who love our Lord Jesus Christ with a love incorruptible. Ephesians 6:23-24

To our God and Father be glory for ever and ever. Amen. Greet all God’s people in Christ Jesus. The brothers and sisters who are with me send greetings. All God’s people here send you greetings, especially those who belong to Caesar’s household. The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit. Amen. Philippians 4:20-23

May God himself, the God of peace, sanctify you through and through. May your whole spirit, soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. The one who calls you is faithful, and he will do it. Brothers and sisters, pray for us. Greet all God’s people with a holy kiss. I charge you before the Lord to have this letter read to all the brothers and sisters. The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you. 1st Thessalonians 5:23-28

The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you. 2nd Thessalonians 3:18

The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit. Philemon 2:25

Now may the God of peace, who through the blood of the eternal covenant brought back from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great Shepherd of the sheep, equip you with everything good for doing his will, and may he work in us what is pleasing to him, through Jesus Christ, to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.

but grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To Him be the glory, both now and to the day of eternity. Amen. 2nd Peter 3:18

We know that we are children of God, and that the whole world is under the control of the evil one. We know also that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true. And we are in him who is true by being in his Son Jesus Christ. He is the true God and eternal life. 1st John 5:19-20

Anyone who goes too far and does not abide in the teachings of Christ, does not have God; the one who abides in the teachings, he has both the Father and the Son. 2nd John 1:9

There is no possibility that the one God formula is true. There are three full fledged Gods that are united. They are in accord, in union, but not one. Trinity....Tri...unity, not Triune or Tri-one. A Godhead.

The concept of one God having three aspects is strictly Pagan.

i am unable to Read this book you posted - please take one point you wish to convey and we will discuss - THANK YOU

 

[Grailhunter]

i am unable to Read this book you posted - please take one point you wish to convey and we will discuss - THANK YOU

LOL belly roll....then that might be your problem with the Bible. Most of that was Bible verses. LOL
Ya know, the scriptures did not originally have chapter and verse numbers.
They numbered them so people could take it slow.

The study of Beliefs....Truths....Facts
As far as convictions or faith, beliefs can deny, reject, or ignore truths or facts.
There is no latch in the mind for rejection of falsehoods. no physical connection to reality.
Once the mind decides to believe something it can be set in a personal reality.
"As crazy as it sounds" they have observed this in abnormal psychology. LOL
A person can literally live in an alternate reality. An it can be emotionally disturbing to find out that that reality is not real.
This is what makes it so tough to reassess beliefs.

This is what makes religious beliefs so strong. This can be seen in the challenge that interventionists have with rescuing someone that has believed a cult's theology. They may know that they have been fooled, that they have been controlled, that they have been abused, but the shocking thing is, that they find it comforting and rejecting that reality is disturbing and scary. Not that abnormal Psychology or cult beliefs apply to you.

By nature we are social creatures and we like to "fitting in" Others believe what I believe and I believe what they believe. The other side of it all, Truth can be alarming and shocking and not always nice or comforting. For example the Old Testament can be a horrible shock to people because it can be cruel and violent and can seem so unlike a good God. Why? Because it is a whole different reality, one that is alien to ours and is so objectionable to Christian morals and standards.

It is a tough world, religious freedoms are that you can live a fantasy if you want. So the choice is yours.

 

[David in NJ]

LOL belly roll....then that might be your problem with the Bible. Most of that was Bible verses. LOL
Ya know, the scriptures did not originally have chapter and verse numbers.
They numbered them so people could take it slow.

The study of Beliefs....Truths....Facts
As far as convictions or faith, beliefs can deny, reject, or ignore truths or facts.
There is no latch in the mind for rejection of falsehoods. no physical connection to reality.
Once the mind decides to believe something it can be set in a personal reality.
"As crazy as it sounds" they have observed this in abnormal psychology. LOL
A person can literally live in an alternate reality. An it can be emotionally disturbing to find out that that reality is not real.
This is what makes it so tough to reassess beliefs.

This is what makes religious beliefs so strong. This can be seen in the challenge that interventionists have with rescuing someone that has believed a cult's theology. They may know that they have been fooled, that they have been controlled, that they have been abused, but the shocking thing is, that they find it comforting and rejecting that reality is disturbing and scary. Not that abnormal Psychology or cult beliefs apply to you.

By nature we are social creatures and we like to "fitting in" Others believe what I believe and I believe what they believe. The other side of it all, Truth can be alarming and shocking and not always nice or comforting. For example the Old Testament can be a horrible shock to people because it can be cruel and violent and can seem so unlike a good God. Why? Because it is a whole different reality, one that is alien to ours and is so objectionable to Christian morals and standards.

It is a tough world, religious freedoms are that you can live a fantasy if you want. So the choice is yours.

Problem with Scripture??? lol

Did you correct your error of saying "satan was not the serpent in the Garden", when in fact, the LORD says he was.

Do you understand who THESE are - "Let Us make man in Our Image according to Our Likeness"

 

[Grailhunter]

Did you correct your error of saying "satan was not the serpent in the Garden", when in fact, the LORD says he was.

LOL Waiting with baited breath....who are you call Lord....scripture please.

Do you understand who THESE are - "Let Us make man in Our Image according to Our Likeness"

Who Yahweh was referring to, are not named or described. For this reason this scripture and scriptures like it are open to the most imaginative minds....usually fertile

 

[David in NJ]

LOL Waiting with baited breath....who are you call Lord....scripture please.



Who Yahweh was referring to, are not named or described. For this reason this scripture and scriptures like it are open to the most imaginative minds....usually fertile

You need help and assistance from the Lord - it is crucial, if you desire to please Him.

i am signing off now - Good Nite Friend

 

[Stumpmaster]

What is nonsense is the impossibility of God dying. If Jesus were God, who raised him from the dead?

The 'life for life' standard necessary means the sacrifice must be made by one who can die. This being cannot be God because Scripture tells us God does not change. Death is the ultimate change.

The truth is that God the Father stayed alive in the Spirit while God the Son died in the flesh, to appease His Father's wrath:

Rom 1:18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness,

Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Joh 1:14 The Word became flesh, and lived among us. We saw his glory, such glory as of the one and only Son of the Father, full of grace and truth.

For further edification:
The Death Of Christ Proclaimed | Christian Forums @ Christianity Board